---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 04/23/12: 28 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 01:51 AM - Re: Starter contactor location (Stuart Hutchison) 2. 02:03 AM - Re: Starter contactor location (Bob Verwey) 3. 02:39 AM - Re: Starter contactor location (Stuart Hutchison) 4. 02:39 AM - Re: Starter contactor location (maca2790) 5. 02:46 AM - Re: Starter contactor location (user9253) 6. 04:00 AM - wig wag again (bob noffs) 7. 07:02 AM - Push to Test (Eric M. Jones) 8. 07:07 AM - Re: Re: OS Wig-Wag Project (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 9. 07:09 AM - Re: Removing contacts from a King radio connector (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 10. 07:52 AM - Re: wig wag again (gregmchugh) 11. 10:05 AM - Re: Removing contacts from a King radio connector (Jared Yates) 12. 10:21 AM - Re: Removing contacts from a King radio connector () 13. 02:09 PM - Re: Push to Test (Vern Little) 14. 02:15 PM - Re: Starter contactor location (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 15. 02:36 PM - Re: Removing contacts from a King radio connector (Peter Pengilly) 16. 03:22 PM - Re: Re: Antenna mounting-doubler (dougshep@netzero.com) 17. 04:06 PM - Open Source software license options (gregmchugh) 18. 04:36 PM - Re: Open Source software license options (Dennis Golden) 19. 05:14 PM - Re: Open Source software license options (Ralph Finch) 20. 05:49 PM - Re: Removing contacts from a King radio connector (David Lloyd) 21. 05:54 PM - Re: Open Source software license options (Dwight Frye) 22. 06:09 PM - Re: Removing contacts from a King radio connector (Charlie England) 23. 06:20 PM - Re: Open Source software license options (Dennis Golden) 24. 06:49 PM - Re: Open Source software license options (Dwight Frye) 25. 07:13 PM - Re: Open Source software license options (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 26. 07:19 PM - Re: Re: Antenna mounting-doubler (Rick Lark) 27. 10:10 PM - Re: Re: Antenna mounting-doubler (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 28. 10:34 PM - Anyone interested in a 9lb battery/jumpstart kit? (rparigoris) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 01:51:25 AM PST US From: "Stuart Hutchison" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Starter contactor location G'day Mickey, The aim is to pick off master power from the "big lead" as it enters the starter solenoid up front. Seems to be more cumbersome to run a big lead forward to carry start currents (energised or not) and another lead forward to carry main bus power. Kind regards, Stu F1 Rocket VH-FLY http://www.mykitlog.com/RockFLY www.teamrocketaircraft.com _____ From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mickey Coggins Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 3:29 PM Subject: AeroElectric-List: Starter contactor location I have a rear-mounted battery on my RV8 and I'm trying to figure out why I wouldn't want to install the starter solenoid in the back near the battery instead of on the firewall - anyone see an issue with putting it back there? Advantages I see: 1) the long run of the fat cable will not be energized when not starting the engine 2) less stuff on the firewall 3) a bit more weight in the back Thanks for any tips. -- Mickey Coggins ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 02:03:28 AM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Starter contactor location From: Bob Verwey I have had the same thought as Mickey.....from a safety point of view, I think this is a huge plus. Twisted metal and big conductors equals sparks..... Best.. Bob Verwey Safari ZU-AJF in rebuild On 23 April 2012 10:51, Stuart Hutchison wrote: > ** > G'day Mickey, > > The aim is to pick off master power from the "big lead" as it enters the > starter solenoid up front. Seems to be more cumbersome to run a big lead > forward to carry start currents (energised or not) and another lead forward > to carry main bus power. > > > Kind regards, Stu****** > > ** ** > > F1 Rocket VH-FLY http://www.mykitlog.com/RockFLY > www.teamrocketaircraft.com**** > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto: > owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Mickey > Coggins > *Sent:* Monday, April 23, 2012 3:29 PM > *To:* aeroelectric-list@matronics.com > *Subject:* AeroElectric-List: Starter contactor location > > I have a rear-mounted battery on my RV8 and I'm trying to figure out > why I wouldn't want to install the starter solenoid in the back near the > battery instead of on the firewall - anyone see an issue with putting it > back there? > > Advantages I see: > > 1) the long run of the fat cable will not be energized when not starting > the engine > 2) less stuff on the firewall > 3) a bit more weight in the back > > Thanks for any tips. > > -- > Mickey Coggins > > * > > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List > href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c* > > * > > * > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 02:39:27 AM PST US From: "Stuart Hutchison" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Starter contactor location Sure, but even medium wires + twisted metal = enough sparks to ignite fires ... hence the reason for turning the master off (once the flaps are out/comms complete) before any crash landing :) Some builders also slot the forward wing tank attach point to help avoid the tank being ripped open in a crash ... any fire is bad of course, but I would be more concerned about igniting fuel fumes than a slower starting fire electrical fire ... and practically any gauge power wire can spark off fuel fumes. Kind regards, Stu _____ From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Verwey Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 7:03 PM Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Starter contactor location I have had the same thought as Mickey.....from a safety point of view, I think this is a huge plus. Twisted metal and big conductors equals sparks..... Best.. Bob Verwey Safari ZU-AJF in rebuild On 23 April 2012 10:51, Stuart Hutchison wrote: G'day Mickey, The aim is to pick off master power from the "big lead" as it enters the starter solenoid up front. Seems to be more cumbersome to run a big lead forward to carry start currents (energised or not) and another lead forward to carry main bus power. Kind regards, Stu F1 Rocket VH-FLY http://www.mykitlog.com/RockFLY www.teamrocketaircraft.com _____ From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mickey Coggins Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 3:29 PM Subject: AeroElectric-List: Starter contactor location I have a rear-mounted battery on my RV8 and I'm trying to figure out why I wouldn't want to install the starter solenoid in the back near the battery instead of on the firewall - anyone see an issue with putting it back there? Advantages I see: 1) the long run of the fat cable will not be energized when not starting the engine 2) less stuff on the firewall 3) a bit more weight in the back Thanks for any tips. -- Mickey Coggins href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List">http://www.matro nics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c ist" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List tp://forums.matronics.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 02:39:59 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Starter contactor location From: "maca2790" Electrically Speaking (Impedance) there is no difference between the Solenoid being at the front or the rear. Mechanically you will need to run another Heavy cable (8ga) to the front if you have the Solenoid at the Battery. So in the end you will save weight and dollars by running the 2 ga cable to the firewall and then an 8 ga cable to the distribution bus. cheers John MacCallum RV10 VH-DUU #41016 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371566#371566 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 02:46:10 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Starter contactor location From: "user9253" Mickey, A rear mounted starter contactor will work just fine. The disadvantage is that a longer wire will be required to connect the battery to the main bus at the panel. Weight can be saved by wiring the plane the conventional way using shorter wires for the main bus and starter contactor control. If installed properly, the big fat cable is unlikely to short to ground. Just remember to shut off the master switch if a forced landing is imminent. Joe -------- Joe Gores Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371569#371569 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 04:00:13 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: wig wag again From: bob noffs hi all, as i had just recently put wig wags on my plane i didn't pay much attention to all the posts about the led system. i am just now finding out how poor my lights are. is there a site that sums up what was said and offers schematic and parts list to build the led system? bob noffs ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 07:02:58 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Push to Test From: "Eric M. Jones" > Can someone point me in the direction of a '2 pole push switch' or a 'standard' 2 pole switch ie: OFF-ON(mom) - this is to enable me to have a single push to test switch, for both push to earth circuits, and push to > live circuits in one switch John Just a note: Using LEDs for indicators pretty much obviates the need for "push-to-test" switches that test only the lamp function. LEDs should last longer than the switch, the socket, the wiring or the airplane. So eliminate this function unless you are actually testing the entire function (which is usually quite impractical). -------- Eric M. Jones www.PerihelionDesign.com 113 Brentwood Drive Southbridge, MA 01550 (508) 764-2072 emjones(at)charter.net Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371596#371596 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 07:07:24 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: OS Wig-Wag Project At 09:33 AM 4/22/2012, you wrote: > >Bob, > >Took a look at the P2 version and it looks good. Only noticed an issue >on page 3 with the d-sub pins. Pin 11 is listed twice (one should be >Pin 10) and Pin 2 is missing (2nd line to the power bus). > >I will use the P2 to continue with the software for the wig-wag. I should >have something available later this week to use for testing with the >hardware. Very good. I'll order boards today when I get back to the office. Been toting barges and lifting bales this weekend (moving furniture). Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 07:09:47 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Removing contacts from a King radio connector At 05:35 PM 4/21/2012, you wrote: > >Peter > >The working blade is 10mm long, 1.5mm wide and 0.65mm thick on a "handle" >5mm wide and 67mm long, same thickness > >Best Regards > >Peter I've made similar tools from a pocket screwdriver using a grinder. Adjust dimensions to your specifics. See: http://aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Tools/Extraction_Tools/extraction_tool.jpg Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 07:52:34 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: wig wag again From: "gregmchugh" There seem to be many options for the LED landing/taxi lights. I did not do an exhaustive analysis but based on a quick survey, at the moment, my plan is to use two of the Teledyne Alphabeam lights at the wing tips of my Xenos motor glider. http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/teledynelandinglight.php While I may at some point fly at night, my main goal was to get wig-wag lights for improved recognition. The Teledyne's seemed to be a little more rugged than most, they have a wide beam that would allow them to have good visibility from off center, and the price did not seem out of line compared to similar lights. They also fit into in a standard landing light mount (e.g, Duckworks). You can definitely find lots of options that are less expensive but they appeared to me to be less rugged and have a less powerful beam. Of course many use less power which could be a consideration for many applications. I am about a year away from when I need to purchase them so things could change based on what becomes available... Greg McHugh Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371606#371606 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 10:05:37 AM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Removing contacts from a King radio connector From: Jared Yates Street sweeper bristles are also good tool blanks. They are made from a soft steel that is easy to grind, and in most municipalities they are available for free. On Apr 23, 2012, at 10:08, "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" wrote: > > At 05:35 PM 4/21/2012, you wrote: >> >> Peter >> >> The working blade is 10mm long, 1.5mm wide and 0.65mm thick on a "handle" >> 5mm wide and 67mm long, same thickness >> >> Best Regards >> >> Peter > > I've made similar tools from a pocket screwdriver > using a grinder. Adjust dimensions to your specifics. > > See: > > http://aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Tools/Extraction_Tools/extraction_tool.jpg > > > Bob . . . > > > > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 10:21:53 AM PST US From: Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Removing contacts from a King radio connector Here's a really simple, cheap and amazingly effective, homemade Molex KK pin extractor: http://www.berkut13.com/extractor.htm Enjoy. -James Berkut/Race 13 www.berkut13.com -----Original Message----- From: Jared Yates Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 12:01 PM Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Removing contacts from a King radio connector Street sweeper bristles are also good tool blanks. They are made from a soft steel that is easy to grind, and in most municipalities they are available for free. On Apr 23, 2012, at 10:08, "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" wrote: > > At 05:35 PM 4/21/2012, you wrote: >> >> Peter >> >> The working blade is 10mm long, 1.5mm wide and 0.65mm thick on a "handle" >> 5mm wide and 67mm long, same thickness >> >> Best Regards >> >> Peter > > I've made similar tools from a pocket screwdriver > using a grinder. Adjust dimensions to your specifics. > > See: > > http://aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Tools/Extraction_Tools/extraction_tool.j pg > > > Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 02:09:20 PM PST US From: "Vern Little" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Push to Test Interesting that a thread over on Van's airforce involves removing the LEDs from unreliable annunciators and replacing them with after market LEDs. LEDs can fail if mis-applied or if they are part of some of the cheap junk lamps sold online. Eric has tweaked some opinions that I have, that I can distill into "a fools guide to idiot lights": Rule 1) Any system that measures must be more reliable than the system it is measuring. Rule 2) If rule 1 is violated, it will guarantee that an actual failure in the underlying system will be ignored. For example, I had a VDO fuel pressure sender fail on my RV-9A after 400 hours. After in flight diagnosis, I determined that both the mechanical and electrical boost pumps were functioning properly, so I replaced the sender. Replacing the sender fixed the problem. The next time I have a fuel pressure alarm I will suspect the sender has failed again... which may not be a correct assumption. I'm sure someone else has a more clever way of saying this than me. As for Eric's comments, they are spot-on... -----Original Message----- From: Eric M. Jones Just a note: Using LEDs for indicators pretty much obviates the need for "push-to-test" switches that test only the lamp function. LEDs should last longer than the switch, the socket, the wiring or the airplane. So eliminate this function unless you are actually testing the entire function (which is usually quite impractical). -------- Eric M. Jones www.PerihelionDesign.com 113 Brentwood Drive Southbridge, MA 01550 (508) 764-2072 emjones(at)charter.net Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371596#371596 ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 02:15:33 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Starter contactor location At 12:29 AM 4/23/2012, you wrote: >I have a rear-mounted battery on my RV8 and I'm trying to figure out >why I wouldn't want to install the starter solenoid in the back near >the battery instead of on the firewall - anyone see an issue with >putting it back there? > >Advantages I see: > >1) the long run of the fat cable will not be energized when not >starting the engine and it's also not available for taking alternator output to the battery . . . or bringing current forward for running your electro-whizzies. >2) less stuff on the fire wall The forward side of a fire wall is sort of the preferred place to be a distribution depot for things electrical and fluid. It's a flat surface of significant area for organizing such tasks and compared to all other spaces, much easier to get at (cowl removal) than say stuffed in between the panel and fire wall. >3) a bit more weight in the back If you have a w/b problem better to put in a larger battery (useful weight in terms of watt-seconds per pound of energy stored) or move the battery aft. Legacy design goals for distribution of power from the most dangerous source of energy on the airplane calls for (1) crew controlled disconnect of all major feeders AT the battery via either battery contactor, keeping always-hot feeders small and protected by fast devices (7A or less fuses) or 'mini-contactor' for isolating less than minor feeders like the alternate feed to the e-bus. http://tinyurl.com/756ydec By taking your fat wire from battery contactor to a starter contactor on the fire wall, this single fat-wire starts the engine, supplies power from battery to electro-whizzies, charges the battery, and terminates at a handy distribution point right up front where things are happening. It was once said that "all roads lead to Rome." In little airplanes all wires lead to the battery side of the starter contactor. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 02:36:28 PM PST US From: Peter Pengilly Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Removing contacts from a King radio connector Many thanks to all who replied, I modified an small screwdriver on the belt sander which works admirably. Peter On 23/04/2012 18:16, berkut13@berkut13.com wrote: > Here's a really simple, cheap and amazingly effective, homemade Molex > KK pin extractor: > http://www.berkut13.com/extractor.htm > Enjoy. > -James > Berkut/Race 13 > www.berkut13.com > -----Original Message----- > From: Jared Yates > Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 12:01 PM > To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Removing contacts from a King radio > connector > > Street sweeper bristles are also good tool blanks. They are made from > a soft steel that is easy to grind, and in most municipalities they > are available for free. > On Apr 23, 2012, at 10:08, "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" > wrote: > > > > > At 05:35 PM 4/21/2012, you wrote: > > >> > >> Peter > >> > >> The working blade is 10mm long, 1.5mm wide and 0.65mm thick on a > "handle" > >> 5mm wide and 67mm long, same thickness > >> > >> Best Regards > >> > >> Peter > > > > I've made similar tools from a pocket screwdriver > > using a grinder. Adjust dimensions to your specifics. > > > > See: > > > > > http://aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Tools/Extraction_Tools/extraction_tool.jpg > > > > > > Bob . . . > * > > > * ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 03:22:28 PM PST US From: "dougshep@netzero.com" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Antenna mounting-doubler I had the same question last year when I was using Alodine coated ALCAD for a bus bar. I talked with the manufacturing tech. staff and got the following reply...I also included another comment. I noticed when using it, not to let your part submerge too long in the Alodine bath, else excess Alodine can coat your aluminum surface: AL 1201 From: Kristina.Tkacz@us.henkel.com To:dougshep@netzero.com Sent: Fri, Jun 10, 2011 11:14 AM Doug, Per our discussion yesterday about the Alodine 1201, we unfortunately do not have any documentation or data regarding the resistivity capabilities. This product is approved on the QPL-81706 (see: http://www.chemical-supermarket.com/files/Henkel%20Alodine%20Conversion%20Coatings/Mil-DTL-81706B.pdf) for Class 1A. However, we do believe that because of its similarities in chemistries to the Alodine 1200S it should pass the electrical resistance testing. Again, we do not have any data to confirm this. As for the thickness of the coating, an average application would be around 100 nm. Please let me know if you have any further questions. Kind Regards / mit freundlichen Gr��en, Kristina Tkacz Kristina Tkacz Technical Service Representative Surface Treatment Application Specialist Aerospace, Global Henkel Corporation ( Office: +248.577.2115 � Mobile: +248.376.9294 * Email:Kristina.Tkacz@henkel.com www.henkel.com - - - - - - - - - - - - - - (another question/answer from someone else) Electrical properties of Alodine 1200 (from; http://www.finishing.com/364/48.shtml ) I would like to know the electrical properties of ALODINE 1200. We are using it as protection on our metallic housing of Door Control Unit. Is it necessary to protect the ground stud from ALODINE 1200 ? Emmanuel SEREZAT transport - FRANCE Alodine 1200 is one of chromate chemical conversion coating that meets requirements of MIL-C-5541 (you can find a lot of other processes). Mil-C-5541 [link is to spec at TechStreet] Class 3 requires maximum 5000 Ohm per sq. inch electrical resistance. Actually, electrical resistance for properly performed Class 3 is usually 1000-2000 Ohm per sq. inch. MIL-C-5541 Class 1A does not require electrical conductivity. Most chemical conversion coatings from QPL (including Alodine 1200) can be performed as both Class 1A and Class 3. Therefore you should check which class is processed on your parts. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Alodine 1200, 1201, & 1200S: (from: http://www.chemical-supermarket.com/home.php?cat=109) Alodine 1200 is Henkels product family for hexavalent chromium conversion. Contained in this family are two primary products; Alodine 1201 and Alodine 1200S. Alodine 1201 is a ready-to-use liquid product which, when brushed-on or diluted and immersion-applied, produces a gold-colored Chromate Conversion Coating which contains hexavalent chromium. Consistent with Class 1A of the mil spec, it is formulated to provide maximum corrosion prevention when left unpainted as well as to improve adhesion of paint finish systems on aluminum and aluminum alloys. Alodine 1200S is the powdered composition dissolved by professional industrial facilities into their immersion baths. Doug Shepard, RV-9A construction ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 04:06:27 PM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Open Source software license options From: "gregmchugh" Anyone have a suggestion on which of the various open source license options would be appropriate for the Wig-Wag project and the possible follow-on modules. I need to put something in the header file for the software that I will be sending out for testing on the hardware and I could use some guidance on what language to include with the software code... Greg McHugh Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371663#371663 ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 04:36:05 PM PST US From: Dennis Golden Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Open Source software license options On 04/23/2012 06:03 PM, gregmchugh wrote: > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "gregmchugh" > > Anyone have a suggestion on which of the various open source > license options would be appropriate for the Wig-Wag project > and the possible follow-on modules. I need to put something > in the header file for the software that I will be sending out > for testing on the hardware and I could use some guidance > on what language to include with the software code... > > Greg McHugh I would suggest that you start by reading the GPL and derivative licenses. Dennis -- Dennis Golden Golden Consulting Services, Inc. ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 05:14:03 PM PST US From: Ralph Finch Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Open Source software license options I agree. The General Public License is widely used and understood. http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl.html Another commonly used license is the Creative Commons license http://creativecommons.org/ One of these should work fine. RF On Mon, Apr 23, 2012 at 4:32 PM, Dennis Golden < dgolden@golden-consulting.com> wrote: > dgolden@golden-consulting.com**> > > > On 04/23/2012 06:03 PM, gregmchugh wrote: > >> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "gregmchugh"> com > >> >> Anyone have a suggestion on which of the various open source >> license options would be appropriate for the Wig-Wag project >> and the possible follow-on modules. I need to put something >> in the header file for the software that I will be sending out >> for testing on the hardware and I could use some guidance >> on what language to include with the software code... >> >> Greg McHugh >> > > I would suggest that you start by reading the GPL and derivative licenses. > > Dennis > -- > Dennis Golden > Golden Consulting Services, Inc. ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 05:49:55 PM PST US From: "David Lloyd" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Removing contacts from a King radio connector James, ..great tips. Thanks for the details. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------- ----- Original Message ----- From: berkut13@berkut13.com To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 10:16 AM Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Removing contacts from a King radio connector Here's a really simple, cheap and amazingly effective, homemade Molex KK pin extractor: http://www.berkut13.com/extractor.htm Enjoy. -James Berkut/Race 13 www.berkut13.com -----Original Message----- From: Jared Yates Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 12:01 PM To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Removing contacts from a King radio connector Street sweeper bristles are also good tool blanks. They are made from a soft steel that is easy to grind, and in most municipalities they are available for free. On Apr 23, 2012, at 10:08, "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" wrote: > > At 05:35 PM 4/21/2012, you wrote: >> >> Peter >> >> The working blade is 10mm long, 1.5mm wide and 0.65mm thick on a "handle" >> 5mm wide and 67mm long, same thickness >> >> Best Regards >> >> Peter > > I've made similar tools from a pocket screwdriver > using a grinder. Adjust dimensions to your specifics. > > See: > > http://aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Tools/Extraction_Tools/extraction_tool.j pg > > > Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 05:54:22 PM PST US From: Dwight Frye Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Open Source software license options Let me respectfully submit that the answer is .... it depends. More to the point, it depends upon your goals. I just finished three years as a senior member of the Cisco open source support and license compliance group and gained a real appreciation for how different licenses have different impact and net results. GPL is unarguably popular, but so are many others. Quite old tried-and-true licenses such as BSD and MIT are still -heavily- used as well. Creative commons is also gaining in popularity. If you do go GPL which flavor might you want? GPLv2? Or v3? And do you know what different effects the two different licenses bring to the table? (Short answer ... v3 adds the anti-Tivo install-and-run provisions targeted at consumer-type products and also has greatly modified language regarding the impacts on patent portfolios). Do you want the copyleft behavior that is the hallmark of the GPL licenses? If so, do you also want the prohibition of combining your GPL licensed code with other bodies of code which might -not- be GPL compatible? I'm not arguing against GPL at all ... just suggesting that you make sure it achieves what you want to achieve. The one thing I would suggest ... no, beg ... you to do is resist the temptation to craft your own "vanity license". I realize you have not suggested doing that, but have seen some truly awful licenses written by well-intentioned geeks (I'm speaking as a geek myself) which actually prevented the very goals that the author had in mind when he wrote the language when the license was strictly interpreted. Don't go building your own license without -real- advice from a -real- intellectual property lawyer! You can't believe how often code-slingers think they can craft a legal document that makes sense, much less actually does what they want. I may have already crossed the point where people's eyes are glazing over, so I'll stop. If you want more discussion of this topic off-list I'd be happy to discuss at length the various licenses .. their pros and cons .. and be of any assistance I can in helping you pick something that achieves your goals. -- Dwight On 04/23/2012 08:10 PM, Ralph Finch wrote: > I agree. The General Public License is widely used and understood. > > http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl.html > > Another commonly used license is the Creative Commons license > http://creativecommons.org/ > > One of these should work fine. > > RF > > On Mon, Apr 23, 2012 at 4:32 PM, Dennis Golden > > > wrote: > > > > > > On 04/23/2012 06:03 PM, gregmchugh wrote: > > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: > "gregmchugh"> > > Anyone have a suggestion on which of the various open source > license options would be appropriate for the Wig-Wag project > and the possible follow-on modules. I need to put something > in the header file for the software that I will be sending out > for testing on the hardware and I could use some guidance > on what language to include with the software code... > > Greg McHugh > > > I would suggest that you start by reading the GPL and derivative > licenses. > > Dennis > -- > Dennis Golden > Golden Consulting Services, Inc. > > ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 06:09:19 PM PST US From: Charlie England Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Removing contacts from a King radio connector Now all you have to do is find a way to make them stay in the shell when you insert the radio.... :-) On 04/23/2012 07:47 PM, David Lloyd wrote: > James, > ..great tips. Thanks for the details. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* berkut13@berkut13.com > *To:* aeroelectric-list@matronics.com > > *Sent:* Monday, April 23, 2012 10:16 AM > *Subject:* Re: AeroElectric-List: Removing contacts from a King > radio connector > > Here's a really simple, cheap and amazingly effective, homemade > Molex KK pin extractor: > http://www.berkut13.com/extractor.htm > Enjoy. > -James > Berkut/Race 13 > www.berkut13.com > -----Original Message----- > From: Jared Yates > Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 12:01 PM > To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com > > Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Removing contacts from a King > radio connector > > Street sweeper bristles are also good tool blanks. They are made > from a soft steel that is easy to grind, and in most > municipalities they are available for free. > On Apr 23, 2012, at 10:08, "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" > wrote: > III" > > > > At 05:35 PM 4/21/2012, you wrote: > > >> > >> Peter > >> > >> The working blade is 10mm long, 1.5mm wide and 0.65mm thick on > a "handle" > >> 5mm wide and 67mm long, same thickness > >> > >> Best Regards > >> > >> Peter > > > > I've made similar tools from a pocket screwdriver > > using a grinder. Adjust dimensions to your specifics. > > > > See: > > > > > http://aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Tools/Extraction_Tools/extraction_tool.jpg > > > > > > Bob . . . > ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 06:20:05 PM PST US From: Dennis Golden Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Open Source software license options On 04/23/2012 07:52 PM, Dwight Frye wrote: > Let me respectfully submit that the answer is .... it depends. More to > the point, it depends upon your goals. I just finished three years as a > senior member of the Cisco open source support and license compliance > group and gained a real appreciation for how different licenses have > different impact and net results. GPL is unarguably popular, but so are > many others. Quite old tried-and-true licenses such as BSD and MIT are > still -heavily- used as well. Creative commons is also gaining in > popularity. > > If you do go GPL which flavor might you want? GPLv2? Or v3? And do you > know what different effects the two different licenses bring to the > table? (Short answer ... v3 adds the anti-Tivo install-and-run > provisions targeted at consumer-type products and also has greatly > modified language regarding the impacts on patent portfolios). Do you > want the copyleft behavior that is the hallmark of the GPL licenses? If > so, do you also want the prohibition of combining your GPL licensed code > with other bodies of code which might -not- be GPL compatible? I'm not > arguing against GPL at all ... just suggesting that you make sure it > achieves what you want to achieve. > > The one thing I would suggest ... no, beg ... you to do is resist the > temptation to craft your own "vanity license". I realize you have not > suggested doing that, but have seen some truly awful licenses written by > well-intentioned geeks (I'm speaking as a geek myself) which actually > prevented the very goals that the author had in mind when he wrote the > language when the license was strictly interpreted. Don't go building > your own license without -real- advice from a -real- intellectual > property lawyer! You can't believe how often code-slingers think they > can craft a legal document that makes sense, much less actually does > what they want. > > I may have already crossed the point where people's eyes are glazing > over, so I'll stop. If you want more discussion of this topic off-list > I'd be happy to discuss at length the various licenses .. their pros and > cons .. and be of any assistance I can in helping you pick something > that achieves your goals. > > -- Dwight > > On 04/23/2012 08:10 PM, Ralph Finch wrote: >> I agree. The General Public License is widely used and understood. >> >> http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl.html >> >> Another commonly used license is the Creative Commons license >> http://creativecommons.org/ >> >> One of these should work fine. >> >> RF >> >> On Mon, Apr 23, 2012 at 4:32 PM, Dennis Golden >> > >> wrote: >> >> > > >> >> >> On 04/23/2012 06:03 PM, gregmchugh wrote: >> >> "gregmchugh"> >> >> Anyone have a suggestion on which of the various open source >> license options would be appropriate for the Wig-Wag project >> and the possible follow-on modules. I need to put something >> in the header file for the software that I will be sending out >> for testing on the hardware and I could use some guidance >> on what language to include with the software code... >> >> Greg McHugh >> And it might be that you just want it in the public domain where no license is needed/wanted. If you don't care, why bother with the legalities of the various licenses. Dennis -- Dennis Golden Golden Consulting Services, Inc. ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 06:49:26 PM PST US From: Dwight Frye Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Open Source software license options On 04/23/2012 09:19 PM, Dennis Golden wrote: > And it might be that you just want it in the public domain where no > license is needed/wanted. If you don't care, why bother with the > legalities of the various licenses. Absolutely true! Public domain is a completely valid choice. But .. again .. the question is whether that meets your goals or not. I will say that if you do want it in the public domain please be explicit in your language for the sake of clarity (i.e. say straight out "this is in the public domain"). Anything else is subject to interpretation. However, if you want to at least retain some sort of acknowledgement that this thing was your creation then one of the liberal licenses (BSD, MIT, etc.) can achieve that goal without encumbering the receiver much at all. Mostly those licenses demand what some of us have come to call "good open source hygiene" in that they request the receiver not remove headers with copyrights and license language from the source files (plus a few other similar obligations). It once again comes back to ... what are your goals? If you want the lowest bar to adoption, don't care if acknowledgment that you produced the work is maintained, and are happy for folks to incorporate your work into some commercial product, then public domain is perfect. If you want something else, well then .. by golly .. pick what achieves -those- goals. -- Dwight ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 07:13:00 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Open Source software license options >And it might be that you just want it in the public domain where no >license is needed/wanted. If you don't care, why bother with the >legalities of the various licenses. I would suggest we keep it simple. Making such things work well seems sufficiently challenging without adding bragging rights. We could craft a AEC Public Domain page explaining what's offered and why we did it. Any improvements or expansions on the ideas are welcome and will be added to the page . . . but if somebody feels inclined to snatch and run . . . do we really care? Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 07:19:56 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Antenna mounting-doubler From: Rick Lark Guys, I believe I started this thread about a week ago. Today I came upon a "General Antenna Installation Guidlines", written by Cobham which I think is the parent company to Comant. In those instructions they state that electrical bonding is best accomplished by "direct metal to metal" contact of the antenna base to the aircraft skin. Also paint is to be removed and to protect the aluminum against corrosion, the surface can be alodined. They then also mention using the mounting screws to provide a good ground as an alternate method with a couple of other stipulations. As well to test the bonding, a reading of .003 ohms between the base and the ground should be achieved. So since I'm mostly using Comant on my -10, I guess I will continue alodining. I will check to see what kind of readings I get with my VOM. Rick #40956 Southampton, Ont On Mon, Apr 23, 2012 at 6:18 PM, dougshep@netzero.com wrote: > dougshep@netzero.com> > > I had the same question last year when I was using Alodine coated ALCAD > for a bus bar. I talked with the manufacturing tech. staff and got the > following reply...I also included another comment. I noticed when using > it, not to let your part submerge too long in the Alodine bath, else exce ss > Alodine can coat your aluminum surface: > > AL 1201 > > From: Kristina.Tkacz@us.henkel.com > To:dougshep@netzero.com > Sent: Fri, Jun 10, 2011 11:14 AM > > Doug, > > Per our discussion yesterday about the Alodine 1201, we unfortunately do > not have any documentation or data regarding the resistivity capabilities .. > This product is approved on the QPL-81706 (see: > http://www.chemical-supermarket.com/files/Henkel%20Alodine%20Conversion%2 0Coatings/Mil-DTL-81706B.pdf) > for Class 1A. However, we do believe that because of its similarities in > chemistries to the Alodine 1200S it should pass the electrical resistance > testing. Again, we do not have any data to confirm this. As for the > thickness of the coating, an average application would be around 100 nm. > Please let me know if you have any further questions. > > Kind Regards / mit freundlichen Gr��en, > Kristina Tkacz > > Kristina Tkacz > Technical Service Representative Surface Treatment Application Specialist > Aerospace, Global > Henkel Corporation > ( Office: +248.577.2115 � Mobile: +248.376.9294 > * Email:Kristina.Tkacz@henkel.com www.henkel.com > > - - - - - - - - - - > - - - - > (another question/answer from someone else) > Electrical properties of Alodine 1200 (from; > http://www.finishing.com/364/48.shtml ) > I would like to know the electrical properties of ALODINE 1200. We are > using it as protection on our metallic housing of Door Control Unit. Is i t > necessary to protect the ground stud from ALODINE 1200 ? > Emmanuel SEREZAT transport - FRANCE > Alodine 1200 is one of chromate chemical conversion coating that meets > requirements of MIL-C-5541 (you can find a lot of other processes). > Mil-C-5541 [link is to spec at TechStreet] Class 3 requires maximum 5000 > =B5Ohm per sq. inch electrical resistance. Actually, electrical resistanc e > for properly performed Class 3 is usually 1000-2000 =B5Ohm per sq. inch. > MIL-C-5541 Class 1A does not require electrical conductivity. Most chemic al > conversion coatings from QPL (including Alodine 1200) can be performed as > both Class 1A and Class 3. Therefore you should check which class is > processed on your parts. > > - - - - - - - - - - > - - - - > > Alodine 1200, 1201, & 1200S: (from: > http://www.chemical-supermarket.com/home.php?cat=109) > Alodine 1200 is Henkel=92s product family for hexavalent chromium > conversion. Contained in this family are two primary products; Alodine > 1201 and Alodine 1200S. Alodine 1201 is a ready-to-use liquid product > which, when brushed-on or diluted and immersion-applied, produces a > gold-colored Chromate Conversion Coating which contains hexavalent > chromium. Consistent with Class 1A of the mil spec, it is formulated to > provide maximum corrosion prevention when left unpainted as well as to > improve adhesion of paint finish systems on aluminum and aluminum alloys. > Alodine 1200S is the powdered composition dissolved by professional > industrial facilities into their immersion baths. > > Doug Shepard, RV-9A construction > > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 10:10:54 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Antenna mounting-doubler At 09:16 PM 4/23/2012, you wrote: >Guys, I believe I started this thread about a week ago. > >Today I came upon a "General Antenna Installation Guidlines", >written by Cobham which I think is the parent company to Comant. In >those instructions they state that electrical bonding is best >accomplished by "direct metal to metal" contact of the antenna base >to the aircraft skin. Also paint is to be removed and to protect >the aluminum against corrosion, the surface can be alodined. They >then also mention using the mounting screws to provide a good ground >as an alternate method with a couple of other stipulations. As well >to test the bonding, a reading of .003 ohms between the base and the >ground should be achieved. > >So since I'm mostly using Comant on my -10, I guess I will continue >alodining. I will check to see what kind of readings I get with my VOM. Your VOM is incapable of resolving resitance measurements this low. A 4-wire, low ohms adapter is called for. See: http://tinyurl.com/4l3tuj6 If you're not inclined to roll your own, this is another option . . . http://www.aeroelectric.com/Catalog/AEC/9008/ Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 10:34:12 PM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Anyone interested in a 9lb battery/jumpstart kit? From: "rparigoris" Hi Group I have quite a few brand new sets of components from a Jump Start Battery: https://skydrive.live.com/redir.aspx?cid=550fc20dbddb521d&resid=550FC20DBDDB521D!413&parid=550FC20DBDDB521D!408&authkey=!ADA-L-1AURQ0PJU We gutted the brand new jump start packs because we needed the case, volt meter, flashlight and receptacles. The set consists of one 9lb AGM sealed Lead Acid Battery, a 500mA constant current charger with line cord (UL approved), 1 set of jumper cables a little shy of 2 feet long, the charger control board that turns charging off at ~ 14.1 volts, also a DC cord that you can charge from a 12 VDC source (Red LED turns off when charging is complete) and a 15 amp resettable fuse that was attached to a cigarette adapter. I'm looking for $10 each plus shipping. They work great as a bench 12 volt source or turning your 12 volt cordless drill into a corded version that you can use the entire day. The local Battery Plus will give me 7$ each for just the battery as scrap but it kills me to do that, all this stuff is brand new. A little ingenuity will give you a nice jump start pack. Or buy a few hundred and make packs and sell them. I need to move them by the end of next month. Ron Parigoris Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371691#371691 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message aeroelectric-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/aeroelectric-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/aeroelectric-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.