Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:33 AM - Re: Why Brass Bolt for ground terminal? (bob noffs)
2. 05:52 AM - Re: Re: Shielded wire for wingtip strobe (Bob Collins)
3. 06:51 AM - Re: Re: Shielded wire for wingtip strobe (Fisher Paul A.)
4. 07:10 AM - Re: Protecting the compass from interference ()
5. 07:10 AM - Re: [Probable SPAM] Re: Why Brass Bolt for ground terminal? ()
6. 07:43 AM - Re: Protecting the compass from interference (Ernest Christley)
7. 07:43 AM - Re: Why Brass Bolt for ground terminal? (dave.gribble@mchsi.com)
8. 09:42 AM - Re: Protecting the compass from interference (Jared Yates)
9. 02:22 PM - Fried Master switch wires (Ron Patterson)
10. 02:22 PM - Re: Protecting the compass from interference (LarryMcFarland)
11. 03:07 PM - Re: Shielded wire for wingtip strobe (dalemed)
12. 05:20 PM - Re: Re: Sensor wires with ignition leads (Bob Barrow)
13. 06:07 PM - wiring diagram (James Robinson)
14. 07:42 PM - Re: Protecting the compass from interference ()
15. 08:50 PM - Re: Re: Sensor wires with ignition leads (dave.gribble@mchsi.com)
16. 11:01 PM - Official AeroElectric-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) (Matt Dralle)
17. 11:13 PM - Official AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines (Matt Dralle)
Message 1
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Subject: | Re: Why Brass Bolt for ground terminal? |
the brass bolt will carry the current thru the firewall to the ''forest of
tabs'' you will mount on it on the cabin side of the firewall.
bob noffs
On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 9:23 PM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III <
nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com> wrote:
> nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
>
> At 08:00 PM 8/31/2009, you wrote:
>
>>
>> I'm building a firewall ground terminal system consisting of faston tabs
>> soldered to sheets of brass stock. I'll sandwich these around the RV
>> firewall (thin stainless steel) and use a big bolt on one side to attach the
>> battery and engine ground straps to.
>>
>> I see that the B&C version of this calls for a brass bolt - what is the
>> reason for this, and also what size of bolt to use? I assume it is a
>> dissimilar metals corrosion problem... I have designed for a few smaller #8
>> bolts to hold the brass sheets together.. do these have to be brass too?
>>
>
> If the Big bolt is long (like through a composite
> firewall) the brass bolt is preferred for electrical
> conductivity. But for a thin firewall, regular AN
> hardware is fine. The #8 hardware is mechanical only,
> plain vanilla AN hardware there too.
>
>
> Bob . . .
>
> ---------------------------------------
> ( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
> ( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
> ( appearance of being right . . . )
> ( )
> ( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
> ---------------------------------------
>
>
Message 2
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Subject: | Re: Shielded wire for wingtip strobe |
Somewhat related question. I have the Whelen Comet system for my RV-7A, It
has shielded cable, of course, the power unit out to the wingtip strobe,
with the shield grounded at the power unit.
But, because there's a chance I won't be able to fly my project off the
field where it's now being built, I may hve to take the wings off and truck
it to anothre airport, so I want to use a terminal strip at the inboard wing
root, so that the wires can be disconnected. What should I do with the
shield wire at that location. Should I treat it like any other wire and
connect it at the terminal strip and continue it out to the wing tip? Or
should I just terminate it at the wing root?
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of dalemed
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 7:47 PM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Shielded wire for wingtip strobe
I ran about 15 feet of wire from a battery to the strobe. When an AM
weather Band radio was anywhere within 10 feet of the circuit, there was
considerable noise in the radio.
I didn't get any information with my lights. Any info I got was from their
website. Where did you read that they are "noise free"? The spikes I see
on the power lines using an oscilloscope would indicate otherwise.
In any event, I don't see where the use of shielded wire would hurt. I'd
like to know the best way/place to ground the shield.
Thanks for your feedback!
--------
Dale
Flying Cessna 170B
Building Zenith CH650
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=260732#260732
Message 3
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Subject: | Re: Shielded wire for wingtip strobe |
Bob,
I treated it like any other wire at the Molex connectors in the wing root. Seems
to be working so far. Full disclosure - I've only got 19 hours on it, but
I don't have any problems with audio, communications, or navigation equipment.
Paul A. Fisher
RV-7A N18PF
-----Original Message-----
...snip...
What should I do with the
shield wire at that location. Should I treat it like any other wire and
connect it at the terminal strip and continue it out to the wing tip? Or
should I just terminate it at the wing root?
Message 4
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Subject: | Protecting the compass from interference |
Thanks Bob,
Based on your last comment I've thought seriously of just removing it. I
have 2 Dynon AHRS remotes in the wings and 2 Garmin GPS units (panel)
and 1 handheld unit on board. If all of that goes to hell, I'll just
land in a field and ask directions.
While building my panel I did notice specifically when or what caused
the interference, it just developed over the process. First I should
probably remove the compass to be sure it is in itself accurate simply
standing outside.
I have a small military compass from LL Bean which I carry and may do in
a pinch. Cheaper too.
Glenn
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Robert L. Nuckolls, III
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 10:42 PM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Protecting the compass from interference
<nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
At 11:46 AM 8/31/2009, you wrote:
>
>Is there anything I use as a shield to protect my compass (panel
>mounted) from interference with surrounding neighbors? I was thinking
>about dipping it in lead. Perhaps I could wrap it in tin foil?
>
>Thanks,
>Glenn
The magnetic compass is intended to deduce alignment of
the earth's magnetic field (on the order of 500 milliGauss)
and produce a useful navigation display based thereon.
Your query doesn't give us a good sense of any problems
you may be having. ALL compasses installed on ALL vehicles
are subject to external influences that tend to distort
the field of interest. This is why the compass is "swung" or
calibrated at the compass rose after installation. Further,
swinging the compass is done with a known condition for
certain electrical system components being ON or OFF.
There is no value in attempting to isolate surrounding
effects with special shielding. If there is some accessory
that causes a major swing in compass reading, then you
increase the separation between compass and antagonist.
The last compass issue I worked was on the Bonanza after
the B&C standby alternator was installed. Magnetic leakage
from the alternator on the back of the engine produced
an unacceptable deviation to the compass reading when mounted
on the glare shield. Moving the compass to a previously
qualified location higher on the windshield fixed the problem.
The BEST compasses are remotely sensed with the transducer
in the tailcone or out on wing.
But your panel mounted GPS should be backed up with
a hand held GPS . . . the compass has become a historical
curiosity of limited usefulness.
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
---------------------------------------
Message 5
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Subject: | Re: Why Brass Bolt for ground |
terminal?
Bob,
Wow, I really appreciate your craftsmanship effort, but why would you
build one of these? B & C sells them relatively cheaply and they are
perfect for the job. Drill a hole, add the appropriate number of washers
and move on.
Glenn
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of bob
noffs
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 7:28 AM
Subject: [Probable SPAM] Re: AeroElectric-List: Why Brass Bolt for
ground terminal?
the brass bolt will carry the current thru the firewall to the ''forest
of tabs'' you will mount on it on the cabin side of the firewall.
bob noffs
On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 9:23 PM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III
<nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com> wrote:
<nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
At 08:00 PM 8/31/2009, you wrote:
I'm building a firewall ground terminal system consisting of faston tabs
soldered to sheets of brass stock. I'll sandwich these around the RV
firewall (thin stainless steel) and use a big bolt on one side to attach
the battery and engine ground straps to.
I see that the B&C version of this calls for a brass bolt - what is the
reason for this, and also what size of bolt to use? I assume it is a
dissimilar metals corrosion problem... I have designed for a few smaller
#8 bolts to hold the brass sheets together.. do these have to be brass
too?
If the Big bolt is long (like through a composite
firewall) the brass bolt is preferred for electrical
conductivity. But for a thin firewall, regular AN
hardware is fine. The #8 hardware is mechanical only,
plain vanilla AN hardware there too.
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------
( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
( appearance of being right . . . )
( )
( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
---------------------------------------
s such as List Un/Subscription,
www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List"
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
ronics.com/" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
Matt Dralle, List Admin.
====
Message 6
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Subject: | Re: Protecting the compass from interference |
longg@pjm.com wrote:
>
> Thanks Bob,
>
> Based on your last comment I've thought seriously of just removing it. I
> have 2 Dynon AHRS remotes in the wings and 2 Garmin GPS units (panel)
> and 1 handheld unit on board. If all of that goes to hell, I'll just
> land in a field and ask directions.
>
Regardless of that, you will need to please the bureaucrats. The regs
say you need a compass. Come hell or high-water, you don't have an
airplane until you have a compass.
I got a cheap, light plastic thingy from Advance Auto. A 1" hole in the
dash, and I have it front and center, but low enough that it can be
safely ignored (ie, it doesn't interfere with the all important view of
the runway 8*).
Message 7
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Subject: | Re: Why Brass Bolt for ground terminal? |
Hi Glenn - I built the ground block because I like building things! I enjoy the
challenge, and also learning new skills (never sweat soldered brass before)....Sort
of the same reason I'm building my plane instead of buying one :)
I'm sure the B&C parts are nice, but $50 is about $49 more than I spent and I can
save that money and put it towards my EFIS. Besides, B&C has already got enough
ca$h from me this month!
-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: <longg@pjm.com>
>
> Bob,
>
>
>
> Wow, I really appreciate your craftsmanship effort, but why would you
> build one of these? B & C sells them relatively cheaply and they are
> perfect for the job. Drill a hole, add the appropriate number of washers
> and move on.
>
>
>
> Glenn
>
>
>
> From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of bob
> noffs
> Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 7:28 AM
> To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
> Subject: [Probable SPAM] Re: AeroElectric-List: Why Brass Bolt for
> ground terminal?
>
>
>
> the brass bolt will carry the current thru the firewall to the ''forest
> of tabs'' you will mount on it on the cabin side of the firewall.
>
> bob noffs
>
> On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 9:23 PM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III
> <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com> wrote:
>
> <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
>
>
>
> At 08:00 PM 8/31/2009, you wrote:
>
>
> I'm building a firewall ground terminal system consisting of faston tabs
> soldered to sheets of brass stock. I'll sandwich these around the RV
> firewall (thin stainless steel) and use a big bolt on one side to attach
> the battery and engine ground straps to.
>
> I see that the B&C version of this calls for a brass bolt - what is the
> reason for this, and also what size of bolt to use? I assume it is a
> dissimilar metals corrosion problem... I have designed for a few smaller
> #8 bolts to hold the brass sheets together.. do these have to be brass
> too?
>
>
>
> If the Big bolt is long (like through a composite
> firewall) the brass bolt is preferred for electrical
> conductivity. But for a thin firewall, regular AN
> hardware is fine. The #8 hardware is mechanical only,
> plain vanilla AN hardware there too.
>
>
> Bob . . .
>
> ---------------------------------------
> ( . . . a long habit of not thinking )
> ( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial )
> ( appearance of being right . . . )
> ( )
> ( -Thomas Paine 1776- )
> ---------------------------------------
>
> s such as List Un/Subscription,
> www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List"
> target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
> ronics.com/" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
> Matt Dralle, List Admin.
> ====
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 8
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Subject: | Protecting the compass from interference |
If you are thinking of 14CFR part 91.205 b.3, I think it says that you are
required to have a magnetic direction indicator, not a compass. Doesn't a
Dynon satisfy this requirement, since it derives its heading from a
magnetic-field based sensor?
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ernest
Christley
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 10:37 AM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Protecting the compass from interference
<echristley@nc.rr.com>
longg@pjm.com wrote:
>
> Thanks Bob,
>
> Based on your last comment I've thought seriously of just removing it. I
> have 2 Dynon AHRS remotes in the wings and 2 Garmin GPS units (panel)
> and 1 handheld unit on board. If all of that goes to hell, I'll just
> land in a field and ask directions.
>
Regardless of that, you will need to please the bureaucrats. The regs
say you need a compass. Come hell or high-water, you don't have an
airplane until you have a compass.
I got a cheap, light plastic thingy from Advance Auto. A 1" hole in the
dash, and I have it front and center, but low enough that it can be
safely ignored (ie, it doesn't interfere with the all important view of
the runway 8*).
Message 9
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Subject: | Fried Master switch wires |
Here is a real puzzle.
-
I used Bob's Z-11 wiring plan to structure my wiring system in my RV. All w
as well (3 years)-until I inadvertently jumped a dead battery and reverse
d polarity. The master switch wire that runs from the switch to the master
relay, that powers up the starter relay burned (smoked actually). Nothing e
lse burned, just ancillary damage to wire insulation from the melted insula
tion on the master to ground and master to relay and 7 burned fuses.
-
There was a diode on both relays. The yellow diode on the MR showed discolo
ration (a small brown spot) but appeared intact. I replaced all the master
wiring and the Odyssey-battery and tried to lite it.-Again it smoked th
e master wires to the MR and to ground.
-
Then I replaced the MR, the Starter Relay, both diodes AND the master switc
h along with the burned up wire. Seems fine now and I flew it home. The pro
blem is this. Except for the Yellow MR diode frying during the second attem
pt, nothing in that circuit appears damaged. We cut open the MR and it is a
s new inside. Same with the Master-Switch....contact are normal appearing
. So what happened the second time??? Why does everything appear OK on insp
ection?
-
One side note....except for a loss of a battery, one microphone jack and th
e Alternator now putting out only 13.9 volts, the rest of the avionics and
electrical system-appear unharmed. Burned out 7 fuses on the first incide
nt, but no apparent damage to the expensive equipment. That alone makes fus
es superior to circuit breakers in my mind.
-
I appreciate any electrical Guru's thoughts on this event and what I might
still need to do to insure safety in flight. Not knowing what caused the se
cond event makes me a bit nervous that It might still be lurking. Smoke in
the cockpit is not good!
-
Thanks for your ideas,
Ron
-=0A=0A=0A
Message 10
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Subject: | Re: Protecting the compass from interference |
Hi guys,
The compass does seem an excess item until youve left the GPS home or
the replacement batteries dont seem to be working. Ive been only
30-miles out when the snow and visibility had me temporarily dependent
on the GPS and it quit. I knew the last GPS heading and followed it back
via that worthless compass until the white on white of the airport was
back in view. Id give the Compass more respect, as its probably the
only thing that works when all else has dumped out on you. Im
constantly comparing my compass heading with whats on the GPS.
http://www.macsmachine.com/images/flightviews/full/Seaton(4).gif
Larry McFarland 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com
Ernest Christley wrote:
> <echristley@nc.rr.com>
>
> longg@pjm.com wrote:
>>
>> Thanks Bob,
>>
>> Based on your last comment I've thought seriously of just removing it. I
>> have 2 Dynon AHRS remotes in the wings and 2 Garmin GPS units (panel)
>> and 1 handheld unit on board. If all of that goes to hell, I'll just
>> land in a field and ask directions.
>>
> Regardless of that, you will need to please the bureaucrats. The regs
> say you need a compass. Come hell or high-water, you don't have an
> airplane until you have a compass.
>
> I got a cheap, light plastic thingy from Advance Auto. A 1" hole in
> the dash, and I have it front and center, but low enough that it can
> be safely ignored (ie, it doesn't interfere with the all important
> view of the runway 8*).
>
Message 11
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Subject: | Re: Shielded wire for wingtip strobe |
Since everyone (including the manufacturer) says I shouldn't need shielded wire,
I'm going to go with standard wire and save the weight.
Thanks, everybody!
--------
Dale
Flying Cessna 170B
Building Zenith CH650
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=260896#260896
Message 12
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Subject: | Re: Sensor wires with ignition leads |
Bob=2C I'm building an RV7A (not much guidance from the "manufacturer" on t
his issue). Am I to conclude from your comments below that I might be bette
r off separating the EGT and CHT sensor wires from the ignition leads.
If the sensor wires are run with the ignition leads what possible adversiti
es might I be facing. Might I get radio noise. Might I get erroneous instru
ment readings from the EGT and CHT guages.
Regards Bob Barrow
> Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Sensor wires with ignition leads
> From: bob.nuckolls@aeroelectric.com
> Date: Mon=2C 31 Aug 2009 05:10:33 -0700
> To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
>
ectric.com>
>
> Bundling the wires of different and potentially antagonistic systems is q
uite practical and in fact a foregone conclusion in the TC aircraft world.
There's a suite of tests conducted for all electro-whizzies that quantifies
potential victimization/antagonism factors when installed per the manufact
urer's instructions.
>
> While building wire bundles for biz jets consisting of a hundred miles of
wire and very limited options for wire routing=2C the LAST challenge anyon
e wants to address is a requirement for keeping the wires of one system sep
arated from the wires of another system.
>
> The general rule is that unless the manufacturer demands that such separa
tions be established=2C don't worry about it. It they DO make such demands
=2C you may wish to consider an alternative system. Separation requirements
arise from lack of due diligence in crafting an installer and user friendl
y system. Lack of diligence in issues of environmental co-existence aboard
airplanes should make one wonder if other qualities you seek are likewise l
acking.
>
> Bob . . .
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=260592#260592
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
>
>
_________________________________________________________________
View photos of singles in your area Click Here
Message 13
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Bob
Is there a link to your wiring diagrams? Particularly the 2 alts 2 battery all
electric airplane. I can't locate mine. I probably put it where I would be
sure to find it HA HA ;-)
James Robinson
Glasair lll N79R
Spanish Fork UT U77
________________________________
Message 14
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Subject: | Re: Protecting the compass from interference |
You might want to be careful abouting getting rid of the compass. FARs require
a Magnetic direction indicator. If you ditch the compass what do you have that
will meet that requirement? A GPS won't meet it as its not magnetic.
Rodney
---- LarryMcFarland <larry@macsmachine.com> wrote:
>
> Hi guys,
>
> The compass does seem an excess item until youve left the GPS home or
> the replacement batteries dont seem to be working. Ive been only
> 30-miles out when the snow and visibility had me temporarily dependent
> on the GPS and it quit. I knew the last GPS heading and followed it back
> via that worthless compass until the white on white of the airport was
> back in view. Id give the Compass more respect, as its probably the
> only thing that works when all else has dumped out on you. Im
> constantly comparing my compass heading with whats on the GPS.
>
> http://www.macsmachine.com/images/flightviews/full/Seaton(4).gif
>
> Larry McFarland 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com
>
>
> Ernest Christley wrote:
> > <echristley@nc.rr.com>
> >
> > longg@pjm.com wrote:
> >>
> >> Thanks Bob,
> >>
> >> Based on your last comment I've thought seriously of just removing it. I
> >> have 2 Dynon AHRS remotes in the wings and 2 Garmin GPS units (panel)
> >> and 1 handheld unit on board. If all of that goes to hell, I'll just
> >> land in a field and ask directions.
> >>
> > Regardless of that, you will need to please the bureaucrats. The regs
> > say you need a compass. Come hell or high-water, you don't have an
> > airplane until you have a compass.
> >
> > I got a cheap, light plastic thingy from Advance Auto. A 1" hole in
> > the dash, and I have it front and center, but low enough that it can
> > be safely ignored (ie, it doesn't interfere with the all important
> > view of the runway 8*).
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 15
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|
Subject: | Re: Sensor wires with ignition leads |
My A&P & I installed the EGT & CHT probes in my Skipper (O-235 Lycoming with Slick
mags) and ran the wires in the traditional way, in shared adel clamps attached
to the bottom of the valve covers, right along with the spark plug wires.
No radio noise, no problems with the engine monitor (Electronics International
UBG). Hope this data point helps. dave
-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: Bob Barrow <bobbarrow10@hotmail.com>
>
>
> Bob, I'm building an RV7A (not much guidance from the "manufacturer" on this
> issue). Am I to conclude from your comments below that I might be better off
> separating the EGT and CHT sensor wires from the ignition leads.
>
>
>
> If the sensor wires are run with the ignition leads what possible adversities
> might I be facing. Might I get radio noise. Might I get erroneous instrument
> readings from the EGT and CHT guages.
>
>
>
> Regards Bob Barrow
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Sensor wires with ignition leads
> > From: bob.nuckolls@aeroelectric.com
> > Date: Mon, 31 Aug 2009 05:10:33 -0700
> > To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
> >
> <bob.nuckolls@aeroelectric.com>
> >
> > Bundling the wires of different and potentially antagonistic systems is quite
> practical and in fact a foregone conclusion in the TC aircraft world. There's
a
> suite of tests conducted for all electro-whizzies that quantifies potential
> victimization/antagonism factors when installed per the manufacturer's
> instructions.
> >
> > While building wire bundles for biz jets consisting of a hundred miles of wire
> and very limited options for wire routing, the LAST challenge anyone wants to
> address is a requirement for keeping the wires of one system separated from the
> wires of another system.
> >
> > The general rule is that unless the manufacturer demands that such separations
> be established, don't worry about it. It they DO make such demands, you may wish
> to consider an alternative system. Separation requirements arise from lack of
> due diligence in crafting an installer and user friendly system. Lack of
> diligence in issues of environmental co-existence aboard airplanes should make
> one wonder if other qualities you seek are likewise lacking.
> >
> > Bob . . .
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=260592#260592
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> ===========
> ===========
> ===========
> ===========
> >
> >
> >
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> View photos of singles in your area Click Here
>
Message 16
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|
Subject: | Official AeroElectric-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) |
Dear Listers,
Please read over the AeroElectric-List Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) below.
The
complete AeroElectric-List FAQ including the Usage Guidelines can be found at the
following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/AeroElectric-List.FAQ.html
Thank you,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
[ Note: This FAQ was designed to be displayed with a fixed width font such as
Courier. Proportional fonts will cause display formatting errors. ]
This FAQ can also be viewed in HTML online at the following address:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm
************************************************************
******* LIST POLICIES AND FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS *******
************************************************************
PLEASE READ. This document contains AeroElectric-List policies and information
for new and old subscribers. Understanding the AeroElectric-List policies will
minimize problems for the Administrator, and will help keep the AeroElectric-List
running smoothly for all of us.
******************************************
*** Quick Start Guide to List Features ***
******************************************
There are many features available on the Matronics Email Lists and each
one is described in detailed below. However, using the List Navigator
you can quickly access the complete set of features available for this
List. The List Navigator can be found at the following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
****************************************
*** How to Subscribe and Unsubscribe ***
****************************************
Simply go to the Web Page shown below and enter your email address and
select the List(s) that you wish to subscribe or unsubscribed from. You
may also use the handy "Find" function to determine the exact syntax of
your email address as it is subscribed to the List. Please see the
complete instructions at the top of the Web Page for more information.
The Subscribe/Unsubscribe web page is:
http://www.matronics.com/subscribe
Note that you will receive TWO conformation emails regarding your subsciption
process. The first verifies that your subscription/unsubsciption request
was received, and the second confirms that the process has been completed.
You should receive the first email within a few minutes of your request.
The second conformation will arrive in less than 24 hours. You cannot post
until you receive the second conformation email message.
*****************************
*** How to Post a Message ***
*****************************
Send an email message to:
aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
Your message will be redistributed to everyone currently subscribed
to the List.
*****************************************************
*** SPAM Fighter - You Must be Subscribed to Post ***
*****************************************************
When a new post is received by the system, the From: line of the message
is checked and compared against the current subscription list. If the
email address is found, the message is passed on to the List Processor.
If the email address isn't found in the current list of subscribers, it
is dumped. This serves to very effectively thwart 99% of the SPAM that
gets posted to the Lists.
Remember, however, that the syntax of your email address is very important
with regard to the configuration of your email application such as Outlook
or Eudora. For example, the following two email addresses may be
functionally equivalent, but only one would pass the Matronics Email SPAM
test depending on which was syntax was subscribed to the given List:
smith@machine.domain.com
smith@domain.com
Either email address syntax is alright, just be sure that you configure
your email application to match *exactly* the address you've subscibed to
the List.
**************************************
*** Enclosure Support on the Lists ***
**************************************
Limited posting of enclosures such as pictures, documents, and spreadsheets
is supported on the Lists. There are a number of restrictions, and these
are detailed below. Please abide by the rules put forth regarding the
content of enclosures.
These are some of the features and limits of enclosures on the Matronics
Lists:
1) Enclosures will only be posted to the Real Time version of the Lists.
2) Enclosures will NOT be included in the Daily Digest version of the Lists.
3) Enclosures WILL BE forwarded on to the BBS Forum Web site.
4) Enclosures will NOT be appended to the Archives.
5) Enclosures will NOT be available in the List Browse feature.
6) Only the following file types and extensions will be allowed:
bmp doc dwg dxf gif jpg pdf png txt xls
All other enclosures types will be rejected and email returned to
sender. The enclosure types listed above are relatively safe from
a virus standpoint and don't pose a particularly large security risk.
7) !! All incoming enclosures will be scanned for viruses prior to posting
to the List. This is done in real time and will not slow down
the process of posting the message !!
Here are some rules for posting enclosures. Failure to abide by these rules
could result in the removal of a subscriber's email address from the Lists.
1) Pay attention to what you are posting!! Make sure that the files
you are enclosing aren't HUGE (greater that 1MB). Remember that there
are still people checking they're email via dial up modem. If you post
30MB worth of pictures, you are placing an unnecessary burden on these
folks and the rest of us, for that matter.
2) SCALE YOUR PICTURES DOWN!!! I don't want to see huge 3000 x 2000
pictures getting posted that are 3 or 4MB each. This is just
unacceptable. Use a program such as Photoshop to scale the picture
down to something on the order of 800 x 600 and try to keep the
file size to less-than 200KB, preferably much less.
Microsoft has a really awesome utility available for free that allows
you to Right-Click on a picture in Explorer and automatically
scale it down and resave it. This is a great utility - get it, use it!
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/downloads/powertoys/xppowertoys.mspx
Look for the link "Image Resizer"
3) !! This would seem to go without saying, but I'll say it anyway. Do not
post anything that would be considered offensive by your grandmother.
And you know what I'm saying; I don't want to see anything even
questionable. !!
4) REMEMBER THIS: If you post a 1MB enclosure to a List with 1000 members
subscribed, your 1MB enclosure must be resent 1000 times amounting
to 1MB X 1000 = 1 Gigabyte of network traffic!! BE CAREFUL and
BE COURTEOUS!
Also see the section below on the Matronics Photo and File Share where
you can have your files and photos posted on the Matronics web server
for long time viewing and availability.
*******************
*** Digest Mode ***
*******************
Each day, starting at 12 midnight PST US, a new 'digest' will be started.
This digest will contain the same information that is currently appended
to the archive file. It has all of the headers except for the "From:"
and "Subject:" lines removed, and includes a message separator consisting
of a line of underscores.
Each day at 23:55 PST US, the day's messages as described above will be
combined and sent as a single message to everyone on the digest email list.
To subscribe to the digest list, use the same subscription web form
described above, and just select the Digest version of the List.
http://www.matronics.com/subscribe
Note that you *can* be subscribed to both the realtime and digest versions
of the List at the same time. This is perfectly acceptable.
Now some caveats:
* Messages sent to "aeroelectric-list-digest" will be forwarded to the standard
email list. In other words, you cannot post messages only to the
digest List.
* If you are subscribed to both the regular List and the digest List, you
will receive the realtime postings as well as the digest at the end of
the day.
* If you reply to the digest email, your message will be forwarded to the
normal list associated with the digest. Important Note: Please change
the subject line to reflect the topic of your response! Also, please
*do not include all or most of the digest in your reply*.
****************************
*** List Digest Browser ***
****************************
An archive of all the List Digests can be found online in either plain text
or HTML format. These archives contain the exact Digest that was posted to
the Digest email list on the given day. The Digest Archives can be found
at the following location:
http://www.matronics.com/digest
*****************************************
*** The "DO NOT ARCHIVE" Message Flag ***
*****************************************
At times, your message may concern something that is revelent only to a very
small number of persons or to a limited area, and you may not wish to archive
it. In such a case, simply put the following phrase anywhere in the
message:
do not archive
Your message will not be appended to the archive, but will be sent to List
email distribution as normal.
**********************************************
***** READ THIS - Automatic Unsubscribes *****
**********************************************
Note that if your email address begins to cause problems such as bounced
email, mailbox is filled, or any other errors, your address will be promptly
removed from the List. If you discover that you are no longer receiving
messages from the AeroElectric-List, go to the following Web page, and look
for your email address and a possible reason for your removal.
The Matronics Email List uses utility called the "Email Weasel" that
automatically looks though the day's bounced email for addresses that
caused problems due to common things like "user is unknown", "mailbox
full", etc. If the Email Weasel removes your email address from the
Lists you will find record of it at the following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/unsubscribed
If the problem listed on the web site above has been resolved, please feel
free to resubscribe to the Lists of your choice.
*******************************
*** List Member Information ***
*******************************
If you have not done so already, please email me your phone numbers and
paper mail address in the following format:
smith@somehost.com
Joe Smith
123 Airport Lane
Tower, CA 91234-1234
098-765-1234 w
123-456-7890 h
Please forward this information to the following email address:
requests@matronics.com
I have a file of such things, that I typically use to contact you when
there are problems with your email address. The information will NOT
be used for any other commercial purpose.
****************************************
*** Realtime Web Email List Browsing ***
****************************************
Recent messages posted to the AeroElectric-List are also made available on
the Web for realtime browsing. Seven days worth of back postings are
available with this feature. The messages can be sorted by Subject,
Author, Date, or Message Thread. The Realtime List Browser indexes are
updated twice per hour at xx:15 and xx:45. You can also reply to a message
or start a new message directly from the List Browser Interface (coming soon).
You do not have to be subscribed to the given list to use the List
Browser Interface in view-mode.
http://www.matronics.com/browselist/aeroelectric-list
*******************************************
*** Web Forums Bulletin Board Interface ***
*******************************************
A phpBB BBS web Forums front end is available for all AeroElectric-List content.
content. The Forums contain all of the same content available via the email
distribution and found on the various archive viewing formats such as the
List Browse, etc. Any posts on the web Forums will be cross posted to the
respective email List, and posts to the Email List will be cross posted to
the web Forums.
You may view all List content on the Forums without any special login.
If you wish to post a message via the Web Forum interface, however, you
will need to Register. This is a simple process that takes only a few
minutes. A link to the Registration page can be found at the top of the
main web Forums page. Note that registering on the Forum web site also
enables you to send email posts to the Lists as well. You will also need to
Subscribe to the respective Email List as described above to receive the
Email Distribution of the List, however.
The Matroincs Email List Web BBS Forums can be found at the following URL:
http://forums.matronics.com
*********************************
*** Matronics Email List Wiki ***
*********************************
In an attempt to make it easy to store and find structured and often accessed
information, Matronics has installed a Wiki at:
http://wiki.matronics.com
The Wiki allows individuals to create web pages to contain useful information
for other users of the mailing lists and web site. Unlike an ordinary web page
where the content needs to be submitted to Matronics for inclusion, the Wiki
permits the users to construct their own pages and have them visible immediately.
While constructing pages for the Wiki is not difficult, some may not be
comfortable building pages. In that case, simply prepare the text and any
images and email it to:
wiki-support@matronics.com
One of the volunteers on that list will take your submission and construct
a Wiki page for you.
Often someone produces a particularly useful posting in email one one of the
Lists that would be of general interest. In that case Matronics may take that
post and convert it into a Wiki page.
*********************
*** List Archives ***
*********************
A file containing of all of the previous postings to the AeroElectric-List is
available on line. The archive file information is available via the
Web and FTP in a number of forms. Each are briefly described below:
* AeroElectric-List.FAQ
- Latest version of the AeroElectric-List Frequently Asked Question
page (this document).
* AeroElectric-Archive.digest.complete
- Complete file with most of the email header info removed and
page breaks inserted between messages.
* AeroElectric-Archive.digest.vol-??
- Same as the file above, but broken up into small sections that
can more easily handled.
* AeroElectric-Archive.digest.complete.zip
- Same as the AeroElectric-Archive.digest.complete file above, but
in PKZIP format. Use "binary" data transfer methods.
* AeroElectric-Archive.digest.complete.Z
- Same as the AeroElectric-Archive.digest.complete file above, but
in
UNIX compress format. Use "binary" data transfer methods.
Download Via FTP
----------------
The archive file is available via anonymous FTP from ftp.matronics.com
in the "/pub/Archives" directory. It is updated daily and can be found in
a number of formats as described above. (All filenames are case sensitive.)
ftp://ftp.matronics.com/pub/Archives
Download Via Web
----------------
The archives are also available via a web listing. These can be found
toward the bottom of the following web page:
http://www.matronics.com/archives
******************************************
*** Complete List Web Archive Browsing ***
******************************************
All messages posted to the AeroElectric-List are also available using the
Email List Archive Browsing feature. With this utility, all messages
in the List are indexed, and individual sub-archives can be browsed.
http://www.matronics.com/archive/archive-index.cgi?AeroElectric
*****************************************
**** High-Speed Archive Search Engine ***
*****************************************
You can use the custom, high-performance Matronics Email List Search Engine
to quickly locate and browse any messages that have been posted to the
List. The Engine allows the user to easily search any of the currently
available List archives.
http://www.matronics.com/search
****************************
*** File and Photo Share ***
****************************
With the Matronics Email List File and Photo Share you can share pictures
and other data with members of the List without having to forward a
copy of it to everyone. To share your Files and Photos, simply email
them to:
pictures@matronics.com
!! ==> Please including the following information with each submission:
1) Email Lists that they are related to.
2) Your Full Name.
3) Your Email Address.
4) One line Subject description.
5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic.
6-x) One-line Description of each photo or file
Prior to public availability of the files and photos, each will be scanned
for viruses. Please also note that the process of making the files and
photos available on the web site is a pseudo-manual process, and I try to
process them every few days.
Following the availability of the new Photoshare, an email message will be
sent to the Email Lists enumerated in 1) above indicating that the new
Share is available and what the direct URL to it is.
For a current list of available Photoshares, have a look at the Main
Index Page:
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
**************************
*** List Archive CDROM ***
**************************
A complete Matronics Email List Archive CD is available that contains
all of the archives since the beginning of each of the Lists. The archives
for all of the Lists are included on the CD along with a freeware search
engine written by a list member. The CD is burned the day you order it
and will contain archive received up to the last minute. They make
great gifts!
http://www.matronics.com/ArchiveCDROM
**********************************
*** List Support Contributions ***
**********************************
The Matronics Lists are run *completely* through the support of it members.
You won't find any PopUpAds, flashing Banner ads, or any other form of
annoying commercialism on either the Email Messages or the List web pages
associated with the Matronics Email Lists. Every year during November
I run a low-key, low-pressure "Fund Raiser" where, throughout the month,
I ask List members to make a Contribution in any amount with which they
are comfortable.
I will often offer free gifts with certain contribution levels during the
Fund Raiser to increase the participation. The gifts are usually donated
by companies that are themselves List members.
Your Contributions go directly to supporting the operation of the Lists
including the high-speed, business-class Internet connection, server
system hardware and software upgrades, and to partially offset the many
many hours I spend running, maintaining, upgrading, and developing the
variety of services found here.
Generally Contributions range from $20 to $100 and are completely voluntary
and non-compulsory. I ask only that if person enjoys the Lists and obtains
value from them, that they make a Contribution of equal magnitude.
Contributions are accepted throughout the year, and if you've just
subscribed, feel free to make a Contribution when you've settled in.
The website for making SSL Secure Contributions is listed below. There are
a variety of payment methods including Visa and MasterCard, PayPal, and
sending a personal check.
If you enjoy and value the List, won't you make a Contribution today to
support its continued operation?
http://www.matronics.com/contributions
Thank you!
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
******************************************************************************
AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines
******************************************************************************
The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the AeroElectric-List.
You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein.
Failure to use the AeroElectric-List in the manner described below may result
in the removal of the subscribers from the List.
AeroElectric-List Policy Statement
The purpose of the AeroElectric-List is to provide a forum of discussion for
things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals
are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver
high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie
among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals
requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of
the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established:
- Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit
posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long
lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc.
- THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be
relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it.
- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive
that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and
terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and
responses.
- Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address,
aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line
about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid
bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary
space in the archive.
- DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is
easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the
web page or FAQ first.
- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of
your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it
easy to find threads in the archive.
- When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your
response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the
reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that
quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive
can not be overstated!
- When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT
then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the
"reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your
response to the original poster. You might have to actively address
your response with the original poster's email address.
- DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something
to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I
agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent
to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large.
- When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to
comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly
contribute something valuable.
- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone
polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack
other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously
controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that
will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.
- Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly
subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by
List members promoting their respective products or items for sale
should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble
a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but
is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to
everyone, including those who provide products to the entire
community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the
operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists.
-------
[This is an automated posting.]
do not archive
Message 17
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|
Subject: | Official AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines |
Dear Listers,
Please read over the AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines below. The complete
AeroElectric-List FAQ including these Usage Guidelines can be found at the
following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/AeroElectric-List.FAQ.html
Thank you,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
******************************************************************************
AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines
******************************************************************************
The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the AeroElectric-List.
You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein.
Failure to use the AeroElectric-List in the manner described below may result
in the removal of the subscribers from the List.
AeroElectric-List Policy Statement
The purpose of the AeroElectric-List is to provide a forum of discussion for
things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals
are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver
high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie
among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals
requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of
the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established:
- Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit
posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long
lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc.
- THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be
relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it.
- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive
that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and
terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and
responses.
- Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address,
aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line
about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid
bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary
space in the archive.
- DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is
easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the
web page or FAQ first.
- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of
your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it
easy to find threads in the archive.
- When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your
response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the
reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that
quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive
can not be overstated!
- When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT
then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the
"reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your
response to the original poster. You might have to actively address
your response with the original poster's email address.
- DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something
to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I
agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent
to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large.
- When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to
comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly
contribute something valuable.
- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone
polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack
other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously
controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that
will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.
- Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly
subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by
List members promoting their respective products or items for sale
should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble
a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but
is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to
everyone, including those who provide products to the entire
community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the
operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists.
-------
[This is an automated posting.]
do not archive
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