Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:08 AM - Re: Battery Proximity and mounting ()
2. 05:15 AM - Splicing at D-subs. (Sam Hoskins)
3. 05:23 AM - Splicing at D-subs. (Sam Hoskins)
4. 05:39 AM - Splicing at D-subs. (Sam Hoskins)
5. 06:32 AM - Re: Splicing of 2 or 3 conductor shielded cable (Angier M. Ames)
6. 06:45 AM - Re: Splicing at D-subs. (Charlie England)
7. 06:46 AM - Re: Splicing at D-subs. (Bill Bradburry)
8. 07:15 AM - Complex aircraft NTSB report ()
9. 07:15 AM - Re: Splicing at D-subs. (Sam Hoskins)
10. 08:05 AM - Re: Complex aircraft NTSB report (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
11. 08:19 AM - Re: Splicing at D-subs. (Bob McCallum)
12. 08:28 AM - Re: Splicing at D-subs. (Bill Bradburry)
13. 08:28 AM - Re: Splicing at D-subs. (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
14. 08:33 AM - Re: Splicing at D-subs. (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
15. 08:35 AM - Re: Complex aircraft NTSB report (Bob Collins)
16. 08:35 AM - Re: Battery Proximity and mounting (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
17. 09:00 AM - Re: Splicing at D-subs. (Ron Quillin)
18. 09:00 AM - Re: Re: Splicing of 2 or 3 conductor shielded cable (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
19. 09:10 AM - Re: Splicing at D-subs. (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
20. 09:47 AM - NASA docs (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
21. 09:52 AM - Re: Splicing at D-subs. (Sam Hoskins)
22. 10:12 AM - First Flight (Speedy11@aol.com)
23. 10:20 AM - Re: Battery Proximity and mounting (Speedy11@aol.com)
24. 10:51 AM - Re: First Flight (Franz Fux)
25. 10:51 AM - Re: NASA docs (Ron Quillin)
26. 11:27 AM - Re: First Flight (Bret Smith)
27. 11:50 AM - TCW product update: SmartStart (Bob-tcw)
28. 12:57 PM - Re: NASA docs (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
29. 01:01 PM - Re: First Flight (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
30. 01:41 PM - Internally Regulated Alternator Control (Gordon Smith)
31. 02:27 PM - Re: First Flight (Brooke Wolf)
32. 04:40 PM - Re: Internally Regulated Alternator Control (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
33. 04:40 PM - Re: First Flight (MLWynn@aol.com)
Message 1
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Subject: | Re: Battery Proximity and mounting |
To All:
I recently made statements in a post under this subject that was
critical of Bob's responsiveness to an issue. The statements were based
on my recollections of posts over the past two years. Bob was kind
enought to continue the discussion with me off-group. In preparation
for that discussion, I reveiwed my posts on the issue and could not find
support for the statements I made. I would like to retract those
statements and make an appology to Bob and the group for making them.
Mark
Message 2
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Subject: | Splicing at D-subs. |
I didn't hear back on this one, so here it is again:
Bob - do you have a comic book about splicing a second 20 AWG wire into the
wire(s) heading into a D-sub connector? I looked through the articles at
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles.html, but didn't find exactly what I
was trying to accomplish.
I have a 37 pin connector which is plugged into a device. I want to tap
into 5 of those wires to connect to another gizmo, and figured you already
have a razzle-dazzle way to accomplish it.
Thanks.
Sam Hoskins
Murphysboro, IL
www.samhoskins.blogspot.com
Message 3
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Subject: | Splicing at D-subs. |
I didn't hear back on this one, so here it is again:
Bob - do you have a comic book about splicing a second 20 AWG wire into the
wire(s) heading into a D-sub connector? I looked through the articles at
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles.html, but didn't find exactly what I
was trying to accomplish.
I have a 37 pin connector which is plugged into a device. I want to tap
into 5 of those wires to connect to another gizmo, and figured you already
have a razzle-dazzle way to accomplish it.
Thanks.
Sam Hoskins
Murphysboro, IL
www.samhoskins.blogspot.com
Message 4
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Subject: | Splicing at D-subs. |
I didn't hear back on this one, so here it is again:
Bob - do you have a comic book about splicing a second 20 AWG wire into the
wire(s) heading into a D-sub connector? I looked through the articles at
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles.html, but didn't find exactly what I
was trying to accomplish.
I have a 37 pin connector which is plugged into a device. I want to tap
into 5 of those wires to connect to another gizmo, and figured you already
have a razzle-dazzle way to accomplish it.
Thanks.
Sam Hoskins
Murphysboro, IL
www.samhoskins.blogspot.com
Message 5
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Subject: | Re: Splicing of 2 or 3 conductor shielded cable |
I am relocating the comm and mic jacks in my Lancair to a position
behind the pilot/co-pilot seatback and so the comm and mic cables need
to be lengthened. Any suggestions here for what would be the best
method for splicing additional length to these cables and also
maintaining the integrity of the shields?
Thanks
Message 6
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Subject: | Re: Splicing at D-subs. |
Sam Hoskins wrote:
> I didn't hear back on this one, so here it is again:
>
> Bob - do you have a comic book about splicing a second 20 AWG wire
> into the
> wire(s) heading into a D-sub connector? I looked through the articles at
> http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles.html, but didn't find exactly what I
> was trying to accomplish.
>
> I have a 37 pin connector which is plugged into a device. I want to tap
> into 5 of those wires to connect to another gizmo, and figured you already
> have a razzle-dazzle way to accomplish it.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Sam Hoskins
> Murphysboro, IL
>
> www.samhoskins.blogspot.com <http://www.samhoskins.blogspot.com>
Hi Sam,
There's a comic book somewhere on the aeroelectric site showing how to
feed power *in* to multiple pins on a subD connector. You can just
reverse the technique to feed multiple outs. Bring one lead out of the
subD for a few inches. At that point, use an in-line (butt) splice with
your subD lead in one end and your 2 destination leads in the other.
Of course, this assumes that you have researched the signal quality
implications of splitting the signals.
Charlie
Message 7
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Subject: | Splicing at D-subs. |
Sam,
Is this what you were looking for?
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/pigtail/pigtail.html
Bill B
_____
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sam
Hoskins
Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 8:11 AM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Splicing at D-subs.
I didn't hear back on this one, so here it is again:
Bob - do you have a comic book about splicing a second 20 AWG wire into the
wire(s) heading into a D-sub connector? I looked through the articles at
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles.html, but didn't find exactly what I
was trying to accomplish.
I have a 37 pin connector which is plugged into a device. I want to tap
into 5 of those wires to connect to another gizmo, and figured you already
have a razzle-dazzle way to accomplish it.
Thanks.
Sam Hoskins
Murphysboro, IL
<http://www.samhoskins.blogspot.com>
www.samhoskins.blogspot.com
Message 8
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Subject: | Complex aircraft NTSB report |
6/28/2009
The NTSB Report NYC08FA023 contains the following statement:
"14 CFR Part 21.93 requires that any major changes that are made to an
airplane require inspection by the FAA prior to further flight."
This statement does not apply to the amateur built experimental airplane
being reported upon in this accident report. Instead it applies to aircraft
with changes in type design.
Actions required when changes are made to an amateur built experimental
aircraft are described in the Operating Limitations for that specific
aircraft.
'OC' Says: "The best investment we can make is the effort to gather and
understand knowledge."
Message 9
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Subject: | Re: Splicing at D-subs. |
No - I saw that one and it's for shields. I was looking for something
similar for single conductor wire.
It's no big deal. I was just looking for one of Bob's elegant soultions.
Thanks.
Sam
On Sun, Jun 28, 2009 at 8:43 AM, Bill Bradburry <bbradburry@bellsouth.net>wrote:
> Sam,
>
> Is this what you were looking for?
>
>
> http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/pigtail/pigtail.html
>
>
> Bill B
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
> owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Sam Hoskins
> *Sent:* Sunday, June 28, 2009 8:11 AM
> *To:* AeroElectric-List@matronics.com
> *Subject:* AeroElectric-List: Splicing at D-subs.
>
> I didn't hear back on this one, so here it is again:
>
> Bob - do you have a comic book about splicing a second 20 AWG wire into the
> wire(s) heading into a D-sub connector? I looked through the articles at
> http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles.html, but didn't find exactly what I
> was trying to accomplish.
>
> I have a 37 pin connector which is plugged into a device. I want to tap
> into 5 of those wires to connect to another gizmo, and figured you already
> have a razzle-dazzle way to accomplish it.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Sam Hoskins
> Murphysboro, IL
>
> www.samhoskins.blogspot.com
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> **
>
> **
>
> **
>
> *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List*
>
> **
>
> **
>
> *http://forums.matronics.com*
>
> **
>
> **
>
> *http://www.matronics.com/contribution*
>
> * *
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
Message 10
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Subject: | Re: Complex aircraft NTSB report |
At 09:07 AM 6/28/2009, you wrote:
6/28/2009
The NTSB Report NYC08FA023 contains the following statement:
"14 CFR Part 21.93 requires that any major changes that are made to an
airplane require inspection by the FAA prior to further flight."
This statement does not apply to the amateur built experimental
airplane being reported upon in this accident report. Instead it
applies to aircraft with changes in type design.
Actions required when changes are made to an amateur built
experimental aircraft are described in the Operating Limitations for
that specific aircraft.
Thanks for responding to this Bob. It rang
some alarm bells when I first read it but
had not yet taken time to research it.
I would offer to add the following: Just
because some legacy or regulatory mandate
"does not apply" to the OBAM aircraft endeavor
does not automatically tag it useless or
unworthy of consideration.
I have many moons of experience working inside
the rubber padded room that is bounded by lots
of rules . . . some of which were crafted and
later administered by folks who didn't understand
the discipline in which we work.
At the same time, MOST of the rules stand
on foundations crafted of simple-ideas of
physics, logic and/or historical experience.
In the case of 21.93, when one takes hammer
and saw to the airplane, it doesn't hurt and
may be very helpful to seek the advice of
any who can offer mentorship.
Clearly, the subject of this unhappy thread
did not avail himself of the volumes of
data and guidance freely offered from hundred
of sources. It was his choice, decision and
risk. Fortunately, the other seats were
un occupied when the risks tagged him on the
shoulder.
If the community of OBAM aircraft builders
can claim any common fraternal goal, it
should go much deeper than the sharing goggles,
helmet and white scarf experiences of flying.
It includes the task of RISK REDUCTION. Our
machines are beautiful, exciting, and offer
a potential for great utility. But they
are exceedingly unforgiving of those
who do not embrace a necessity of
responsible conduct supported by skill
and understanding.
Fly comfortably my friends . . .
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
---------------------------------------
Message 11
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Subject: | Splicing at D-subs. |
Sam;
Same process works. Just bring an inch or so of the wire from the pin out of
the connector, splice on your two leads, heat shrink the assembly, just as
shown in this "comic book" for shields and carry on. The second wire instead
of looping back into the connector as shown here, simply goes to your second
device. Either the solder technique or the solder sleeve method are neat and
compact.
Bob McC
_____
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sam
Hoskins
Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 10:03 AM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Splicing at D-subs.
No - I saw that one and it's for shields. I was looking for something
similar for single conductor wire.
It's no big deal. I was just looking for one of Bob's elegant soultions.
Thanks.
Sam
On Sun, Jun 28, 2009 at 8:43 AM, Bill Bradburry <bbradburry@bellsouth.net>
wrote:
Sam,
Is this what you were looking for?
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/pigtail/pigtail.html
Bill B
_____
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sam
Hoskins
Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 8:11 AM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Splicing at D-subs.
I didn't hear back on this one, so here it is again:
Bob - do you have a comic book about splicing a second 20 AWG wire into the
wire(s) heading into a D-sub connector? I looked through the articles at
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles.html, but didn't find exactly what I
was trying to accomplish.
I have a 37 pin connector which is plugged into a device. I want to tap
into 5 of those wires to connect to another gizmo, and figured you already
have a razzle-dazzle way to accomplish it.
Thanks.
Sam Hoskins
Murphysboro, IL
<http://www.samhoskins.blogspot.com>
www.samhoskins.blogspot.com
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
ist" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
a>http://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 12
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Subject: | Splicing at D-subs. |
Sam,
While I was looking I also found the one that Charlie is talking about here.
You just use 6" pigtails and crimp them together as Charlie describes.
Bill B
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Charlie
England
Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 9:38 AM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Splicing at D-subs.
--> <ceengland@bellsouth.net>
Sam Hoskins wrote:
> I didn't hear back on this one, so here it is again:
>
> Bob - do you have a comic book about splicing a second 20 AWG wire
> into the
> wire(s) heading into a D-sub connector? I looked through the articles
> at http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles.html, but didn't find exactly
> what I was trying to accomplish.
>
> I have a 37 pin connector which is plugged into a device. I want to
> tap into 5 of those wires to connect to another gizmo, and figured you
> already have a razzle-dazzle way to accomplish it.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Sam Hoskins
> Murphysboro, IL
>
> www.samhoskins.blogspot.com <http://www.samhoskins.blogspot.com>
Hi Sam,
There's a comic book somewhere on the aeroelectric site showing how to feed
power *in* to multiple pins on a subD connector. You can just reverse the
technique to feed multiple outs. Bring one lead out of the subD for a few
inches. At that point, use an in-line (butt) splice with your subD lead in
one end and your 2 destination leads in the other.
Of course, this assumes that you have researched the signal quality
implications of splitting the signals.
Charlie
Message 13
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Subject: | Re: Splicing at D-subs. |
At 09:03 AM 6/28/2009, you wrote:
>No - I saw that one and it's for shields. I was looking for
>something similar for single conductor wire.
>
>It's no big deal. I was just looking for one of Bob's elegant soultions.
Sorry for the long delay in responding . . . I
wish there were an "elegant" solution. Obviously
the D-Sub pin is limited to the insertion of but
a single 20AWG wire. The task is to tap
into a few conductors in a manner that does not
result in the wire bundle taking on that
"rabbit satisfied snake" appearance.
The lowest volume approach I can deduce is
to bare a short segment (1/4 to 3/8 inch)
of strands on wire to be tapped a couple
of inches from the end . . .
Emacs!
Wrap the branch strands around the open gap, solder
and heat shrink. Then install the d-sub pin.
Emacs!
You probably want to have the spice occur outside
the back-shell of the connector. Stagger their
positions so that they don't "bulk up" a lump
in one place on the harness.
Are you committed to 20AWG wire throughout?
22AWG does this hat-dance a little better.
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
---------------------------------------
Message 14
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Subject: | Re: Splicing at D-subs. |
There's a comic book somewhere on the aeroelectric site showing how
to feed power *in* to multiple pins on a subD connector. You can just
reverse the technique to feed multiple outs. Bring one lead out of
the subD for a few inches. At that point, use an in-line (butt)
splice with your subD lead in one end and your 2 destination leads in
the other.
Of course, this assumes that you have researched the signal quality
implications of splitting the signals.
Charlie
---------------------
I think you're referring to the suggestion for
paralleling pins in a d-sub to achieve higher current
ratings for conductors in the connector. This technique
was used on a super-sonic target project I worked on
some years ago and is illustrated here:
http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Wiring_Technique/Paralleled_DSub_Pins.pdf
Sam is looking for a way to add a "wye-intersection"
into one of the connectors for carrying the same
current of to another location in the system. I've
illustrated a suggestion to this task in another
posting.
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
---------------------------------------
Message 15
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|
Subject: | Complex aircraft NTSB report |
I'm building an RV. I leave my hangar door open (I don't understand why
people don't want visitors, really.) When expert builders stop by -- as they
often do -- I encourage them to look at the project and holler if they see
something that doesn't look right or could be improved (although I do joke
that my hangar rules or "no looking closer than from 1 foot!"(g)).
I've been building since 2001 and, yes, I'm a slow builder, but when I was
growing up, my family called me the "Scotch tape kid," because I took the
shortest route to fix any problem -- tape. If the airplane project has
taught me anything at all, "take your time, do it right, and kick the people
who make fun of how long it's taking out of the hangar" are the most
important.
I fear we're preaching to the choir here, however. People who read
AeroElectric Connection or hang out here on the list, already have a
preference for quality and good workmanship.
Bob Collins
St. Paul, MN.
Letters From Flyover Country
http://rvnewsletter.blogspot.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert L.
Nuckolls, III
Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 10:01 AM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Complex aircraft NTSB report
--> <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
At 09:07 AM 6/28/2009, you wrote:
6/28/2009
The NTSB Report NYC08FA023 contains the following statement:
"14 CFR Part 21.93 requires that any major changes that are made to an
airplane require inspection by the FAA prior to further flight."
This statement does not apply to the amateur built experimental airplane
being reported upon in this accident report. Instead it applies to aircraft
with changes in type design.
Actions required when changes are made to an amateur built experimental
aircraft are described in the Operating Limitations for that specific
aircraft.
Thanks for responding to this Bob. It rang
some alarm bells when I first read it but
had not yet taken time to research it.
Message 16
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Subject: | Re: Battery Proximity and mounting |
At 02:03 AM 6/28/2009, you wrote:
>To All:
>
>I recently made statements in a post under this subject that was
>critical of Bob's responsiveness to an issue. The statements were
>based on my recollections of posts over the past two years. Bob was
>kind enought to continue the discussion with me off-group. In
>preparation for that discussion, I reveiwed my posts on the issue
>and could not find support for the statements I made. I would like
>to retract those statements and make an appology to Bob and the
>group for making them.
>
>Mark
Thank you sir. No problem . . . and let's not
dwell on it. We are all friends here.
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
---------------------------------------
Message 17
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Subject: | Re: Splicing at D-subs. |
As an additional data point, Garmin has a D-sub crimp and poke
contact P/N 336-00023-00 for standard density connectors that
accommodated an 18AWG wire.
Ron Q.
At 08:25 6/28/2009, you wrote:
> Sorry for the long delay in responding . . . I
> wish there were an "elegant" solution. Obviously
> the D-Sub pin is limited to the insertion of but
> a single 20AWG wire. The task is to tap
> into a few conductors in a manner that does not
> result in the wire bundle taking on that
> "rabbit satisfied snake" appearance.
Message 18
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Subject: | Re: Splicing of 2 or 3 conductor shielded cable |
At 08:19 AM 6/28/2009, you wrote:
>
>I am relocating the comm and mic jacks in my Lancair to a position
>behind the pilot/co-pilot seatback and so the comm and mic cables need
>to be lengthened. Any suggestions here for what would be the best
>method for splicing additional length to these cables and also
>maintaining the integrity of the shields?
Strip back 3 inches or so of outer insulation
on cables to be spliced. Pull conductors out
of the shield as shown in , , ,
http://aeroelectric.com/articles/shldwire/shldwire.html
Lap splice the individual strands as shown
here . . .
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/Solder_Lap_Splicing/Solder_Lap_Splices.html
Actually, you don't even need to "bulk up" the
joint by wrapping the strands, you can simply
lay them parallel and solder as shown on page
84 of . . .
http://www.aeroelectric.com/Reference_Docs/NASA/NASA-STD-8739p4c4.pdf
Once the individual strands are joined and
insulated, overlap the braid pigtails a half
inch or so and lap solder them too. No
individual insulation is called for on this
final joint.
Put a piece of heat-shrink over the finished
splice.
Shielding of these wires has a vanishingly small
benefit for noise mitigation on these wires.
Don't worry about loss of shielding integrity
at the joint.
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
---------------------------------------
Message 19
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Subject: | Re: Splicing at D-subs. |
At 10:56 AM 6/28/2009, you wrote:
>As an additional data point, Garmin has a D-sub crimp and poke
>contact P/N 336-00023-00 for standard density connectors that
>accommodated an 18AWG wire.
I've heard of those but never had an opportunity
to use them. I'm sure there are other "nifty"
solutions out there. I'll try to get my hands on
some and look 'em over. I think I've heard of similar
products from yesteryear.
A larger diameter crimp/solder cup adapter would
be quite elegant. Unfortunately, these devices
seldom find their way into the Digikey or Radio Shack
catalogs at attractive prices. Shade tree technicians
are oft obliged to resort to processes adapted from
the materials at hand. An as one can see from a study
of the NASA handbook cited earlier, even the
Big Guys have adopted some techniques we Poor
Guys can duplicate.
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
---------------------------------------
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While searching the reference documents archives I'm
reminded of this collection of NASA documents found on
the 'net. I've compiled a library of useful publications
and posted them to my website at:
http://www.aeroelectric.com/Reference_Docs/NASA/
I'll invite any with an interest in the processes
cited to add these documents to their library. In
particular, check out the 1963 NASA wiring handbook
that one of your fellow readers forwarded to me
some months ago. This book was published two years
after I got out of high school! It's an interesting
adventure back in time but still rich in solid,
simple-ideas.
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
---------------------------------------
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Subject: | Re: Splicing at D-subs. |
Thanks all - got it!. Now, off to the airport...
Sam
On Sun, Jun 28, 2009 at 10:25 AM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III <
nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com> wrote:
> At 09:03 AM 6/28/2009, you wrote:
>
> No - I saw that one and it's for shields. I was looking for something
> similar for single conductor wire.
>
> It's no big deal. I was just looking for one of Bob's elegant soultions.
>
>
> Sorry for the long delay in responding . . . I
> wish there were an "elegant" solution. Obviously
> the D-Sub pin is limited to the insertion of but
> a single 20AWG wire. The task is to tap
> into a few conductors in a manner that does not
> result in the wire bundle taking on that
> "rabbit satisfied snake" appearance.
>
> The lowest volume approach I can deduce is
> to bare a short segment (1/4 to 3/8 inch)
> of strands on wire to be tapped a couple
> of inches from the end . . .
>
>
> [image: Emacs!]
>
> Wrap the branch strands around the open gap, solder
> and heat shrink. Then install the d-sub pin.
>
> [image: Emacs!]
>
> You probably want to have the spice occur outside
> the back-shell of the connector. Stagger their
> positions so that they don't "bulk up" a lump
> in one place on the harness.
>
> Are you committed to 20AWG wire throughout?
> 22AWG does this hat-dance a little better.
>
>
> Bob . . .
>
> ---------------------------------------
> ( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
> ( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
> ( appearance of being right . . . )
> ( )
> ( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
> ---------------------------------------
>
>
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My Appreciation to Bob and others on this list who helped me better
understand electricity and its application to aircraft systems. The invaluable
information I obtained on this forum was implemented into my RV-8A and my
airplane flew for the first time today. The electrical system performed as
expected and will continue to do so far into the future.
Most of the info I got on this forum was not available elsewhere - or, at
least, not without great difficulty.
Thanks!
Stan Sutterfield
RV-8A N884P - Flying
**************Make your summer sizzle with fast and easy recipes for the
grill. (http://food.aol.com/grilling?ncid=emlcntusfood00000006)
Message 23
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Subject: | Re: Battery Proximity and mounting |
Ha - I thought I was being gentle.
My apology.
Actually, I got an off forum email from him (his name is Mark) and we
apologized to one another.
Stan
>Looks like we have another a**hole that refuses to include his
>name. Could he be ashamed of it?
>I got a nasty note from him off the forum for my comments on the forum.
>Wonder what up with him?
Gently my friend. This is after all a classroom
with a broad spectrum of attendee needs and
skill sets. The value of what we do here is
not increased by prejudicial words. Let
us strive to be teachers with a goal of
working to everyone's satisfaction.
Bob . . .
**************Make your summer sizzle with fast and easy recipes for the
grill. (http://food.aol.com/grilling?ncid=emlcntusfood00000006)
Message 24
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Subject: | Re: First Flight |
Congratulations
Franz
On 28/06/09 10:07 AM, "Speedy11@aol.com" <Speedy11@aol.com> wrote:
> My Appreciation to Bob and others on this list who helped me better understand
> electricity and its application to aircraft systems. The invaluable
> information I obtained on this forum was implemented into my RV-8A and my
> airplane flew for the first time today. The electrical system performed as
> expected and will continue to do so far into the future.
> Most of the info I got on this forum was not available elsewhere - or, at
> least, not without great difficulty.
> Thanks!
> Stan Sutterfield
> RV-8A N884P - Flying
>
>
> Make your summer sizzle with fast and easy recipes
> <http://food.aol.com/grilling?ncid=emlcntusfood00000006> for the grill.
>
>
>
>
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Bob,
The current editions I teach from...
http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/codeq/doctree/87391.htm
http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/codeq/doctree/87392.htm
http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/codeq/doctree/87393.htm
http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/codeq/doctree/87394.htm
Ron Q.
At 09:44 6/28/2009, you wrote:
>From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
>
><nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
>
>While searching the reference documents archives I'm
>reminded of this collection of NASA documents found on
>the 'net. I've compiled a library of useful publications
>and posted them to my website at:
>
>http://www.aeroelectric.com/Reference_Docs/NASA/
>
>
>I'll invite any with an interest in the processes
>cited to add these documents to their library. In
>particular, check out the 1963 NASA wiring handbook
>that one of your fellow readers forwarded to me
>some months ago. This book was published two years
>after I got out of high school! It's an interesting
>adventure back in time but still rich in solid,
>simple-ideas.
>
>
> Bob . . .
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Congrats Stan! Now comes the fun part! Be careful during Phase 1.
Bret Smith
RV-9A N16BL
Blue Ridge, Ga
www.FlightInnovations.com <http://www.flightinnovations.com/>
_____
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Speedy11@aol.com
Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 1:08 PM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: First Flight
My Appreciation to Bob and others on this list who helped me better
understand electricity and its application to aircraft systems. The
invaluable information I obtained on this forum was implemented into my
RV-8A and my airplane flew for the first time today. The electrical system
performed as expected and will continue to do so far into the future.
Most of the info I got on this forum was not available elsewhere - or, at
least, not without great difficulty.
Thanks!
Stan Sutterfield
RV-8A N884P - Flying
_____
Make your summer sizzle with fast and easy
<http://food.aol.com/grilling?ncid=emlcntusfood00000006> recipes for the
grill.
Message 27
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Subject: | TCW product update: SmartStart |
Fellow RV builders,
Just a quick update regarding our SmartStart product. We have
added a new option for use with our SmartStart anti-theft and safety
starting module. We now are offering SmartStart with an optional
airspeed switch that allows for in-flight restarting without having to
re-arm the system. The airspeed switch (ASW-2) is available as an
add-on for those who have already installed a SmartStart module. We
are also making the system available as package which includes the
SmartStart module, wiring harness and an airspeed switch.
All the details are available on our web site: www.tcwtech.com The
product instruction sheet has been updated and is avialable for
downloading from our web site.
Thanks,
Bob Newman
TCW Technologies, LLC.
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At 12:48 PM 6/28/2009, you wrote:
>Bob,
>
>The current editions I teach from...
>
>http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/codeq/doctree/87391.htm
>http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/codeq/doctree/87392.htm
>http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/codeq/doctree/87393.htm
>http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/codeq/doctree/87394.htm
>
>Ron Q.
Thanks! I'll update my library as well as the website
posting.
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
---------------------------------------
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Subject: | Re: First Flight |
At 12:07 PM 6/28/2009, you wrote:
>My Appreciation to Bob and others on this list who helped me better
>understand electricity and its application to aircraft systems. The
>invaluable information I obtained on this forum was implemented into
>my RV-8A and my airplane flew for the first time today. The
>electrical system performed as expected and will continue to do so
>far into the future.
>Most of the info I got on this forum was not available elsewhere -
>or, at least, not without great difficulty.
>Thanks!
>Stan Sutterfield
>RV-8A N884P - Flying
Outstanding! Post some pictures!
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
---------------------------------------
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Subject: | Internally Regulated Alternator Control |
I have followed posts to the list regarding internally regulated alternators
and it appears to me that all are not the same regarding regulator functions
and connections.
I am considering the use of an Eggenfellner E6.0 Subaru Auto conversion.
The electrical system architecture will basically be Z-19.
The Egg is supplied with an internally regulated alternator and their
installation manual shows the following:
ALTERNATOR CONNECTIONS - 4
1. B+ Lead Out - Large connection to Starter & Main Battery Contactor.
2. Fault - Goes to ground in case of alternator failure. For use of
"idiot light". I suppose this could be used as a low voltage warning but I
would opt for an active and separate warning system that could also control
my aux battery contactor.
3. Sense - This is a short jumper to the B+ output terminal; I assume for
voltage info to the internal regulator. (I also assume that sense and
enable connections could be jumpered together and fed from the panel
alternator master switch through the 5A CB controlled by the OV module.)
4. Enable - Clip From manual below:
"5A Alternator Enable. To enable your alternator to produce charging
current, this wire must be connected to a power source. This power source
can be switched by the Master Switch or a subservient "Alternator" switch.
People have come to know this function as an "alternator field", however
that is a term that has lingered on from years ago. It is actually just an
enable signal going to a solid-state voltage regulator inside the
alternator. It knows only ON or OFF, not specific voltages in between.
If you wish to have the ability to manually turn on and off the alternator,
a switch should be provided. However, beware that turning an alternator on
and off under heavy load can dramatically shorten the life of the alternator
and cause substantial spikes and surges. If used, this switch should be
left in the ON position, except when the alternator actually needs to be
taken offline for some reason. For simplicity, this wire can simply be
switched by the Master Switch or the Ignition Switch."
End clip from manual.
I would take this to indicate that the alternator can be shut down using
this enable circuit, by switching off the 12V+ that goes to it. And
therefore the Z-24 (&/or Z-24A) circuitry including the Alternator OV
Disconnect Contactor would not have to be used.
However, I believe that I have read on this list that these enable circuits
will cause the alternator to power up when power is applied, but won't
necessarily shut the alternator down when power is removed.
Now I am confused. Is it possible/likely that the internally regulated
alternator that Egg supplies will operate off and on through this "Enable"
terminal; and all that one would need for OV protection (the manual does not
say that the internal alternator regulator contains any circuitry for OV
protection) is to add an OV module and 5A resettable CB in this circuit?
Gordon Smith
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Subject: | Re: First Flight |
Gongrats Stan! Which is more fun, T-38 or RV-8A? In my mind's
eye.....a tough choice! Congratulations again!
Brooke
On Jun 28, 2009, at 1:07 PM, Speedy11@aol.com wrote:
> My Appreciation to Bob and others on this list who helped me better
> understand electricity and its application to aircraft systems. The
> invaluable information I obtained on this forum was implemented into
> my RV-8A and my airplane flew for the first time today. The
> electrical system performed as expected and will continue to do so
> far into the future.
> Most of the info I got on this forum was not available elsewhere -
> or, at least, not without great difficulty.
> Thanks!
> Stan Sutterfield
> RV-8A N884P - Flying
>
> Make your summer sizzle with fast and easy recipes for the grill.
>
>
Message 32
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Subject: | Re: Internally Regulated Alternator Control |
At 03:28 PM 6/28/2009, you wrote:
I have followed posts to the list regarding
internally regulated alternators and it appears
to me that all are not the same regarding regulator functions and connections.
I am considering the use of an Eggenfellner E6.0
Subaru Auto conversion. The electrical system
architecture will basically be Z-19.
The Egg is supplied with an internally regulated
alternator and their installation manual shows the following:
ALTERNATOR CONNECTIONS - 4
1. B+ Lead Out Large connection to Starter & Main Battery Contactor.
Yes . . .
2. Fault Goes to ground in case of
alternator failure. For use of idiot light. I
suppose this could be used as a low voltage
warning but I would opt for an active and
separate warning system that could also control my aux battery contactor.
This was discussed earlier this week. The built-in
alternator failure light does not comport with
legacy design goals for separate and independent
monitoring and warning of low voltage.
The AEC9005 is discontinued but Eric Jones has
a clone. We'll have a new replacement in the form
of the AEC9011 later this year. Either approach
will satisfy the legacy design goals for low voltage
monitor and control.
3. Sense This is a short jumper to the B+
output terminal; I assume for voltage info to the
internal regulator. (I also assume that sense
and enable connections could be jumpered together
and fed from the panel alternator master switch
through the 5A CB controlled by the OV module.)
Don't know. Does the alternator have a brand and
part number on it?
4. Enable Clip From manual below:
5A Alternator Enable. To enable your alternator
to produce charging current, this wire must be
connected to a power source. This power source
can be switched by the Master Switch or a
subservient Alternator switch. People have come
to know this function as an alternator field,
however that is a term that has lingered on from
years ago. It is actually just an enable signal
going to a solid-state voltage regulator inside
the alternator. It knows only ON or OFF, not specific voltages in between.
This is characteristic of ALL internally regulated
alternators. I.e. there are no stock provisions
for absolute control over the field supply source.
This is why both B&C and Plane Power opt for their
own modifications of stock alternators to provide
this functionality.
If you wish to have the ability to manually turn
on and off the alternator, a switch should be
provided. However, beware that turning an
alternator on and off under heavy load can
dramatically shorten the life of the alternator
and cause substantial spikes and surges. If
used, this switch should be left in the ON
position, except when the alternator actually
needs to be taken off line for some reason. For
simplicity, this wire can simply be switched by
the Master Switch or the Ignition Switch.
Almost . . . Under the legacy design goals for
alternator control, turning the field supply line
on and off while a battery is on line offers no
particular risk to the alternator or the ship's
electro-whizzies.
Further, it's a design goal of any quality supplier
of alternators that their product be able to withstand
b-lead disconnects (load dumps) under hot, full load, high
rpm conditions. So adding Z-24 style OV protection
to the internally regulated alternator presents
no operational hazard for two reasons . . .
(1) there is no normal operating condition where
turning an alternator OFF under heavy load using
Z-24 is called for . . . but a quality alternator
would not be at risk anyhow.
(2) Z-24 style protection can be depended upon
to do it's intended job should the admittedly
rare OV event occur.
I would take this to indicate that the alternator
can be shut down using this enable circuit, by
switching off the 12V+ that goes to it. And
therefore the Z-24 (&/or Z-24A) circuitry
including the Alternator OV Disconnect Contactor would not have to be used.
Assuming the electronics of the internal
regulator is functioning as designed, then
external control by means of the little wire
at the back is possible and predictable. But
if the electronics fails (which is the definition
of an OV event) then all bets are off.
Legacy design goals call for separate and
independent control over the alternator during
an OV event . . . this is what drove the
design philosophy for Z-24.
Alternatively, you can modify your alternator
to adopt the control philosophy adopted by
Plane Power.
However, I believe that I have read on this list
that these enable circuits will cause the
alternator to power up when power is applied, but
wont necessarily shut the alternator down when power is removed.
As far as anyone KNOWS, the control lead will always
exert any time, ON/OFF control . . . as long as the
internal electronics are intact. Further, exercising
this control at any time under any conditions is
not a risky thing to do as long as the battery
is on line. This design goal is satisfied when you utilize
the progressive transfer DC PWR MASTER switch
architecture described in the Z-figures.
Now I am confused. Is it possible/likely that
the internally regulated alternator that Egg
supplies will operate off and on through this
Enable terminal; and all that one would need
for OV protection (the manual does not say that
the internal alternator regulator contains any
circuitry for OV protection) is to add an OV
module and 5A resettable CB in this circuit?
If it were my airplane, I would add OV protection
in the form of either Plane Power style modification
or Z-24 interim to be replaced by the Z-24 final solution
at a later time.
Bob . . .
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Subject: | Re: First Flight |
Congratulations, Stan!
All the work come to fruition.
Regards,
Michael Wynn
RV 8 FWF
San Ramon, CA
In a message dated 6/28/2009 10:14:31 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
Speedy11@aol.com writes:
My Appreciation to Bob and others on this list who helped me better
understand electricity and its application to aircraft systems. The invaluable
information I obtained on this forum was implemented into my RV-8A and my
airplane flew for the first time today. The electrical system performed as
expected and will continue to do so far into the future.
Most of the info I got on this forum was not available elsewhere - or, at
least, not without great difficulty.
Thanks!
Stan Sutterfield
RV-8A N884P - Flying
____________________________________
Make your summer sizzle with _fast and easy recipes_
(http://food.aol.com/grilling?ncid=emlcntusfood00000006) for the grill.
(http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List)
(http://www.matronics.com/contribution)
**************An Excellent Credit Score is 750. See Yours in Just 2 Easy
Steps!
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