Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:52 AM - Re: [OT] Pronunciation question (Richard Girard)
2. 05:41 AM - Re: Unshielded Twisted Pair (Ernest Christley)
3. 07:19 AM - Re: Unshielded Twisted Pair (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
4. 09:59 AM - Re: Unshielded Twisted Pair ()
5. 10:07 AM - Preferred Bulkhead Disconnects ()
6. 11:37 AM - Re: A Tale of Two Batteries (Ed Holyoke)
7. 11:59 AM - Re: Preferred Bulkhead Disconnects (Mike Humphrey)
8. 12:22 PM - Re: Preferred Bulkhead Disconnects (Ed Gilroy)
9. 01:42 PM - Re: Preferred Bulkhead Disconnects ()
10. 01:54 PM - Re: Capacitance Probes ()
11. 02:51 PM - VDC Battery Minders (Ed Holyoke)
12. 03:03 PM - Re: [OT] Pronunciation question (Gilles Thesee)
13. 03:17 PM - Re: Re: Capacitance Probes (James Robinson)
14. 04:52 PM - Re: VDC Battery Minders (Ed Mueller)
15. 04:53 PM - Re: [OT] Pronunciation question (Robert McCallum)
16. 06:53 PM - Re: VDC Battery Minders (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
17. 07:40 PM - Re: VDC Battery Minders (follow up) (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
18. 07:58 PM - Re: Preferred Bulkhead Disconnects (Mike Humphrey)
Message 1
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Subject: | Re: [OT] Pronunciation question |
Bob, Your reference to the period being used as a decimal point is a bit
ethnocentric. Take a look at the manuals written for the Rotax engines. A
comma is used as the decimal point.Confusing? You bet. Drove me crazy at
first (just as the organization of the manuals did, too)
then I realized this was a "Mounties hat" situation and my head changed to
fit. :-}
Rick
On Mon, Sep 29, 2008 at 8:48 PM, raymondj <raymondj@frontiernet.net> wrote:
> raymondj@frontiernet.net>
>
> One point zero two eight would be my 1st choice.
>
> Common usage would also be one point oh two eight, but can lead to
> confusion between the letter "o" and the number "0".
>
> Hope this helps,
> Raymond Julian
> Kettle River, MN
>
> "Hope for the best,
> but prepare for the worst."
>
> do not archive
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gilles Thesee" <
> Gilles.Thesee@ac-grenoble.fr>
> To: <aeroelectric-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Monday, September 29, 2008 2:55 PM
> Subject: AeroElectric-List: [OT] Pronunciation question
>
>
>> Gilles.Thesee@ac-grenoble.fr>
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> No electrics this time.
>>
>> Some time ago the FCL 1.028 Language proficiency was implemented.
>> How do you natural English speakers pronounce FCL 1.028 ?
>>
>> One thousand twenty eight ?
>> One point....
>> etc..
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Best regards,
>> --
>> Gilles
>> http://contrails.free.fr
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
> 1:30 PM
>
>
Message 2
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Subject: | Re: Unshielded Twisted Pair |
Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote:
>
> Again, this goes to my earlier suggestion that wires
> should be twisted based on manufacturer's installation
> instructions . . . and the fact that one system get
> twisted wires doesn't mean that all systems should get
> them.
>
Just to be clear, twisting wires isn't 'bad', per se. It is just that
it isn't necessary. Correct?
If I have up to four wires following the same route (same origin and
destination), I tend to twist them. It's not for any electrical purpose
... just makes the installation neater and easier to handle. I have a
rack with four colors of wire in various gauges. Twisting more that
four wires doesn't create a tight bundle, so I switch to using looming
after that.
The technique does have the drawback that if one wire goes bad or is
damaged, I will have to replace two or more, but I figure there isn' t
much that can damage one that won't damage all of them if they're
following the same path anyway.
Message 3
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Subject: | Re: Unshielded Twisted Pair |
At 08:40 AM 9/30/2008 -0400, you wrote:
><echristley@nc.rr.com>
>
>Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote:
>>
>> Again, this goes to my earlier suggestion that wires
>> should be twisted based on manufacturer's installation
>> instructions . . . and the fact that one system get
>> twisted wires doesn't mean that all systems should get
>> them.
>
>Just to be clear, twisting wires isn't 'bad', per se. It is just that it
>isn't necessary. Correct?
Correct. It has a downside of making wire bundles more bulky.
>If I have up to four wires following the same route (same origin and
>destination), I tend to twist them. It's not for any electrical purpose
>... just makes the installation neater and easier to handle. I have a
>rack with four colors of wire in various gauges. Twisting more that four
>wires doesn't create a tight bundle, so I switch to using looming after that.
Nothing wrong with process-for-a-purpose. I've often
used my drill motor to twist a pair or trio of 22AWG
wires together for the purpose of bundling . . . just
as you've suggested. We just need to be careful that
our conversation is not mis-understood by bunches of
other folks and they start twisting everything under
a misguided notion that it automatically adds value.
>The technique does have the drawback that if one wire goes bad or is
>damaged, I will have to replace two or more, but I figure there isn' t
>much that can damage one that won't damage all of them if they're
>following the same path anyway.
This is an exceedingly low risk. It's been my experience
that single wires don't take mechanical hits very often.
Single wires are most at-risk from poor protection due
to over-current. When wires take mechanical hits, it
generally involves multiple wires.
Bob . . .
Message 4
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Subject: | Unshielded Twisted Pair |
Hey,
When I look behind my panel, all the wires are twisted :)
Do Not Archive.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Robert L. Nuckolls, III
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 10:18 AM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Unshielded Twisted Pair
--> <nuckolls.bob@cox.net>
At 08:40 AM 9/30/2008 -0400, you wrote:
><echristley@nc.rr.com>
>
>Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote:
>>
>> Again, this goes to my earlier suggestion that wires
>> should be twisted based on manufacturer's installation
>> instructions . . . and the fact that one system get
>> twisted wires doesn't mean that all systems should get
>> them.
>
>Just to be clear, twisting wires isn't 'bad', per se. It is just that
>it
>isn't necessary. Correct?
Correct. It has a downside of making wire bundles more bulky.
>If I have up to four wires following the same route (same origin and
>destination), I tend to twist them. It's not for any electrical
purpose
>... just makes the installation neater and easier to handle. I have a
>rack with four colors of wire in various gauges. Twisting more that
four
>wires doesn't create a tight bundle, so I switch to using looming after
that.
Nothing wrong with process-for-a-purpose. I've often
used my drill motor to twist a pair or trio of 22AWG
wires together for the purpose of bundling . . . just
as you've suggested. We just need to be careful that
our conversation is not mis-understood by bunches of
other folks and they start twisting everything under
a misguided notion that it automatically adds value.
>The technique does have the drawback that if one wire goes bad or is
>damaged, I will have to replace two or more, but I figure there isn' t
>much that can damage one that won't damage all of them if they're
>following the same path anyway.
This is an exceedingly low risk. It's been my experience
that single wires don't take mechanical hits very often.
Single wires are most at-risk from poor protection due
to over-current. When wires take mechanical hits, it
generally involves multiple wires.
Bob . . .
Message 5
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Subject: | Preferred Bulkhead Disconnects |
I have two 5 wire bundles coming off the wings which control lights and
trim. My wings are detachable and I want to incorporate bulkhead
disconnects. What approach have any of you taken which is cost effective
and relatively easy to plug and unplug? I do not have easy access (one
3" hole) outside the cockpit so I need to be able to manage unplugging,
securing etc from inside. Pictures welcome.
I have thought about fast tabs something or 9 pin d-subs. I am thinking
two 9 pin d's would be bulky. They would also need a good size hole to
feed them back through when the wing is removed.
Thanks,
Glenn
Message 6
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Subject: | Re: A Tale of Two Batteries |
Follow up:
I tested Battery 3 yesterday and quit at 11volts instead of 10.5 because
it had already proved itself and I wanted to get it on the charger
before I left the hangar. It tested to 25.4 ah at a 4 amp draw (and
stopping early). I have no doubt that it would last longer than my fuel
after an alternator failure. Displayed on the same graph as Battery 2,
it looks better, but only slightly. By the way, I looked closer and
these batteries are rated at 24 ah, not 25.
I think we'll probably set 16 or 17 amp hours as the bottom limit, test
at annual and run this battery for a long, long time to come. It might
take a while to pay for the CBA in un-replaced batteries, but the
knowledge of just how much is in there is priceless.
Pax,
Ed Holyoke
Ed Holyoke wrote:
> <bicyclop@pacbell.net>
>
> Howdy,
>
> I recently bought the West Mountain Radio CBA and did some tests on
> some old batteries. Here's what I found:
>
> Battery 1 came with our airplane and after about 2 years we decided to
> replace it. It is a Conorde RG-25XC rated at 25 ah. It was removed
> from the airplane in January of 06 and charged 2 or 3 times since. It
> mostly just sat. I charged it with a BatteryMINDer at 8 amps and
> discharged it at 4amps to 10.5v. It tested to 12.1 ah, or about half
> it's rated capacity.
>
> Battery 2 is the same make and model and is the battery which replaced
> Bat 1 in Jan/06. This battery gave no problems in service until the
> day that the positive cable chafed through and shorted against a
> stainless braided brake line in flight. It resulted in a smoke filled
> cabin and an emergency landing (on airport). When I arrived on the
> scene an hour and a half later, I moved the brake line away from the
> cable and measured 5 volts on the battery. Needless to say, the cable
> has been protected from this ever happening again. The battery was
> charged overnight (on an ancient non-smart charger) and returned to
> service. A month or two later, it failed to start the airplane and was
> changed out for another RG-25 XC. This was all about a year ago. I
> don't remember if I charged this battery after removal, but it was at
> 12.66 volts before I charged it for this test. I discharged it at 4
> amps to 10.5v. It, surprisingly, came in at 25.4 ah - right at rated
> capacity. I'm going to swap it back into the airplane long enough to
> test Battery 3 and see how that one is doing.
>
> I also tested a friend's 35 ah Concorde battery which is a year old
> but hasn't yet seen service at 4 amps to 10.5v and got 37.4 ah out of it.
>
> In the meantime, my computer's UPS quit working so I pulled the 8 ah
> battery out of it and found it to be 5.3v. I extended the leads out of
> the UPS box and hooked them to Battery 1 and hooked my computer back
> up to it. The float voltage seems high at 13.72, but I'm not worried
> about it seeing as how that battery is useless for much else and if it
> fails at some point, I have another to replace it.
>
> Hope I didn't bore Y'all too much,
>
> Ed Holyoke
>
>
Message 7
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Subject: | Re: Preferred Bulkhead Disconnects |
Glenn,
Aeroelectric advises the use of the 5 prong waterproof trailer towing
male/female plugs which you could leave excess in wings. Available
anywhere, ie Lowe's, Home Depot, NAPA, AutoZone, etc.
Mike H 9A/8A
----- Original Message -----
From: <longg@pjm.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 1:06 PM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Preferred Bulkhead Disconnects
>
>
> I have two 5 wire bundles coming off the wings which control lights and
> trim. My wings are detachable and I want to incorporate bulkhead
> disconnects. What approach have any of you taken which is cost effective
> and relatively easy to plug and unplug? I do not have easy access (one
> 3" hole) outside the cockpit so I need to be able to manage unplugging,
> securing etc from inside. Pictures welcome.
>
> I have thought about fast tabs something or 9 pin d-subs. I am thinking
> two 9 pin d's would be bulky. They would also need a good size hole to
> feed them back through when the wing is removed.
>
>
> Thanks,
> Glenn
>
>
>
Message 8
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Subject: | Re: Preferred Bulkhead Disconnects |
How about a WeatherPak connector? Available in your finer auto
establishments...
On Tue, Sep 30, 2008 at 1:06 PM, <longg@pjm.com> wrote:
>
>
> I have two 5 wire bundles coming off the wings which control lights and
> trim. My wings are detachable and I want to incorporate bulkhead
> disconnects. What approach have any of you taken which is cost effective
> and relatively easy to plug and unplug? I do not have easy access (one
> 3" hole) outside the cockpit so I need to be able to manage unplugging,
> securing etc from inside. Pictures welcome.
>
> I have thought about fast tabs something or 9 pin d-subs. I am thinking
> two 9 pin d's would be bulky. They would also need a good size hole to
> feed them back through when the wing is removed.
>
>
> Thanks,
> Glenn
>
>
Message 9
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Subject: | Preferred Bulkhead Disconnects |
Mike,
Great idea. Since my tiny trim wire is about 26 and those trailer
connectors are about 14, I'm not sure how that will tie together. I see
a lot of those with the pigtails already molded in. Are they available
without wires?
Glenn
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mike
Humphrey
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 2:58 PM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Preferred Bulkhead Disconnects
<mike109g6@insideconnect.net>
Glenn,
Aeroelectric advises the use of the 5 prong waterproof trailer towing
male/female plugs which you could leave excess in wings. Available
anywhere, ie Lowe's, Home Depot, NAPA, AutoZone, etc.
Mike H 9A/8A
----- Original Message -----
From: <longg@pjm.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 1:06 PM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Preferred Bulkhead Disconnects
>
>
> I have two 5 wire bundles coming off the wings which control lights
and
> trim. My wings are detachable and I want to incorporate bulkhead
> disconnects. What approach have any of you taken which is cost
effective
> and relatively easy to plug and unplug? I do not have easy access (one
> 3" hole) outside the cockpit so I need to be able to manage
unplugging,
> securing etc from inside. Pictures welcome.
>
> I have thought about fast tabs something or 9 pin d-subs. I am
thinking
> two 9 pin d's would be bulky. They would also need a good size hole to
> feed them back through when the wing is removed.
>
>
> Thanks,
> Glenn
>
>
>
Message 10
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Subject: | Re: Capacitance Probes |
Jim
Could you describe your set-up more thoroughly? What type probes, converter and
output volts, ect.
The probes themselve work as a capacitor, two plates with one wire for each.
The three wires you mentioned probably go to the converter. Which converts the
capacitive reading to probably vdc (0-5 my guess) for your display. If so, you
can read the output of the converter with a multimeter and see if that jives
with the level reading. You can also set your multimeter to diode check and use
that as a voltage source to inject a voltage (1. something if I remeber right)to
your gauge and see what level it gives to test the wiring and gauge. Can
compare to other side. This ONLY applies if your system is set-up as I guessed.
Hard to say more without more details of the system.
Wade
Message 11
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Subject: | VDC Battery Minders |
Howdy,
Just got off the phone with the tech rep at VDC. Had a chat about the
difference between the "aviation adjusted" charger and the straight
12248. He says that the aviation specific batteries, ie; Concorde and
Gill, use a chemistry with a higher concentration of acid than other
batteries and require a different charge profile. He said that the
voltage is slightly lower and the time in the second phase of the charge
cycle is longer, and the voltage in the float is lower. The de-sulfation
circuit is exactly the same in all the models.
They also make a model of this charger specific to the Hawker Odyssey
battery which wants a higher charge voltage and specific charging
profile because of the pure lead used for the plates. They also have a
model for the Optima battery with it's own charging profile. He said
that these are all settable inside the unit via dip switch setting, but
not user accessible. I bet you'd void the warranty if you played around
with it.
He stated that leaving any battery hooked up to the wrong profile
charger for an extended period of time, say more than 3 months, would
damage it. That being said, he agreed that almost any sort of smart
charger would work for the occasional recharge of a battery kept
reasonably charged by it's vehicle or after a discharge capacity test.
If a battery were to be left hooked up the the straight 12248 charger
for a longer term float, one could mitigate the potential damage by
setting to the "Gell cell" setting which floats at a lower voltage and
wouldn't cook the battery off.
I told him that I didn't want to have to buy 3 or 4 chargers do do all
this. The key is that I fly often, nearly daily in fact. Most of the
people, to whom they sell chargers, don't and want something to keep
their batteries in tip-top shape even if they can't afford the avgas to
keep them charged up. He agreed with me, that for my purposes and taking
into account how I use a charger, that the 12248 would be the most
versatile of their offerings. The chargers sense ambient temperature and
so the $20 temp probe is of limited value is what we agreed. Your
mileage may vary.
By the way, the 12248 is on sale now at Northern Tool for $85, $15 less
than their regular price and a bunch cheaper than anywhere else I could
find. They, and VDC for that matter, have been out of stock, but the guy
said that Northern should be getting theirs in within a week.
Pax,
Ed Holyoke
Message 12
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Subject: | Re: [OT] Pronunciation question |
>
> One point zero two eight
Hi all,
Thanks to all who responded.
Oh, and by the way, what about ICAO ?
Eye See Ay Oh or Eye Kay-Oh, or....;-)
Thanks again,
Best regards,
--
Gilles
http://contrails.free.fr
Message 13
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Subject: | Re: Capacitance Probes |
Wade
Thanks for the response.- I have Vision Micro probes (lt and rt) that fee
d into a converter box (analog to digital) then into the GRT- EAU.- I s
poke to Princeston Electronics (they make the converter box)- He said tha
t they have had some problems with the older unit I have and they have impr
oved the newer units.- He was very gracious to warrantee my units, and is
sending me new converters.- The new units have some other diagnostic fun
ctions that mine don't so that should be helpful.- I'll keep you posted.
Jim Robinson
N79R- Glll
--- On Tue, 9/30/08, <wlively@gvtc.com> wrote:
From: <wlively@gvtc.com>
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Capacitance Probes
<wlively@gvtc.com>
Jim
Could you describe your set-up more thoroughly? What type probes, convert
er
and output volts, ect.
The probes themselve work as a capacitor, two plates with one wire for ea
ch.
The three wires you mentioned probably go to the converter. Which converts
the
capacitive reading to probably vdc (0-5 my guess) for your display. If so,
you
can read the output of the converter with a multimeter and see if that jive
s
with the level reading. You can also set your multimeter to diode check and
use
that as a voltage source to inject a voltage (1. something if I remeber rig
ht)to
your gauge and see what level it gives to test the wiring and gauge. Can co
mpare
to other side. This ONLY applies if your system is set-up as I guessed.
Hard to say more without more details of the system.
Wade
Message 14
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|
Subject: | Re: VDC Battery Minders |
I think I've voided more warranties then I can remember.
I wonder if a nice 4 position switch would give it a lot of versatility.
Ed
On Sep 30, 2008, at 5:45 PM, Ed Holyoke wrote:
> <bicyclop@pacbell.net>
>
> Howdy,
>
> Just got off the phone with the tech rep at VDC. Had a chat about the
> difference between the "aviation adjusted" charger and the straight
> 12248. He says that the aviation specific batteries, ie; Concorde and
> Gill, use a chemistry with a higher concentration of acid than other
> batteries and require a different charge profile. He said that the
> voltage is slightly lower and the time in the second phase of the
> charge cycle is longer, and the voltage in the float is lower. The
> de-sulfation circuit is exactly the same in all the models.
>
> They also make a model of this charger specific to the Hawker Odyssey
> battery which wants a higher charge voltage and specific charging
> profile because of the pure lead used for the plates. They also have a
> model for the Optima battery with it's own charging profile. He said
> that these are all settable inside the unit via dip switch setting,
> but not user accessible. I bet you'd void the warranty if you played
> around with it.
>
> He stated that leaving any battery hooked up to the wrong profile
> charger for an extended period of time, say more than 3 months, would
> damage it. That being said, he agreed that almost any sort of smart
> charger would work for the occasional recharge of a battery kept
> reasonably charged by it's vehicle or after a discharge capacity test.
> If a battery were to be left hooked up the the straight 12248 charger
> for a longer term float, one could mitigate the potential damage by
> setting to the "Gell cell" setting which floats at a lower voltage and
> wouldn't cook the battery off.
>
> I told him that I didn't want to have to buy 3 or 4 chargers do do all
> this. The key is that I fly often, nearly daily in fact. Most of the
> people, to whom they sell chargers, don't and want something to keep
> their batteries in tip-top shape even if they can't afford the avgas
> to keep them charged up. He agreed with me, that for my purposes and
> taking into account how I use a charger, that the 12248 would be the
> most versatile of their offerings. The chargers sense ambient
> temperature and so the $20 temp probe is of limited value is what we
> agreed. Your mileage may vary.
>
> By the way, the 12248 is on sale now at Northern Tool for $85, $15
> less than their regular price and a bunch cheaper than anywhere else I
> could find. They, and VDC for that matter, have been out of stock, but
> the guy said that Northern should be getting theirs in within a week.
>
> Pax,
>
> Ed Holyoke
>
>
Message 15
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Subject: | Re: [OT] Pronunciation question |
Now, now Gilles. Lets not carry this too far. We could go on forever. Your
command of English is excellent by the way. Far better than some whose first
language is English.
Bob McC.
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gilles Thesee" <Gilles.Thesee@ac-grenoble.fr>
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 5:58 PM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: [OT] Pronunciation question
<Gilles.Thesee@ac-grenoble.fr>
>
>
> >
> > One point zero two eight
>
> Hi all,
>
> Thanks to all who responded.
> Oh, and by the way, what about ICAO ?
> Eye See Ay Oh or Eye Kay-Oh, or....;-)
>
> Thanks again,
> Best regards,
> --
> Gilles
> http://contrails.free.fr
>
>
Message 16
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Subject: | Re: VDC Battery Minders |
At 02:45 PM 9/30/2008 -0700, you wrote:
>
>Howdy,
>
>Just got off the phone with the tech rep at VDC. Had a chat about the
>difference between the "aviation adjusted" charger and the straight 12248.
>He says that the aviation specific batteries, ie; Concorde and Gill, use a
>chemistry with a higher concentration of acid than other batteries and
>require a different charge profile. He said that the voltage is slightly
>lower and the time in the second phase of the charge cycle is longer, and
>the voltage in the float is lower. The de-sulfation circuit is exactly the
>same in all the models.
>
>They also make a model of this charger specific to the Hawker Odyssey
>battery which wants a higher charge voltage and specific charging profile
>because of the pure lead used for the plates. They also have a model for
>the Optima battery with it's own charging profile. He said that these are
>all settable inside the unit via dip switch setting, but not user
>accessible. I bet you'd void the warranty if you played around with it.
>
>He stated that leaving any battery hooked up to the wrong profile charger
>for an extended period of time, say more than 3 months, would damage it.
>That being said, he agreed that almost any sort of smart charger would
>work for the occasional recharge of a battery kept reasonably charged by
>it's vehicle or after a discharge capacity test. If a battery were to be
>left hooked up the the straight 12248 charger for a longer term float, one
>could mitigate the potential damage by setting to the "Gell cell" setting
>which floats at a lower voltage and wouldn't cook the battery off.
>
>I told him that I didn't want to have to buy 3 or 4 chargers do do all
>this. The key is that I fly often, nearly daily in fact. Most of the
>people, to whom they sell chargers, don't and want something to keep their
>batteries in tip-top shape even if they can't afford the avgas to keep
>them charged up. He agreed with me, that for my purposes and taking into
>account how I use a charger, that the 12248 would be the most versatile of
>their offerings. The chargers sense ambient temperature and so the $20
>temp probe is of limited value is what we agreed. Your mileage may vary.
>
>By the way, the 12248 is on sale now at Northern Tool for $85, $15 less
>than their regular price and a bunch cheaper than anywhere else I could
>find. They, and VDC for that matter, have been out of stock, but the guy
>said that Northern should be getting theirs in within a week.
The only reason to put any kind of charger on an
RG battery is because you ran it down accidently
and you want to get it back to 80% or more capacity
before you fly again.
The self discharge rate on an RG battery is so low
that you should be able to put your airplane away
in the fall and come back next spring to crank it right
up.
If one insists on plugging the battery in for storage
every night and the battery was put away charged, the
charger won't even have a chance to do a full blown
recharge, top-off-drop-to-float cycle. This
slicing and dicing of float voltage from a charger
is mostly smoke and mirrors. Open circuit on a SVLA
battery at room temperature is right at 13.0 volts.
Ideal float voltage would be right at 13.0 volts too.
All you're wanting to do is externally offset the
internal leakage of the battery. Now if you really
screw up and float it at say 13.4 volts, the current
that flows into the battery will be somewhere around
30 mA on a 17 a.h. battery.
If you plan on routinely abusing the battery with
the "wrong charger" then perhaps there is value in
fine tuning the product. Keep in mind that your
airplane's electrical system really sucks for
air as a charging system. The alternator runs full-out
at recharge at top-off voltage until the recharge current
"breaks". Top-off voltage is maintained until engine
shut down. Typical recharge current after 2 hours of
flight will be on the order of 100 to 500 mA. No pampering
of the battery with a "float voltage" while in flight!
If I were chartered with crafting a new regulator
design, it would be software driven and have
some smarts that drops to a float voltage after
recharge is assured . . . increase in service life?
No idea. Won't launch into a $100K$ test program to
prove it one way or another.
I'll suggest that spending the $time$ to optimize
the recharging/maintaining of batteries in airplanes
is a lousy return on investment. If your battery
fails to meet manufacturer's fondest wishes
for a laboratory-pure service life, it's because
you have it bolted to an airplane . . . not because
you've charged it with the wrong charger.
Batteries used for motive power (golf carts, trolling,
weed eaters, etc) are another matter. These spend 99%
of their time on a charger getting replenished from
a deep-cycle service. You MIGHT see a couple more passes
around the yard or one more trip out onto the pond
by fine tuning the technology in the charger.
If you have a dead battery, charge it with ANYTHING
and go fly. If you're storing a battery for less than
60 days, don't beat it up with an unnecessary, less-than-
ideal charger. If you're storing over the winter,
take the battery home and put it on a Battery Tender
out in the garage until spring.
Bob . . .
Message 17
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Subject: | Re: VDC Battery Minders (follow up) |
>
>
> If one insists on plugging the battery in for storage
> every night and the battery was put away charged, the
> charger won't even have a chance to do a full blown
> recharge, top-off-drop-to-float cycle. This
> slicing and dicing of float voltage from a charger
> is mostly smoke and mirrors. Open circuit on a SVLA
> battery at room temperature is right at 13.0 volts.
> Ideal float voltage would be right at 13.0 volts too.
> All you're wanting to do is externally offset the
> internal leakage of the battery. Now if you really
> screw up and float it at say 13.4 volts, the current
> that flows into the battery will be somewhere around
> 30 mA on a 17 a.h. battery.
Just took one of my instrumentation SVLA batteries that
have been off the charger for several months. The open
circuit voltage was 13.03 volts. I hooked it to a
power supply set for 13.5 volts. As soon as the clips
touched, the 'charge' current jumped to over 1.5 amps.
Came back in 20 minutes at it was down to 0.013 amps
or 13 milliamps.
I raised the power supply to 13.6 volts. Again, charge
current jumped up to about 400 mA. But after 20 minutes,
it was again down around 0.022 amps or 22 mA.
This suggests that if I "floated" this battery anywhere
between 13.1 and 13.6 volts, it would be just fine.
In my shop, I used to keep the instrumentation batteries
all clipped in parallel on a single Battery Tender Jr.
That was several years ago. Now, after using a battery
to some task, I put it on the SC2500 (super-duper smart
charger with a switch for "deep-cycle", "AGM" and
"regular". I think the charger defaults to "regular"
when plugged in. I hook it to the battery, come back
in the morning and put the battery back on the shelf.
All of my batteries are still above 80% of new capacity
after 6 years with no special pampering to "optimize"
service life. Walmart generally stocks the Schumacher
SEM1562A for under $20. This is a fine low rate,
charger maintainer at a very attractive price. See
page 11 of
http://www.schumacherproducts.com/assets/pdf/sec_catalog.pdf
Bob . . .
Message 18
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Subject: | Re: Preferred Bulkhead Disconnects |
Glenn,
I used it on my RAC electric trim servo in the elevator so that I could
detach stab/elevator for transport. RAC wires are 26awg. Just expose an
extra long piece of wire, make a 'J' shaped loop in the trailer wire, wrap
the 26awg around the 14awg inside the J loop(5 or 6 wraps will do), crip
down on the J loop lightly, just to snug the wires together. Solder well
with high grade silver solder. When cooled cover soldered connection with a
piece of heat shrink. Your done. If you want to be extra careful, place a
piece of large diameter heat shrink over the wire bundle before starting any
of this and then heat shrink the entire 5 wire bundle under one piece, or
wrap the entire assembly in high quality electrical tape or silicon tape.
Hope that this helps,
Mike H 9A/8A
----- Original Message -----
From: <longg@pjm.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 4:40 PM
Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Preferred Bulkhead Disconnects
>
> Mike,
> Great idea. Since my tiny trim wire is about 26 and those trailer
> connectors are about 14, I'm not sure how that will tie together. I see
> a lot of those with the pigtails already molded in. Are they available
> without wires?
>
> Glenn
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mike
> Humphrey
> Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 2:58 PM
> To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Preferred Bulkhead Disconnects
>
> <mike109g6@insideconnect.net>
>
> Glenn,
> Aeroelectric advises the use of the 5 prong waterproof trailer towing
> male/female plugs which you could leave excess in wings. Available
> anywhere, ie Lowe's, Home Depot, NAPA, AutoZone, etc.
> Mike H 9A/8A
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <longg@pjm.com>
> To: <aeroelectric-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 1:06 PM
> Subject: AeroElectric-List: Preferred Bulkhead Disconnects
>
>
>>
>>
>> I have two 5 wire bundles coming off the wings which control lights
> and
>> trim. My wings are detachable and I want to incorporate bulkhead
>> disconnects. What approach have any of you taken which is cost
> effective
>> and relatively easy to plug and unplug? I do not have easy access (one
>> 3" hole) outside the cockpit so I need to be able to manage
> unplugging,
>> securing etc from inside. Pictures welcome.
>>
>> I have thought about fast tabs something or 9 pin d-subs. I am
> thinking
>> two 9 pin d's would be bulky. They would also need a good size hole to
>> feed them back through when the wing is removed.
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Glenn
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
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