Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:05 AM - Re: Rotax w/ Perihelion OVM (Chris Stone)
2. 07:39 AM - Re: Polyfuses (Radioflyer)
3. 07:40 AM - Anyone with a KR22 Marker Beacon pinout? (Radioflyer)
4. 07:48 AM - Re: (Gilles Thesee)
5. 08:03 AM - S-Tec 30 problem (galaxyone@juno.com)
6. 08:20 AM - Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: (Jan de Jong)
7. 08:41 AM - S-Tec 30 problem (David LLoyd)
8. 08:46 AM - Question on Z-11, Main Buss Feed (Don Morrisey)
9. 09:03 AM - Re: Re: Polyfuses ()
10. 09:06 AM - Re: S-Tec 30 problem (Ralph E. Capen)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Rotax w/ Perihelion OVM |
Thanks Bob... et al.
This list is a wonderful resource. Saves me unknown hours researching!
Chris
do not archive
-----Original Message-----
>From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
>Sent: Mar 15, 2009 4:19 PM
>To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Rotax w/ Perihelion OVM
>
>
>>I purchased this to provide over voltage protection for the
>>electrics powered by the built-in alternator on the Rotax. I am not
>>entirely clear on the operation of the Rotax alternator nor is the
>>Rotax manual. It contains only a schematic, no theory of
>>operation. It has what appear to be two B leads. Per Bob's
>>schematic breaking one B lead shuts down the alternator. Per Rotax
>>the output is 20A@5,000 RPM. Thus a 20A relay would be suitable if
>>each B lead produces 10A max. Since Rotax calls the voltage
>>regulator a rectifier/regulator I am assuming each B lead is single
>>phase AC but I am not clear as to how breaking one B lead would shut
>>down the alternator.
>
> You have two wires coming out of a wall socket to
> power some device, but the ON-OFF switch needs to
> open or close only one leg of the wall-power to
> control the device. Those are not "B" (battery)
> leads coming off the engine. They are as you've
> guessed, two leads with single phase, AC power on them.
>
> The B-leads are the "R" and "B+" wires that
> come off the rectifier/regulator.
>
> Breaking one of the green ac power input leads
> is the same as the single switch on your desk
> lamp. The PM alternator continues to develop
> voltage but it has no place to go.
>
>
>>A couple of questions: Why both a fusable link and 5A CB in series
>>on the master sw/OV disconnect relay?
>
> This is to accommodate some legacy design rules adopted
> from certified aircraft . . . since the power to operate
> the relay is so small, and since you've elimnated the
> need for a pilot accessible circuit breaker, I'll suggest
> you eliminate both the fusible link and the 5A breaker.
> Power your alternator control circuit directly from a
> 3A fuse on your main bus.
>
>> How does breaking one line from the 'dynamo' shut it down, or
>> does it? Per this schematic power is required from the battery to
>> close the OV disconnect relay and bring the 'dynamo' on-line. Thus
>> with a dead battery there is no way to bring the 'dynamo' on-line?
>
> Right. But given what we know about the internals
> of the rectifier regulator, it doesn't matter. It's
> not self-exciting. I suspect we could do a "band-aid"
> not unlike that which was developed for the SD-8 and
> shown in the latest z-figures . . . but the proof-of-
> concept study has not been accomplished for that
> product. If you have a dead battery, the prudent
> action is to recharge it from some ground based source
> before you start the engine to go flying.
>
> Except for elimination of the fusible link and CB,
> what you've proposed should work as advertised.
>
>
> Bob . . .
>
> ----------------------------------------)
> ( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
> ( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
> ( appearance of being right . . . )
> ( )
> ( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
> ----------------------------------------
>
Message 2
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I'm late into this discussion, but have been wondering how to implement the polyfuses
since I first read about them in Jim Weir's article and Blue Mountain's
wiring guide. They are very attractive to me due to their compact size, inexpensiveness,
and solid state reliability. Everyone agrees they perform as advertised.
But, as others have stated, the packaging issue makes their use somewhat
problematic, especially if you're interested in taking them offline, bypassing
their auto-reset feature.
What I would like to see is a polyfuse mounted into an ATC fuse shell, preferably
one of those ATC types that have the LED already built in to indicate a fault.
By so doing, you could use the readily available ATC fuse blocks, thereby
retaining the option to simply pull the Polyfuse out when you need to. For my
first attempt, I was going to try a little surgery on an ATC fuse package and
epoxy a Polyfuse to it..., but I have not yet taken the chance to play with this.
My guess is that it may be only a matter of time before some Taiwanese manufacturer
starts putting polyfuses in the ATC fuse format.
--Jose
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=234820#234820
Message 3
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| Subject: | Anyone with a KR22 Marker Beacon pinout? |
Can anyone point me to some KR-22 marker beacon receiver pinout info? I think I
can figure out the antenna, power and audio out pins, but I would appreciate
some confirmation before proceeding, just to make sure I get the grounds correct.
--Jose
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=234821#234821
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: ectric-List: |
Robert L. Nuckolls, III a crit :
> Some time back some fellows of your acquaintance were
> exploring the thermal deficiencies in the stock Rotax/Ducati
> rectifier regulator.
>
> Has that work evolved further than what's currently
> described on your website?
Hi Bob,
That was some years ago, so part of the info may no longer be available
: the researcher who helped me has changed assignment.
I'll try to retrieve as much data as I can. Just give me a few days.
Also, the parts we used may be lost. I'll see if someone has heard of them.
Best regards,
--
Gilles
http://contrails.free.fr
Message 5
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| Subject: | S-Tec 30 problem |
I have a Lancair with an S-Tec 30 auto pilot. It can be follow either a
GNS 530 (with GPSS), or a SL 30. Initially it worked OK but has now deve
loped a problem in the altitude hold mode.
Most times it will drop out of altitude after 1-15 minutes and occasiona
lly it will drop out as soon as it is engaged. It will not do this on th
e ground, which makes it hard to diagnose what is wrong. I do not have a
schematic for this unit, only the install manual.
Two questions.
Can some one point me to a site for the manual?
Has anyone seen this kind of response from an S-Tec?
____________________________________________________________
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Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: |
Bob,
Your question to Gilles regarding Rotax/Ducati regulator reminded me of
something I mentioned on the Europa list last year.
Maybe of use here, maybe not.
-----
I think I found an interesting bit of forum:
http://www.pilots24.com/pilots24/forum/viewtopic.php?t=7756&sid=542ce097cbdde3a5ceba2e5bd0d71c38
Scroll down to 40% of the page.
Writer Arrow is convinced that he has found the problem with the
912/Ducati regulators, as follows.
The regulating bridge has 4 elements:
2 power diodes MR2510 and 2 thyristors TP154E (obsolete) or 2N6504.
One diode and one thyristor in series conduct part of one half sinus of
the alternator output, the other diode and other thyristor in series
conduct part of the other half sinus of the alternator output.
The thyristors have TO220AB packaging and are mounted directly to the
housing.
The diodes have MICRODE BUTTON CASE 193 leadless packaging and Ducati
designed a mounting technique: both diodes with their cathodes soldered
to a small copper sheet, copper sheet mounted to the housing using
silicone foil heat conducting isolation; wires to the PCB soldered to
both anodes and the copper sheet.
Everything potted with a potting compound.
The problem is that heating/cooling cycles work the electrical
connections to the diodes loose. The symptoms are as follows: charging
ok after startup (13.8V), losing it after half an hour, but the warning
light stays off.
The writer has a diagnostic test using a battery and two 12V lamps to
check continuity under heating.
The writer has a solution: parallelling the diodes with an external pair.
The writer has notified Rotax and asked them what they had done / were
doing about the problem (January 2008). The correspondence can be
followed at:
http://www.pilots24.com/pilots24/forum/viewtopic.php?p=48297&highlight=#48297
Scroll 30% down.
The upshot seems to be that Rotax knows there is a problem but it must
be because units are operated above 80C. No redesign yet.
-----
More translation from German if required...
Regards,
Jan de Jong
Message 7
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| Subject: | S-Tec 30 problem |
A couple of thoughts on your S-Tec A/P......
On your aircraft, I do not know where the pitch sensing static pressure
ports are installed, however check them carefully for any kind of spider
web, tiny wasp nest, etc. in the port hole. On Cessna's the pitch
static ports (2) are aft on the fuselage sides. Check inside to make
sure the plastic tubing to the ports are routed ok and not pinched or
kinked. Cargo stuffed in the rear can shift and kink these lines or
break them. You probably have 2 static sensing ports, one on each side
for the pitch control computer.
If your aircraft did a mild porpoise routine in pitch, I would mention
to check control cable tensions, but, your model may not use cables.
The pitch controller also uses clutches in the system, and maybe those
have developed a problem.
S-Tec at one time had a web link to their library of very good field
notes mostly written by their own staff. I assume these are still
linked to their web even though they were bought out by other firms.
Their support staff was also quite good and would answer email. I am
not familiar with the -30, however, I have heard it is a very nice A/P.
I have used their -55 with GPSS for years and it is a winner. Holds
altitude to better than 20 ft.
If you have to have service performed, be sure to get references for a
shop that "really" knows S-Tec products.....
Let us know what you discover....
David
----- Original Message -----
From: galaxyone@juno.com
To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, March 16, 2009 7:57 AM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: S-Tec 30 problem
I have a Lancair with an S-Tec 30 auto pilot. It can be follow either
a GNS 530 (with GPSS), or a SL 30. Initially it worked OK but has now
developed a problem in the altitude hold mode.
Most times it will drop out of altitude after 1-15 minutes and
occasionally it will drop out as soon as it is engaged. It will not do
this on the ground, which makes it hard to diagnose what is wrong. I do
not have a schematic for this unit, only the install manual.
Two questions.
Can some one point me to a site for the manual?
Has anyone seen this kind of response from an S-Tec?
____________________________________________________________
Digital Photography - Click Now.
Message 8
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| Subject: | Question on Z-11, Main Buss Feed |
Howdy Listers=2C
I am using Z-11 as the basis for my wiring architecture. My question is on
the 6 AWG wire between the battery contactor and the main buss. In my ins
tallation this wire will be running back through the firewall. Z-11 shows
no protection for this wire but does show an ANL 60 current limiter between
the starter contactor and the alternator.
A similar VFR elec drawing on the B&C website shows the 6 AWG wire between
the battery contactor and the main buss being protected with a ANL 60 curre
nt limiter and also shows another ANL 60 current limiter between the starte
r contactor and the alternator.
So for this type of setup are two ANL 60's required or one???
Thanks. Don...
www.donsbushcaddy.com
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Message 9
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Jose,
Would you bet your life on a floppy adaptation on your Lightspeed
ignition? Perhaps yours is just cursory interest. I'm sure you can jam
pennies in there if you like. There's no reason that would not work.
Right now I am using Bob's proposed schematic which adds two in-line 30
amp fuses in front of two 5 amp breakers. He also considered two relays
in place of the 30 amp ATC's.
I guess my deal is how am I going to get at those 30 amp in-line fuses
and still keep my eye on flying the airplane. I suppose if you blow two
30 amp fuses behind the two five amp breakers suggested by LSA, you're
already in deep doo-doo.
I wanted to ask Bob why the 30 amp fuse? Couldn't we get-a-way with
something lighter, say 20 amp?
Glenn
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Radioflyer
Sent: Monday, March 16, 2009 10:37 AM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Polyfuses
<skyeyecorp@airpost.net>
I'm late into this discussion, but have been wondering how to implement
the polyfuses since I first read about them in Jim Weir's article and
Blue Mountain's wiring guide. They are very attractive to me due to
their compact size, inexpensiveness, and solid state reliability.
Everyone agrees they perform as advertised. But, as others have stated,
the packaging issue makes their use somewhat problematic, especially if
you're interested in taking them offline, bypassing their auto-reset
feature.
What I would like to see is a polyfuse mounted into an ATC fuse shell,
preferably one of those ATC types that have the LED already built in to
indicate a fault. By so doing, you could use the readily available ATC
fuse blocks, thereby retaining the option to simply pull the Polyfuse
out when you need to. For my first attempt, I was going to try a little
surgery on an ATC fuse package and epoxy a Polyfuse to it..., but I have
not yet taken the chance to play with this. My guess is that it may be
only a matter of time before some Taiwanese manufacturer starts putting
polyfuses in the ATC fuse format.
--Jose
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=234820#234820
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: S-Tec 30 problem |
I have a 'sorta-kinda' similar setup in my RV6A. The S-Tec 30 is connected to
my GX60 through the S-Tec GPSS box which switches between the GX60 and my Century
HSI.
During my ground troubleshooting (I haven't tried it at altitude yet), I found
a wire that had broken off right behind the solder connection - in the altitude
control box. I'm not getting a clean signal from my HSI yet - that's the reasoning
behind not trying it so far.
How is your SL30 controlling the S-Tec 30?
Is the autopilot dropping off-line or just the altitude hold part (blue-light)?
If I recall correctly, the system holds altitude by sensing barometric pressure
- this implies that if you go through a pressure change area, your altitude should
be controlled to the original pressure altitude.
I have the install manuals (scanned) and the charts (some scanned) that came with
my system (two mergers ago). I don't know what part might help - but I'm willing
to try.
Ralph
RV6A N822AR @ N06 5.9 hrs
-----Original Message-----
>From: "galaxyone@juno.com" <galaxyone@juno.com>
>Sent: Mar 16, 2009 10:57 AM
>To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
>Subject: AeroElectric-List: S-Tec 30 problem
>
>I have a Lancair with an S-Tec 30 auto pilot. It can be follow either a GNS 530
(with GPSS), or a SL 30. Initially it worked OK but has now developed a problem
in the altitude hold mode.
>Most times it will drop out of altitude after 1-15 minutes and occasionally it
will drop out as soon as it is engaged. It will not do this on the ground, which
makes it hard to diagnose what is wrong. I do not have a schematic for this
unit, only the install manual.
>Two questions.
>Can some one point me to a site for the manual?
>Has anyone seen this kind of response from an S-Tec?
>____________________________________________________________
>Digital Photography - Click Now.
>http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/BLSrjpTDvmQRLqGa6vHPLwyjHuJ382KmgG1ZiXKbI9qS8MJJFlHiX1YB9za/
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