Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:48 AM - Electrical diagram ()
2. 06:32 AM - Re: Re: Electrical diagram (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
3. 11:26 AM - AeroElectric-List... PDF Problem...?? (David LLoyd)
4. 11:37 AM - Re: AeroElectric-List... PDF Problem...?? (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
5. 12:21 PM - Re: AeroElectric-List... PDF Problem...?? (David LLoyd)
6. 12:46 PM - Re: AeroElectric-List... PDF Problem...?? (ray)
7. 01:39 PM - Re: AeroElectric-List... PDF Problem...?? ()
8. 01:48 PM - Re: AeroElectric-List... PDF Problem...?? (Charlie England)
9. 02:59 PM - Re: AeroElectric-List... PDF Problem...?? (David LLoyd)
10. 11:14 PM - Official AeroElectric-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) (Matt Dralle)
11. 11:22 PM - Official AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines (Matt Dralle)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Electrical diagram |
5/1/2010
Hello Marc, You wrote: "Also, my thoughts were that I'm probably not going
to be shutting
off the alternator that often."
{Comment} My shut down procedure calls for shutting the externally regulated
alternator off (after confirming that the voltage and amperage being put out
is at a nominal level) and waiting for the low voltage light to start
flashing. This simulates an alternator failure in flight and confirms that
the low voltage warning system is working.
Then the engine is shut down with the mixture and the magnetos are turned
off.
Then ,after turning on the essential bus switch, the battery and avionics
master switch (yes, I have one) are turned off. This turns off all non
essential electrical and avionics items and is the procedure that I would
follow with an actual alternator failure in flight.
Then I confirm that the Garmin 430W and transponder are continuing to
operate, now from the avionics essential bus. These two boxes are required
for entering the Washington DC SFRA where I am based and for a reasonably
comfortable landing if operating elsewhere.
Then I shut off the essential bus switch and the shut down is complete.
'OC' Says: "The best investment we can make is the effort to gather and
understand knowledge."
========================================================
Time: 06:45:47 PM PST US
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Electrical diagram
From: "marchudson" <marchudson@verizon.net>
Bob and Joe, I want to thank you for reviewing my diagram. I appreciate it.
Have the start button on the e-bus was an oversight. I will move it to the
main
bus. Thanks for catching that.
Leaving the baggage light on was taken into consideration and I'm willing to
take
the risk on this one. I'm sure after if bites me a couple of times, I'll
reconsider.
Joe, good call on putting the transponder and trim on e-bus. I will
probably do
this as the transponder consumes little power.
The EFIS does annunciate a low voltage condition and crowbar over voltage
protection
is built into the Plane Power alternator.
Bob, to be honest, I went with the single battery switch for simplicity and
cost.
Much cheaper to purchase the two position locking Honeywell toggle than the
three position. Also, my thoughts were that I'm probably not going to be
shutting
off the alternator that often. If I really need to then yes, I'm going
to be using the breaker as a switch. I called Plane Power twice and made
sure
that this alternator will run fine without the battery online, just in case
the battery inadvertently got shut off with the engine running.
Again guys, I really appreciate you having a look.
Marc
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Electrical diagram |
At 08:41 PM 4/30/2010, you wrote:
Bob and Joe, I want to thank you for reviewing my diagram. I appreciate it.
Have the start button on the e-bus was an oversight. I will move it
to the main bus. Thanks for catching that.
Leaving the baggage light on was taken into consideration and I'm
willing to take the risk on this one. I'm sure after if bites me a
couple of times, I'll reconsider.
One of the products under development is a variant
of the 9024 4-function module who's use is illustrated
in Figure Z9. It's a baggage/cabin light on-limit timer.
Further consider building your own baggage
light fixture using white, very bright LEDs readily available
from a lot of sources . . . I can send you some. 4-6 lamps
a 2-3 resistors would get you fixture that puts out
most adequate light with a power budget of 0.09 Amps.
We've pondered offering such a fixture with the timer
built in.
Joe, good call on putting the transponder and trim on e-bus. I will
probably do this as the transponder consumes little power.
The transponder is on the list of recommended clients for the
ebus as explained in Chapter 17 of the 'Connection.
The EFIS does annunciate a low voltage condition and crowbar over
voltage protection is built into the Plane Power alternator.
Bob, to be honest, I went with the single battery switch for
simplicity and cost. Much cheaper to purchase the two position
locking Honeywell toggle than the three position.
Why a locking $high$ switch? Hundreds of thousands
of GA aircraft including airplanes like the Beechjet
and Hawkers have perfectly ordinary toggle switches
to control ship's power sources.
Also, my thoughts were that I'm probably not going to be shutting
off the alternator that often. If I really need to then yes, I'm
going to be using the breaker as a switch. I called Plane Power
twice and made sure that this alternator will run fine without the
battery online, just in case the battery inadvertently got shut off
with the engine running.
See? You've properly identified a risk of human
error that became non-zero because of your
perception of another unqualified and certainly
unquantified risk. I.e. accidental mis-positioning
of the battery switch. This deliberation drove you to
purchase an expensive battery switch and created
a new operational risk.
The recipes for success in aviation electrical
systems are many and their operational histories
date back nearly a century. We would do well to
avail ourselves of that knowledge so that we
can build with confidence as opposed to jousting
with new worries and creating new risks.
Bob . . .
Message 3
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| Subject: | AeroElectric-List... PDF Problem...?? |
Hi Bob,
I was reviewing your files on.....
http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Curves/
Your lists are very much appreciated.
On this 'list' are two files for the Battery_Minder_Recharge.pdf.
Both of those files will not open in my cpu. All others on the list do open
normally. Before I get into my cpu, I thought possibly you could look at
the files and see if they got corrupted by a gremlin of sorts.....
David
_________________________________________________________
>
> Not all charger/maintainers are equal. Even amongst
> the Schumacher products, there are considerable variations
> depending on model. See:
>
> http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Curves/
>
> Behaviors for several Schumacher products are plotted
> there. We don't know why they all differ but we DO know
> that putting any RG battery on a constant "recharge"
> voltage or "trickle" charge current will kill it over
> time.
>
> If you see anything that looks like a "top off" behavior
> followed by an extended period of "relaxation" where
> the voltage drops below 14 volts, there is a strong
> likelihood that the device is doing good things for
> your RG battery.
>
> Bob . . .
>
>
> =========
> At 06:11 AM 3/18/2010, Radioflyer wrote:
> <skyeyecorp@airpost.net>
>
> After several postings here about how this is the best no-nonsense
> maintainer for Pb-acid chemistry I got myself one from Walmart. Model SEM
> 1562A. I put it on an Odyssey PC625 and checked the voltages. The unit was
> charging at 15.6V. After 3 hrs, the float charge kicked in, hovering
> around 14.6 volts. Later I believe I found a review on Amazon from
> somebody who measured about the same voltages.
>
> Don't know that I would call it "the best". I have no
> first-hand knowledge or criteria by which I could
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: AeroElectric-List... PDF Problem...?? |
On this 'list'
http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Curves/
are two files for the Battery_Minder_Recharge.pdf.
Both of those files will not open in my cpu. All others on the list
do open normally. Before I get into my cpu, I thought possibly you
could look at the files and see if they got corrupted by a gremlin of
sorts.....
David
I am mystified my friend. Both the Battery Minder and Battery Tender files
are pretty old and have been linked numerous times. I've just opened
them from this computer with no problems. You might reload your
Adobe Reader and see if that 'fixes' anything. Let me know
what you discover. First try right-clicking to download the
files to your hard drive and THEN see if your computer will
open them. It might be a 'linkage' thing between your browser
and the PDF reader.
Bob . . .
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: AeroElectric-List... PDF Problem...?? |
Bob,
You were correct that there is a linking problem. I was able to save it to
the HD and then, was able to open it with my Adobe Reader 9.2. However,
when 9.2 opened the file it popped this error message.....(see attachment).
I have never seen this message before. Funny that all other files on your
list open normally and these 2 do not. I wonder if I update 9.2 to 9.3 if
that would solve the linking problem.
Your suggestions.....
David
___________________________________________________
----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
Sent: Saturday, May 01, 2010 11:36 AM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: AeroElectric-List... PDF Problem...??
> <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
>
>
> On this 'list'
>
> http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Curves/
>
> are two files for the Battery_Minder_Recharge.pdf.
>
> Both of those files will not open in my cpu. All others on the list do
> open normally. Before I get into my cpu, I thought possibly you could
> look at the files and see if they got corrupted by a gremlin of sorts.....
>
> David
>
> I am mystified my friend. Both the Battery Minder and Battery Tender
> files
> are pretty old and have been linked numerous times. I've just opened
> them from this computer with no problems. You might reload your
> Adobe Reader and see if that 'fixes' anything. Let me know
> what you discover. First try right-clicking to download the
> files to your hard drive and THEN see if your computer will
> open them. It might be a 'linkage' thing between your browser
> and the PDF reader.
>
> Bob . . .
>
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: AeroElectric-List... PDF Problem...?? |
Both opened on my computer. I'm running Linux and opened them with the
Firefox plugin for pdfs.
Just another data point.
Hope this helps.
Raymond Julian
Kettle River, MN.
do not archive
Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote:
> <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
>
>
>
>
>
> On this 'list'
>
> http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Curves/
>
> are two files for the Battery_Minder_Recharge.pdf.
>
> Both of those files will not open in my cpu. All others on the list do
> open normally. Before I get into my cpu, I thought possibly you could
> look at the files and see if they got corrupted by a gremlin of sorts.....
>
> David
>
> I am mystified my friend. Both the Battery Minder and Battery Tender
> files
> are pretty old and have been linked numerous times. I've just opened
> them from this computer with no problems. You might reload your
> Adobe Reader and see if that 'fixes' anything. Let me know
> what you discover. First try right-clicking to download the
> files to your hard drive and THEN see if your computer will
> open them. It might be a 'linkage' thing between your browser
> and the PDF reader.
>
> Bob . . .
>
>
>
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: AeroElectric-List... PDF Problem...?? |
Both files (and others on the site) opened fine for me using both Adobe re
ader (9.3.2) and also Foxit reader.(3.1.4.1125)
Bob McC
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: AeroElectric-List... PDF Problem...?? |
Hi David,
I see one called battery minder and another called battery tender; both
open on my old xp machine with whatever version of pdf reader is used by
the Google Chrome browser.
Charlie
On 5/1/2010 1:21 PM, David LLoyd wrote:
> <skywagon@charter.net>
>
> Hi Bob,
>
> I was reviewing your files on.....
>
> http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Curves/
>
> Your lists are very much appreciated.
> On this 'list' are two files for the Battery_Minder_Recharge.pdf.
> Both of those files will not open in my cpu. All others on the list
> do open normally. Before I get into my cpu, I thought possibly you
> could look at the files and see if they got corrupted by a gremlin of
> sorts.....
> David
>
> _________________________________________________________
>>
>> Not all charger/maintainers are equal. Even amongst
>> the Schumacher products, there are considerable variations
>> depending on model. See:
>>
>> http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Curves/
>>
>> Behaviors for several Schumacher products are plotted
>> there. We don't know why they all differ but we DO know
>> that putting any RG battery on a constant "recharge"
>> voltage or "trickle" charge current will kill it over
>> time.
>>
>> If you see anything that looks like a "top off" behavior
>> followed by an extended period of "relaxation" where
>> the voltage drops below 14 volts, there is a strong
>> likelihood that the device is doing good things for
>> your RG battery.
>>
>> Bob . . .
>>
>>
>> =========
>> At 06:11 AM 3/18/2010, Radioflyer wrote:
>> <skyeyecorp@airpost.net>
>>
>> After several postings here about how this is the best no-nonsense
>> maintainer for Pb-acid chemistry I got myself one from Walmart. Model
>> SEM 1562A. I put it on an Odyssey PC625 and checked the voltages. The
>> unit was charging at 15.6V. After 3 hrs, the float charge kicked in,
>> hovering around 14.6 volts. Later I believe I found a review on
>> Amazon from somebody who measured about the same voltages.
>>
>> Don't know that I would call it "the best". I have no
>> first-hand knowledge or criteria by which I could
>>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: AeroElectric-List... PDF Problem...?? |
Bob,
Problem of opening old .pdf file fixed.
However, I am not sure of a specific fix.
I uninstalled my latest (AR) Adobe Reader 9.2, followed by a reboot and
installed AR 9.3. After it came up and went through its 'acceptance', etc.,
then all the .pdf files on you "curves" file link would open as normal.
It's good to have a repair work but, it would have been better to know the
specific reason my AR 9.2 did not work.
David
PS: for some you going through similar updating for PDF files, you should
know that the newest version does not function until you try and open a .pdf
file. Then, it comes up with the legal jargon that one must sign on to
before new version of AR go into operation.
________________________________________________________
----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
Sent: Saturday, May 01, 2010 11:36 AM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: AeroElectric-List... PDF Problem...??
> <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
>
>
> On this 'list'
>
> http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Curves/
>
> are two files for the Battery_Minder_Recharge.pdf.
>
> Both of those files will not open in my cpu. All others on the list do
> open normally. Before I get into my cpu, I thought possibly you could
> look at the files and see if they got corrupted by a gremlin of sorts.....
>
> David
>
> I am mystified my friend. Both the Battery Minder and Battery Tender
> files
> are pretty old and have been linked numerous times. I've just opened
> them from this computer with no problems. You might reload your
> Adobe Reader and see if that 'fixes' anything. Let me know
> what you discover. First try right-clicking to download the
> files to your hard drive and THEN see if your computer will
> open them. It might be a 'linkage' thing between your browser
> and the PDF reader.
>
> Bob . . .
>
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Official AeroElectric-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) |
Dear Listers,
Please read over the AeroElectric-List Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) below.
The
complete AeroElectric-List FAQ including the Usage Guidelines can be found at the
following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/AeroElectric-List.FAQ.html
Thank you,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
[ Note: This FAQ was designed to be displayed with a fixed width font such as
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*********************
*** List Archives ***
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A file containing of all of the previous postings to the AeroElectric-List is
available on line. The archive file information is available via the
Web and FTP in a number of forms. Each are briefly described below:
* AeroElectric-List.FAQ
- Latest version of the AeroElectric-List Frequently Asked Question
page (this document).
* AeroElectric-Archive.digest.complete
- Complete file with most of the email header info removed and
page breaks inserted between messages.
* AeroElectric-Archive.digest.vol-??
- Same as the file above, but broken up into small sections that
can more easily handled.
* AeroElectric-Archive.digest.complete.zip
- Same as the AeroElectric-Archive.digest.complete file above, but
in PKZIP format. Use "binary" data transfer methods.
* AeroElectric-Archive.digest.complete.Z
- Same as the AeroElectric-Archive.digest.complete file above, but
in
UNIX compress format. Use "binary" data transfer methods.
Download Via FTP
----------------
The archive file is available via anonymous FTP from ftp.matronics.com
in the "/pub/Archives" directory. It is updated daily and can be found in
a number of formats as described above. (All filenames are case sensitive.)
ftp://ftp.matronics.com/pub/Archives
Download Via Web
----------------
The archives are also available via a web listing. These can be found
toward the bottom of the following web page:
http://www.matronics.com/archives
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All messages posted to the AeroElectric-List are also available using the
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in the List are indexed, and individual sub-archives can be browsed.
http://www.matronics.com/archive/archive-index.cgi?AeroElectric
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6-x) One-line Description of each photo or file
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Following the availability of the new Photoshare, an email message will be
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Share is available and what the direct URL to it is.
For a current list of available Photoshares, have a look at the Main
Index Page:
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*** List Archive CDROM ***
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A complete Matronics Email List Archive CD is available that contains
all of the archives since the beginning of each of the Lists. The archives
for all of the Lists are included on the CD along with a freeware search
engine written by a list member. The CD is burned the day you order it
and will contain archive received up to the last minute. They make
great gifts!
http://www.matronics.com/ArchiveCDROM
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******************************************************************************
AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines
******************************************************************************
The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the AeroElectric-List.
You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein.
Failure to use the AeroElectric-List in the manner described below may result
in the removal of the subscribers from the List.
AeroElectric-List Policy Statement
The purpose of the AeroElectric-List is to provide a forum of discussion for
things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals
are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver
high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie
among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals
requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of
the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established:
- Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit
posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long
lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc.
- THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be
relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it.
- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive
that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and
terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and
responses.
- Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address,
aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line
about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid
bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary
space in the archive.
- DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is
easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the
web page or FAQ first.
- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of
your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it
easy to find threads in the archive.
- When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your
response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the
reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that
quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive
can not be overstated!
- When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT
then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the
"reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your
response to the original poster. You might have to actively address
your response with the original poster's email address.
- DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something
to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I
agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent
to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large.
- When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to
comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly
contribute something valuable.
- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone
polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack
other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously
controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that
will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.
- Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly
subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by
List members promoting their respective products or items for sale
should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble
a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but
is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to
everyone, including those who provide products to the entire
community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the
operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists.
-------
[This is an automated posting.]
do not archive
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| Subject: | Official AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines |
Dear Listers,
Please read over the AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines below. The complete
AeroElectric-List FAQ including these Usage Guidelines can be found at the
following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/AeroElectric-List.FAQ.html
Thank you,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
******************************************************************************
AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines
******************************************************************************
The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the AeroElectric-List.
You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein.
Failure to use the AeroElectric-List in the manner described below may result
in the removal of the subscribers from the List.
AeroElectric-List Policy Statement
The purpose of the AeroElectric-List is to provide a forum of discussion for
things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals
are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver
high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie
among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals
requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of
the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established:
- Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit
posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long
lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc.
- THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be
relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it.
- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive
that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and
terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and
responses.
- Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address,
aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line
about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid
bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary
space in the archive.
- DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is
easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the
web page or FAQ first.
- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of
your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it
easy to find threads in the archive.
- When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your
response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the
reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that
quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive
can not be overstated!
- When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT
then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the
"reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your
response to the original poster. You might have to actively address
your response with the original poster's email address.
- DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something
to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I
agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent
to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large.
- When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to
comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly
contribute something valuable.
- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone
polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack
other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously
controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that
will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.
- Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly
subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by
List members promoting their respective products or items for sale
should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble
a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but
is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to
everyone, including those who provide products to the entire
community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the
operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists.
-------
[This is an automated posting.]
do not archive
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