Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:56 AM - Re: Crossfeed (Sam Hoskins)
2. 06:41 AM - Re: Re: Switch Failures (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
3. 07:53 AM - Re: Re: AEC9011 (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
4. 10:21 AM - Re: AEC9011 (messydeer)
5. 10:42 AM - why not a Schottky rectifier for essential bus diode? (dave.gribble@mchsi.com)
6. 11:21 AM - Re: why not a Schottky rectifier for essential bus diode? (dave.gribble@mchsi.com)
7. 11:21 AM - Re: why not a Schottky rectifier for essential bus diode? (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
8. 11:44 AM - Test - why are my posts empty? (dave.gribble@mchsi.com)
9. 12:19 PM - Re: Test - why are my posts empty? (Steve Thomas)
10. 12:53 PM - Re: Test - why are my posts empty? (Dave Gribble)
11. 12:55 PM - questions about B&C toggle swtiches (Dave Gribble)
12. 01:08 PM - Re: Re: AEC9011 (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
13. 02:20 PM - Switch failures (Lapsley R. and Sandra E. Caldwell)
14. 02:25 PM - Re: questions about B&C toggle swtiches (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
15. 02:42 PM - Re: AEC9011 (messydeer)
16. 03:51 PM - Re: questions about B&C toggle swtiches (Charlie England)
17. 04:05 PM - UMA engine gauge problem (Chenoweth)
18. 04:30 PM - Load Monitoring (al38kit)
19. 06:02 PM - Re: Re: AEC9011 (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
20. 06:02 PM - Re: Switch failures (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
21. 06:06 PM - Re: Load Monitoring (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
22. 07:05 PM - Re: Load Monitoring (al38kit)
23. 11:01 PM - Official AeroElectric-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) (Matt Dralle)
24. 11:13 PM - Official AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines (Matt Dralle)
Message 1
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Answers to questions/comments embedded below.
On Fri, Jul 31, 2009 at 2:42 PM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III <
nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com> wrote:
> nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
>
> At 10:32 AM 7/27/2009, you wrote:
>
>> I have an all electric plane and have attempted to emulate Z19-RB.
>>
>> Both batteries are the same size, but I am intending on starting on the
>> main battery only. My alternator-out load analysis shows around 17 amps to
>> keep it in the air, though I think I can drop that to 10.
>>
>
> Okay, what are your design goals for battery only
> endurance?
>
I understand that I have added complication in order to persue this
electronic ignition/injection path, and I am not flying the same plane as
before. (The wire count is now over 150, for this little plane. My old
wire count was about 70). If I could get a reliable 1.5 hours of flight
time, from the time of an alternator faliure, I could deal with that. I fly
day VFR, but sometimes fly over the mountains and the Ozarks.
>
>
> The "keep the engine running" components may run off either bus, but the
>> endurance bus is just connected to the main.
>>
>> Could I install a crossfeed switch between the main and engine batteries,
>> without a contactor?
>>
>
> Obviously, yes. But 30A always hot wires to a panel mounted
> switch? You're stacking lots of switches and
> options together that PRESUMES you'll be making good
> and useful decisions when things aren't going right.
> You also appear to be stacking multiple failures onto
> a single tank full of gas.
>
It's always a question about how far to take this "redundancy" issue.
I was recently thrown for another loop when Tracy Crook informed me I should
have power supplied simultaneously to both the power inputs on the EC3
controller. I have not yet figured how to do that without adding any more
switches. I had one scenario figured out, but it required the ON-ON-OFF
switch. It turns out the switch is too wide to fit into the existing rows
or switched. For right now, I am using an unwieldy workaround.
>
>
> It would allow me to use the engine battery for the endurance bus, to
>> supplement the main battery. That would also allow me to simultaneously
>> charge both batteries without engaging the engine battery contactor.
>>
>
> Hmmmm . . . the whole idea behind Z-19 was to partition
> duties for the two batteries batteries of known condition.
> If there's rationale for paralleling them, perhaps one larger
> battery is more appropriate?
>
I already have the two batteries installed and I like the idea of using a
timed replacement/rotation program. I would need a really complelling
reason to backtrack all that.
>
> With respect to hangar maintenance for dual batteries, how
> about dual battery maintainers? Give each their own accessory
> plug to a wire off the battery bus protected with a 5A
> fuse??
I could do that. The backup battery is easily accessible and the main
backup is harder to get to, so that is simple and works out for charging.
>
> If you're worried about having total battery energy
> available for any and all duties aboard the aircraft,
> what's the failure mode that prompts the design
> goal?
>
Of course, the worst failure would be the alternator giving up the ghost.
At that point, electrons become as valuable as fuel. If the alternator is
gone, I need to be able to have available all the juice in each of the
batteries.
>
> I'll try and attach a pdf.
>>
>
> Nice job on the drawing . . .
>
Thanks. I use SolidEdge 2D by Seimens. It's free. It's the most similar
to ME10/CoCreate, which we used back at the explosives factory.
>
>
> BTW, after a year and a half, I am somewhat back in the air, though many
>> bugs remain.
>>
>
> Yup, it's no different in the development of TC
> aircraft. Hopefully we slay all the dragons during
> pre-cert flight testing and shepherding the first
> dozen or so airplanes down the line. The NICE thing
> about dead-dragons in the factory is that the outcome
> benefits lots of future airplanes. Your website for
> sharing your own hunting successes is a good and useful
> thing . . .
>
I figure the best I can give back is to make a good record for others to
follow or to reject, as it suits them.
Sam
www.samhoskins.blogspot.com
>
>
> Bob . . .
>
> ---------------------------------------
> ( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
> ( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
> ( appearance of being right . . . )
> ( )
> ( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
> ---------------------------------------
>
>
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Subject: | Re: Switch Failures |
At 11:17 PM 7/31/2009, you wrote:
><dave.gribble@mchsi.com>
>
>His handout reads:
>
>"MAJOR PROBLEM! If you install the NEW Beech Circuit Breaker for
>the AD, be prepared for smoke, sparks, or fire in the cockpit.
>
>THE Braided Wire BREAKS..."
>
>You can read the rest of it with photos here:
>http://www.williamsairpower.com/pdf/switches.pdf
Good grief! A one page .pdf file of over 12 megabytes!
Here's the meat of the text . . .
The Braided Wire BREAKS
This one was 90% failed when opened. ALL Beech
and Tyco circuit breaker switches have the braided
wire.
Yes, that basic design has existed in this
product since the early 60's. That series
of breaker-switches has been manufactured
in the hundreds of thousands with about
80K used in Beech products and perhaps
the same amount in some Cessna models.
Commercially, that design has a market footprint
probably in the millions. Now, there is
a fundamental flaw in the design for this
product. You'll all no doubt recall numerous
discussions about "gas-tight" for reliable
connectivity and "support at the stress risers"
for robustness. This is a common theme throughout
the universe of wire connection. It was discussed
at length in . . .
http://aeroelectric.com/articles/terminal.pdf
As you can see in this photo . . .
http://aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Breakers/W31_w_%27Failed%27_jumper_wires.jpg
. . . the braid is SPOT WELDED to the
forward corner of the frame. Yeah, let's hear
it for gas-tight. But were is the support at the
stress-risers for robustness? It isn't there.
Now, in the photo above, the "failed" wires are
some that I cut to see if I could detect a delta-R
in the breaker's closed position for the purposes
of detecting an impending failure. It wasn't possible
with ordinary tools. However, when wires break in the
fielded products, they fail right at the edge of
the spotweld. Predictable.
When the braided wire fails it either fails open or
closed. If it fails open, the current then goes through
the arm, through the spring and onto the load bar.
The FAA used the word "shorted" in some of their
descriptions of failure modes. I objected but
the document was already published and in the
field. It's a rare bureaucrat that will
step up to do the right thing when caught with
his pants down. I don't think there were EVER
instances of shorting, only of broken wires
that transferred the major current path to
an uninsulated spring.
By insulating the spring it solved this problem. However
many Tyco circuit breaker switches have failed
closed or shorted (in all types of aircraft). When the
braid breaks off and closes the buss input to the load
bar, it renders the switch ineffective and uncontrolled
electricity goes through that circuit. After that it is
smoke, sparks, and ultimately fire unless God
intervenes.
A classic example of seizing on a few
facts, a few off the wall assumptions,
some mis-interpreted drivel from the
bureaucrats, an scare the pants off the
uninformed by alluding to enhanced risk
of joining their maker . . .
What is needed is a circuit breaker switch that
does not have a braided wire.
Simplify the current path.
Without a doubt, the new design is superior
with regard to the elimination of the poorly
implemented spot-welds for wire bonding. However,
this product doesn't have the field history
of the existing part. It's not known if 20
years and 100,000 parts from now, some new
AD won't be issued against this part as well.
What we DO know is that the failures are rare,
and relatively benign and is only a risk for
the breakers above 10A continuous loads.
If it were my airplane, I'd replace the pitot
heat and prop heat switch breakers with the
new design, leave the rest alone.
Just like the guy who got an STC for replacing
Piper's aluminum cables with copper cables
and made a bundle selling holy-watered hunks
of wire, this guy is going to make some bux
selling a $30 device at a huge mark-up . . .
made possible because he was willing to run
the traps with the folks who holy-watered
his product.
Hey, how about a "cash for breakers" program?
Talk to the right folks in Congress and I'll
bet we can soak our grandchildren for a
few $millions$ to help this guy get well quicker
and alleviate the need for prayers in the cockpit.
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
---------------------------------------
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At 11:41 PM 7/31/2009, you wrote:
>
>
> > I've decided to leave the alternator/generator version
> > as shown . . . for several reasons. There will be a PM
> > alternator version -10/14V AND -11/28v that drops out
> > the relay for alternator OV condition.
>
>So I would get something separately, like the current one offered, S704-1?
Yes
> > This will merge nicely with all the existing PM alternator Z-figures.
>How so?
Because the present design philosophy for controlling
the PM alternator is to ENERGIZE the alternator disconnect
relay to bring the alternator on line. This would remain
the same. The ground side of the alternator disconnect
relay would be controlled by the OV/LV module.
>And from the Jabiru installation manual,
>http://www.usjabiru.com/images/pdf/manuals/new%20stuff/3300%20Install.pdf
>it says on page 16 a low voltage warning light can be connected to
>the green wire of the voltage regulator. So I would be left with an
>test/reset switch.
As a general rule, the alternator failure warnings
integral to voltage regulators are indicative of
gross alternator failure and may not be sensitive
to simple reductions in voltage due to regulator
control failure and/or alternator over-loading.
Legacy design goals for TC aircraft call for LV/OV
monitoring and control to be independent systems
not electrically connected with the regulator.
It is my recommendation that the "LV warning"
built into the regulator be ignored and that
all LV/OV related functions be handled by the
AEC9011-10
>This makes me ask, is a test/reset switch of great value for the OV
>disconnect system? If it is, it seems it would be better to get it
>separately, instead of in a package where most or all of the other
>components are of no use.
Connected to the answer above. First, you'd like to
be able to pre-flight the LV/OV monitoring and
control system. The LV light begins to flash as
soon as you turn the master switch ON. After
engine start, RPMs high enough to bring the
alternator to life should turn the LV warning light
out. After that, a manual TEST trip of the OV system
should bring the LV warning back on. A RESET
should clear the LV condition. It's all a package
designed to address design goals driven by
the legacy failure modes effects analysis
process that has served us well in the TC
aircraft world for decades.
For your application, the only thing you'll leave
off is the second LV warning light.
>I just now saw a pic of the arc suppression relay:
>http://aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Relays/Relay_with_Arc_Suppression_s.jpg
>I had thought the capacitor was 10 or 20 times bigger!
It doesn't take much. And except for the fact
that we'd like to trip the OV system once per
flight cycle in preflight, the arc suppression
system would probably not add much value. But
when you test a generator or alternator at low
rpm, field currents tend to be high and stored
energy greater than for the average OV trip
condition at cruise. So it's a good thing to
have. But control of the PM alternator doesn't
present these kinds of stresses so the arc
suppression is left off.
Bob . . .
Message 4
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Hey, Bob :-)
> For your application, the only thing you'll leave
> off is the second LV warning light.
So I would still get the S704-1 separately and the only moving parts in the 9011
would be the OV test/reset switch?
It would look similar to the drawing on page 4 of 9011-700-1C, except everything
inside the dotted lines would be replaced by my PM alternator and my S704-1.
The inductor for my S704-1 would be wired into the OV WARN light somehow.
> The ground side of the alternator disconnect
> relay...
You mean the wire from the ground side of the inductor S704-1 that is grounded
to the firewall?
> ...would be controlled by the OV/LV module.
The OV/LV module is the 9011, 9011-10 in my case. From Z-20, I thought the 'ground
side of the alternator disconnect relay' was normally controlled by the crowbar
OVM via tripping the ALT 5A circuit breaker. You're not saying the crowbar
OVM and ALT circuit breaker would be changed, are you?
Finally, From your 2nd reply in this thread:
> So all you'll have is the OV test/reset switch and the
> LV warning light.
Which seems different than what you have said now:
> ...the only thing you'll leave
> off is the second LV warning light.
I feel like I have a progressive transfer switch in my brain. It still isn't in
the 'on-on' position for this topic, but you'll help me get it there soon!
Thanks,
Dan
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=255518#255518
Message 5
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Subject: | why not a Schottky rectifier for essential bus diode? |
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Subject: | Re: why not a Schottky rectifier for essential bus |
diode?
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Subject: | Re: why not a Schottky rectifier for essential bus |
diode?
At 12:31 PM 8/1/2009, you wrote:
q: Why not a Schottky rectifier for essential bus diode?
a: They work too. The hype used to market them doesn't match
realities of the application but they're fine in terms
of suitability to task.
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
---------------------------------------
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Subject: | Test - why are my posts empty? |
Message 9
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Subject: | Re: Test - why are my posts empty? |
You have some strange HTML code in your message that is being ignored,
hence a blank message. If your email client allows you to see the raw
source of the message, you can see everything.
Try changing your text settings to "Plain Text". You loose all the
superfluous crap that comes with some HTML editors and gets your basic
message across.
Steve Thomas
________________________________________________________________________
On Aug 1, 2009, at 11:34 AM, dave.gribble@mchsi.com wrote:
>
>
Message 10
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Subject: | Re: Test - why are my posts empty? |
Thanks Steve - testing 1 2 3.... sending this with outlook express.
Previous were sent via web client, which seems to have changed for the
worse!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Thomas" <lists@stevet.net>
Sent: Saturday, August 01, 2009 2:10 PM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Test - why are my posts empty?
>
> You have some strange HTML code in your message that is being ignored,
> hence a blank message. If your email client allows you to see the raw
> source of the message, you can see everything.
>
> Try changing your text settings to "Plain Text". You loose all the
> superfluous crap that comes with some HTML editors and gets your basic
> message across.
>
>
> Steve Thomas
> ________________________________________________________________________
>
>
> On Aug 1, 2009, at 11:34 AM, dave.gribble@mchsi.com wrote:
>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 11
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Subject: | questions about B&C toggle swtiches |
Hello group - I have 2 questions about B&C toggle switches... they are at
the show so I thought I'd post here...
1) Anyone know what brand they are? With all the recent discussion of
switch failures I'd like to know if they are OK or not. Of course my system
will be failure tolerant so this isn't a safety question, more of a consumer
question.
2) Do the single pole and double pole switches physically look the same
from the panel side? Sometimes I've seem some that don't quite match
(toggle shape, metal finish, etc.) and in that case I'd buy all double pole
switches.
Thanks for any info, hope this post works (plain text via outlook express...
fingers crossed).
dave
Message 12
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>
>So I would still get the S704-1 separately and the only moving parts
>in the 9011 would be the OV test/reset switch?
Yes . . .
<snip>
>I feel like I have a progressive transfer switch in my brain. It
>still isn't in the 'on-on' position for this topic, but you'll help
>me get it there soon!
See wiring diagram posted at:
http://www.aeroelectric.com/temp/9011_PM_OV-LV.pdf
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
---------------------------------------
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Does anyone have a cross reference from B & C part numbers to
Honeywell's part numbers?
Roger
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Subject: | Re: questions about B&C toggle swtiches |
At 02:54 PM 8/1/2009, you wrote:
><dave.gribble@mchsi.com>
>
>Hello group - I have 2 questions about B&C toggle switches... they
>are at the show so I thought I'd post here...
>
>1) Anyone know what brand they are? With all the recent discussion
>of switch failures I'd like to know if they are OK or not. Of
>course my system will be failure tolerant so this isn't a safety
>question, more of a consumer question.
They're Carling products. Direct descendants
of the rocker switches (including the infamous
split rocker master) used on Cessnas and others
for decades. See:
http://www.aeroelectric.com/Mfgr_Data/Switches/Carling/
>2) Do the single pole and double pole switches physically look the
>same from the panel side? Sometimes I've seem some that don't quite
>match (toggle shape, metal finish, etc.) and in that case I'd buy
>all double pole switches.
The are identical.
>Thanks for any info, hope this post works (plain text via outlook
>express... fingers crossed).
Yup, that works.
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
---------------------------------------
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Great :-)
The new diagram shows no crowbar OVM, nor circuit breaker between terminals 2 and
5 in the master switch, so does this mean the 9011 will indeed replace these,
taking the overvoltage PM alternator offline?
--------
Dan
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=255558#255558
Message 16
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Subject: | Re: questions about B&C toggle swtiches |
Dave Gribble wrote:
> <dave.gribble@mchsi.com>
>
> Hello group - I have 2 questions about B&C toggle switches... they are
> at the show so I thought I'd post here...
>
> 1) Anyone know what brand they are? With all the recent discussion
> of switch failures I'd like to know if they are OK or not. Of course
> my system will be failure tolerant so this isn't a safety question,
> more of a consumer question.
>
> 2) Do the single pole and double pole switches physically look the
> same from the panel side? Sometimes I've seem some that don't quite
> match (toggle shape, metal finish, etc.) and in that case I'd buy all
> double pole switches.
>
> Thanks for any info, hope this post works (plain text via outlook
> express... fingers crossed).
>
> dave
limited answer/thought set:
2)
Many panel designers now recommend using dissimilar switch handles for
different jobs. Perfect rows of matching switches look nice on the
flight line, but bouncing around in the air in the dark, being able to
identify a switch by feel can be an asset.
outlook express: Try Thunderbird. Or just about anything other than
outlook.... :-)
Charlie
Message 17
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Subject: | UMA engine gauge problem |
I have UMA tachometer, oil pressure, oil temperature, and cylinder heat
temperature gauges installed as part of a recently completed Rotax 912S
installation in a Kitfox that previously had a 582. The airplane (and
its electrical system) are about 8 years old except for the changes made
to accommodate the brand new engine.
I am using an electrical system design as outlined in the Aeroelectric
Connection including the over voltage module and the ground block bolted
thru the firewall to the 6 awg engine ground cable.
At about seven hours of trouble-free operation the CHT and oil
temperature gauges registered 140 degrees at power-up with the ambient
temperature at about 60. The oil pressure gauge barely crept up to 12
psi as I ran the engine for about 60 seconds (before shutting down).
The plane is hangared and had sat idle thru about 10 days of damp, rainy
weather. Prior to this point the gauges had behaved in a normal way -
temperatures pegged at zero then rising as the engine warmed up and oil
pressure climbing immediately at start-up to 70 psi and then declining
as things warmed up. Oil temperature would reach 120 after about 5 to 6
minutes. The tach behaved normally.
Simple explanation, right? Evidently not. After testing the
instruments in the plane and discussion with UMA I sent the gauges back,
they were declared to be working correctly, I got them back, installed
them (one at a time with tests in between), and they worked fine. For
about two flight hours. Then after the plane sat for three or four
days the false readings reappeared.
This time I made a test rig so I could completely bypass the plane's
electrical system. I have a db9 with separate leads. I ran one to the
battery positive, one to the sensor on the engine, and held the ground
lead against the engine block within a couple of inches of the sensor.
Same false reading. Battery voltage at this point was about 11.9 (as
shown on the aircraft voltmeter just after the test). We checked the
resistance of the CHT sensor where we did the test and it was 1145 ohms
which is consistent with the ambient temperature of 70 or so.
The following day the "falseness" of the temperature readings was less.
The day after it was still less so I flew the plane a bit. Oil pressure
readings were lower than "normal"; temperatures were higher but all
within a range that I felt ok running the engine in flight (briefly).
The fact that three instruments are involved makes me wonder just what
I've done to cause this. The fact that an instrument, isolated from the
plane's electrical system, is reading inaccurately makes me wonder about
some kind of problem in all three gauges.
Can anyone on the list suggest a cause or perhaps an additional
debugging technique.
Thanks very much.
Bill
Kitfox IV 1200
Albion, Maine
Message 18
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I'm considering using two alternators, the 20 Amp B&C, and the 60 AMP Plane Power.
I'm also considering using two PP regulators, as it appears that they will
load share as a percent of output...I'm going to use a JPI 930 that has the
ability to monitor two locations with 50mv shunts...they sell 100 AMP units at
$75 a pop...I thought that to be a little much for a shunt...
I think I read that you were using 50mv shunts in your load meter set up and that
they were matched or calibrated or something...
Do you think that using two of them on the load meter of the JPI would be a good
idea...and how much are they?
Any other comments welcome, especially on the PP regulators and the load sharing
feature.
PS...I found the Tyco EV200 relays for $50, delivered...so I bought them.
Thanks,
Al Kittleson
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=255568#255568
Message 19
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At 04:40 PM 8/1/2009, you wrote:
>
>Great :-)
>
>The new diagram shows no crowbar OVM, nor circuit breaker between
>terminals 2 and 5 in the master switch, so does this mean the 9011
>will indeed replace these, taking the overvoltage PM alternator offline?
that's what it does . . .
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
---------------------------------------
Message 20
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Subject: | Re: Switch failures |
At 04:13 PM 8/1/2009, you wrote:
>Does anyone have a cross reference from B & C part numbers to
>Honeywell's part numbers?
>
The last two digits of B&C's numbers carry over
to the Honeywell part numbers shown in
http://www.aeroelectric.com/Mfgr_Data/Switches/Microswitch/Microswitch_TL-Series.pdf
For example, the S700-2-3 is a Honeywell 2TL1-3
| | | |
| | | \--Function
| | \-- # of poles
| \---- Function
\----- # of poles
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
---------------------------------------
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Subject: | Re: Load Monitoring |
At 06:28 PM 8/1/2009, you wrote:
>
>I'm considering using two alternators, the 20 Amp B&C, and the 60
>AMP Plane Power. I'm also considering using two PP regulators, as
>it appears that they will load share as a percent of output...I'm
>going to use a JPI 930 that has the ability to monitor two locations
>with 50mv shunts...they sell 100 AMP units at $75 a pop...I thought
>that to be a little much for a shunt...
>
>I think I read that you were using 50mv shunts in your load meter
>set up and that they were matched or calibrated or something...
>
>Do you think that using two of them on the load meter of the JPI
>would be a good idea...and how much are they?
>
>Any other comments welcome, especially on the PP regulators and the
>load sharing feature.
>
>PS...I found the Tyco EV200 relays for $50, delivered...so I bought them.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Al Kittleson
Please don't do this. The elegant application of
the two alternators is EITHER as shown in
Z-11 or INDEPENDENT W/cross-feed as shown in
Z-14.
What are your load requirements that you think you'll
ever need the combined output of both alternators to
drive a single bus?
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
---------------------------------------
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Subject: | Re: Load Monitoring |
Sorry to not word the question better regarding the shunts.
I was generally thinking of a design along the lines of Z-14...my thought was to
run with the crossfeed tie closed in normal operation and use both alternators
to feed the tied busses...
If that is a bad idea, then I'll run split busses.
My monitor should function the same way, regardless of whether the buss tie is
open or closed...that is where the question regarding the shunts enters the picture.
Thanks,
Al
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=255585#255585
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Subject: | Official AeroElectric-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) |
Dear Listers,
Please read over the AeroElectric-List Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) below.
The
complete AeroElectric-List FAQ including the Usage Guidelines can be found at the
following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/AeroElectric-List.FAQ.html
Thank you,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
[ Note: This FAQ was designed to be displayed with a fixed width font such as
Courier. Proportional fonts will cause display formatting errors. ]
This FAQ can also be viewed in HTML online at the following address:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm
************************************************************
******* LIST POLICIES AND FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS *******
************************************************************
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running smoothly for all of us.
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Microsoft has a really awesome utility available for free that allows
you to Right-Click on a picture in Explorer and automatically
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Look for the link "Image Resizer"
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*******************
*** Digest Mode ***
*******************
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*****************************************
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If you have not done so already, please email me your phone numbers and
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*********************
*** List Archives ***
*********************
A file containing of all of the previous postings to the AeroElectric-List is
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- Latest version of the AeroElectric-List Frequently Asked Question
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* AeroElectric-Archive.digest.complete
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* AeroElectric-Archive.digest.vol-??
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* AeroElectric-Archive.digest.complete.zip
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in PKZIP format. Use "binary" data transfer methods.
* AeroElectric-Archive.digest.complete.Z
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in
UNIX compress format. Use "binary" data transfer methods.
Download Via FTP
----------------
The archive file is available via anonymous FTP from ftp.matronics.com
in the "/pub/Archives" directory. It is updated daily and can be found in
a number of formats as described above. (All filenames are case sensitive.)
ftp://ftp.matronics.com/pub/Archives
Download Via Web
----------------
The archives are also available via a web listing. These can be found
toward the bottom of the following web page:
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******************************************
*** Complete List Web Archive Browsing ***
******************************************
All messages posted to the AeroElectric-List are also available using the
Email List Archive Browsing feature. With this utility, all messages
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http://www.matronics.com/archive/archive-index.cgi?AeroElectric
*****************************************
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*****************************************
You can use the custom, high-performance Matronics Email List Search Engine
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http://www.matronics.com/search
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****************************
With the Matronics Email List File and Photo Share you can share pictures
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!! ==> Please including the following information with each submission:
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2) Your Full Name.
3) Your Email Address.
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5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic.
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Prior to public availability of the files and photos, each will be scanned
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Following the availability of the new Photoshare, an email message will be
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For a current list of available Photoshares, have a look at the Main
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**************************
*** List Archive CDROM ***
**************************
A complete Matronics Email List Archive CD is available that contains
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**********************************
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******************************************************************************
AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines
******************************************************************************
The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the AeroElectric-List.
You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein.
Failure to use the AeroElectric-List in the manner described below may result
in the removal of the subscribers from the List.
AeroElectric-List Policy Statement
The purpose of the AeroElectric-List is to provide a forum of discussion for
things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals
are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver
high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie
among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals
requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of
the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established:
- Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit
posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long
lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc.
- THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be
relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it.
- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive
that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and
terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and
responses.
- Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address,
aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line
about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid
bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary
space in the archive.
- DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is
easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the
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- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of
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easy to find threads in the archive.
- When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your
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-------
[This is an automated posting.]
do not archive
Message 24
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|
Subject: | Official AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines |
Dear Listers,
Please read over the AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines below. The complete
AeroElectric-List FAQ including these Usage Guidelines can be found at the
following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/AeroElectric-List.FAQ.html
Thank you,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
******************************************************************************
AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines
******************************************************************************
The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the AeroElectric-List.
You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein.
Failure to use the AeroElectric-List in the manner described below may result
in the removal of the subscribers from the List.
AeroElectric-List Policy Statement
The purpose of the AeroElectric-List is to provide a forum of discussion for
things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals
are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver
high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie
among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals
requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of
the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established:
- Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit
posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long
lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc.
- THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be
relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it.
- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive
that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and
terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and
responses.
- Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address,
aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line
about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid
bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary
space in the archive.
- DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is
easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the
web page or FAQ first.
- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of
your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it
easy to find threads in the archive.
- When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your
response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the
reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that
quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive
can not be overstated!
- When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT
then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the
"reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your
response to the original poster. You might have to actively address
your response with the original poster's email address.
- DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something
to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I
agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent
to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large.
- When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to
comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly
contribute something valuable.
- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone
polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack
other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously
controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that
will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.
- Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly
subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by
List members promoting their respective products or items for sale
should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble
a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but
is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to
everyone, including those who provide products to the entire
community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the
operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists.
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