Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:47 AM - Re: Ammetr Help (Keith Burris)
2. 07:19 AM - Re: Was Ammeter Help- Now about switches (user9253)
3. 10:05 AM - Electrical: Fire Hazard in Resetting Circuit Breakers (C/Bs) - General Aviation (ROGER & JEAN CURTIS)
4. 10:09 AM - Re: duracell battery leak (gmcjetpilot)
5. 11:00 AM - Re: Re: duracell battery leak (Bill Boyd)
6. 01:35 PM - A Christmas Current Regulator for All..... (Eric M. Jones)
7. 02:13 PM - Re: Re: duracell battery leak (Matt Prather)
8. 02:20 PM - Re: duracell battery leak (rgent1224@aol.com)
9. 03:25 PM - Re: Re: duracell battery leak (ray)
10. 04:09 PM - Re: duracell battery leak (gmcjetpilot)
11. 04:59 PM - Re: Battery leakage (Speedy11@aol.com)
12. 05:46 PM - Re: Battery leakage (Ron Quillin)
13. 06:01 PM - Re: Re: duracell battery leak and "engineers" ()
14. 06:05 PM - Merry CRISTmas (Dennis Golden)
15. 06:48 PM - Re: Re: duracell battery leak and "engineers" (ray)
16. 07:02 PM - Re: Re: Battery leakage (Steve Gregory)
17. 07:12 PM - Re: Re: Battery leakage (Richard Girard)
18. 07:18 PM - Re: Re: duracell battery leak (Perry, Phil)
19. 08:04 PM - Re: duracell battery leak (jerb)
20. 08:13 PM - Re: duracell battery leak (jerb)
21. 09:03 PM - Re: Re: Duracell Leaking Batteries (jerb)
Message 1
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Bob and all
Thanks for the responses and thanks to you Bob, for an enlightening
discussion.
On another subject: Leaking Duracell
I had to toss a mag-lite also and decided to never knowingly use a Duracell
battery again However, I have seen, in the past, that Duracell claimed they
would fix or replace any item sent to them that was made inoperable or
ruined by a leaking Duracell battery. Never tried it as I wont use them
anymore. Dont know if thats still their policy.
-- Keith
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Subject: | Re: Was Ammeter Help- Now about switches |
Honeywell AML switches are available in DPDT, either 2 position , or 3 position
with center off. The AML24EBA3AC04 can replace the S700-2-7 as used in Z-14
These switches will not replace the S700-2-10. You could use two SPST switches
instead, one for Master and one for Alternator. If it is desirable to have the
Master switch enable the Alternator switch, then a relay will have to be used
behind the panel. But then you add another failure point and cost and weight.
Although these switches may be more pleasing to the eye, they might not have
the optimum functionality, contact rating and price compared to other switches.
Joe
http://www.mouser.com/Electromechanical/Switches/Rocker-Switches-Paddle-Switches/_/N-5g2qZscv7?P=1z0sh5hZ1yzvtnwZ1z0x3c8Z1z0z2xk&Keyword=honeywell&FS=True
--------
Joe Gores
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=278790#278790
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Subject: | Electrical: Fire Hazard in Resetting Circuit Breakers |
(C/Bs) - General Aviation
Here is an FAA publication that I received a couple of days ago. Thought
there might be some interest in reading.
Subject: Electrical: Fire Hazard in Resetting Circuit Breakers (C/Bs) -
General Aviation
CE-10-11 - Small Airplane/ All/ All Models
CE-10-11 - Small/Large Air/ All/ All Models
_____
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Subject: | Re: duracell battery leak |
Bob:
I like the article and have done many test like that, especially with
rechargeable NiMh. I have one complaint, where you say "as Engineers
we'er....". Who is "we" engineers? Normally I would not mind, but you in
particular, have shown some kind of irrational disrespect and personal
animus for any one who is an a true engineer. You went into a long story
how you would not hire engineers, as if you had that power. You went on
to say you would prefer some one from a vocational school over an
engineer with a degree from an accredited University. I know there are
people like you, but never heard anyone bash education. Dear Sir, that
only shows your ignorance of what an engineer is, making your false
association, even in passing, even more egregious. America is falling
behind because people are not taking engineering, a very difficult
curriculum. To bash engineering, which is part of what made America
great, engineering excellence, is really un-American and ignorant.
Bob, you don't have an engineering degree. In fact on these forums you
have attacked and maligned the engineering profession with vitriolic
rants. You really should not "embellish" your qualifications. Engineers go
to school and learn math, physics, science and an intensive engineering
curriculum. I'm offended you'd even think you are an "engineer". It's just
dishonest. You are not a Doctor, Lawyer or Indian Chief either. Is that
battery test circuit your original design? You should give credit where it is
due. May be you should go back to school and take engineering. May be
you will have more respect for them and understand what they do.
Here is another link with extensive comparisons of brands of alkaline
batteries.
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=64660
Personally I am sold on NiMh for all my applications. People complain
they don't last as long. I suspect they don't have the latest NiMh
technology, a good NiMh charger and/or use poor technique in charging
and using them. They are so cheap now, if bought in quantity from
internet discount stores or eBay. There is no reason not to have a bunch
of fully charged AA or AAA batteries ready on standby. Alkaline do have
better shelf life and do have longer run life in most applications. Alkaline
is a wonderful chemistry for solid battery power. However they are
disposable, and it gets expensive replacing them in high use applications.
I have some NiMh batteries I first bought around 1999. They finally failed
and started to decline. I got my moneys worth. There is no need to pay
more than a $1 each or even $1.80 for the higher capacity NiMh AA's and
AAA's. It is a worth while investment. Frankly I now only use Alkaline in
things that need a new battery every year or two, like my home
programmable thermostat or wall mounted outside weather station
receiver. I do keep some Alkaline's around for "emergencies". However
with all the NiMh fully charged I really don't need them.
Merry Christmas every one, fly safe!
George
MS Mechanical Engineering, ATP, CFI, B737/757/767
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=278801#278801
Message 5
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Subject: | Re: duracell battery leak |
Off your meds again, George?
I find your "complaint" not worth the occupied bandwidth. Perhaps you could
utilize "spread-spectrum" by taking it somewhere else.
On Thu, Dec 24, 2009 at 1:08 PM, gmcjetpilot <gmcjetpilot@yahoo.com> wrote:
> gmcjetpilot@yahoo.com>
>
> Bob:
>
> I like the article and have done many test like that, especially with
> rechargeable NiMh. I have one complaint, where you say "as Engineers
> we'er....". Who is "we" engineers? Normally I would not mind, but you in
> particular, have shown some kind of irrational disrespect and personal
> animus for any one who is an a true engineer. You went into a long story
> how you would not hire engineers, as if you had that power. You went on
> to say you would prefer some one from a vocational school over an
> engineer with a degree from an accredited University. I know there are
> people like you, but never heard anyone bash education. Dear Sir, that
> only shows your ignorance of what an engineer is, making your false
> association, even in passing, even more egregious. America is falling
> behind because people are not taking engineering, a very difficult
> curriculum. To bash engineering, which is part of what made America
> great, engineering excellence, is really un-American and ignorant.
>
>
> Bob, you don't have an engineering degree. In fact on these forums you
> have attacked and maligned the engineering profession with vitriolic
> rants. You really should not "embellish" your qualifications. Engineers go
> to school and learn math, physics, science and an intensive engineering
> curriculum. I'm offended you'd even think you are an "engineer". It's just
> dishonest. You are not a Doctor, Lawyer or Indian Chief either. Is that
> battery test circuit your original design? You should give credit where it
> is
> due. May be you should go back to school and take engineering. May be
> you will have more respect for them and understand what they do.
>
> Here is another link with extensive comparisons of brands of alkaline
> batteries.
>
> http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=64660
>
>
> Personally I am sold on NiMh for all my applications. People complain
> they don't last as long. I suspect they don't have the latest NiMh
> technology, a good NiMh charger and/or use poor technique in charging
> and using them. They are so cheap now, if bought in quantity from
> internet discount stores or eBay. There is no reason not to have a bunch
> of fully charged AA or AAA batteries ready on standby. Alkaline do have
> better shelf life and do have longer run life in most applications.
> Alkaline
> is a wonderful chemistry for solid battery power. However they are
> disposable, and it gets expensive replacing them in high use applications.
> I have some NiMh batteries I first bought around 1999. They finally failed
> and started to decline. I got my moneys worth. There is no need to pay
> more than a $1 each or even $1.80 for the higher capacity NiMh AA's and
> AAA's. It is a worth while investment. Frankly I now only use Alkaline in
> things that need a new battery every year or two, like my home
> programmable thermostat or wall mounted outside weather station
> receiver. I do keep some Alkaline's around for "emergencies". However
> with all the NiMh fully charged I really don't need them.
>
> Merry Christmas every one, fly safe!
>
> George
> MS Mechanical Engineering, ATP, CFI, B737/757/767
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=278801#278801
>
>
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Subject: | A Christmas Current Regulator for All..... |
Happy Holidays.
This is a noise-free current regulator that will power up to three LEDs in series
such as the Cree 350-700 lumens stars. ~2100 (maybe) lumens!
I have made a few of these to replace noisey Buck_Pucks. I don't have any plans
to sell as a product, but you can make your own or get together with friends
and make a bunch (Okay, nerds have odd choices of how to have fun get-togethers).
This uses the isolated form of the 317 Regulator. If you use the standard (non-isolated)
part it is more trouble.
Design notes: This is a modified surface-mount assembly used to keep everything
flat against the heat sink. Make sure the 317 gets a dab of heat sink compound.
Keep the resistor up in the air. It gets very hot. I recommend flowing epoxy over
the pcb and 317 leads. You can use RTV, but don't use J-B Weld (I never thought
I'd have to say that...) because it is slightly electrically conductive.
Standard issues apply--keep the leads from chaffing. I used rubber grommets super-glued
in the fingers of the heat sink. This heat sink is good for 1-3 LEDs
at 14.5VDC, or 6 or so at 28VDC.
I'll send the ExpressPCB file as an attachment if you email me, but this is easy
to carve out of plated circuit board. Only a single-sided board is required,
but you'll get a double sided-board from ExpressPCB. Forty-eight circuits for
$1.25 each delivered in a few days. Cool....
Aficionados will note that different versions of voltage regulators will work for
improved performance in some areas or even higher power. Yes...go for it.
--------
Eric M. Jones
www.PerihelionDesign.com
113 Brentwood Drive
Southbridge, MA 01550
(508) 764-2072
emjones@charter.net
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=278813#278813
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/currentregulators_155.pdf
Message 7
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Subject: | Re: duracell battery leak |
You, sir, get one lump of coal..
Matt-
> <gmcjetpilot@yahoo.com>
>
> Bob:
>
> I like the article and have done many test like that, especially with
> rechargeable NiMh. I have one complaint, where you say "as Engineers
> we'er....". Who is "we" engineers? Normally I would not mind, but you in
> particular, have shown some kind of irrational disrespect and personal
> animus for any one who is an a true engineer. You went into a long story
> how you would not hire engineers, as if you had that power. You went on
> to say you would prefer some one from a vocational school over an
> engineer with a degree from an accredited University. I know there are
> people like you, but never heard anyone bash education. Dear Sir, that
> only shows your ignorance of what an engineer is, making your false
> association, even in passing, even more egregious. America is falling
> behind because people are not taking engineering, a very difficult
> curriculum. To bash engineering, which is part of what made America
> great, engineering excellence, is really un-American and ignorant.
>
>
> Bob, you don't have an engineering degree. In fact on these forums you
> have attacked and maligned the engineering profession with vitriolic
> rants. You really should not "embellish" your qualifications. Engineers go
> to school and learn math, physics, science and an intensive engineering
> curriculum. I'm offended you'd even think you are an "engineer". It's just
> dishonest. You are not a Doctor, Lawyer or Indian Chief either. Is that
> battery test circuit your original design? You should give credit where it
> is
> due. May be you should go back to school and take engineering. May be
> you will have more respect for them and understand what they do.
>
> Here is another link with extensive comparisons of brands of alkaline
> batteries.
>
> http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=64660
>
>
> Personally I am sold on NiMh for all my applications. People complain
> they don't last as long. I suspect they don't have the latest NiMh
> technology, a good NiMh charger and/or use poor technique in charging
> and using them. They are so cheap now, if bought in quantity from
> internet discount stores or eBay. There is no reason not to have a bunch
> of fully charged AA or AAA batteries ready on standby. Alkaline do have
> better shelf life and do have longer run life in most applications.
> Alkaline
> is a wonderful chemistry for solid battery power. However they are
> disposable, and it gets expensive replacing them in high use applications.
> I have some NiMh batteries I first bought around 1999. They finally failed
> and started to decline. I got my moneys worth. There is no need to pay
> more than a $1 each or even $1.80 for the higher capacity NiMh AA's and
> AAA's. It is a worth while investment. Frankly I now only use Alkaline in
> things that need a new battery every year or two, like my home
> programmable thermostat or wall mounted outside weather station
> receiver. I do keep some Alkaline's around for "emergencies". However
> with all the NiMh fully charged I really don't need them.
>
> Merry Christmas every one, fly safe!
>
> George
> MS Mechanical Engineering, ATP, CFI, B737/757/767
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=278801#278801
>
>
Message 8
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Subject: | Re: duracell battery leak |
Deke
Do you still have thatflashlight??
If so send it back to Mag-lite. They'll repace at no charge I've done it
Just my $00.0002 Worth
Merry Xmas & Happy New Year
Dick
#606/N20DG
-----Original Message-----
From: fox5flyer <fox5flyer@idealwifi.net>
Sent: Wed, Dec 23, 2009 5:46 am
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: duracell battery leak
I had a 3 cell Mag Light with Duracells in it. Following the marketing hy
pe I always thought they were the best so I bought them in large packages.
Being a plumber I used it on a fairly regular basis and I noticed that
I had to bump it sometimes to make it turn on. One day when it wouldn't
turn on at all so I pulled the cap and found that the batteries had leake
d inside and corroded the whole interior which made them impossible to rem
ove. I ended up having the throw it in the bin. No, I didn't leave it on
or leave it stored with dead batteries. This wasn't the first time I had
an experience with leaking Duracells.
Having heard about this previously I decided at that moment that the best
fix for me was to discontinue all use of Duracells and let others know of
my problem with them. If enough folks stop using them they'll soon fix
the problem...in the form of "new and improved ultra..."
Deke
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Message 9
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Subject: | Re: duracell battery leak |
Shoo, go away.
Raymond Julian
Kettle River, MN
do not archive
gmcjetpilot wrote:
>
> Bob:
>
> I like the article and have done many test like that, especially with
> rechargeable NiMh. I have one complaint, where you say "as Engineers
> we'er....". Who is "we" engineers? Normally I would not mind, but you in
> particular, have shown some kind of irrational disrespect and personal
> animus for any one who is an a true engineer. You went into a long story
> how you would not hire engineers, as if you had that power. You went on
> to say you would prefer some one from a vocational school over an
> engineer with a degree from an accredited University. I know there are
> people like you, but never heard anyone bash education. Dear Sir, that
> only shows your ignorance of what an engineer is, making your false
> association, even in passing, even more egregious. America is falling
> behind because people are not taking engineering, a very difficult
> curriculum. To bash engineering, which is part of what made America
> great, engineering excellence, is really un-American and ignorant.
>
>
> Bob, you don't have an engineering degree. In fact on these forums you
> have attacked and maligned the engineering profession with vitriolic
> rants. You really should not "embellish" your qualifications. Engineers go
> to school and learn math, physics, science and an intensive engineering
> curriculum. I'm offended you'd even think you are an "engineer". It's just
> dishonest. You are not a Doctor, Lawyer or Indian Chief either. Is that
> battery test circuit your original design? You should give credit where it is
> due. May be you should go back to school and take engineering. May be
> you will have more respect for them and understand what they do.
>
> Here is another link with extensive comparisons of brands of alkaline
> batteries.
>
> http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=64660
>
>
> Personally I am sold on NiMh for all my applications. People complain
> they don't last as long. I suspect they don't have the latest NiMh
> technology, a good NiMh charger and/or use poor technique in charging
> and using them. They are so cheap now, if bought in quantity from
> internet discount stores or eBay. There is no reason not to have a bunch
> of fully charged AA or AAA batteries ready on standby. Alkaline do have
> better shelf life and do have longer run life in most applications. Alkaline
> is a wonderful chemistry for solid battery power. However they are
> disposable, and it gets expensive replacing them in high use applications.
> I have some NiMh batteries I first bought around 1999. They finally failed
> and started to decline. I got my moneys worth. There is no need to pay
> more than a $1 each or even $1.80 for the higher capacity NiMh AA's and
> AAA's. It is a worth while investment. Frankly I now only use Alkaline in
> things that need a new battery every year or two, like my home
> programmable thermostat or wall mounted outside weather station
> receiver. I do keep some Alkaline's around for "emergencies". However
> with all the NiMh fully charged I really don't need them.
>
> Merry Christmas every one, fly safe!
>
> George
> MS Mechanical Engineering, ATP, CFI, B737/757/767
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=278801#278801
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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Subject: | Re: duracell battery leak |
Thanks for your kind comments trolls and Bob's girlfriends. Merry Christmas.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=278822#278822
Message 11
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Subject: | Re: Battery leakage |
Regardless, many of us ARE having leakage problems. I discovered my high
dollar LED flishlight (used frequently and batteries changed often)
"welded" closed due to battery leakage just one week ago. I couldn't get the
batteries out and threw away the flashlight. I had changed from ever using
Duracells again and the faulty batteries this time were Everready.
Someone mentioned last week on this forum that the problem might not be
with a particular brand, but with alkalines in general. I'm beginning to
think there may be some validity to that argument. Or perhaps the problem is
caused by the "cheaper" manufacturing process. Perhaps the Chinese cannot
make leak resistant batteries as well as Americans or Mexicans.
Or perhaps the fault lies in the design of the battery. With the correct
design, I suspect quality batteries could be built anywhere.
Thoughts?
Stan Sutterfield
If you dig around in my alkaline cell stock that
ranges from AAAA to D cells, you'll find a host of
different brands. I've not suffered a severe battery
leakage event in so long I don't recall the last time.
At the same time, we go through batteries pretty
quickly. No cell sits around in a seldom used
device.
The fact that some of us here on the
list have suffered a leakage event with a particular
brand is not a definitive study of the propensity
of that brand for failure. If say 90% of all cells
presently occupying the battery box of our favorite
accessories are Duracells . . . it's axiomatic that
the propensity of any failures will be in Duracells.
Message 12
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Subject: | Re: Battery leakage |
At 16:59 12/24/2009, you wrote:
>Someone mentioned last week on this forum that the problem might not
>be with a particular brand, but with alkalines in general. I'm
>beginning to think there may be some validity to that argument. Or
>perhaps the problem is caused by the "cheaper" manufacturing
>process. Perhaps the Chinese cannot make leak resistant batteries
>as well as Americans or Mexicans.
Just to add yet additional data, as many certainly could do, I've
just had to toss a number of unused HF "Thunderbolt Magnum" AAA's
dated 08-1010 due to leakage. Origin, China.
I also ordered on special, from an unremembered source, a large
quantity (~200) of Rayovac "Maximum PLUS" AAA's and have had to
dispose of nearly 20% due to leakage prior to any even being put into
service; these with a Dec 2011 expiration date. This -special-
turned out to be not-so-special. Origin, USA.
These failure rates prompt consideration on just how I may want to
manage batteries in devices...
Ron Q.
Message 13
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Subject: | Re: duracell battery leak and "engineers" |
First, Merry Christmas everyone.
Second, George,
I personnally have, in many ways, similar feelings to Bob towards Engineers. It
is not the engineers fault exactly but it seems there are a lot of jobs out there
that have little or nothing to do with engineering that people, usually in
human resources, have decreed can only be filled by an engineer. There also
seems a certian snobbishness among many engineers. Looking at your signature you
are apparently a mechanical engineer, working as a pilot, giving an opinion
on batteries so it would seem your qualifications to discuss batteries is no
greater than anyone elses.
At the shipyard where I used to work it was policy that no one could be a manager
without an engineering degree. It made no sense that even in the accounting
department you had to have an engineering degree to be a manager. Also "engineers"
were being hired right out of college to supervise men with 20+ years on
the job. As a maintenance planner every job I plan has to be reviewed by an engineer.
Sometimes they come up with the most impractical ideas and almost daily
show their ignorance of the systems they are supposed to be "experts" on. I
have yet to see any of them open a book or do any of those advanced math or physics
calculations they learned in college. Long story short my experience has
led me to placing engineers almost equal to lawyers. They are invaluable when
you really need one but good ones are hard to find and most of the time you
can do without them.
For the record, and I could be wrong,I do not think Thomas Edison, Eli Whitney,
or the Wright Brothers had engineering degrees. Many of the best inventors did
not have engineering degrees but much of the building of america could not have
been done without engineers building roads, bridges and other infrastructure.
Rodney
Message 14
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May God bless you and your families a merry Christmas and prosperous new year.
Dennis
--
Dennis Golden
Golden Consulting Services, Inc.
Message 15
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Subject: | Re: duracell battery leak and "engineers" |
An Engineering degree does not an engineer make!
Nor is an Engineering degree required to be an engineer.
I had classmates in my engineering classes that DID NOT KNOW how change
a flat on their car. They called a service station to come and do it.
An Engineering degree implies a certain skill set, and says nothing
about the ability to apply that skill set to the real world.
Raymond Julian
Kettle River, MN.
do not archive
r.r.hall@cox.net wrote:
>
>
> First, Merry Christmas everyone.
>
> Second, George,
>
> I personally have, in many ways, similar feelings to Bob towards
> Engineers. It is not the engineers fault exactly but it seems there are
> a lot of jobs out there that have little or nothing to do with
> engineering that people, usually in human resources, have decreed can
> only be filled by an engineer. There also seems a certain snobbishness
> among many engineers. Looking at your signature you are apparently a
> mechanical engineer, working as a pilot, giving an opinion on batteries
> so it would seem your qualifications to discuss batteries is no greater
> than anyone else.
>
> At the shipyard where I used to work it was policy that no one could be
> a manager without an engineering degree. It made no sense that even in
> the accounting department you had to have an engineering degree to be a
> manager. Also "engineers" were being hired right out of college to
> supervise men with 20+ years on the job. As a maintenance planner every
> job I plan has to be reviewed by an engineer. Sometimes they come up
> with the most impractical ideas and almost daily show their ignorance of
> the systems they are supposed to be "experts" on. I have yet to see any
> of them open a book or do any of those advanced math or physics
> calculations they learned in college. Long story short my experience has
> led me to placing engineers almost equal to lawyers. They are invaluable
> when you really need one but good ones are hard to find and most of the
> time you can do without them.
>
> For the record, and I could be wrong,I do not think Thomas Edison, Eli
> Whitney, or the Wright Brothers had engineering degrees. Many of the
> best inventors did not have engineering degrees but much of the building
> of America could not have been done without engineers building roads,
> bridges and other infrastructure.
>
> Rodney
>
> *
>
>
> *
Message 16
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Subject: | Re: Battery leakage |
I had more than just a leak. I had two Duracell's "explode" in two
different smoke detectors at my house. I was sitting quietly reading, and
it sounded like a .22 pistol went off. Couldn't figure out where the loud
pop came from. It happened the next day as well. I finally found the
source (no red power light on the detector). The bottoms of the batteries
were blown out. Went online and Goggled "exploding Duracell batteries". I
found a lot of articles. No more Duracell's for me. And if I'm not
mistaken, Safeway Select brand alkaline batteries are made by Duracell as
well.
Steve Gregory
925-323-6987 (cell)
steve@stevegregory.us
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Speedy11@aol.com
Sent: Thursday, December 24, 2009 4:59 PM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Battery leakage
Regardless, many of us ARE having leakage problems. I discovered my high
dollar LED flishlight (used frequently and batteries changed often) "welded"
closed due to battery leakage just one week ago. I couldn't get the
batteries out and threw away the flashlight. I had changed from ever using
Duracells again and the faulty batteries this time were Everready.
Someone mentioned last week on this forum that the problem might not be with
a particular brand, but with alkalines in general. I'm beginning to think
there may be some validity to that argument. Or perhaps the problem is
caused by the "cheaper" manufacturing process. Perhaps the Chinese cannot
make leak resistant batteries as well as Americans or Mexicans.
Or perhaps the fault lies in the design of the battery. With the correct
design, I suspect quality batteries could be built anywhere.
Thoughts?
Stan Sutterfield
If you dig around in my alkaline cell stock that
ranges from AAAA to D cells, you'll find a host of
different brands. I've not suffered a severe battery
leakage event in so long I don't recall the last time.
At the same time, we go through batteries pretty
quickly. No cell sits around in a seldom used
device.
The fact that some of us here on the
list have suffered a leakage event with a particular
brand is not a definitive study of the propensity
of that brand for failure. If say 90% of all cells
presently occupying the battery box of our favorite
accessories are Duracells . . . it's axiomatic that
the propensity of any failures will be in Duracells.
Message 17
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Subject: | Re: Battery leakage |
I almost hate to write this testimonial but it's true, nonetheless.
Several years ago, Bob did a test of various batteries and the best value in
that test were the ones from Dollar General. I started using them and have
ever since. I've never had one leak, I've had a very few of less than
stellar capacity, but in general they have been of outstanding quality and
at the best price around, 25 cents apiece for AA and AAA in packs of 20. I
do change out batteries fairly often in these two sizes, but I've had the
same experience with their C and D's that have been in flashlights for up to
two years with no leakage.
Wish I could say the same for the Duracells I have to run in my ELT's. I
have a very corroded, near new unit on the shelf that had one year old
batteries that with the exception of the occasional test were unused.
I have no explanation for my experience with Dollar General batteries other
than I don't leave dead batteries in devices.
Rick Girard
On Thu, Dec 24, 2009 at 6:59 PM, <Speedy11@aol.com> wrote:
> Regardless, many of us ARE having leakage problems. I discovered my high
> dollar LED flishlight (used frequently and batteries changed often) "welded"
> closed due to battery leakage just one week ago. I couldn't get the
> batteries out and threw away the flashlight. I had changed from ever using
> Duracells again and the faulty batteries this time were Everready.
> Someone mentioned last week on this forum that the problem might not be
> with a particular brand, but with alkalines in general. I'm beginning to
> think there may be some validity to that argument. Or perhaps the problem
> is caused by the "cheaper" manufacturing process. Perhaps the Chinese
> cannot make leak resistant batteries as well as Americans or Mexicans.
> Or perhaps the fault lies in the design of the battery. With the correct
> design, I suspect quality batteries could be built anywhere.
> Thoughts?
> Stan Sutterfield
>
>
> If you dig around in my alkaline cell stock that
> ranges from AAAA to D cells, you'll find a host of
> different brands. I've not suffered a severe battery
> leakage event in so long I don't recall the last time.
> At the same time, we go through batteries pretty
> quickly. No cell sits around in a seldom used
> device.
>
> The fact that some of us here on the
> list have suffered a leakage event with a particular
> brand is not a definitive study of the propensity
> of that brand for failure. If say 90% of all cells
> presently occupying the battery box of our favorite
> accessories are Duracells . . . it's axiomatic that
> the propensity of any failures will be in Duracells.
>
>
> *
>
> *
>
> ery few
Message 18
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Subject: | Re: duracell battery leak |
You could do like me.
Just add the address to the spam filter.
Phil
From: Bill Boyd [mailto:sportav8r@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, December 24, 2009 12:28 PM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: duracell battery leak
Off your meds again, George?
I find your "complaint" not worth the occupied bandwidth. Perhaps you
could utilize "spread-spectrum" by taking it somewhere else.
On Thu, Dec 24, 2009 at 1:08 PM, gmcjetpilot <gmcjetpilot@yahoo.com>
wrote:
<gmcjetpilot@yahoo.com>
Bob:
I like the article and have done many test like that, especially with
rechargeable NiMh. I have one complaint, where you say "as Engineers
we'er....". Who is "we" engineers? Normally I would not mind, but you in
particular, have shown some kind of irrational disrespect and personal
animus for any one who is an a true engineer. You went into a long story
how you would not hire engineers, as if you had that power. You went on
to say you would prefer some one from a vocational school over an
engineer with a degree from an accredited University. I know there are
people like you, but never heard anyone bash education. Dear Sir, that
only shows your ignorance of what an engineer is, making your false
association, even in passing, even more egregious. America is falling
behind because people are not taking engineering, a very difficult
curriculum. To bash engineering, which is part of what made America
great, engineering excellence, is really un-American and ignorant.
Bob, you don't have an engineering degree. In fact on these forums you
have attacked and maligned the engineering profession with vitriolic
rants. You really should not "embellish" your qualifications. Engineers
go
to school and learn math, physics, science and an intensive engineering
curriculum. I'm offended you'd even think you are an "engineer". It's
just
dishonest. You are not a Doctor, Lawyer or Indian Chief either. Is that
battery test circuit your original design? You should give credit where
it is
due. May be you should go back to school and take engineering. May be
you will have more respect for them and understand what they do.
Here is another link with extensive comparisons of brands of alkaline
batteries.
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=64660
Personally I am sold on NiMh for all my applications. People complain
they don't last as long. I suspect they don't have the latest NiMh
technology, a good NiMh charger and/or use poor technique in charging
and using them. They are so cheap now, if bought in quantity from
internet discount stores or eBay. There is no reason not to have a bunch
of fully charged AA or AAA batteries ready on standby. Alkaline do have
better shelf life and do have longer run life in most applications.
Alkaline
is a wonderful chemistry for solid battery power. However they are
disposable, and it gets expensive replacing them in high use
applications.
I have some NiMh batteries I first bought around 1999. They finally
failed
and started to decline. I got my moneys worth. There is no need to pay
more than a $1 each or even $1.80 for the higher capacity NiMh AA's and
AAA's. It is a worth while investment. Frankly I now only use Alkaline
in
things that need a new battery every year or two, like my home
programmable thermostat or wall mounted outside weather station
receiver. I do keep some Alkaline's around for "emergencies". However
with all the NiMh fully charged I really don't need them.
Merry Christmas every one, fly safe!
George
MS Mechanical Engineering, ATP, CFI, B737/757/767
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=278801#278801
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ooks.com" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com
et="_blank">www.homebuilthelp.com
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Message 19
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Subject: | Re: duracell battery leak |
Bob,
I don't think its an issue of a definitive study but rather
experience gained over time. Myself I never used to have problems
with Duracells leaking - even if they were dead - now they leak for
no determined reason even if not fully discharged. Even new ones
used well within there date code in my PDA device leaked.
Something with the product has had to been changed to cause them to
leak prematurely. My experience with Rayovac's is you could just
about guarantee they would leak if left in a flashlight for any
period of time. My experience with Energizers has been better than
the prior brand but still experienced leakage problems. In the past
Duracells seldom ever leaked even if left in equipment for
years. Not so anymore, so what is different with them today. From
my position I don't have enough knowledge about the engineering and
manufacturing aspects of this type of battery product to determine
the cause, I can only base it upon my recent experience in last few
years to compared to that before then. I had them leak in my PDA,
GPS, and a few Mag lites.
jerb
At 08:08 AM 12/23/2009, you wrote:
><nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
>
>A few years ago I did a study of variability in various
>brands of alkaline batteries. I concluded from the study
>that there is no extra value to be realized for the
>purchase of batteries that have high-dollar advertising
>budgets. See:
>
>http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/AA_Bat_Test.pdf
>
>I suspect that any brand and any size of alkaline cell
>is capable of leaking under some conditions. Further,
>given today's business environment for farming out
>the production about any kind of product, there's
>not much you can hang a hat on for stating that
>brand D's demonstrable leakage problems will go away
>if one moves their loyalty to brand E.
>
>If you dig around in my alkaline cell stock that
>ranges from AAAA to D cells, you'll find a host of
>different brands. I've not suffered a severe battery
>leakage event in so long I don't recall the last time.
>At the same time, we go through batteries pretty
>quickly. No cell sits around in a seldom used
>device.
>
>The fact that some of us here on the
>list have suffered a leakage event with a particular
>brand is not a definitive study of the propensity
>of that brand for failure. If say 90% of all cells
>presently occupying the battery box of our favorite
>accessories are Duracells . . . it's axiomatic that
>the propensity of any failures will be in Duracells.
>
>Bob . . .
>
>
Message 20
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Subject: | Re: duracell battery leak |
Raymond,
Your comments are exactly what I have experienced. The question is
what has changed with regards to the Duracell product and is this now
a product characteristic.
jerb
At 06:28 PM 12/23/2009, you wrote:
>
>That is similar to my experiences with Duracell. For more than a
>decade I used them in my car and boat flashlights and had no
>problems. More recently I have had several leak. Same environment
>and use profile, many more failures. Anecdotal evidence, but enough
>to send me in search of a different battery.
>
>Raymond Julian
>Kettle River, MN.
>do not archive
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Subject: | Re: Duracell Leaking Batteries |
Bob,
As for repair they may clean the compartment and contacts with
something - for alkaline some form of base neutralizer like vinegar
but, once the battery contacts have had the plating eaten off, they
will never work as well. With my PDA, they were not fully
discharged, in fact some new ones out of the same package laying on
the surface on a desk even started to leak and corrode even though
they were within there use date.
There is something with these batteries either how there now made or
what there made of, that must be causing this.
jerb
> In the mean time, Duracell offers to repair or
> replace a damaged appliance in their sales literature
> at:
>
>http://www.duracell.com/procell/about/care.asp
>
> Now it may be that they could claim no fault if
> somehow their analysis says the cell was left
> installed long after it was depleted. I.e., flash
> lights, radios, etc inadvertently left on or
> perhaps the auto off feature isn't working, etc.
>
> Bob . . .
>
>
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