Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:31 AM - Slick 6393 (bouguy)
2. 08:06 AM - Re: Z-19 and multiple busses (Corey Crawford)
3. 08:06 AM - Re: Z-19 and multiple busses ()
4. 08:46 AM - Re: Z-19 and multiple busses (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
5. 08:47 AM - Re: Z-19 and multiple busses (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
6. 11:04 AM - EIS resistor (Sam Marlow)
7. 11:46 AM - Re: EIS resistor (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
8. 04:53 PM - Re: EIS resistor (Sam Marlow)
9. 06:20 PM - NEARLY ready for first flight (Cassius Smith)
10. 07:02 PM - Re: NEARLY ready for first flight (Bill Hibbing)
11. 09:10 PM - Re: NEARLY ready for first flight (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
Message 1
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Hi ,
i have a quite new Bendix starting vibrator 10-176487-241B and
i would like to know if it is possible to use it with the 6393 left SLICK magneto
of the IO540C4B5 of my Barracuda .
thanks for reply ,
Boullu guy .
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=164978#164978
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Z-19 and multiple busses |
Thanks for setting me straight. I was under the impression that normal
operation would see both engine power switches on.
- Corey
On Feb 18, 2008 9:00 PM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III <nuckolls.bob@cox.net>
wrote:
> nuckolls.bob@cox.net>
>
> At 07:09 PM 2/18/2008 -0700, you wrote:
>
> >On Feb 18, 2008 6:32 PM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III
> ><<mailto:nuckolls.bob@cox.net>nuckolls.bob@cox.net> wrote:
> >> The dual diodes are intended to isolate a battery
> >> with higher state of charge from being tapped by
> >> the equipment that has reduced the other battery
> >> to a lower state of charge. It's not batteries that
> >> are the energy thieves . . . it's stuff you have
> >> turned on.
> >
> >I think I got it .. the diodes prevent the Main Battery from being used
> by
> >components on the Engine Bus and vise versa. If the two busses would feed
> >the exact same components, is there any reason to separate them? The only
> >thing I'd lose is not being able to isolate a battery, or am I missing
> >something? (I'm not sure being able to isolate a single battery is very
> >helpful in this scenario - the whole engine can be isolated with the dc
> >power switch if needed).
>
> I'm not sure about your desire to "isolate a
> battery". When the alternator quits, the
> energy available is finite and contained totally
> within the battery(ies).
>
> When the low volts warning light comes on, wiring
> per Z-19 requires no action on the part of the
> pilot except to close the endurance bus alternate
> feed switch and open both battery master switches.
> Then make preparations for a no-alternator
> en-route phase of flight followed by approach to
> comfortable landing. Once your comfortable landing
> is assured (short final over the numbers) close
> the master relays and run as much "stuff" as you
> like to complete the flight.
>
> Normal operations are with the primary engine
> power switch ON and the secondary switch off.
> Assuming you've done your homework and have
> a considered preventative maintenance program
> for batteries, then you KNOW how long you
> can operate battery only in the endurance
> mode. If you have not done your homework and
> find that the engine is not running well for
> as long as you anticipated, you may have
> to close the secondary power switch to allow
> the main battery to support the engine. If
> the engine battery's lack of capacity proves
> to be a surprise, then the main battery's true
> condition is probably a mystery too . . . it's
> time to call it an emergency.
>
> The design goal is to minimize in-flight
> diagnostics, switch flipping and other
> distractions that prevent you from doing
> your best as a pilot. With a modicum of
> planning it's a no-sweat deal.
>
> Bob . . .
>
--
Corey Crawford
Message 3
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| Subject: | Z-19 and multiple busses |
Bob, if I "open both battery master switches" which carry my EFI, ECU
and primary fuel pump, my engine will go putt-putt and die. On the other
hand closing the #2 fuel pump switch will provide power to the #2 fuel
pump from the main bus for my non-running engine. I'm sure you were
referring to a standard aircraft engine and not an electrically
dependent one. For Z-19 to be effective, the EFI/ECU/FP require at least
1 live feed. That source is not provided on the e-bus.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Robert L. Nuckolls, III
Sent: Monday, February 18, 2008 11:01 PM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Z-19 and multiple busses
--> <nuckolls.bob@cox.net>
At 07:09 PM 2/18/2008 -0700, you wrote:
>On Feb 18, 2008 6:32 PM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III
><<mailto:nuckolls.bob@cox.net>nuckolls.bob@cox.net> wrote:
>> The dual diodes are intended to isolate a battery
>> with higher state of charge from being tapped by
>> the equipment that has reduced the other battery
>> to a lower state of charge. It's not batteries that
>> are the energy thieves . . . it's stuff you have
>> turned on.
>
>I think I got it .. the diodes prevent the Main Battery from being used
>by
>components on the Engine Bus and vise versa. If the two busses would
feed
>the exact same components, is there any reason to separate them? The
only
>thing I'd lose is not being able to isolate a battery, or am I missing
>something? (I'm not sure being able to isolate a single battery is very
>helpful in this scenario - the whole engine can be isolated with the dc
>power switch if needed).
I'm not sure about your desire to "isolate a
battery". When the alternator quits, the
energy available is finite and contained totally
within the battery(ies).
When the low volts warning light comes on, wiring
per Z-19 requires no action on the part of the
pilot except to close the endurance bus alternate
feed switch and open both battery master switches.
Then make preparations for a no-alternator
en-route phase of flight followed by approach to
comfortable landing. Once your comfortable landing
is assured (short final over the numbers) close
the master relays and run as much "stuff" as you
like to complete the flight.
Normal operations are with the primary engine
power switch ON and the secondary switch off.
Assuming you've done your homework and have
a considered preventative maintenance program
for batteries, then you KNOW how long you
can operate battery only in the endurance
mode. If you have not done your homework and
find that the engine is not running well for
as long as you anticipated, you may have
to close the secondary power switch to allow
the main battery to support the engine. If
the engine battery's lack of capacity proves
to be a surprise, then the main battery's true
condition is probably a mystery too . . . it's
time to call it an emergency.
The design goal is to minimize in-flight
diagnostics, switch flipping and other
distractions that prevent you from doing
your best as a pilot. With a modicum of
planning it's a no-sweat deal.
Bob . . .
----------------------------------------)
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
----------------------------------------
Message 4
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| Subject: | Z-19 and multiple busses |
At 11:02 AM 2/19/2008 -0500, you wrote:
>
>Bob, if I "open both battery master switches" which carry my EFI, ECU
>and primary fuel pump, my engine will go putt-putt and die. On the other
>hand closing the #2 fuel pump switch will provide power to the #2 fuel
>pump from the main bus for my non-running engine. I'm sure you were
>referring to a standard aircraft engine and not an electrically
>dependent one. For Z-19 to be effective, the EFI/ECU/FP require at least
>1 live feed. That source is not provided on the e-bus.
Your electrically dependent engine accessories should
run from always hot battery busses as illustrated in
Z-19 and recommended for ALL the Z-figures. If you've
got bad smells in the cockpit you should be able to
open all the battery switches and kill the alternator
and NOT have the engine stop.
Bob . . .
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Z-19 and multiple busses |
At 09:01 AM 2/19/2008 -0700, you wrote:
>Thanks for setting me straight. I was under the impression that normal
>operation would see both engine power switches on.
The system would "function" with both switches ON. But
the purpose for batteries is to have TWO, KNOWN sources
of stored energy, one for the engine, one for other stuff.
If you do your homework, you never have to close the second
engine power switch except during a pre-flight test.
Bob . . .
Message 6
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I'm having trouble with my EIS 6000. Thinking about changing the 27k
resistor, but I can't find one. My question is, can I put a 22k and a
5.5k in series instead?
Thanks,
Sam Marlow
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: EIS resistor |
At 01:58 PM 2/19/2008 -0500, you wrote:
>I'm having trouble with my EIS 6000. Thinking about changing the 27k
>resistor, but I can't find one. My question is, can I put a 22k and a 5.5k
>in series instead?
>Thanks,
>Sam Marlow
Sure . . . Or even consider
a 50K potentiometer so that you
can adjust it to exactly what's needed.
Bob . . .
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: EIS resistor |
Can I get one at a local Radio Shack, and what exactly do I ask for?
Thanks,
Sam
Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote:
> <nuckolls.bob@cox.net>
>
> At 01:58 PM 2/19/2008 -0500, you wrote:
>
>> I'm having trouble with my EIS 6000. Thinking about changing the 27k
>> resistor, but I can't find one. My question is, can I put a 22k and a
>> 5.5k in series instead?
>> Thanks,
>> Sam Marlow
>
> Sure . . . Or even consider
> a 50K potentiometer so that you
> can adjust it to exactly what's needed.
>
> Bob . . .
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | NEARLY ready for first flight |
Hello all,
I'm new to the Matronics list. My son is building an RV7-A, and we used
the Aero Electric Connection figure Z-11 with very few modifications
(added an SPST switch in front of the Alt. Hold; that was about all). We
are using the B&C LR-3 alternator controller, and we used an LED in the
panel for the low voltage indicator.
My son cranked the engine the first time and just let it idle a couple
of minutes. Voltage was indicated on the Dynon EMS-10 as 12.1V, which
I'm told is low. We asked around and were told by a couple of folks that
12.1V is normal for idle speeds; it will pick up at higher RPM runups.
The low volt indicator was flashing the whole time.
Today, we're about ready for first flight. My son did a 1600 RPM runup
to check mags, oil pressure, stuff like that. HOWEVER the low voltage
light never stopped blinking. He didn't notice the exact voltage
reading. When he turned on all the lights, the current draw went into
the red.
Here's my question - how do I start trying to debug this problem? Do I
suspect the alternator, the LR-3, or what? It was about 30 degrees at
the hangar when he shut the engine down, so I haven't had the chance to
check the wiring connectivity yet, and I know that's the first step.
The EMS is connected to the main power bus, so it's not behind the
bridge diode that protects the E-bus.
Any suggestions?
Cassius Smith
-----------------
"With the possible exception of the equator, everything begins
somewhere."
C. S. Lewis
-----------------
"With the possible exception of the equator, everything begins
somewhere."
C. S. Lewis
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: NEARLY ready for first flight |
Check the B&C web site. They have a troubleshooting guide for the LR-3.
Print it out and follow it. I had roughly the same problem when I first
tried my electrical system with the alternator and using the guide I found I
had made a bad crimp connection. Easy fix. Good luck.
Bill
Glasair SIIS-FT
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cassius Smith" <cassius@cassius.org>
Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2008 8:16 PM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: NEARLY ready for first flight
> <cassius@cassius.org>
>
> Hello all,
> I'm new to the Matronics list. My son is building an RV7-A, and we used
> the Aero Electric Connection figure Z-11 with very few modifications
> (added an SPST switch in front of the Alt. Hold; that was about all). We
> are using the B&C LR-3 alternator controller, and we used an LED in the
> panel for the low voltage indicator.
>
> My son cranked the engine the first time and just let it idle a couple
> of minutes. Voltage was indicated on the Dynon EMS-10 as 12.1V, which
> I'm told is low. We asked around and were told by a couple of folks that
> 12.1V is normal for idle speeds; it will pick up at higher RPM runups.
> The low volt indicator was flashing the whole time.
>
> Today, we're about ready for first flight. My son did a 1600 RPM runup
> to check mags, oil pressure, stuff like that. HOWEVER the low voltage
> light never stopped blinking. He didn't notice the exact voltage
> reading. When he turned on all the lights, the current draw went into
> the red.
>
> Here's my question - how do I start trying to debug this problem? Do I
> suspect the alternator, the LR-3, or what? It was about 30 degrees at
> the hangar when he shut the engine down, so I haven't had the chance to
> check the wiring connectivity yet, and I know that's the first step.
>
> The EMS is connected to the main power bus, so it's not behind the
> bridge diode that protects the E-bus.
>
> Any suggestions?
>
> Cassius Smith
>
> -----------------
> "With the possible exception of the equator, everything begins
> somewhere."
> C. S. Lewis
> -----------------
> "With the possible exception of the equator, everything begins
> somewhere."
> C. S. Lewis
>
>
> --
> 10:55 AM
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: NEARLY ready for first flight |
At 07:16 PM 2/19/2008 -0700, you wrote:
>
>Hello all,
>I'm new to the Matronics list. My son is building an RV7-A, and we used
>the Aero Electric Connection figure Z-11 with very few modifications
>(added an SPST switch in front of the Alt. Hold; that was about all). We
>are using the B&C LR-3 alternator controller, and we used an LED in the
>panel for the low voltage indicator.
>
>My son cranked the engine the first time and just let it idle a couple
>of minutes. Voltage was indicated on the Dynon EMS-10 as 12.1V, which
>I'm told is low. We asked around and were told by a couple of folks that
>12.1V is normal for idle speeds; it will pick up at higher RPM runups.
>The low volt indicator was flashing the whole time.
>
>Today, we're about ready for first flight. My son did a 1600 RPM runup
>to check mags, oil pressure, stuff like that. HOWEVER the low voltage
>light never stopped blinking. He didn't notice the exact voltage
>reading. When he turned on all the lights, the current draw went into
>the red.
>
>Here's my question - how do I start trying to debug this problem? Do I
>suspect the alternator, the LR-3, or what? It was about 30 degrees at
>the hangar when he shut the engine down, so I haven't had the chance to
>check the wiring connectivity yet, and I know that's the first step.
>
>The EMS is connected to the main power bus, so it's not behind the
>bridge diode that protects the E-bus.
>
>Any suggestions?
>
>Cassius Smith
There's a troubleshooting procedure for the LR-3 published
at:
http://bandc.biz/Downloads.html
Pick the one appropriate to the model you have.
There's a general troubleshooting guide for
externally regulated alternators in Appendix
Z to the AeroElectric Connection which you
can download at:
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/Rev11/AppZ_R11M.pdf
See Note 8 on Page Z-7.
Let us know what you find.
Bob . . .
----------------------------------------)
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
----------------------------------------
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