Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:01 AM - Re: S701 Contactor Failure Analysis (tomcostanza)
2. 05:16 AM - Re: BMA Efis G4 Lite (LINDA WALKER)
3. 05:29 AM - Re: BMA Efis G4 Lite (n395v)
4. 05:48 AM - For you workers in wood (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
5. 06:11 AM - Re: Re: BMA Efis G4 Lite (Werner Schneider)
6. 07:00 AM - Re: Re: BMA Efis G4 Lite ()
7. 07:41 AM - Re: S701 Contactor Failure Analysis (Bob White)
8. 07:48 AM - Re: S701 Contactor Failure Analysis (Speedy11@aol.com)
9. 08:14 AM - Re: Re: S701 Contactor Failure Analysis (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
10. 08:16 AM - Re: S701 Contactor Failure Analysis (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
11. 08:28 AM - Re: BMA Efis G4 Lite (rampil)
12. 08:31 AM - Re: Basic Electricity....Grrrrr......... (rampil)
13. 08:43 AM - Re: Re: S701 Contactor Failure Analysis (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
14. 08:47 AM - Re: S701 Contactor Failure Analysis (Ron Quillin)
15. 10:13 AM - Re: Re: Basic Electricity....Grrrrr......... (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
16. 11:15 AM - Re: Re: Basic Electricity....Grrrrr......... (Bill Mauledriver Watson)
17. 11:42 AM - Failure modes with Z12 (Jeff Page)
18. 12:37 PM - Re: S701 Contactor Failure Analysis (Bob White)
19. 02:00 PM - Re: S701 Contactor Failure Analysis (Richard Tasker)
20. 02:03 PM - Re: Basic Electricity....Grrrrr......... (rampil)
21. 07:03 PM - Re: Basic Electricity....Grrrrr......... (Dave)
22. 07:11 PM - Re: Re: Basic Electricity....Grrrrr......... (BobsV35B@aol.com)
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Subject: | Re: S701 Contactor Failure Analysis |
If I remember correctly, the wire-wrap technique was only for microamp level circuits;
a few milliamps at the most. I never saw any wire-wraps for the approx
1 amp that the contactor would need. Or am I mistaken?
Clear Skies,
Tom
--------
Clear Skies,
Tom Costanza
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286910#286910
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Subject: | Re: BMA Efis G4 Lite |
Help!
The backlight yesterday went on my Blue Mountain Avionics EFIS G4 Lite!
Possibly, and hopefully, this is an inverter issue, and not the display
itself.
As this company no longer exists, can anyone suggest the best method for
getting this sort of problem rectified?
Are the circuit board schematics for their products available anywhere?
Any help much appreciated.
Patrick Elliott, Reigate, Surrey, England.
Long-Ez, G-LGEZ.
----- Original Message -----
From: "AeroElectric-List Digest Server" <aeroelectric-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2010 7:55 AM
Subject: AeroElectric-List Digest: 12 Msgs - 02/17/10
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Subject: | Re: BMA Efis G4 Lite |
Best to go to the BMA website or www.vansairforce.net and advertise for G4 lite wanted. Or watch e bay. One or 2 sold recently for less than$500.
Also try calling Greg Richter- 404-434-3990
apparently sometimes he answers and may be able to tell you how to fix it.
--------
Milt
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286915#286915
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Subject: | For you workers in wood |
I've been acquiring some new skills in my Dad's refurbished
shop. I've been building shelves and benches for the new
digs and cabinets for the house in Lindsborg KS where
Dr. Dee teaches. I've owned several sets of dado blades
and was reasonably satisfied with their work product
until this week . . .
One of the M.L. locals is a cabinet builder who knew my
dad. He stopped by about a week ago when he saw the
garage door open. During our conversation he noted an
old dado set I had laying on the table and remarked that
I might like to try a Freud brand dado set.
I read up on them and found a range of prices that
were probably related to quality/capability. I sucked
in a breath and ordered a 6" model 206 for about $80
(about 2x what I usually spent on dado sets).
Got it in the mail last Monday and got a chance to
try it today. What a tool! Very nicely crafted.
very precise and wonderfully smooth-bottom grooves.
Very little splintering of cross cuts on oak faced
plywood.
If anyone on the List has occasion to build shelves
or fixtures that would benefit from tight, square
joints in solid or plywood, I can report that the
new blade-set is worth every dime I spent on it.
I'm also working on a fixture that will allow dado
cuts across lumber as wide as 24" on a relatively
short table saw. I'll report on that when reasonably
perfected.
Bob . . .
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Subject: | Re: BMA Efis G4 Lite |
Or go and buy a Dynon Skyview and get 1000$ for your broken G4
<http://www.dynonavionics.com/docs/SkyView_BMA_Trade-In.html>
Werner
On 18.02.2010 14:28, n395v wrote:
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "n395v"<Bearcat@bearcataviation.com>
>
> Best to go to the BMA website or www.vansairforce.net and advertise for G4 lite wanted. Or watch e bay. One or 2 sold recently for less than$500.
>
> Also try calling Greg Richter- 404-434-3990
>
> apparently sometimes he answers and may be able to tell you how to fix it.
>
> --------
> Milt
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286915#286915
>
>
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Subject: | Re: BMA Efis G4 Lite |
I agree, BMA - don't even go there. they haven't updated that product
since the Clinton administration. So many people have had issues with
their systems - why torture yourself. Get a Dynon, call Approach
FastStack and get a cable, plug it in, hook up a power and ground lead
and fly away.
Glenn
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Werner Schneider
Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2010 8:42 AM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: BMA Efis G4 Lite
<glastar@gmx.net>
Or go and buy a Dynon Skyview and get 1000$ for your broken G4
<http://www.dynonavionics.com/docs/SkyView_BMA_Trade-In.html>
Werner
On 18.02.2010 14:28, n395v wrote:
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by:
"n395v"<Bearcat@bearcataviation.com>
>
> Best to go to the BMA website or www.vansairforce.net and advertise
for G4 lite wanted. Or watch e bay. One or 2 sold recently for less
than$500.
>
> Also try calling Greg Richter- 404-434-3990
>
> apparently sometimes he answers and may be able to tell you how to fix
it.
>
> --------
> Milt
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286915#286915
>
>
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Subject: | Re: S701 Contactor Failure Analysis |
I remember using the "no strip" technique many years ago. As I recall,
the wrap tool did slit the insulation as it was wrapped around the
post so that bare wire was wrapped onto the post.
Bob W.
On Wed, 17 Feb 2010 23:30:03 -0600
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com> wrote:
>
> At 10:22 PM 2/17/2010, you wrote:
> >I'm feeling old... My only hands-on experimental
> >circuit making was pre-digital. Over the
> >years I'd pickup electronics mags and see
> >references to "wire wrapped" terminals and never
> >had a clue what it referred to. Now I get it... Thanks.
> >
> >Bill
>
> see:
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wire_wrap
>
> This is the modern incarnation used on complex backplanes
> where gazillion-layer boards are impractical. The no-strip
> version is from way-back-when and it didn't hang around
> long.
>
> Bob . . .
>
>
>
>
>
>
--
N93BD - Rotary Powered BD-4 - http://www.bob-white.com
Now Rotary Powered Alpine
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwceNc2ydN8
Cables for your rotary installation - http://roblinstores.com/
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Subject: | Re: S701 Contactor Failure Analysis |
Bob,
That was one of the most educational episodes ever on the Aeroelectric
Connection.
You removed some of the mystery for us.
Thanks,
Stan Sutterfield
Do not archive
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Subject: | Re: S701 Contactor Failure Analysis |
At 05:58 AM 2/18/2010, you wrote:
><Tom@CostanzaAndAssociates.com>
>
>If I remember correctly, the wire-wrap technique was only for
>microamp level circuits; a few milliamps at the most. I never saw
>any wire-wraps for the approx 1 amp that the contactor would
>need. Or am I mistaken?
Yes, but that was more a function of wire size and
size of the post in the specific process. If one
adequately understood the physics behind making
such joints on 4-cornered posts with the appropriate
insulation and tools, I have no doubt that this
contactor design could exploit the process.
Bob . . .
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Subject: | Re: S701 Contactor Failure Analysis |
At 09:37 AM 2/18/2010, you wrote:
>
>I remember using the "no strip" technique many years ago. As I recall,
>the wrap tool did slit the insulation as it was wrapped around the
>post so that bare wire was wrapped onto the post.
Yeah . . . I recall that. It WAS a pretty specialized
wrapping tool.
Bob . . .
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Subject: | Re: BMA Efis G4 Lite |
Actually, according to Larry on the BMA site, they are trying to
handle hardware repairs. Check out the bulletin board site.
BMA hardware in the field was no less reliable than Dynon or
any other non cert hardware. Its been 2 years since BMA stopped
development, Dynon still has not caught up with the useful feature list.
The main problem with the BMA hardware was that it assumed at least
a high school education in electricity to install. Apparently this was
a bad assumption. Greg had actually assumed that users would
actually want to calibrate their sensors, turns out most installers did not
know what that actually meant since no one does it for antediluvian
analog hardware. Most people accept 20% accuracy and never know
the difference.
I used a gold box for 4 years before upgrading to a G4. Never
had a hardware problem that was not of my own creation.
--------
Ira N224XS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286953#286953
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Subject: | Re: Basic Electricity....Grrrrr......... |
On the other hand, there's the observation in the Avionics-List last Friday
that noted if there was any electrical (not even electronic) literacy, out
there, the traffic on this List would drop by 90%.
I would think Bob's Seminars would be much more popular!
--------
Ira N224XS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286954#286954
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Subject: | Re: S701 Contactor Failure Analysis |
At 09:45 AM 2/18/2010, you wrote:
>Bob,
>That was one of the most educational episodes ever on the
>Aeroelectric Connection.
>You removed some of the mystery for us.
>Thanks,
My pleasure my friend . . . it's an extension
of a number of tasks I accomplished on the TC side of the
house for many years.
It was frustrating to me that folks making $multi-million$
decisions had so little knowledge of the physics that
described the failure . . . even less on the physics
that was proposed to fix it.
It took me nearly 8 years to get a brake friction material
changed on a motor that was breaking shafts due to
a vibration that literally screamed at the most
casual observer.
I explored dozens of arm-chair suppositions only
to return to the original hypothesis and proposal
for a fix. Finally got it done but not after
a bucket full of money in warranty costs and
customer dis-satisfaction went down the drain.
I still have a copy of a 6-page letter I wrote to the V.P.
of Engineering describing in minute detail how the
shafts were failing . . . delighted to receive an e-mail
inviting me to a working lunch. Was astounded to find that
he wanted to discuss the letter for about 2 minutes
and talk about fishing the rest of the time . . . sigh.
Here on the list we have a unique opportunity to
tap the combined knowledge and experience of folks
who's paychecks and promotions do not depend on
smoothing the feathers of superiors that know even
less about the problem.
Bob . . .
Message 14
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Subject: | Re: S701 Contactor Failure Analysis |
At 08:14 2/18/2010, you wrote:
>Yeah . . . I recall that. It WAS a pretty specialized
> wrapping tool.
>
> Bob . . .
Frightning;
I still have and can locate the auto strip bit for my electric Gardner WW tool!
Ron Q
do not archive
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Subject: | Re: Basic Electricity....Grrrrr......... |
At 10:29 AM 2/18/2010, you wrote:
>
>On the other hand, there's the observation in the Avionics-List last Friday
>that noted if there was any electrical (not even electronic) literacy, out
>there, the traffic on this List would drop by 90%.
Not sure that's true . . . folks gravitate into groups
for a host of reasons. I suspect the participation here
is mixed. Certainly there are individuals who seek
customer service style yes/no answers to immediate
decisions/problems.
It has always been my goal that this be more of a
classroom than a "customer support" activity.
And given the size of the list (about 1700 at last count)
and relatively low traffic, I suspect that most are
here to expand their horizons.
This is why I (and I'm sure most others) welcome information
and ideas that help us DO things with cgreater onfidence,
understanding and competence.
>I would think Bob's Seminars would be much more popular!
I've been rethinking the weekend seminar format as
a teaching tool. It's a drink-from-a-firehose which
probably has a lower rate of retention than a 3-hour
college course . . . which also has a demonstrably poor
retention rate.
I've been watching my 2.5 year old grandson with
great interest. We humans are blessed with a great
deal of potential but the process by which that
potential is exploited is torturously slow. Retention
of ideas and acquisition of skill comes with
close attention and interest over long periods
of time. The most capable among us did not get
that way by taking a course. They acquired it over
years of hands-on activity and often in the company
of true teachers.
This is why Mr. C's parents and grandparents are
attentive to the idea that every day experiences
should to be framed as teaching moments. What is
that? How does it work? Is it easy to break?
Can it hurt you? Are there inappropriate usages
that attack the liberty of others or destroys
property? I'm not suggesting that this little
guy is being treated like a high-school student . . .
certainly everything offered has to be tailored
to his level of understanding. But the process
of becoming 'educated' goes far beyond any time
one spends in the formal classroom. One gets
and holds his attention by making it fun.
The AeroElectric-List is an opportunity for
the interested and attentive to read about ideas
and their supporting physics go by over as
long much time as one is willing to expend
on the effort.
This is why I encourage folks to write about
any whippy new discovery, any unexplained
event (contactor failures?), or ask any question.
It's then up to those who can contribute to
an exploration of the question or understanding
of the answers have an opportunity to become
true teachers.
We all have things to learn, things to offer
and opportunities to share in the pleasure of
advancing our collective art. The process is
slow and laborious . . . and the older we get,
the more laborious it becomes. One of my
teachers once opined, "The day you stop learning
the first day of your decline toward insignificance."
Mr. C is one of my strongest motives to add to
my own catalog of understanding and skills to
share with him as he grows up. Folks here on
the list are participants in that task. You
all contribute to expansion of my own horizons
which I will ultimately pass down to the next
generation.
Bob . . .
Message 16
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Subject: | Re: Basic Electricity....Grrrrr......... |
rampil wrote:
>
> On the other hand, there's the observation in the Avionics-List last Friday
> that noted if there was any electrical (not even electronic) literacy, out
> there, the traffic on this List would drop by 90%.
>
> I would think Bob's Seminars would be much more popular!
>
> --------
> Ira N224XS
>
I think the level of electrical, and even electronic, literacy is a bit
higher here than one might think.
An analogy I might make is with instrument flight. I'm IFR literate
(talk the talk, been there-done that, remember most rules, read most
pubs), but not proficient or current. Having grown up with my Dad's
scratch built TV, testing vacuum tubes for fun, studying for my Class
III, practicing morse code, recyling components from surplus boards, and
building pre-proportional RC aircraft, I'm electrically literate but not
proficient or current. And 30+ years in the computer industry doesn't
necessarily cover the same ground.
For those of us not in the business or practicing an
electrical/electronics hobby on a daily basis, this list is a pretty
good substitute. Of course fooling around with OBAM aircraft can be an
electrically engaging pursuit... and I think what we all see here is a
lot of literate people building skills while regaining a little currency
and proficiency as they work their projects.
Ohm's law?? On at least 2 occassions over the last year I can recall
relearning that simple little equation as a fuse fried or some unit
dimmed. I learned it, I know what it is, but haven't applied it in so
long that a little rediscovery is to be expected.
Anyway, I'm REALLY enjoying this list and everyone on it. Thanks to Bob
in particular.
Bill "losing proficiency with sanding block in hand" Watson
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Subject: | Failure modes with Z12 |
I am still vacillating between Z13/8 and Z12.
I intend to use two electronic ignitions. The only thing that
concerns me is an overvoltage event that burns out both ignitions.
Probably very rare, considering the robust design, but perhaps a
lightning strike, or the failure of an overvoltage module ? Z12 would
isolate the two and alleviate my concern.
Second, I frequently cruise at 2200rpm and the output of the SD-8
would be only about 5A. For 0.8 pounds and $79 more, with an
insignificant balance improvement, I can buy a 40A and 20A alternator
instead, which is very tempting.
The concept of the essential bus diode is not used in Z12, so now we
get to my question. It appears that after a failure of either battery
contactor, there is no configuration to supply power to the
corresponding battery bus. So duration of flight is limited by the
battery capacity, rather than the capacity of the remaining alternator
to supply all the ships loads with the cross feed contactor engaged.
What change could be safely made to provide power to both battery
buses without negatively impacting other features of Z12 ?
Thanks !
Jeff Page
Dream Aircraft Tundra #10
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Subject: | Re: S701 Contactor Failure Analysis |
On Thu, 18 Feb 2010 08:42:28 -0800
Ron Quillin <rjquillin@cox.net> wrote:
> At 08:14 2/18/2010, you wrote:
> >Yeah . . . I recall that. It WAS a pretty specialized
> > wrapping tool.
> >
> > Bob . . .
>
> Frightning;
> I still have and can locate the auto strip bit for my electric Gardner WW tool!
>
> Ron Q
>
> do not archive
OK, I got curious. You can still buy the thing from Digikey:
http://parts.digikey.com/1/parts/996077-tool-slit-n-wrap-manual-w-28-p184-1.html
I can't believe they are charging $232 for one of those things. I'm
sure I didn't pay anything like that. I might even be able to find my
old one if anybody want a real deal. :)
Bob W.
--
N93BD - Rotary Powered BD-4 - http://www.bob-white.com
Now Rotary Powered Alpine
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwceNc2ydN8
Cables for your rotary installation - http://roblinstores.com/
Message 19
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Subject: | Re: S701 Contactor Failure Analysis |
Yeah, I know. I recently looked to see if the OK Industry
wrap/strip/unwrap tool I have was still available. My jaw dropped when
I found out the answer is yes and it costs $34.33 from Digikey!
Do not archive
Bob White wrote:
> On Thu, 18 Feb 2010 08:42:28 -0800
> Ron Quillin<rjquillin@cox.net> wrote:
>
>
>> At 08:14 2/18/2010, you wrote:
>>
>>> Yeah . . . I recall that. It WAS a pretty specialized
>>> wrapping tool.
>>>
>>> Bob . . .
>>>
>> Frightning;
>> I still have and can locate the auto strip bit for my electric Gardner WW tool!
>>
>> Ron Q
>>
>> do not archive
>>
> OK, I got curious. You can still buy the thing from Digikey:
> http://parts.digikey.com/1/parts/996077-tool-slit-n-wrap-manual-w-28-p184-1.html
>
> I can't believe they are charging $232 for one of those things. I'm
> sure I didn't pay anything like that. I might even be able to find my
> old one if anybody want a real deal. :)
>
> Bob W.
>
>
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Subject: | Re: Basic Electricity....Grrrrr......... |
Hey Bill,
Just remember that wax on - wax off with a sanding block generates
proficiency too (and muscles)!
--------
Ira N224XS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=287030#287030
Message 21
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Subject: | Re: Basic Electricity....Grrrrr......... |
>
>
> I've been rethinking the weekend seminar format as
> a teaching tool. It's a drink-from-a-firehose which
> probably has a lower rate of retention than a 3-hour
> college course . . . which also has a demonstrably poor
> retention rate.
Bob,
I would love to attend one of your seminars, but due to the distance,
work and a number of other
reasons of life getting in the way of life, I have been unable to
participate. Have you considered
a set of seminar dvds. Even though they seminars are a drink from the
firehose. The dvd/s could allow a review
as required and a chance for some of us to drink from the firehose who
may never get to drink in person.
Thanks for all of your contributions to the OBAM world.
Dave
>
Message 22
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Subject: | Re: Basic Electricity....Grrrrr......... |
Good Evening Dave,
I was able to attend one of Bob's seminars near Milwaukee a couple of years
ago. Well worth the time and if the opportunity presents itself. I will
attend again.
Firehose or not, well worth the time!
Happy Skies,
Old Bob
In a message dated 2/18/2010 9:04:53 P.M. Central Standard Time,
dave@coltnet.net writes:
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dave" <dave@coltnet.net>
>
>
> I've been rethinking the weekend seminar format as
> a teaching tool. It's a drink-from-a-firehose which
> probably has a lower rate of retention than a 3-hour
> college course . . . which also has a demonstrably poor
> retention rate.
Bob,
I would love to attend one of your seminars, but due to the distance,
work and a number of other
reasons of life getting in the way of life, I have been unable to
participate. Have you considered
a set of seminar dvds. Even though they seminars are a drink from the
firehose. The dvd/s could allow a review
as required and a chance for some of us to drink from the firehose who
may never get to drink in person.
Thanks for all of your contributions to the OBAM world.
Dave
>
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