AeroElectric-List Digest Archive

Tue 02/07/12


Total Messages Posted: 11



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 04:11 AM - Re: alternator wiring (Kenneth Johnson)
     2. 06:32 AM - Re: alternator wiring (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
     3. 06:49 AM - XM weather receiver? (Dawson-Townsend,Timothy)
     4. 07:50 AM - APRS / ATRS (Paul Millner)
     5. 07:59 AM - Re: Com and Nav Radio and Antenna Questions (Richard Girard)
     6. 08:58 AM - Re: Cross talk problem (jonlaury)
     7. 09:15 AM - Re: Com and Nav Radio and Antenna Questions (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
     8. 06:37 PM - DraftSight CAD WARNING (Richard Girard)
     9. 08:49 PM - Re: APRS / ATRS (Don)
    10. 09:35 PM - Re: APRS / ATRS (Daniel Hooper)
    11. 09:41 PM - Re: Re: Cross talk problem (Daniel Hooper)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 04:11:04 AM PST US
    From: Kenneth Johnson <kjohnsondds@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: alternator wiring
    Bob,=0AThe EXP-Bus does provide some OV protection.- In reading informati on about its use, recommendations suggested not to go above 40 amps.- I h ave planned to install a 40 amp fusable link before the bus.- I also am i nstalling both an amp meter and volt meter to monitor electrical flow.- I know there are several alternatives.- What would you recommend?- Ken J ohnson=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0A From: "Robert L. Nuck olls, III" <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>=0ATo: aeroelectric-list@matronic s.com =0ASent: Sunday, February 5, 2012 1:45 PM=0ASubject: Re: AeroElectric bert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>=0A=0AAt 12:23 PM 2/5 /2012, you wrote:=0A> Bob, thanks again for your help. I have an EXP-Bus th at I am using and in which I can connect- for OV protection.- Does the 10 o'clock connection go to this bus?=0A=0A- - The data was not helpful about the upper-left terminal . . .=0A- - given that it's an internall y regulated alternator, I=0A- - haven't even got a good guess as to wha t that terminal=0A- - is for.=0A=0A- - At 70A, it's certainly a rob ust alternator. But without=0A- - adding a b-lead disconnect contactor, this style=0A- - of alternator many not be controllable from outside =0A- - during a runaway OV event. Suggest you consider modifying=0A- - it for use with an external regulator, ov protection system=0A- - f ===========


    Message 2


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    Time: 06:32:28 AM PST US
    From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
    Subject: Re: alternator wiring
    At 06:06 AM 2/7/2012, you wrote: >Bob, >The EXP-Bus does provide some OV protection. But is it compatible with internally regulated alternators? > In reading information about its use, recommendations suggested > not to go above 40 amps. I have planned to install a 40 amp > fusable link before the bus. Not necessary and probably wouldn't perform as desired. The EXP bus was crafted for much simpler/ smaller systems. It brings FAT WIRE distribution onto etched circuit board traces which are vulnerable to failure under continuous loads. Adding a fusible is not necessary . . . you just need to limit the number of electro-whizzies to 40A or less when everything is turned on. > I also am installing both an amp meter and volt meter to monitor > electrical flow. I know there are several alternatives. What > would you recommend? My personal choice would be to modify the alternator for use with an external regulator. Check the AeroElectric List archives for discussions on internal failure modes that cannot be controlled from outside the alternator except by gross disconnection of the B-lead . . . which is difficult at best. An alternator that size will quickly push lots of energy into your ship's electrical system. Legacy design goals call for millisecond-fast response to such an event. These design goals are satisfied by the use of external regulation and ov protection like that depicted in the 'Connection's z-figures -OR- modifications like those crafted by Plane-Power. Bob . . .


    Message 3


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    Time: 06:49:16 AM PST US
    From: "Dawson-Townsend,Timothy" <tdawson-townsend@aurora.aero>
    Subject: XM weather receiver?
    Just throwing this out there . . . I have a portable XM weather data receiver, the older "roundish" style that has a USB output on it. I'd like to figure out two things: 1) Does someone know the meaning of the status LED? It's either red/green f lashing or green steady. 2) Does anyone happen to know the pin-out for the J13 8-pin connector on th e circuit board inside? I know that it is an RS-232 output that one can tap into, but my old information I have is conflicting . . . Thanks, Tim N52KS RV-10


    Message 4


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    Time: 07:50:20 AM PST US
    From: Paul Millner <millner@me.com>
    Subject: APRS / ATRS
    >> RV's with ATRS installed use the JPOLE Are folks using ATRS (APRS?) for sending text messages also? Is there a WiFi interface to smart phones, or what's the input device of choice? Paul


    Message 5


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    Time: 07:59:33 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Com and Nav Radio and Antenna Questions
    From: Richard Girard <aslsa.rng@gmail.com>
    Bob, I have a question. How much performance degradation, TLAR estimate, is there from placing a com antenna in a horizontal or near horizontal position? Are not com radio signals vertically polarized? Doesn't mounting them horizontally increase there directional selectivity, for lack of knowing the proper term? Rick Girard On Mon, Feb 6, 2012 at 8:20 PM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III < nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com> wrote: > nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com**> > > At 07:20 PM 2/5/2012, you wrote: > > This will not break the bank, will purchase one. It does not mention the > ability to excite the feedline and antenna for setting up vor so U will > need help in doing that. > > This is a self contained antenna analyzer. It features > a variable frequency oscillator that provides a test > signal source over a 2 to 170 Mhz range. There is a > counter that displays the oscillator's present frequency. > Finally, there is an array of detectors upon which a > ratiometric analysis is conducted to deduce the resistive > and reactive components of the antenna and display them. > > Instruction manual can be found here: > > http://www.mfjenterprises.com/**pdffiles/MFJ-259B.pdf<http://www.mfjenterprises.com/pdffiles/MFJ-259B.pdf> > > While not a laboratory grade instrument, it's > a lot of bang for the buck. > > The wingtip antenna you talk about in the connection is a slightly > modified Archer. Archer mounts them to the fiberglass wing tip and > sandwiches it between the glass and the wing root for the ground. I am > looking for the instructions that came with the unit and will send them to > you as soon as I find them. > > Yeah, Bob was a little incensed when the folks > at Van's published dimensional details on his > first RV wingtip offerings (and I repeated them > in the 'Connection). Bottom line is that the antenna > is simply a gamma-matched monopole of which there > are many variations on a theme. The now arcane > 'sled runner' marker beacon antennas on the belly > are a good example. > > Once you have an MFJ259 in hand, you can both > trim overall length of the Archer design to > desired center frequency, you could also adjust > the gamma-match and tuning capacitor for optimum > performance too. > > While this might be an intellectually satisfying > exercise (Hams can get downright pedantic in > their quest for the Holy-SWR), it would be hard > to observe much difference in performance between > an Archer cookie-cutter installation and one that > has be tuned to technical Nirvana. > > I would like to be able to get one of these. To work in each wing tip for > my two vors. I have an APRS (2meter Jpole in one wingtip that may make it > impossible to get the Archer to work. > > Why a j-pole? That's an awfully big antenna for > a line-of sight application. Why not the simple > vertical whisker? > > I will ask the additional questions after I send you the Archer > instructions. > > > Got the data package. What's your question? > > > Bob . . . > > -- Zulu Delta Mk IIIC Thanks, Homer GBYM It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy. - Groucho Marx


    Message 6


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    Time: 08:58:05 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Cross talk problem
    From: "jonlaury" <jonlaury@impulse.net>
    Daniel, Thanks for that. I'll give it a try. > Another reasonable place to try is on the speaker line, where it meets the lighting power. Do you mean where the two sets of wires come together from their respective sources of Audio Panel and the power/ground bus's, or from the appliance ends at the speaker and light? Does it matter? The appliance ends are right next to each other in a small overhead console and their wire runs are parallel for about 17', the first 5' of speaker wire being unshielded/untwisted. Best, John Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=365807#365807


    Message 7


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    Time: 09:15:50 AM PST US
    From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
    Subject: Re: Com and Nav Radio and Antenna Questions
    At 09:56 AM 2/7/2012, you wrote: >Bob, I have a question. How much performance degradation, TLAR >estimate, is there from placing a com antenna in a horizontal or >near horizontal position? Are not com radio signals vertically >polarized? Doesn't mounting them horizontally increase there >directional selectivity, for lack of knowing the proper term? The ONLY time that an antenna delivers on it's theoretical performance (radiation efficiency and patters) is on the antenna test range under controlled conditions. Many antennas can approach theoretical performance in service when situated in free space and "ground" configurations that are large compared to the frequency of interest. In other words, antennas for GPS and transponders at 1000+ MHz do pretty well. As you go down in frequency, it becomes increasingly difficult to configure an antenna installation that even approaches theoretical performance. On small structures like airplanes with lots of 'sticky-outs' (wings, stabilizers, landing gear, whirring props, other antennas, etc) both radiation pattern and polarity are distorted. Out in the vacuum of space, the theoretical loss for a vertical antenna talking to a horizontal antenna is huge . . . in practice here on the ground antenna range, it's on the order of 10-20 dB. But these will be "centered up" measurements where the two antennas are looking right at each other. However, as soon as you bolt the antenna to an airplane, one's ability to predict performance variables goes down. Someone who has measured the effects of vertical vs. horizontal polarization on airplanes like yours might offer some advice based on experience, but I've never met an RF guru who would attempt to put a quantitative answer to your question without going out to measure it - a difficult task at best. RF squirted from (or at) your airplane's compromised antenna is subject to MANY unpredictable variables. Once you've relocated your antenna, YOU are going to become the AeroElectric-List guru for having carried out the experiment. Put the second antenna on along with a switch that will let you switch quickly between the 'compromised' and 'optimized' antennas. Do some listening tests with weak stations as you fly a 360 pattern listening for 'hot' and 'dead' spots while making not of the relative signal strength of 'compromised' vs. 'optimized' antennas. We conducted similar tests on our production aircraft using a ground station at the field for a signal source. Automated acquisition systems would gather data on received signal strengths as the airplane maneuvers. But attempting to predict relative antenna performance without conducting real tests is sorta like hypothesizing about "The theory of everything". Here's some further reading on the topic. http://www.astronwireless.com/topic-archives-selecting-antennas.asp http://www.astronwireless.com/topic-archives-antennas-polarization.asp http://home.comcast.net/~n9rla/Antenna_Polarization.PDF Bob . . .


    Message 8


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    Time: 06:37:19 PM PST US
    Subject: DraftSight CAD WARNING
    From: Richard Girard <aslsa.rng@gmail.com>
    I made the mistake of downloading the latest release R1.4 today. It crashes randomly. I've tried deleting all previous versions, cleaning the registry before downloading it, nothing seems to work. I've also found that the circle function will not work if you specify a radius, it only works when you specify diameter. That doesn't seem to be related to the crashing. Anyway, if you're a DraftSight user be very wary of making an upgrade to this release. Rick Girard PS I should add that I have run the previous releases for almost two years and NEVER had a crash before. -- Zulu Delta Mk IIIC Thanks, Homer GBYM It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy. - Groucho Marx


    Message 9


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    Time: 08:49:06 PM PST US
    From: "Don" <dsvs@ca.rr.com>
    Subject: APRS / ATRS
    APRS is only available to ham operators and uses a two meter packet radio. No text. No wifi. -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Paul Millner Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2012 7:46 AM Subject: AeroElectric-List: APRS / ATRS >> RV's with ATRS installed use the JPOLE Are folks using ATRS (APRS?) for sending text messages also? Is there a WiFi interface to smart phones, or what's the input device of choice? Paul


    Message 10


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    Time: 09:35:30 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: APRS / ATRS
    From: Daniel Hooper <enginerdy@gmail.com>
    I think I read about someone experimenting with a MicroTrak4 in their airplane... http://www.byonics.com/mt-tt4 Unlike the other MicroTracks, it has a receiver on it as well, so it is capable of receiving text. I'm not sure about a wifi interface, but a bluetooth-serial interface for handling APRS messages would be a pretty simple (relatively speaking) hack for android devices. That'd be pretty slick! On Feb 7, 2012, at 9:46 AM, Paul Millner wrote: > > >> RV's with ATRS installed use the JPOLE > > Are folks using ATRS (APRS?) for sending text messages also? Is there a WiFi interface to smart phones, or what's the input device of choice? > > Paul > > > > >


    Message 11


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    Time: 09:41:05 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Cross talk problem
    From: Daniel Hooper <enginerdy@gmail.com>
    I meant where the speaker line joins the light power wiring at the panel. If it's RF, it's leaking in from somewhere, and you need to separate that source from the problem area. Another possibility is clamping the ferrite mid-way down the line, on both lines separately, or just clamping the entire bundle with one larger ferrite. You are trying to isolate the noise source from the rest of the system (particularly the touch-light). If you have wires bundled together, or running near each other, RF can jump across cables. Ferrites kill the RF, but if, for example, you put just one ferrite on the power, midway down the 17' run, the RF energy will have no problem jumping from one cable to the other freely, bypassing the ferrite filter. Have you tried the experiment with the comm radio off? The RF theory sounds good, but it's best to rule easy things out if you can, even if it sounds unlikely. On Feb 7, 2012, at 10:54 AM, jonlaury wrote: > > Daniel, > Thanks for that. I'll give it a try. > > >> Another reasonable place to try is on the speaker line, where it meets the lighting power. > > > Do you mean where the two sets of wires come together from their respective sources of Audio Panel and the power/ground bus's, or from the appliance ends at the speaker and light? Does it matter? The appliance ends are right next to each other in a small overhead console and their wire runs are parallel for about 17', the first 5' of speaker wire being unshielded/untwisted. > > Best, > John > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=365807#365807 > > > > > > > > > >




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