---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 06/05/08: 16 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 04:35 AM - SllckStart Troubleshooting () 2. 07:26 AM - Re: Bridge Diodes use (Eric M. Jones) 3. 07:30 AM - Pseudo-science run amok . . . (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 4. 09:01 AM - Re: Pseudo-science run amok . . . (RV Builder (Michael Sausen)) 5. 11:14 AM - Re: Pseudo-science run amok . . . (Eric M. Jones) 6. 11:15 AM - Re: Re: Bridge Diodes use (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 7. 11:51 AM - Re: Re: Pseudo-science run amok . . . (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 8. 12:06 PM - Re: Re: Pseudo-science run amok . . . (RV Builder (Michael Sausen)) 9. 12:07 PM - Re: Re: Pseudo-science run amok . . . (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)) 10. 12:47 PM - Re: Re: Pseudo-science run amok . . . (Ernest Christley) 11. 01:03 PM - Re: Re: Pseudo-science run amok . . . (Chuck Jensen) 12. 01:36 PM - Re: Re: Pseudo-science run amok . . . (Bill Boyd) 13. 02:24 PM - Re: Pseudo-science run amok . . . (Eric M. Jones) 14. 04:08 PM - Wire Labeling Question (Dave VanLanen) 15. 04:23 PM - Re: Wire Labeling Question (Don Vs) 16. 06:56 PM - CD ROM Question (Dave VanLanen) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:35:12 AM PST US From: Subject: AeroElectric-List: SllckStart Troubleshooting 6/5/2008 Hello Dave, Thanks for your very interesting input. I operate a SlickStart unit on a TCM IO-240 B9B engine and am very interested in anything related to the system. A semantic quibble. You wrote: "That does make sense, because one of the first things I did was to check the mag timing, and I found it had advanced about 10 degrees, to about 15 BTC on the main points and about 10 past TC on the retard points." Don't your numbers mean that the timing had retarded (further) to those figures rather than advanced? In the normal condition for a running engine the spark happens some 20 plus degrees before piston top dead center so any spark happening later in time than normal is considered retarded. 'OC' Says: "The best investment we can make is the effort to gather and understand knowledge." ------------------------------------------------- Time: 09:56:13 PM PST US From: "Dave Saylor" Subject: AeroElectric-List: SlilckStart Troubleshooting If your SlickStart doesn't seem to be starting so slick, read on. Our RV-10 developed a starting problem in that in suddenly becare VERY difficult to start. For 130 hours it had been starting quite nicely, but the last time I tired, I just had to give up. N921AC has two slick mags, one with retard points on the left, and a SlickStart solid state starting module, essentially a newer version of the Shower of Sparks system. I went through all the normal troubleshooting and figured the problem must be the SlickStart module. I wasn't getting any spark at the plug with the SlickStart powered up and the retard points in firing position. I called Unison just to make sure I was checking the right things, and they confirmed it had to be the SlickStart. So I changed it. No help. I checked as many things as I could think of: timing, p-leads, harness, fuse, grounds.. I knew the points were opening because my timing box was indicating OK. I knew the mag was basically sound because when we had managed to get it started (I won't go into how...), it ran fine with a normal mag drop. I finally gave up and sent the mag and both SlickStarts (old one and new one) to LyCon, where I got my engine. They put it on their magneto bench, and came up with the following explanation. This is somewhat untested, but it makes sense and all the evidence >>points<< to it. Sorry, I couldn't resist. Ken at LyCon explained to me that the capacitor had failed, and in so doing had caused the frame of the points (both sets, I guess), to get warm enough to accelerate the wear of the cam follower. So, both points were technically opening, but just barely enough to trip the timing light. Maybe .001 or .002 inches instead of .012 or more. That does make sense, because one of the first things I did was to check the mag timing, and I found it had advanced about 10 degrees, to about 15 BTC on the main points and about 10 past TC on the retard points. I just reset the timing and went on troubleshooting. As the cam follower wears, it retards the spark. Part of the SlickStart troubleshooting says to look for ~300 volts from the output. If the points were barely opening, I think that 300 volts would be able to jump the gap and essentially ground through the retard points instead of exciting the primary coil. I installed my old mag after LyCon replaced boths sets of points and the capacitor, and it worked fine. So the upshot is, if the SlickStart troubleshooting points to a bad module, it's probably worth physically checking the point gap with a feeler gauge, instead of just with the timing box before you replace the module. In retrospect I wish Unison would have suggested that. Dave Saylor AirCrafters LLC 140 Aviation Way Watsonville, CA 831-722-9141 831-750-0284 CL www.AirCraftersLLC.com 135 hours ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 07:26:12 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Bridge Diodes use From: "Eric M. Jones" > Note 24. When you have critical loads that you would like > to accommodate with dual power sources, the 4-diode > bridge rectifier offers an easy to acquire, easy to mount, > easy to wire solution. The figure for this note illustrates > which terminals are used. Figure Z-19 shows one example > of how the device is used. > If your critical system draws more than 4 but less than 8 > amps, the diode bridge should be mounted on a metallic > surface for heat sinking. If the loads are heavier, say 8 amps > up to the 25 or 30 amp rating of the device, perhaps a finned > heat sink is called for. Consult the membership of the > AeroElectric List for guidance in these special cases. But let's be careful out there. Remember that a 25A Full Wave Bride is made up of four 12.5 Amp diodes. One must never make the mistake of thinking you can use it for 25A currents in a power-source-selecting circuit like Z-19. Bigger diodes are required. "In times of rapid change, experience could be your worst enemy." ---Jean Paul Getty -------- Eric M. Jones www.PerihelionDesign.com 113 Brentwood Drive Southbridge, MA 01550 (508) 764-2072 emjones@charter.net Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=186362#186362 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 07:30:41 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Pseudo-science run amok . . . A friend of mine turned me on to what must be a relatively new phenomenon running through the ranks of the poorly educated, easily scammed members of society. Do a Google search on "HHO Gas" and/or "Browns Gas" and watch what pops up. Do the same search on Ebay and see how many different products are being offered (and unfortunately . . . purchased) to individuals believing that this simple 7th grade science experiment offers relief from high gas prices. There's an important law of thermodynamics (2nd I think) that states that energy is never created, only transformed. Further, any transformation is never 100% efficient. So the process of breaking water into it's constituent gaseous components takes more energy to accomplish than the energy you will get back by burning those gasses later (in your car or elsewhere). Unfortunately for victims of poor schooling (or inattention in good schools), a great deal of money will change hands to the benefit of those who sell "hope". Show this to your families and especially any kids you know. This has to be a prime example of dishonorable behaviors that prey on the ignorant in a world-wide scale! Honorable skepticism is the citizen's most effective defense from hucksters and cheats. Bob . . . ----------------------------------------) ( . . . a long habit of not thinking ) ( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial ) ( appearance of being right . . . ) ( ) ( -Thomas Paine 1776- ) ---------------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 09:01:51 AM PST US From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Pseudo-science run amok . . . Two things about this, don't confuse the scams with an HHO torch which is a real thing and has nothing to do with increasing mileage or free fuel. Second you can absolutely get more energy out of water than you put into it. Doesn't anyone recall the Mr Fusion on the DeLorean time machine? HA! Do not archive this garbage that has nothing to do with the group subject matter and anyone in their right mind should know better of. -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert L. Nuckolls, III Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 9:26 AM Subject: AeroElectric-List: Pseudo-science run amok . . . A friend of mine turned me on to what must be a relatively new phenomenon running through the ranks of the poorly educated, easily scammed members of society. Do a Google search on "HHO Gas" and/or "Browns Gas" and watch what pops up. Do the same search on Ebay and see how many different products are being offered (and unfortunately . . . purchased) to individuals believing that this simple 7th grade science experiment offers relief from high gas prices. There's an important law of thermodynamics (2nd I think) that states that energy is never created, only transformed. Further, any transformation is never 100% efficient. So the process of breaking water into it's constituent gaseous components takes more energy to accomplish than the energy you will get back by burning those gasses later (in your car or elsewhere). Unfortunately for victims of poor schooling (or inattention in good schools), a great deal of money will change hands to the benefit of those who sell "hope". Show this to your families and especially any kids you know. This has to be a prime example of dishonorable behaviors that prey on the ignorant in a world-wide scale! Honorable skepticism is the citizen's most effective defense from hucksters and cheats. Bob . . . ----------------------------------------) ( . . . a long habit of not thinking ) ( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial ) ( appearance of being right . . . ) ( ) ( -Thomas Paine 1776- ) ---------------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 11:14:32 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Pseudo-science run amok . . . From: "Eric M. Jones" A number of people have asked me about this hydrogen-from-water thing ("hydro-gen" means "makes water", by the way). I explain to them that water is the burnt ashes of chemical processes and is at the lowest possible chemical energy stable state. Just because a fire and its ashes are related doesn't mean the ashes have any chemical energy left in them. Only by adding lots of energy to the water can you get anything useful back out. Nothing is going to change this--the vast oceans stand as mute witness to this fact. Coincidentally, yesterday a friend of mine told me that diesel truckers used water injection AND acetylene. The problem with all these ideas is that engines using various fuel saving, power boosting schemes have far shorter lifetimes. This doesn't matter to the military but would matter to the public. (Do Not Archive) -------- Eric M. Jones www.PerihelionDesign.com 113 Brentwood Drive Southbridge, MA 01550 (508) 764-2072 emjones@charter.net Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=186386#186386 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 11:15:28 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Bridge Diodes use At 07:21 AM 6/5/2008 -0700, you wrote: > > > > Note 24. When you have critical loads that you would like > > to accommodate with dual power sources, the 4-diode > > bridge rectifier offers an easy to acquire, easy to mount, > > easy to wire solution. The figure for this note illustrates > > which terminals are used. Figure Z-19 shows one example > > of how the device is used. > > If your critical system draws more than 4 but less than 8 > > amps, the diode bridge should be mounted on a metallic > > surface for heat sinking. If the loads are heavier, say 8 amps > > up to the 25 or 30 amp rating of the device, perhaps a finned > > heat sink is called for. Consult the membership of the > > AeroElectric List for guidance in these special cases. > > >But let's be careful out there. Remember that a 25A Full Wave Bride is >made up of four 12.5 Amp diodes. One must never make the mistake of >thinking you can use it for 25A currents in a power-source-selecting >circuit like Z-19. Bigger diodes are required. True! When I picked the bridge rectifier assembly for it's mechanical considerations (easy mounting, fast-on tab connections) the smallest device that came in that package was a 25A rated, full wave rectifier. 35A devices also come in that package. See: http://aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Misc/s401-25.jpg It didn't occur to me then that a builder would find a practical application that would 'overload' the device electrically. As you've accurately pointed out, there are applications other than e-bus normal feed-path circuits that could begin to load one of these critters to it's rated limits. Referring to an exemplar data sheet . . . http://aeroelectric.com/Mfgr_Data/Semiconductors/gbpc12.pdf . . . it's not clear but should be understood by the astute reader that only 1/2 of the components of a bridge rectifier are 'working' at any given time on alternate half-cycles of the incoming AC waveform. The data sheets don't offer a continuous duty rating for single devices. In practice, I suspect the individual devices can be used at more than 1/2 the ratings for the total package. It's a matter of getting the heat out. From the neophyte builder's perspective, limiting continuous current on a single device to 1/2 the rated current for the whole device is a no-brainer conservative approach that will not disappoint. But keep in mind that ANY semi-conductor loaded to it's maximum continuous ratings dissipates heat . . . energy that must be removed through the mounting surfaces for the device. Further, no matter how large the ratings for any device - if the installation does not also take care of the heat generated. 10A of current flowing in a 100A rate part can smoke the device! There's nothing electrically 'magic' about the diode bridge rectifier illustrated above. It was originally suggested for its convenience of installation into systems that originally placed very low demands on its electrical abilities . . . no large concerns for rejecting heat. However, as one considers pushing the practical limits for this or any other device, close attention to ratings, limits and installation is called for. Thanks for bringing this up Eric. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 11:51:57 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Pseudo-science run amok . . . At 11:10 AM 6/5/2008 -0700, you wrote: > >A number of people have asked me about this hydrogen-from-water thing >("hydro-gen" means "makes water", by the way). I explain to them that >water is the burnt ashes of chemical processes and is at the lowest >possible chemical energy stable state. Just because a fire and its ashes >are related doesn't mean the ashes have any chemical energy left in them. >Only by adding lots of energy to the water can you get anything useful >back out. Nothing is going to change this--the vast oceans stand as mute >witness to this fact. > >Coincidentally, yesterday a friend of mine told me that diesel truckers >used water injection AND acetylene. The problem with all these ideas is >that engines using various fuel saving, power boosting schemes have far >shorter lifetimes. This doesn't matter to the military but would matter to >the public. Good point. Another oft ignored feature of "alternative" technologies is big-picture economics. Some colleagues of mine at Lear did a study on water-alcohol injection for carbureted engines with the idea of being able to run mo-gas in 100 octane engines by using injection at low- altitude full throttle conditions and limiting manifold pressures for remainder of flight (most of which is at altitude). The idea being that a 100 octane engine running full throttle at altitude can't really use all that the fuel has to offer. After running all the numbers on the full envelope of flight scenarios (including extended forced operations at low altitude) it was determined that the amount of mixture to be carried combined with weight and volume of installed hardware painted an un-attractive big-picture image. This study didn't even touch on the effects of large differences in lead between 100LL and mo-gas. It's easy to get sucked into the vortex of excitement that surrounds some ideas. I'll suggest that 90+ percent of ideas enshrined in the patent office have no useful place in an attractive big-picture. Only after the idea finds useful application in a repeated recipe for success is it time to reach for the credit card. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 12:06:26 PM PST US From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Re: Pseudo-science run amok . . . Haven't heard of the acetylene injection before but propane injection in diesels is common and the equivalent of NOS in gas engines. Water injection is for the same reasons as aircraft engines, anti-knock and cooling with a side effect of reducing NOX emissions which is the big problem with diesels. Do not archive -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Eric M. Jones Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 1:11 PM Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Pseudo-science run amok . . . A number of people have asked me about this hydrogen-from-water thing ("hydro-gen" means "makes water", by the way). I explain to them that water is the burnt ashes of chemical processes and is at the lowest possible chemical energy stable state. Just because a fire and its ashes are related doesn't mean the ashes have any chemical energy left in them. Only by adding lots of energy to the water can you get anything useful back out. Nothing is going to change this--the vast oceans stand as mute witness to this fact. Coincidentally, yesterday a friend of mine told me that diesel truckers used water injection AND acetylene. The problem with all these ideas is that engines using various fuel saving, power boosting schemes have far shorter lifetimes. This doesn't matter to the military but would matter to the public. (Do Not Archive) -------- Eric M. Jones www.PerihelionDesign.com 113 Brentwood Drive Southbridge, MA 01550 (508) 764-2072 emjones@charter.net Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=186386#186386 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 12:07:08 PM PST US From: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Re: Pseudo-science run amok . . . Well funny that 'cus a friend of a friend..has another friend who swears that by using battery current make hydrogen from a water sample and then sucking the resulant gas into the carb intake he's like getting 60mpg from his Subaru station wagon..he was waxing enthusiastically about this and of course now everyone at our table wanted to try this out. When I suggested that "it just doesn't add up"...using the exact argument below I was of course told I was just a party pooper and it MUST work right? Hmm...but the numbers don't add up..If they did, then why not remove the gasoline altogether and run the entire engine on water and just use the "spare" little bit of current it would take to turn water into wine...I mean into hydrogen. I told them I was highly scptical..:) Frank -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Eric M. Jones Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 11:11 AM Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Pseudo-science run amok . . . --> A number of people have asked me about this hydrogen-from-water thing ("hydro-gen" means "makes water", by the way). I explain to them that water is the burnt ashes of chemical processes and is at the lowest possible chemical energy stable state. Just because a fire and its ashes are related doesn't mean the ashes have any chemical energy left in them. Only by adding lots of energy to the water can you get anything useful back out. Nothing is going to change this--the vast oceans stand as mute witness to this fact. Coincidentally, yesterday a friend of mine told me that diesel truckers used water injection AND acetylene. The problem with all these ideas is that engines using various fuel saving, power boosting schemes have far shorter lifetimes. This doesn't matter to the military but would matter to the public. (Do Not Archive) -------- Eric M. Jones www.PerihelionDesign.com 113 Brentwood Drive Southbridge, MA 01550 (508) 764-2072 emjones@charter.net Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=186386#186386 ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 12:47:17 PM PST US From: Ernest Christley Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Pseudo-science run amok . . . Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis) wrote: > > Well funny that 'cus a friend of a friend..has another friend who swears that by using battery current make hydrogen from a water sample and then sucking the resulant gas into the carb intake he's like getting 60mpg from his Subaru station wagon..he was waxing enthusiastically about this and of course now everyone at our table wanted to try this out. > > When I suggested that "it just doesn't add up"...using the exact argument below I was of course told I was just a party pooper and it MUST work right? > > Hmm...but the numbers don't add up..If they did, then why not remove the gasoline altogether and run the entire engine on water and just use the "spare" little bit of current it would take to turn water into wine...I mean into hydrogen. > > I told them I was highly scptical..:) > > Frank > > > The last time fuel prices were bumping their way up, there were two big rages. On was to put a magnet on the fuel line just before the carbeurator (supposed to align the molecules and make them burn straight). Some schools systems bought into the idea around here. Never heard much more about it. The other was a plug of platinum in the fuel line. Tiny amounts of platinum cause the fuel to burn closer to completion was the claim. Heh, platinum is used in the catalytic converter, why not just move that into the combustion chamber. That idea quietly fell by the wayside also. Adding hydrogen or propane actually does have some merit in some older installations, but not for any of the magical handwaving reasons usually given. The fact is that these compounds ignite easily, and for years the typical car was so poorly tuned that ANYTHING would improve the combustion process. Trying to tell the people that a $100 tune-up would do more good is just a waste of breath. Highly compromised intake systems would also cause mixture problems. The advent of computer controls, fuel injection, and ignition systems that are self adjusting has obliterated the usefulness of such measures. I point this out, because most airplane engines don't take advantage of modern technology to improve the combustion process. Consider the trick of slight closing the throttle, so that the plate will increase turbulence and improve the mixture distribution on some Lycomings. A propane injection system could be a solution that would equalize the combustion events across pistons, while still providing full power, or allow the engine to run leaner. ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 01:03:39 PM PST US Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Re: Pseudo-science run amok . . . From: "Chuck Jensen" Heck, I've got so many of those energy saving and creating devices on my plane that I have to stop every 300 miles or so and drain the excess fuel from my tanks. Chuck Jensen -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis) Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 3:03 PM Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Re: Pseudo-science run amok . . . Well funny that 'cus a friend of a friend..has another friend who swears that by using battery current make hydrogen from a water sample and then sucking the resulant gas into the carb intake he's like getting 60mpg from his Subaru station wagon..he was waxing enthusiastically about this and of course now everyone at our table wanted to try this out. When I suggested that "it just doesn't add up"...using the exact argument below I was of course told I was just a party pooper and it MUST work right? Hmm...but the numbers don't add up..If they did, then why not remove the gasoline altogether and run the entire engine on water and just use the "spare" little bit of current it would take to turn water into wine...I mean into hydrogen. I told them I was highly scptical..:) Frank -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Eric M. Jones Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 11:11 AM Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Pseudo-science run amok . . . --> A number of people have asked me about this hydrogen-from-water thing ("hydro-gen" means "makes water", by the way). I explain to them that water is the burnt ashes of chemical processes and is at the lowest possible chemical energy stable state. Just because a fire and its ashes are related doesn't mean the ashes have any chemical energy left in them. Only by adding lots of energy to the water can you get anything useful back out. Nothing is going to change this--the vast oceans stand as mute witness to this fact. Coincidentally, yesterday a friend of mine told me that diesel truckers used water injection AND acetylene. The problem with all these ideas is that engines using various fuel saving, power boosting schemes have far shorter lifetimes. This doesn't matter to the military but would matter to the public. (Do Not Archive) -------- Eric M. Jones www.PerihelionDesign.com 113 Brentwood Drive Southbridge, MA 01550 (508) 764-2072 emjones@charter.net Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=186386#186386 ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 01:36:57 PM PST US From: "Bill Boyd" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Pseudo-science run amok . . . Chuck, you need to have your spark plug electrodes ground to a "custom airfoil shape." Then you'll become a true petroleum exporter ;-) Bill B On Thu, Jun 5, 2008 at 3:58 PM, Chuck Jensen wrote: > cjensen@dts9000.com> > > Heck, I've got so many of those energy saving and creating devices on my > plane that I have to stop every 300 miles or so and drain the excess fuel > from my tanks. > > Chuck Jensen > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 02:24:31 PM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Pseudo-science run amok . . . From: "Eric M. Jones" My Infiniti J30t had so little CO in the exhaust that you couldn't commit suicide with it. Recently, after a lot of Internet study, I changed my 2004 Jeep Grand Cherokee paper air filter to a K&N high-flow metal air filter. As reported on the Internet, and SO FAR from my own brief experience, it seems to get 10% better (displayed) mileage. But it's still early in the averaging to be certain. I think an alternate-air door would do good things for most vehicles and would cost almost nothing. There are computer chips that actually do deliver better mileage. They are about $450, so payback can take a while. I do need to add an anti-squirrel screen. The filter air-box is filling with acorns again. My old Jeep nearly blew its engine because of acorns jammed in the throttle plate and intake valves. [Do Not Archive] -------- Eric M. Jones www.PerihelionDesign.com 113 Brentwood Drive Southbridge, MA 01550 (508) 764-2072 emjones@charter.net Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=186414#186414 ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 04:08:14 PM PST US From: "Dave VanLanen" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Wire Labeling Question I am trying to set up a simple labeling scheme for my wiring, as suggested in the AeroElectric manual,. I will have a basic day VFR airplane, so there is no need for me to make it complex. What do you do for labeling when you have individual wires spliced to wires that run in a pre-sheathed bundle? For example, I am using a RAC servo for my elevator trim. It has 5 individual wires coming out of the servo, which are then connected to wires internal to a sheathed bundle provided by the factory, which routes forward to the cabin. The ends of the wires in the bundle are not accessible for labeling because, after applying heat shrink to each wire connection, a "blanket" heat shrink sheath was applied over all connections. ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 04:23:52 PM PST US From: "Don Vs" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Wire Labeling Question Wire Labeling QuestionAll of these wires are color dodes. you do not need to lable them, just enter the color code in your "wirebook". I choose to use #22 tefzel instead of the bundle that RAC supplies. I was therefore able to lable everything. Either way will work just fine. Don -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Dave VanLanen Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 4:04 PM To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Wire Labeling Question I am trying to set up a simple labeling scheme for my wiring, as suggested in the AeroElectric manual,. I will have a basic day VFR airplane, so there is no need for me to make it complex. What do you do for labeling when you have individual wires spliced to wires that run in a pre-sheathed bundle? For example, I am using a RAC servo for my elevator trim. It has 5 individual wires coming out of the servo, which are then connected to wires internal to a sheathed bundle provided by the factory, which routes forward to the cabin. The ends of the wires in the bundle are not accessible for labeling because, after applying heat shrink to each wire connection, a "blanket" heat shrink sheath was applied over all connections. ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 06:56:44 PM PST US From: "Dave VanLanen" Subject: AeroElectric-List: CD ROM Question I downloaded the CD ROM from the AeroElectric website, but I am unable to open the various drawings. I was told that the CD ROM should also contain .PDF copies of the drawings, but I cannot find them. Am I missing something? Does the purchased version contain more than the downloadable version? I am trying to find examples of wirebooks and wire labeling examples. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message aeroelectric-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/aeroelectric-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/aeroelectric-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.