Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:23 AM - Re:Chemical nut busters. (jakent@unison.ie)
2. 06:01 AM - Re: Chemical "nut busters" (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
3. 06:05 AM - Re: HLMP-2685 multi-LEDs off LR3C (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
4. 06:31 AM - Re: Chemical "nut busters" (William Greenley)
5. 07:35 AM - Re: Chemical "nut busters" (Robert Borger)
6. 12:09 PM - Re: Chemical "nut busters" (ray)
7. 12:43 PM - Re: Chemical "nut busters" (Jared Yates)
8. 06:05 PM - Delete if you wish, but this is funny! (rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us)
9. 07:48 PM - Re: Delete if you wish, but this is funny! (Rob Housman)
10. 07:55 PM - Re: Delete if you wish, but this is funny! (Dj Merrill)
11. 08:09 PM - Peer Review of Schematic (Noah)
Message 1
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| Subject: | RE:Chemical nut busters. |
Now the Honours question!
Lots of RVers have reported using ATF fluid instead of aircraft brake fluid.
Will aircraft brake fluid work in the 'nut-buster' mixture instead of ATF
liquid?
Some of our number have it still on our shelves.
Rgds John Kent RV-4 (EI-DIY).
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Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Chemical "nut busters" |
At 09:10 AM 4/7/2010, you wrote:
<david.nelson@pobox.com>
Hi Bob,
Thank you for forwarding this great info on. I was pondering this
info while driving into work this AM and came up with a couple of
curiosity questions:
- How long were the assemblies exposed to the penetrants before
applying the torque (seconds, minutes, hours, days)?
I Did a web search on "ATF" and "acetone" and got a gob
of hits. Seems the original author of the article
did an update of the article but the website link
is broken. I think the site is defunct. Did find this
bit on at:
------------------------------
http://mytractorforum.com/showthread.php?t=99250
------------------------------
This same quote has been circulated over the internet for a while but
if you actually read the article you will find:
The scientifically rusted environment was just 12 hours in salt water.
No bolts, no nuts but just dowel pins rusted into a block of steel.
A 8 hour soaking in the penetrating oil not just a few sprays.
There was no ATF but it was a 50-50 mix of acetone and power steering fluid.
Power steering fluid and acetone do not mix well, it will separate
into two layers because acetone is relatively polar.
How valid was his study? From what I could tell from the article, it
was really not valid. I suggest getting a copy of the article and
deciding for your self.
-------------------------------
The ATF/Acetone thing is very widely spread
on 'net. Almost viral. A search on "power steering
fluid" and "acetone" yielded a bunch of articles
on hazardous waste disposal.
Would be interesting to pursue further but I'm painting
cabinets today . . .
Bob . . .
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: HLMP-2685 multi-LEDs off LR3C |
>
>http://parts.digikey.com/1/parts/681506-led-lt-bar-hi-eff-red-8led-dip-hlmp2685.html
>
>I'd like to hook one of these to the LR3C regulator instead of the
>supplied filament lamp, so that it can go into the annunciator panel
>too.
>
>I've been trying to trace a schematic of Bob's, which I'm sure I've
>seen, of how to use an LED instead of a filament lamp with the LR3C,
>as a starting point. I can't find it, and the resistor values would
>be different in any case, so can anyone throw any light on to how to
>use one of these 8-LED devices with the LR3C?
The schematic I published is at:
http://aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Schematics/LR3_LV_Led_1.jpg
Your application will take some experimentation.
You can try paralleling all the LEDs and seeing how
well you can excite the array and still have uniform
illumination. You may find that you need to treat
them as separate LEDs.
Just be aware that LR3 lamp driver is never completely
"OFF". The off current is too low to get any light
from a bulb but it will cause an LED to glow at a
reduced intensity. Hence the paralleling resistor to
get the LED to mimic a lamp more closely.
Bob . . .
Message 4
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| Subject: | Chemical "nut busters" |
I have teach some advanced high school classes where the students are always
looking for interesting projects for science fairs. This research might be a
good fit. What thoughts does anyone have on how to "scientifically" within a
reasonable time frame get a bunch of comparably rusted bolts? Also, any
ideas on what application protocol for the "nut busters" would be most
useful?
Dr Greenley
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert L.
Nuckolls, III
Sent: Thursday, April 08, 2010 8:59 AM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Chemical "nut busters"
<nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
At 09:10 AM 4/7/2010, you wrote:
<david.nelson@pobox.com>
Hi Bob,
Thank you for forwarding this great info on. I was pondering this
info while driving into work this AM and came up with a couple of
curiosity questions:
- How long were the assemblies exposed to the penetrants before
applying the torque (seconds, minutes, hours, days)?
I Did a web search on "ATF" and "acetone" and got a gob
of hits. Seems the original author of the article
did an update of the article but the website link
is broken. I think the site is defunct. Did find this
bit on at:
------------------------------
http://mytractorforum.com/showthread.php?t=99250
------------------------------
This same quote has been circulated over the internet for a while but
if you actually read the article you will find:
The scientifically rusted environment was just 12 hours in salt water.
No bolts, no nuts but just dowel pins rusted into a block of steel.
A 8 hour soaking in the penetrating oil not just a few sprays.
There was no ATF but it was a 50-50 mix of acetone and power steering fluid.
Power steering fluid and acetone do not mix well, it will separate
into two layers because acetone is relatively polar.
How valid was his study? From what I could tell from the article, it
was really not valid. I suggest getting a copy of the article and
deciding for your self.
-------------------------------
The ATF/Acetone thing is very widely spread
on 'net. Almost viral. A search on "power steering
fluid" and "acetone" yielded a bunch of articles
on hazardous waste disposal.
Would be interesting to pursue further but I'm painting
cabinets today . . .
Bob . . .
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Chemical "nut busters" |
Dr. G,
I'd say you have at least two nice projects here.
1. Studying corrosion
Compare solutions of water, water with NaCl, water with CaCl, water
with both, on cheap, unplated, hardware bolts/nuts over time (days/
weeks/months).
2. Once you get a suitable set of corroded bolts/nuts, what works best
to separate them.
I'll think more about the necessary protocols until I return home and
can write more easily.
Regards,
Bob Borger
Sent from my iPhone
On Apr 8, 2010, at 9:26, William Greenley <wgreenley@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
>
> I have teach some advanced high school classes where the students
> are always
> looking for interesting projects for science fairs. This research
> might be a
> good fit. What thoughts does anyone have on how to "scientifically"
> within a
> reasonable time frame get a bunch of comparably rusted bolts? Also,
> any
> ideas on what application protocol for the "nut busters" would be most
> useful?
> Dr Greenley
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> Robert L.
> Nuckolls, III
> Sent: Thursday, April 08, 2010 8:59 AM
> To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Chemical "nut busters"
>
> <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
>
>
> At 09:10 AM 4/7/2010, you wrote:
> <david.nelson@pobox.com>
>
>
> Hi Bob,
>
> Thank you for forwarding this great info on. I was pondering this
> info while driving into work this AM and came up with a couple of
> curiosity questions:
>
> - How long were the assemblies exposed to the penetrants before
> applying the torque (seconds, minutes, hours, days)?
>
> I Did a web search on "ATF" and "acetone" and got a gob
> of hits. Seems the original author of the article
> did an update of the article but the website link
> is broken. I think the site is defunct. Did find this
> bit on at:
>
> ------------------------------
> http://mytractorforum.com/showthread.php?t=99250
> ------------------------------
> This same quote has been circulated over the internet for a while but
> if you actually read the article you will find:
>
> The scientifically rusted environment was just 12 hours in salt water.
>
> No bolts, no nuts but just dowel pins rusted into a block of steel.
>
> A 8 hour soaking in the penetrating oil not just a few sprays.
>
> There was no ATF but it was a 50-50 mix of acetone and power
> steering fluid.
> Power steering fluid and acetone do not mix well, it will separate
> into two layers because acetone is relatively polar.
>
> How valid was his study? From what I could tell from the article, it
> was really not valid. I suggest getting a copy of the article and
> deciding for your self.
> -------------------------------
>
> The ATF/Acetone thing is very widely spread
> on 'net. Almost viral. A search on "power steering
> fluid" and "acetone" yielded a bunch of articles
> on hazardous waste disposal.
>
> Would be interesting to pursue further but I'm painting
> cabinets today . . .
>
> Bob . . .
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Chemical "nut busters" |
William,
Elevated temperature will accelerate the rusting. Salt water, obviously.
Elevated O2 exposure.
For application of mixtures it would be interesting to see the
difference between 15 min. and 12-24 hr.
I'd like to see the wintergreen oil/diesel mixture added to the list.
Hope this is of use.
Raymond Julian
Kettle River, MN
do not archive.
William Greenley wrote:
>
> I have teach some advanced high school classes where the students are always
> looking for interesting projects for science fairs. This research might be a
> good fit. What thoughts does anyone have on how to "scientifically" within a
> reasonable time frame get a bunch of comparably rusted bolts? Also, any
> ideas on what application protocol for the "nut busters" would be most
> useful?
> Dr Greenley
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert L.
> Nuckolls, III
> Sent: Thursday, April 08, 2010 8:59 AM
> To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Chemical "nut busters"
>
> <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
>
>
>
> At 09:10 AM 4/7/2010, you wrote:
> <david.nelson@pobox.com>
>
>
> Hi Bob,
>
> Thank you for forwarding this great info on. I was pondering this
> info while driving into work this AM and came up with a couple of
> curiosity questions:
>
> - How long were the assemblies exposed to the penetrants before
> applying the torque (seconds, minutes, hours, days)?
>
> I Did a web search on "ATF" and "acetone" and got a gob
> of hits. Seems the original author of the article
> did an update of the article but the website link
> is broken. I think the site is defunct. Did find this
> bit on at:
>
> ------------------------------
> http://mytractorforum.com/showthread.php?t=99250
> ------------------------------
> This same quote has been circulated over the internet for a while but
> if you actually read the article you will find:
>
> The scientifically rusted environment was just 12 hours in salt water.
>
> No bolts, no nuts but just dowel pins rusted into a block of steel.
>
> A 8 hour soaking in the penetrating oil not just a few sprays.
>
> There was no ATF but it was a 50-50 mix of acetone and power steering fluid.
> Power steering fluid and acetone do not mix well, it will separate
> into two layers because acetone is relatively polar.
>
> How valid was his study? From what I could tell from the article, it
> was really not valid. I suggest getting a copy of the article and
> deciding for your self.
> -------------------------------
>
> The ATF/Acetone thing is very widely spread
> on 'net. Almost viral. A search on "power steering
> fluid" and "acetone" yielded a bunch of articles
> on hazardous waste disposal.
>
> Would be interesting to pursue further but I'm painting
> cabinets today . . .
>
> Bob . . .
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Chemical "nut busters" |
If you want to step up the educational content even more, you could promote
the corrosion with a little electrolysis. That will also really speed the
process up. Put a rusty piece of plain steel into a water bath with a
little bit of sodium carbonate, and hook up the negative lead of a battery
charger to the rusty metal. Put the positive lead on the head of the bolts,
then submerge the nut end of the bolt (only that end) into the solution and
turn on the power. Follow the general directions here:
http://jaredyates.com/pages/electrolysis/electrolysis.shtml
just be sure to substitute the negative and positive leads, since I wrote
those instructions for rust removal, and you want to add rust. This all
starts to enter the wonderful world of plating, which is a fantastic
learning experience that includes chemistry and electricity and more. Look
for a company called Caswell, since they make small home plating kits for
all sorts of applications. They have a great plating manual that covers how
to plate with various metals at home. I have found that learning about how
all of this works has really transferred well to building planes too. It
helps with understanding the why and how of things like alclad aluminum, cad
plated hardware, gold plated electrical connections (or not) and more. This
type of learning is what makes airplane home-building such a valuable source
of education for understanding the world around us as a whole.
On Thu, Apr 8, 2010 at 3:02 PM, ray <raymondj@frontiernet.net> wrote:
>
> William,
>
> Elevated temperature will accelerate the rusting. Salt water, obviously.
> Elevated O2 exposure.
>
> For application of mixtures it would be interesting to see the difference
> between 15 min. and 12-24 hr.
>
> I'd like to see the wintergreen oil/diesel mixture added to the list.
>
> Hope this is of use.
>
> Raymond Julian
> Kettle River, MN
> do not archive.
>
>
> William Greenley wrote:
>
>> wgreenley@gmail.com>
>>
>> I have teach some advanced high school classes where the students are
>> always
>> looking for interesting projects for science fairs. This research might be
>> a
>> good fit. What thoughts does anyone have on how to "scientifically" within
>> a
>> reasonable time frame get a bunch of comparably rusted bolts? Also, any
>> ideas on what application protocol for the "nut busters" would be most
>> useful?
>> Dr Greenley
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert
>> L.
>> Nuckolls, III
>> Sent: Thursday, April 08, 2010 8:59 AM
>> To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Chemical "nut busters"
>>
>> <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
>>
>>
>>
>> At 09:10 AM 4/7/2010, you wrote:
>> david.nelson@pobox.com>
>>
>>
>> Hi Bob,
>>
>> Thank you for forwarding this great info on. I was pondering this info
>> while driving into work this AM and came up with a couple of curiosity
>> questions:
>>
>> - How long were the assemblies exposed to the penetrants before applying
>> the torque (seconds, minutes, hours, days)?
>>
>> I Did a web search on "ATF" and "acetone" and got a gob
>> of hits. Seems the original author of the article
>> did an update of the article but the website link
>> is broken. I think the site is defunct. Did find this
>> bit on at:
>>
>> ------------------------------
>> http://mytractorforum.com/showthread.php?t=99250
>> ------------------------------
>> This same quote has been circulated over the internet for a while but if
>> you actually read the article you will find:
>>
>> The scientifically rusted environment was just 12 hours in salt water.
>>
>> No bolts, no nuts but just dowel pins rusted into a block of steel.
>>
>> A 8 hour soaking in the penetrating oil not just a few sprays.
>>
>> There was no ATF but it was a 50-50 mix of acetone and power steering
>> fluid.
>> Power steering fluid and acetone do not mix well, it will separate into
>> two layers because acetone is relatively polar.
>>
>> How valid was his study? From what I could tell from the article, it was
>> really not valid. I suggest getting a copy of the article and deciding for
>> your self.
>> -------------------------------
>>
>> The ATF/Acetone thing is very widely spread
>> on 'net. Almost viral. A search on "power steering
>> fluid" and "acetone" yielded a bunch of articles
>> on hazardous waste disposal.
>>
>> Would be interesting to pursue further but I'm painting
>> cabinets today . . .
>>
>> Bob . . .
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Delete if you wish, but this is funny! |
You have to have an engineer’s
personality to understand why it is so funny. Enjoy
Reciprocating Dingle
Arm
This is a very funny and classic
presentation organized by
Rockwell Int'l. Read the introduction
before clicking on the video
link below.
Several years
ago, Rockwell International decided to get into
the heavy duty
transmission business. They were getting ready
to tape a first
introduction video, and as a warm up, the
professional narrator began
what has become a legend within the
trucking industry. This man
should have won an academy award for his
stellar performance.
Now remember this is strictly off the cuff,
nothing is written down,
this became the biggest talk in the
industry, vs the new product
which they were introducing.
Click here: http://home.comcast.net/~steveham21/turbo.mpg
Message 9
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| Subject: | Delete if you wish, but this is funny! |
What player or codec did you use to play the video?
The Media Player in Windows 7 gives this error message:
"\Windows Media Player cannot play the file. The Player might not support
the file type or might not support the codec that was used to compress the
file."
Best regards,
Rob Housman
Irvine, CA
Europa XS Tri-Gear
A070
Airframe complete
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us
Sent: Thursday, April 08, 2010 5:31 PM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Delete if you wish, but this is funny!
You have to have an engineer's personality to understand why it is so funny.
Enjoy
Reciprocating Dingle Arm
This is a very funny and classic presentation organized by
Rockwell Int'l. Read the introduction before clicking on the video
link below.
Several years ago, Rockwell International decided to get into
the heavy duty transmission business. They were getting ready
to tape a first introduction video, and as a warm up, the
professional narrator began what has become a legend within the
trucking industry. This man should have won an academy award for his
stellar performance. Now remember this is strictly off the cuff,
nothing is written down, this became the biggest talk in the
industry, vs the new product which they were introducing.
Click here: <http://home.comcast.net/~steveham21/turbo.mpg>
http://home.comcast.net/~steveham21/turbo.mpg
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Delete if you wish, but this is funny! |
On 4/8/2010 10:46 PM, Rob Housman wrote:
> What player or codec did you use to play the video?
Try VLC, it plays just about everything:
<http://www.videolan.org/>
http://www.videolan.org/
-Dj
--
Dj Merrill - N1JOV
Glastar Sportsman 2+2 Builder #7118 N421DJ - http://deej.net/sportsman/
Grumman Yankee Driver N9870L - http://deej.net/yankee/
Message 11
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| Subject: | Peer Review of Schematic |
Greetings-
I am requesting comments on the following dual alternator single battery schematic
using Plane Power 60A and B&C SD-20 alternators using an external SB-1B regulator.
http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/4748/100408.png
Plane is an RV which will be equipped with a magneto and an EI, so engine is not
electrically dependent. Mission is multi-day X-country with occasional IFR.
Avionics suite will include EFIS/EM, IFR GPS, and autopilot. Backup flight instruments
(AI, ALT, AS) are planned. EFIS and AI will contain internal backup
batteries. Design goal is to keep it as simple as the mission allows.
Thanks in advance for your thoughts and consideration.
--------
Highest Regards,
Noah Forden
RV-7A
Rhode Island
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=293590#293590
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