Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:13 AM - Re: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape? (Jon McLin)
2. 11:41 AM - Re: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape? (Noel Loveys)
3. 12:11 PM - Re: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape? (bob noffs)
4. 01:08 PM - Re: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape? (Mike Nellis)
5. 01:21 PM - Re: Noise in damp weather (user9253)
6. 02:32 PM - Re: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape? (rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us)
7. 04:44 PM - Re: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape? (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
8. 05:21 PM - Re: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape? (Charlie England)
9. 07:46 PM - Re: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape? (Noel Loveys)
10. 07:47 PM - Re: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape? (Noel Loveys)
11. 09:28 PM - Re: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape? (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
12. 09:36 PM - Re: Inexpensive Runway lighting (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
13. 10:12 PM - Re: Re: HID light noise (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
14. 10:16 PM - Re: Electrical Gremlins (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
15. 10:24 PM - Re: Inexpensive Runway lighting (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
16. 10:52 PM - Re: Inexpensive Runway lighting (Daniel Hooper)
17. 11:13 PM - Re: Inexpensive Runway lighting (rayj)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape? |
> Sounds like Silicone tape. (aka rescue tape) Aircraft Spruce carries it. Good
luck!
>
Thanks, but no, it's not silicone tape. That stuff fuses together permanently.
This stuff is easily unwrapped.
I found some earlier notes I made - the Cessna stuff is apparently 12 mils thick.
Where it was used in the cabin it (installed perhaps 34 years ago) it remains
flexible, and could probably be reused. Under the cowl it was pretty hard,
and cracked when I unwrapped it.
Online I find "dry vinyl" tape for wire harnesses, which apparently sticks to itself
but can be easily unwrapped. That's the desired behavior. The dry vinyl
tape that I can find is only available in opaque black or yellow, and is much
thinner (4 mils).
Message 2
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| Subject: | Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape? |
Sure doesn't sound like it would pass legal inspection. Adhesive tapes are
not supposed to be used at all. Not for connecting wires or binding them
together in bundles. For that there is coraseal nylon ties and wax cord.
Noel
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
halbenjamin@optonline.net
Sent: January 15, 2012 2:02 AM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape?
Jon,
Sounds like Silicone tape. (aka rescue tape) Aircraft Spruce carries it.
Good luck!
Hal Benjamin - RV-4
Long Island, NY
Starting engine soon - Should be flying this year!
----- Original Message -----
From: Jon McLin
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape?
>
> Wire bundles in my Cessna are in some places spiral wrapped in a
> white translucent tape. The tape is not the plastic spiral wrap
> that is commonly available for wire harnesses; nor is it regular
> electrical tape. The thickness and "stickiness" is somewhere in
> between - the tape sticks to itself enough that the wrap holds,
> but it can be readily unwrapped. It's roughly 1" wide. I
> estimate the thickness at somewhere between 5 and 10 mils.
>
> What is this, and where can I purchase some?
>
> Thanks,
> Jon McLin
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape? |
i don't talk to many pilots that use the wax cord but i do and it is worth
a look. as i understand it is still used in military planes. it has a
tensile strength of 80 lbs compared to a wire tie at 18 lbs. a spool will
last a lifetime and several wraps will secure about anything. its cross
section is about the same as flat rib lacing.
bob noffs
On Sun, Jan 15, 2012 at 1:38 PM, Noel Loveys <noelloveys@yahoo.ca> wrote:
> Sure doesn=92t sound like it would pass legal inspection. Adhesive tape
s
> are not supposed to be used at all. Not for connecting wires or binding
> them together in bundles. For that there is coraseal nylon ties and wax
> cord.****
>
> ** **
>
> Noel****
>
> ** **
>
> *From:* owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
> owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *
> halbenjamin@optonline.net
> *Sent:* January 15, 2012 2:02 AM
> *To:* aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* Re: AeroElectric-List: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape?****
>
> ** **
>
> Jon,****
>
> Sounds like Silicone tape. (aka rescue tape) Aircraft Spruce carries it.
> Good luck!****
>
> ****
>
> Hal Benjamin - RV-4****
>
> Long Island, NY****
>
> Starting engine soon - Should be flying this year!
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Jon McLin
> Date: Saturday, January 14, 2012 8:53 pm
> Subject: AeroElectric-List: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape?
> To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
>
> >
> > Wire bundles in my Cessna are in some places spiral wrapped in a
> > white translucent tape. The tape is not the plastic spiral wrap
> > that is commonly available for wire harnesses; nor is it regular
> > electrical tape. The thickness and "stickiness" is somewhere in
> > between - the tape sticks to itself enough that the wrap holds,
> > but it can be readily unwrapped. It's roughly 1" wide. I
> > estimate the thickness at somewhere between 5 and 10 mils.
> >
> > What is this, and where can I purchase some?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Jon McLin
> >
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
> > http://www.matronics.com/contribution
> > ==========
> >
> >
> >
> > ****
>
> *
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
> *
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape? |
I use the wax cord as well. There is something nostalgic and relaxing
about lacing up a section of wiring. I use tie wraps, loosely
positioned to hold them in position until the loom is ready.
Mike
> i don't talk to many pilots that use the wax cord but i do and it is
> worth a look. as i understand it is still used in military planes. it
> has a tensile strength of 80 lbs compared to a wire tie at 18 lbs. a
> spool will last a lifetime and several wraps will secure about
> anything. its cross section is about the same as flat rib lacing.
> bob noffs
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Noise in damp weather |
Gavin,
It seems that you have found the problem with the loose alternator connection.
The AC ripple voltage is much larger when one of the alternator wires is not
connected. It has been my experience that a threaded fastener that is 1/4 turn
loose can cause problems.
It is not a good idea to run the engine and alternator with the battery disconnected.
The battery helps to stabilize the alternator output.
You asked,
> "Maybe I don't have anything to worry about?"
Not if everything is working to your satisfaction. The vast majority of electrical
problems are due to bad connections. Good job fixing it.
Joe
--------
Joe Gores
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=363890#363890
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape? |
Hi Jon
Is it perhaps Teflon Tape?
See Aircraft Spruce and Ssearch Teflon Tape, it is adhesive backed. You
can also have a look at www.mcmaster.com.
Ron Parigoris
<jon.mclin@cox.net>
>
>
>> Sounds like Silicone tape. (aka rescue tape) Aircraft Spruce
carries it.
>> Good luck!
>>
> Thanks, but no, it's not silicone tape. That stuff fuses
together
> permanently. This stuff is easily unwrapped.
>
> I found some earlier notes I made - the Cessna stuff is apparently
12 mils
> thick. Where it was used in the cabin it (installed perhaps 34 years
ago)
> it remains flexible, and could probably be reused. Under the cowl it
was
> pretty hard, and cracked when I unwrapped it.
>
> Online I find "dry vinyl" tape for wire harnesses, which
apparently sticks
> to itself but can be easily unwrapped. That's the desired
behavior. The
> dry vinyl tape that I can find is only available in opaque black
or
> yellow, and is much thinner (4 mils).
>
>
>
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape? |
At 07:37 PM 1/14/2012, you wrote:
>
>Wire bundles in my Cessna are in some places spiral wrapped in a
>white translucent tape. The tape is not the plastic spiral wrap
>that is commonly available for wire harnesses; nor is it regular
>electrical tape. The thickness and "stickiness" is somewhere in
>between - the tape sticks to itself enough that the wrap holds, but
>it can be readily unwrapped. It's roughly 1" wide. I estimate the
>thickness at somewhere between 5 and 10 mils.
At Boeing in 1961 we called that stuff "Irvolite". I'm sure
this was a trade name. I've also heard it referred to as
"Sirco". Also a trade name. Given that we were using this
stuff on the B-52, it's a certainty that it has a generic
name further identified by a mil-spec.
The stuff came in both flat wrap (tape) and
sleeve (tubing) forms and the material of choice
for adding extra insulation and/or scuff protection.
The stuff was mildly self-bonding to itself but
we always secured the end of the wrap with a
string-tie.
It's not as chemically and thermally robust as the soft
silicone tape in common use today, at the same
time it's mechanical robustness is superior to
silicone. I've not seen a 'fresh' roll of it in
a very long time. I've not observed its use on
any airplane at Beech in many years. Its pedigree is
from the Polyurethane/Vinyl era . . . not something
we would see on a modern TC aircraft.
Bob . . .
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape? |
Velcro works great as a temporary wrap; just peel it open to add wire.
(Don't tell anyone, but it can work fine as a permanent wrap, too.)
Charlie
On 01/15/2012 03:03 PM, Mike Nellis wrote:
>
> I use the wax cord as well. There is something nostalgic and relaxing
> about lacing up a section of wiring. I use tie wraps, loosely
> positioned to hold them in position until the loom is ready.
>
> Mike
>
>> i don't talk to many pilots that use the wax cord but i do and it is
>> worth a look. as i understand it is still used in military planes. it
>> has a tensile strength of 80 lbs compared to a wire tie at 18 lbs. a
>> spool will last a lifetime and several wraps will secure about
>> anything. its cross section is about the same as flat rib lacing.
>> bob noffs
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape? |
My preference is the wax cord but as with a lot of things it does take some
practice to get to install it properly. It has other pluses over the nylon
tie wraps You will never slice a hand open while rooting around in an engine
bay that has coraseal and wax cord used. I am one of the ones who has
received my fair share of slices on tie wraps.
One easy way to tell if it will pass inspection is to check and see if tape
of any kind is listed in the Maintenance Manual.. If it's not there and you
use it without an STC you may find your plane grounded and according to Mr.
Murphy it will only happen at the worst possible time. I've seen large
aircraft grounded for a $0.11 item.
Noel
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of bob noffs
Sent: January 15, 2012 4:38 PM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape?
i don't talk to many pilots that use the wax cord but i do and it is worth a
look. as i understand it is still used in military planes. it has a tensile
strength of 80 lbs compared to a wire tie at 18 lbs. a spool will last a
lifetime and several wraps will secure about anything. its cross section is
about the same as flat rib lacing.
bob noffs
On Sun, Jan 15, 2012 at 1:38 PM, Noel Loveys <noelloveys@yahoo.ca> wrote:
Sure doesn't sound like it would pass legal inspection. Adhesive tapes are
not supposed to be used at all. Not for connecting wires or binding them
together in bundles. For that there is coraseal nylon ties and wax cord.
Noel
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
halbenjamin@optonline.net
Sent: January 15, 2012 2:02 AM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape?
Jon,
Sounds like Silicone tape. (aka rescue tape) Aircraft Spruce carries it.
Good luck!
Hal Benjamin - RV-4
Long Island, NY
Starting engine soon - Should be flying this year!
----- Original Message -----
From: Jon McLin
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape?
>
> Wire bundles in my Cessna are in some places spiral wrapped in a
> white translucent tape. The tape is not the plastic spiral wrap
> that is commonly available for wire harnesses; nor is it regular
> electrical tape. The thickness and "stickiness" is somewhere in
> between - the tape sticks to itself enough that the wrap holds,
> but it can be readily unwrapped. It's roughly 1" wide. I
> estimate the thickness at somewhere between 5 and 10 mils.
>
> What is this, and where can I purchase some?
>
> Thanks,
> Jon McLin
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
> ==========
>
>
>
>
ist" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
ttp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 10
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| Subject: | Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape? |
Another thing about the use of tape is it will hold heat in a bundle so if
it is used not only may it dry out and fall off but it will also change the
wire spec for current carried on any particular wire in a bundle.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mike
Nellis
Sent: January 15, 2012 5:34 PM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape?
I use the wax cord as well. There is something nostalgic and relaxing
about lacing up a section of wiring. I use tie wraps, loosely
positioned to hold them in position until the loom is ready.
Mike
> i don't talk to many pilots that use the wax cord but i do and it is
> worth a look. as i understand it is still used in military planes. it
> has a tensile strength of 80 lbs compared to a wire tie at 18 lbs. a
> spool will last a lifetime and several wraps will secure about
> anything. its cross section is about the same as flat rib lacing.
> bob noffs
Message 11
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| Subject: | Wire Bundle Wrapping Tape? |
At 09:39 PM 1/15/2012, you wrote:
>My preference is the wax cord but as with a lot of things it does
>take some practice to get to install it properly. It has other
>pluses over the nylon tie wraps You will never slice a hand open
>while rooting around in an engine bay that has coraseal and wax cord
>used. I am one of the ones who has received my fair share of slices
>on tie wraps.
>
Here's a link to a tread on the topic a few years
ago:
http://tinyurl.com/7a89njo
The "waxed cord" commonly found in military and domestic
production aircraft is probably Mil-T-43435 as described
below in the Aircraft Spruce Catalog
Emacs!
. . . and the Braden
Emacs!
Bob . . .
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Inexpensive Runway lighting |
At 11:42 AM 1/13/2012, you wrote:
>
>But reflective-only lights are zero help when you're trying to just
>FIND the airport at night! That is no fun at all.
There's where your GPS comes in. While I was
still flying a lot off of 1K1, I crafted a GPS
aided approach that always put me 1/2 mile off
the approach end of the runway on an aligned
heading. Had the runway lights been out or non-
existent, reflectors would have sufficed to
complete the approach and landing.
Bob . . .
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: HID light noise |
At 11:51 AM 1/13/2012, you wrote:
>Where do we start?
Are we all talking about the same kit? Where do I put
my hands on one of them? I just ordered a plug-n-play
HID conversion for my minivan off of Ebay.
http://tinyurl.com/6q7pueo
I'll evaluate this kit for noise before I put it on
the car.
Bob . . .
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Electrical Gremlins |
>
>2.) I installed an AEC 9005 LVW module per instructions but the LVW
>lamp flashes (blinking LED) when I power the system from my bench
>13.6v power supply.
>
>3.) Same as 2 above for my B&C LR3 regulator. I did all of their
>troubleshooting diagnostics and everything was to spec.
Do the lights go out when the alternator comes on line?
Why two separate LV warning systems?
Bob . . .
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Inexpensive Runway lighting |
At 01:38 PM 1/13/2012, you wrote:
>
>And if GPS is out or a 4G cell tower is nearby???
Not sure what 4G has to do with it . . . are these
known GPS antagonists? I've never experienced a GPS
outage but it's been a few years. If your needing
really robust lighting on the subject field, perhaps
reflectors are not for you. I'm my experience here in
flyover country, they would have sufficed for every
night-time arrival I've ever made to my home field.
One could craft some LED, solar powered REIL fixtures
too. This would get you oriented with the most rudimentary
of navigation devices. It doesn't take much light to be
seen from 5 miles away. Hence, not much energy needs to
be stored to keep a few LEDs flashing.
Bob . . .
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Inexpensive Runway lighting |
I think he's talking about the pending LightSquared issues -- they purchased bandwidth
that was reserved for satellite communication some time ago, but the plans
for using that spectrum was scrapped as impractical (by LightSquared), so
then they began pursuing using the band as land-based 4G network spectrum.
That's all well and good, except that the band is adjacent to the GPS band, and
its power due to proximity tends to overwhelm the input circuitry of GPS receivers,
because they were never designed to be selective enough to filter out such
a thing.
My personal feeling is that this will never actually see the light of day, regardless
of all the lobbying LS can muster.
As a suggestion to your failure analysis, I think it would be a bad idea to rely
on home-grown runway lighting in a critical way -- which means diverting to
a lighted muni airport would always need to be an option anyway.
Thoughts?
On Jan 16, 2012, at 12:21 AM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote:
>
> At 01:38 PM 1/13/2012, you wrote:
>>
>> And if GPS is out or a 4G cell tower is nearby???
>
> Not sure what 4G has to do with it . . . are these
> known GPS antagonists? I've never experienced a GPS
> outage but it's been a few years. If your needing
> really robust lighting on the subject field, perhaps
> reflectors are not for you. I'm my experience here in
> flyover country, they would have sufficed for every
> night-time arrival I've ever made to my home field.
>
> One could craft some LED, solar powered REIL fixtures
> too. This would get you oriented with the most rudimentary
> of navigation devices. It doesn't take much light to be
> seen from 5 miles away. Hence, not much energy needs to
> be stored to keep a few LEDs flashing.
>
>
> Bob . . .
>
>
>
>
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Inexpensive Runway lighting |
Well, I guess the 4G thing depends on who gets elected next November....
:) JUST KIDDING!!! All I know about 4G is what I've read in the
usual aviation mags. I won't try to predict what government regulators
will do.
As far as the runway lights, I guess it depends on how much you trust
your runway lights. If you're willing to trust your work on your OBAM
aircraft, I wouldn't think there would be a problem trusting your OBAM
runway lights.
do not archive
Raymond Julian
Kettle River, MN
"And you know that I could have me a million more friends,
and all I'd have to lose is my point of view." - John Prine
On 01/16/2012 12:49 AM, Daniel Hooper wrote:
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Daniel Hooper<enginerdy@gmail.com>
>
> I think he's talking about the pending LightSquared issues -- they purchased
bandwidth that was reserved for satellite communication some time ago, but the
plans for using that spectrum was scrapped as impractical (by LightSquared),
so then they began pursuing using the band as land-based 4G network spectrum.
> That's all well and good, except that the band is adjacent to the GPS band, and
its power due to proximity tends to overwhelm the input circuitry of GPS receivers,
because they were never designed to be selective enough to filter out
such a thing.
>
> My personal feeling is that this will never actually see the light of day, regardless
of all the lobbying LS can muster.
>
> As a suggestion to your failure analysis, I think it would be a bad idea to rely
on home-grown runway lighting in a critical way -- which means diverting to
a lighted muni airport would always need to be an option anyway.
>
> Thoughts?
>
>
> On Jan 16, 2012, at 12:21 AM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote:
>
>> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III"<nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
>>
>> At 01:38 PM 1/13/2012, you wrote:
>>> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: DavidM<ainut@knology.net>
>>>
>>> And if GPS is out or a 4G cell tower is nearby???
>>
>> Not sure what 4G has to do with it . . . are these
>> known GPS antagonists? I've never experienced a GPS
>> outage but it's been a few years. If your needing
>> really robust lighting on the subject field, perhaps
>> reflectors are not for you. I'm my experience here in
>> flyover country, they would have sufficed for every
>> night-time arrival I've ever made to my home field.
>>
>> One could craft some LED, solar powered REIL fixtures
>> too. This would get you oriented with the most rudimentary
>> of navigation devices. It doesn't take much light to be
>> seen from 5 miles away. Hence, not much energy needs to
>> be stored to keep a few LEDs flashing.
>>
>>
>> Bob . . .
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
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