Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 07:07 AM - Re: Aux power and the battery (Speedy11@aol.com)
2. 08:40 AM - Connecting External Power Supply (Jim Piavis)
3. 12:17 PM - Re: Any Ray Allen LED Dimming Circuit ideas? (Eric M. Jones)
4. 03:16 PM - E-Buss diode vs. Switch (Harold Lanfear)
5. 03:56 PM - Re: E-Buss diode vs. Switch (Ron Shannon)
6. 05:08 PM - KLN90B Lighting (Michael Hinchcliff)
7. 05:41 PM - Large Gauge Wire Crimper ()
8. 06:13 PM - Re: KLN90B Lighting (Ian Edgar)
9. 06:48 PM - Re: KLN90B Lighting (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
10. 06:48 PM - Re: E-Buss diode vs. Switch (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
11. 06:48 PM - Re: Connecting External Power Supply (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
12. 06:48 PM - Re: E-Buss diode vs. Switch (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
13. 06:52 PM - Off line for a few days. (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
14. 07:13 PM - Re: KLN90B Lighting (Jerry Ricciotti)
15. 07:24 PM - Re: Off line for a few days. (Don Curry)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Aux power and the battery |
Well, as I mentioned, a good thought, but, for me, that idea does not work.
The battery size is unique and it in enclosed in a steel case which needed
to be mounted to support structure. At first, I bought only the battery steel
case and used it to fabricate brackets and do fitting. That worked fine for
awhile. But, as I needed to make hold down brackets and finalize wiring and
attach shunts and HE devices, I found having the actual battery beneficial.
I'm sure that with your years of experience, you know how long to make
certain wires and can visualize the entire setup. But, with my limited
experience, I need the actual battery to see where everything fits and to make
sure I
get wire lengths right and don't cause interference problems that I have to
later solve.
I am not using the battery to power anything. I recharge it periodically to
keep it full up and use my Samlex (sp?) power supply to test circuits and
power avionics.
Stan Sutterfield
Do not archive
>Bob,
>A good thought, but I found that I needed the actual battery for making
>brackets and fitting into the airframe. There's nothing like having the
>actual battery when fitting and running wires.
>Stan Sutterfield
>Do not archive
>
> I've always recommended that builders not buy a new
> battery until the airplane was ready to fly. During
> construction phases, a lawn tractor battery and a
> plug-in-the-wall power supply would let you get everything
> running in the airplane without abusing a brand
> new flight-battery.
Sure, but what's wrong with making that the very
last task you complete? Battery leads can be fabricated
extra long and fitted with temporary terminals to
mate with your shop battery. Space can be allocated
for installation of the flight-battery's attach
hardware.
The long leads could even be long enough to
reach outside the airplane so that the test
battery and supporting charger can be on
a cart or stand outside the airframe.
Some folks consider last task before first flight
to be a wash and wax job, why not make it a
battery installation instead?
**************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL
Home.
(http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15&ncid=aolhom00030000000001)
Message 2
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| Subject: | Connecting External Power Supply |
Guys,
For an external power supply such as Samlex 1223, if this is connected at t
he alternator, I assume the + lead can be connected directly to the B-lead.
Does the - lead just connect to the engine or any common ground to simulat
e the alternator power?
Jim
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Any Ray Allen LED Dimming Circuit ideas? |
> Panel is all wired up, just some fine tuning. One item is that the Ray Allen
LED trim indicators are too bright when switched to ? brightness.
>
> I have scanned the net for a way to convert them to a linear dimming range but
have found nothing. I am at point of installing a switch to turn them off except
when needed. Vince H. Idaho RV-8
The LM3914 Bar Graph Driver chip used by RAC/MAC is a clever little device. But
it has its limitations too. Usually people don't complain about the bright "Day"
output, since most airplanes have too much sun in them anyway. But if you
want to dim the bright output, you can add a 28K or so (a 50k 10-turn pot might
be nice) between the white lead and +, instead of being left open.
The "Night" output is connected to + directly, but there is a design limitation
to be understood...since the driver for the LEDs are in the chip, there is a
limit to the dynamic range that can be programmed. 10 to 1 is all you can get
by ordinary means. The "Night" output brightness is about at the bottom now,
so you can't get more dim.
"A witty saying proves nothing"
--Voltaire
--------
Eric M. Jones
www.PerihelionDesign.com
113 Brentwood Drive
Southbridge, MA 01550
(508) 764-2072
emjones@charter.net
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=173937#173937
Message 4
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| Subject: | E-Buss diode vs. Switch |
I am planning to follow Aeroelectric's Z13 / 8 diagram; but as I've
started wiring, I was looking at the diode that separates the e-buss
from the main buss. In use, the diode allows power to flow from the
main to the e-buss in normal use. However, should the main buss fail,
the pilot 'flips' a switch to allow power to flow from the Battery buss
to the e-buss and power cannot feed the main buss because of the diode.
My question is this; why not eliminate the diode and replace the on-off
switch with an on-on switch so power is fed either from the Battery Buss
or the Main Buss but never both? Either way the pilot manually changes
the switch and the diode is not needed (and you eliminate any voltage
reduction due to the diode). Apparently I'm missing something, can
somewhat explain what that is? Thanks much, Harold
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: E-Buss diode vs. Switch |
The purpose of the E-bus is to be able to achieve a rapid load reduction in
case of either alternator failure, main battery contactor failure, or a
stuck starter. To understand the need for the diode approach, you need to
examine your switching alternatives and the effect on running equipment
under each scenario if you use a switch instead of a diode.
For example, if the alternator has failed, which will normally be deduced
from falling voltage, you will need to switch THREE switches (alternate feed
ON, contactor OFF, inter-bus OFF) to get to the load reduction -- otherwise
the alternate feed will back feed the main bus. If you switch in the wrong
sequence (harder to avoid with three) you may also shut down and/or reboot
gear you'd, uh, rather keep running. :-) Either way, that's "suboptimal".
If the main battery contactor fails, you still have three switches to throw
to be sure you're settling things down, and if you don't flip three or are
unsure of the problem, you are still feeding current to the downstream side
of a battery contactor that is at best in an uncertain condition. If you
have a stuck starter (whether contactor or motor) you''re back to having to
flip three switches.
The voltage drop associated with the diode is a minimal price to pay for the
simplicity and reliability of the diode approach. Note that when you have
feed through the main bus and diode, you're going to be running with the
alternator/regulator in play anyway, and by definition should have more than
adequate of voltage even through the diode. Further, that voltage drop can
be greatly minimized to the point of being inconsequential by using a
Schottky diode, such as those available from Perihelion.
Bottom line, the voltage drop issue only exists when you have an alternator
anyway, it can be minimized by using a Schottky, and you will have fewer
switches to maintain, and flip.
Ron
On Mon, Mar 31, 2008 at 3:07 PM, Harold Lanfear <hlanfear@verizon.net>
wrote:
> I am planning to follow Aeroelectric's Z13 / 8 diagram; but as I've
> started wiring, I was looking at the diode that separates the e-buss from
> the main buss. In use, the diode allows power to flow from the main to the
> e-buss in normal use. However, should the main buss fail, the pilot 'flips'
> a switch to allow power to flow from the Battery buss to the e-buss and
> power cannot feed the main buss because of the diode.
>
> My question is this; why not eliminate the diode and replace the on-off
> switch with an on-on switch so power is fed either from the Battery Buss or
> the Main Buss but never both? Either way the pilot manually changes the
> switch and the diode is not needed (and you eliminate any voltage reduction
> due to the diode). Apparently I'm missing something, can somewhat explain
> what that is? Thanks much, Harold
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
Message 6
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I'm working on the wiring harness for my KLN90B GPS. The instructions
for the lighting circuits are not 100% clear to me. There are three
pins for a 14V install: two for "Lighting Bus Low" (pins 28 and 32) and
one "14 V DC Panel Lighting Bus"/HI (pin 29) (figures 2-1 and 2-17 from
the installation manual are attached). Where should these be sourced?
More specifically, what is a "LO" source? Is the "14 V DC Panel
Lighting Bus" the dimmer switch? .or am I wrong on both counts? Is
there something else that I'm missing? This will be a VFR installation.
Thanks,
Michael H.
Message 7
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| Subject: | Large Gauge Wire Crimper |
I saw this under homemade tools for a Volvo.
Ron Parigoris
Large Gauge Wire Crimper. [Tip from Tom Harper] Ever needed to get a
solidly crimped electrical terminal on larger cables (8 - 4 gauge), but
found the cost of crimp tools in that size to cause "sticker shock"?
Here's something I've been doing - it works for UNinsulated terminals.
1. Measure the OD of the uninsulated terminal barrel you need to crimp
2. Find (or buy - a dime or so) a nut with a thread size (thread OD - not
ID) equal to or slightly smaller than the size in step 1
3. Drill out the nut to match the terminal OD
4. Cut the nut in half, across opposing corners (NOT across the flats).
Your Dremel tool will come in handy for this - a hacksaw will do it also,
just takes more time.
5. Find a piece of round stock about 1/8" - 3/16" (3-4 mm) diameter, about
3/8" (1 cm) long (you can cut the head off a screw for this - the threads
won't affect anything.) You now have a "saddle" and a "punch" (halved
nut & screw/round stock piece).
6. Put the terminal in the "saddle", and the "punch" lying lengthwise on
top of the terminal, opposite the "saddle" - you'll probably want to tape
the assembly together, otherwise it takes 3 or 4 hands.
7. Put the cable end into the terminal, and crimp the whole works together
using a bench vise, Vise-Grips, or equivalent. The "saddle" supports the
bottom of the terminal, while the "punch" crimps everything nice & tight.
I've gotten really tight & secure crimps on up to 4 gauge cable by hand
with this method. After a dozen or so uses, the nut may crack & start to
spread; no problem, since you have the other half, and making new
"saddles" is easy & cheap anyway.
Make sure your terminal barrel ID is close to the wire OD - this method
doesn't do too well if there's a lot of empty space between the wire and
the terminal. You may be a bit clumsy at first, but once you work out a
way to keep everything aligned as you start the crimp, it'll go really
well. The new Vice-Grip adjustable wrench is ideal for this - the
"V"-shaped jaw is ideal for supporting the "saddle".
Volvo content - used this trick yesterday when making some "overkill" (4
gauge) engine-to-body ground and alternator-to-starter terminal cables.
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: KLN90B Lighting |
Michael,
I suspect the LO connections are just panel lighting grounds and HI is
supply voltage for your panel lighting. There may be other opinions on this
.
As an aside, I've just bought a used KLN90B and I'm looking for instal/user
manuals. Any chance of copies or links to same?
thanks, Ian - in Canberra
On Tue, Apr 1, 2008 at 11:01 AM, Michael Hinchcliff <cfi@conwaycorp.net>
wrote:
> I'm working on the wiring harness for my KLN90B GPS. The instructions
> for the lighting circuits are not 100% clear to me. There are three pin
s
> for a 14V install: two for "Lighting Bus Low" (pins 28 and 32) and one
> "14 V DC Panel Lighting Bus"/HI (pin 29) (figures 2-1 and 2-17 from the
> installation manual are attached). Where should these be sourced? More
> specifically, what is a "LO" source? Is the "14 V DC Panel Lighting Bus
"
> the dimmer switch? =85or am I wrong on both counts? Is there something
> else that I'm missing? This will be a VFR installation.
>
>
> Thanks,
> Michael H.
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: KLN90B Lighting |
At 07:01 PM 3/31/2008 -0500, you wrote:
>Im working on the wiring harness for my KLN90B GPS. The instructions for
>the lighting circuits are not 100% clear to me. There are three pins for
>a 14V install: two for Lighting Bus Low (pins 28 and 32) and one 14 V
>DC Panel Lighting Bus"/HI (pin 29) (figures 2-1 and 2-17 from the
>installation manual are attached). Where should these be sourced? More
>specifically, what is a LO source? Is the 14 V DC Panel Lighting Bus
>the dimmer switch? or am I wrong on both counts? Is there something
>else that Im missing? This will be a VFR installation.'
There are two strings of 14v lights in series. The
14V wiring grounds the top end of the 28V string
and drives the center with the two ends in parallel.
For 28V, the 14V center tap is left open and one
of the 14V "lo" connections becomes the 28V
lighting load.
Bob . . .
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: E-Buss diode vs. Switch |
At 06:07 PM 3/31/2008 -0400, you wrote:
>I am planning to follow Aeroelectric's Z13 / 8 diagram; but as I've
>started wiring, I was looking at the diode that separates the e-buss from
>the main buss. In use, the diode allows power to flow from the main to
>the e-buss in normal use. However, should the main buss fail, the pilot
>'flips' a switch to allow power to flow from the Battery buss to the
>e-buss and power cannot feed the main buss because of the diode.
>
>My question is this; why not eliminate the diode and replace the on-off
>switch with an on-on switch so power is fed either from the Battery Buss
>or the Main Buss but never both? Either way the pilot manually changes
>the switch and the diode is not needed (and you eliminate any voltage
>reduction due to the diode). Apparently I'm missing something, can
>somewhat explain what that is? Thanks
Voltage drop in diode is not significant. Use of
single switch offers a single point of failure for
BOTH power paths to the e-bus. Recommend you wire
as depicted.
Bob . . .
----------------------------------------)
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
----------------------------------------
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Connecting External Power Supply |
At 08:28 AM 3/31/2008 -0700, you wrote:
>Guys,
>
>
>For an external power supply such as Samlex 1223, if this is connected at
>the alternator, I assume the + lead can be connected directly to the
>B-lead. Does the lead just connect to the engine or any common ground to
>simulate the alternator power?
Yes.
----------------------------------------)
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
----------------------------------------
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: E-Buss diode vs. Switch |
At 03:52 PM 3/31/2008 -0700, you wrote:
>The purpose of the E-bus is to be able to achieve a rapid load reduction
>in case of either alternator failure, main battery contactor failure, or a
>stuck starter. To understand the need for the diode approach, you need to
>examine your switching alternatives and the effect on running equipment
>under each scenario if you use a switch instead of a diode.
>
>For example, if the alternator has failed, which will normally be deduced
>from falling voltage, you will need to switch THREE switches (alternate
>feed ON, contactor OFF, inter-bus OFF) to get to the load reduction --
>otherwise the alternate feed will back feed the main bus. If you switch in
>the wrong sequence (harder to avoid with three) you may also shut down
>and/or reboot gear you'd, uh, rather keep running. :-) Either way, that's
>"suboptimal".
>
>If the main battery contactor fails, you still have three switches to
>throw to be sure you're settling things down, and if you don't flip three
>or are unsure of the problem, you are still feeding current to the
>downstream side of a battery contactor that is at best in an uncertain
>condition. If you have a stuck starter (whether contactor or motor)
>you''re back to having to flip three switches.
>
>The voltage drop associated with the diode is a minimal price to pay for
>the simplicity and reliability of the diode approach. Note that when you
>have feed through the main bus and diode, you're going to be running with
>the alternator/regulator in play anyway, and by definition should have
>more than adequate of voltage even through the diode. Further, that
>voltage drop can be greatly minimized to the point of being
>inconsequential by using a Schottky diode, such as those available from
>Perihelion.
>
>Bottom line, the voltage drop issue only exists when you have an
>alternator anyway, it can be minimized by using a Schottky, and you will
>have fewer switches to maintain, and flip.
>
>Ron
Excellent treatise on the subject sir . . .
Bob . . .
>On Mon, Mar 31, 2008 at 3:07 PM, Harold Lanfear
><<mailto:hlanfear@verizon.net>hlanfear@verizon.net> wrote:
>>I am planning to follow Aeroelectric's Z13 / 8 diagram; but as I've
>>started wiring, I was looking at the diode that separates the e-buss from
>>the main buss. In use, the diode allows power to flow from the main to
>>the e-buss in normal use. However, should the main buss fail, the pilot
>>'flips' a switch to allow power to flow from the Battery buss to the
>>e-buss and power cannot feed the main buss because of the diode.
>>
>>My question is this; why not eliminate the diode and replace the on-off
>>switch with an on-on switch so power is fed either from the Battery Buss
>>or the Main Buss but never both? Either way the pilot manually changes
>>the switch and the diode is not needed (and you eliminate any voltage
>>reduction due to the diode). Apparently I'm missing something, can
>>somewhat explain what that is? Thanks much, Harold
>>
>>
Message 13
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| Subject: | Off line for a few days. |
I'm climbing into the big iron bird tomorrow morning to join
my co-conspirators at the facilities of a couple of clients.
Then instead of coming straight home I'll be joining Dr. Dee
in KC for some goof-off time. There's a really good Mexican
restaurant and a couple of good BBQ places we plan to
visit!
Be back Sunday.
Bob . . .
----------------------------------------)
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
----------------------------------------
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: KLN90B Lighting |
An avionics guy explained to that Low is another word for ground. My
icom and ps engineering audio panel used the same terms and that is how
I wired them.
Jerry
----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Hinchcliff
To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, March 31, 2008 8:01 PM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: KLN90B Lighting
I'm working on the wiring harness for my KLN90B GPS. The instructions
for the lighting circuits are not 100% clear to me. There are three
pins for a 14V install: two for "Lighting Bus Low" (pins 28 and 32) and
one "14 V DC Panel Lighting Bus"/HI (pin 29) (figures 2-1 and 2-17 from
the installation manual are attached). Where should these be sourced?
More specifically, what is a "LO" source? Is the "14 V DC Panel
Lighting Bus" the dimmer switch? .or am I wrong on both counts? Is
there something else that I'm missing? This will be a VFR installation.
Thanks,
Michael H.
Message 15
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| Subject: | Off line for a few days. |
Bob,
If you are in KC on Thurs, I can highly recommend Tanners (sports bar) on
Broadway for some EXCELLENT fillet mignon and fried shrimp. Decent salad
and baked potato, too. For 10 bucks (2004 dollars) you can't beat it!
Enjoy, Don
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-
> server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert L. Nuckolls, III
> Sent: Monday, March 31, 2008 9:49 PM
> To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
> Subject: AeroElectric-List: Off line for a few days.
>
> <nuckolls.bob@cox.net>
>
> I'm climbing into the big iron bird tomorrow morning to join
> my co-conspirators at the facilities of a couple of clients.
> Then instead of coming straight home I'll be joining Dr. Dee
> in KC for some goof-off time. There's a really good Mexican
> restaurant and a couple of good BBQ places we plan to
> visit!
>
> Be back Sunday.
>
>
> Bob . . .
>
> ----------------------------------------)
> ( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
> ( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
> ( appearance of being right . . . )
> ( )
> ( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
> ----------------------------------------
>
>
>
>
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