---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 01/18/11: 8 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 10:37 AM - Odyssey PC680 Battery load tests (Mickey Coggins) 2. 12:58 PM - Re: Odyssey PC680 Battery load tests (Werner Schneider) 3. 03:47 PM - Re: Re: Transponder antenna signal (John Morgensen) 4. 03:54 PM - Re: Odyssey PC680 Battery load tests (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 5. 06:18 PM - Robust transponder antennas (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 6. 06:36 PM - Buss Bar (John Grosse) 7. 07:06 PM - Re: Buss Bar (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 8. 08:13 PM - World's Fastest (Speedy11@aol.com) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 10:37:46 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Odyssey PC680 Battery load tests From: Mickey Coggins Hi, I used the West Mountain Radio CBA to test some batteries that I had hoped to use in my aircraft. Unfortunately the PC680 batteries have been laying around for about 6 years, and had became quite discharged. I have used the Battery Tender to charge them a few times, and have re-run the load test. The results of two tests (with a recharge in between) are below, along with a test of a Panasonic LC-XD1217P (12v, 17 Ah) of a similar form factor, and with identical treatment. https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=explorer&chrome=true&srcid=0B5D8Jl0C8SZbNDQ0N2FiNzItYjA0Yy00MmQ5LTk0NjUtOWVkZTMwNzlmMTU3&hl=en https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=explorer&chrome=true&srcid=0B5D8Jl0C8SZbYmUyMzdhN2ItYjBkOS00MWJkLThlNWUtODUzNjRmMWVmOWE1&hl=en My question is do you think that I can get the Odyssey batteries back to a decent state? Below are the test results in text for those that don't want to download the above PDFs with the pretty graphs. Panasonic2: Description: 6 Lead Acid cells, 17.0 Ah @ 7.50A Started At: 16-Jan-11 2:56 PM Discharge Rate: 7.50 A Starting Voltage: 12.91 V Ending Voltage: 10.50 V Total Time (hh:mm:ss): 01:26:37 Tested Capacity: 10.878 Ah Odyssey: Description: 6 Lead Acid cells, 16.0 Ah @ 7.50A Started At: 16-Jan-11 4:34 PM Discharge Rate: 7.50 A Starting Voltage: 12.56 V Ending Voltage: 10.48 V Total Time (hh:mm:ss): 00:39:53 Tested Capacity: 5.006 Ah Odyssey2: Description: 6 Lead Acid cells, 16.0 Ah @ 7.50A Started At: 18-Jan-11 6:14 PM Discharge Rate: 7.50 A Starting Voltage: 12.80 V Ending Voltage: 10.49 V Total Time (hh:mm:ss): 00:39:37 Tested Capacity: 4.973 Ah I really thought that the Odyssey batteries would hold a charge better than a "standard" Panasonic. Also, the fact that the Panasonic is giving me double the capacity is quite surprising. I have not yet tried my desulfator, but that's my next step. I've only tested one of my two Odyssey batteries, going to test the other "soon". Thanks, Mickey -- Mickey Coggins ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 12:58:05 PM PST US From: Werner Schneider Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Odyssey PC680 Battery load tests Hello Mickey, I would try the desulfator once as well. I had a lead acid battery from a car where one cell seemed to be shorten. I did it leave on the desulfator combined with a battery tender for 2 years and had to use it for my car as that battery was to much depleted (cabin light on for 4 days with minus temp). That Battery showed full recovery for usage in my car even that it is only 2/3 of the capacity of the original battery. Give it a try, just a few cents of power you spend on it and let it there for at least a month. Werner ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 03:47:10 PM PST US From: John Morgensen Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Transponder antenna signal I just saw a picture posted re: oil separator that showed a transponder antenna mounted inside the lower cowling. Looked interesting but I'm not sure which group it was. john On 1/16/2011 1:57 PM, Speedy11@aol.com wrote: > Great responses from everyone. I appreciate each one. Like Old Bob, > I've broken off stub antenna. I'd considered switching to a blade > antenna, but didn't want to fit a new antenna. I will reconsider that > option, but I'd like to investigate doing my own "antenna fairing." > I've been gradually making streamlining changes to my RV-8A and I now > claim the status of "world's fastest RV-8A." Maybe a streamlined > transponder antenna will help a tiny bit more. My new target is 200 > KIAS in level flight at 1000" MSL. I'm already within reach of that goal. > Thanks again for your responses. > Stan Sutterfield > I like that. > > You've been watching: > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ftq8jTQ8ANE > (excuse me if I'm being circular here) > > Bill "need something to do until it warms up" Watson > > On 1/14/2011 11:41 PM, Speedy11@aol.com wrote: > > Bob - or other antenna gurus, > > I want to streamline my transponder antenna. I have the short (3 > > inch) stub antenna with the ball on the tip. To streamline it I'm > > going to make an epoxy resin fiberglass covering that will look like a > > blade antenna. > > Please confirm for me that streamlining with a fiberglass covering > > will not affect signal performance. > > Thanks, > > Stan Sutterfield > * > > > * ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 03:54:37 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Odyssey PC680 Battery load tests I used the West Mountain Radio CBA to test some batteries that I had hoped to use in my aircraft. Unfortunately the PC680 batteries have been laying around for about 6 years, and had became quite discharged. What kind of maintenance did you do on the batteries while stored? The Battery Tender and Battery Minders are not intended to be 'chargers' so much as 'maintainers'. When you have 12v batteries on storage, it's a good idea to clip them all together in parallel and have some sort of sophisticated maintainer supporting the lot. I use the Schumacher 1562 or a Battery Tender to support my test batteries. Some are pushing 7 years old with better than 80% of new capacity. I really thought that the Odyssey batteries would hold a charge better than a "standard" Panasonic. Also, the fact that the Panasonic is giving me double the capacity is quite surprising. Were all three stored under the same conditions? I have not yet tried my desulfator, but that's my next step. I've only tested one of my two Odyssey batteries, going to test the other "soon". We'll be interested to hear what you discover. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:18:14 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Robust transponder antennas I've been away from the home 'puter for a few days and didn't have access to my big archive of reference documents when the List was discussing transponder antennas. Got home a few hours ago and posted a patent issued in '61 for what is euphemistically called a "scimitar" antenna. http://www.aeroelectric.com/Reference_Docs/Antenna/Scimitar_Patent_3015101.pdf I recalled seeing these all over the empannage belly of the B-52. They looked like tie-down rings except that there was about a half dozen of various sizes. They were associated with the electronic counter-measures system. I was a bomb-nav guy so I didn't get any schooling on them. Years later I was thinking about making a robust transponder antenna using this design philosophy but never got around to it. Others here on the List might be interested in trying it out. Note that where the SWR on the exemplar antenna in the patent goes below 2:1 (4,000 Mhz) the horizontal radiation pattern goes pretty circular. An antenna could be crafted from aluminum or perhaps brass and thick enough to offer the wished-for mechanical robustness. The edges could also be sculptured as necessary for aerodynamically appealing affect. It was interesting to contemplate the development history of this antenna. While based on development work by the Turner guys pre 1958 the patent wasn't issued until 1961. The airplanes I was working on were built in the 1954-58 time frame and already had several sizes installed. Similar antennas on the spacecraft programs were faired with radomes. The antennas on the B-52 were bare and hung right out in the breeze. Anywho, for what it's worth, this might be the basis for a nice DIY antenna project. It would lend itself well to an article featuring fabricate-to-drawings illustrations. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 06:36:38 PM PST US From: John Grosse Subject: AeroElectric-List: Buss Bar I know copper is generally used, but is there any reason NOT to use aluminum to construct a ground buss bar? John Grosse ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 07:06:51 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Buss Bar At 09:27 PM 1/18/2011, you wrote: > >I know copper is generally used, but is there any reason NOT to use >aluminum to construct a ground buss bar? How do you plan to attach wires to it? The bus bar designs suggested by AeroElectric Connection and B&C products go to some lengths to reduce threaded fasteners to a minimum. There are none on the panel ground bus . . . and only the fat wires are brought to threaded studs. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 08:13:15 PM PST US From: Speedy11@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: World's Fastest Marty, I thought that might pique someone's interest. I'm still experimenting so my "tricks" thus far are still unproven. But, like Dave Anders and Bob Axsom, I'm making small gradual changes, some of which have failed, to increase speed and improve efficiency. I am on to something. Before my recent aero changes I could get about 185 KIAS at 1000' MSL. My goal was to reduce drag so as to reach 190 KIAS. Last week I got 193. My new goal is 200. 193 is pretty good for a normally aspirated, stock cowling, 3 blade prop, nose dragger. I have several more ideas for speed improvement and I'll be trying them during the next few months. I have no objection to sharing my ideas so long as guys don't claim them as their own. When I have copied others guy's ideas for building techniques , I gave them credit. My speed improvements can be done by anyone and I have tried them after doing a little bit of aero study and talking to some guys educated in aerodynamics. If guys aren't interested in making their own, I may make them available for sale. We'll see. If anyone would like to see what I'm doing, you can visit my web site at _www.rv-8a.net_ (http://www.rv-8a.net) and look at pages posted since Jan 2010. The primary gain came from my Speedy Cuffs added to the main gear (shown in Jan 2011). The web site will explain and has photos. If you have questions, feel free to write me. Regards, Stan Sutterfield PS - Don't tell the guys in the SARL - I want to beat them this year. : ) Stan, Interesting post "world's fastest RV-8A", indeed. How about sharing some of the tricks you used to achieve this goal. You maybe onto something here, starting a new trend in "experimenting". Marty RV-6A N826ME ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message aeroelectric-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/aeroelectric-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/aeroelectric-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.