---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 05/06/12: 6 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 04:56 AM - Re: Secrets Techniques (Glen Matejcek) 2. 04:59 AM - Re: Twisted pair tefzel (Glen Matejcek) 3. 06:38 AM - Re: Re: Secrets Techniques (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 4. 10:42 AM - Re: Secrets Techniques (John Loram) 5. 04:50 PM - Re: Re: Aluminum bronze - conductivity (Henador Titzoff) 6. 05:33 PM - Re: Aluminum bronze - conductivity (Eric M. Jones) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:56:53 AM PST US From: Glen Matejcek Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Secrets Techniques Hi Bob- WRT techniques for dealing with tefzel, Basler up in OSH comes to mind. When they do a turbine conversion, every wire, tube, hose, and threaded fastener comes out. It's quite process, and they build up their own harnesses right there in their electrical loft. Glen Matejcek ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 04:59:27 AM PST US From: Glen Matejcek Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Twisted pair tefzel Will do- > >Time: 11:38:48 AM PST US >From: "John Loram" >Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Twisted pair tefzel > > >Thank you Glen. What I'm hoping to find is a twisted pair of Tefzel 22 AWG >wires inside a out sheath of Tefzel. > >Would you let me know, when you can, if that's what you have? thanks, >-john- Glen Matejcek ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:38:15 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Secrets Techniques At 06:54 AM 5/6/2012, you wrote: > > >Hi Bob- > >WRT techniques for dealing with tefzel, Basler up in OSH comes to >mind. When they do a turbine conversion, every wire, tube, hose, >and threaded fastener comes out. It's quite process, and they build >up their own harnesses right there in their electrical loft. Sure. Tefzel has been the insulation of choice in GA aircraft (and most military) since the early 80's. I had the electrical-avionics group on the Gates-Piaggio GP180 program at Lear. We were considering Tefzel for that program and discovered it required an State Department technology export license if we were going to use it in airplanes sold outside the country. A good friend of mine was a tech-rep for Raychem who was offering an alternative to Tefzel in their "Spec 55" wire. I brought in some samples and the folks on the wire balcony were playing with it when it was announced that Lear had acquire the necessary export license. The changeover to Tefzel was pretty much a foregone conclusion in all the TC aircraft. Tefzel (or ETFE) is a cousin to Teflon (PTFE) and is widely used in many technologies besides wire. See: http://tinyurl.com/24stb9e http://tinyurl.com/yb462g6 It's not a really big deal for stripping except when working with thin overlays that (1) buckle in column load when you try to push it off (2) a braided structure with a very strong grip on the insulation. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 10:42:15 AM PST US From: "John Loram" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Secrets Techniques Yeah, I know. Just being anal.... I'll use it, thanks, -john- _____ From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert L. Nuckolls, III Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2012 3:42 PM Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Secrets Techniques At 01:26 PM 5/5/2012, you wrote: I'm just looking for 15 ft of UNshielded twisted pair for the RS-422 data lines in a Dynon D10A installation. If I can't find it, I'll just twist some 22 AWG, but would prefer to have the Tefzel casing for a little added physical protection. Shielded I got already. but thank you, -john- then use it. it will be fine . . . Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 04:50:53 PM PST US From: Henador Titzoff Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Aluminum bronze - conductivity Eric,=0A=0AThank you for correcting me about copper plating vs. copper clad and also for the additional information after that. I continuously run int o people, even engineers, who think gold is the metal with best conductance . -As you point out, gold has almost zero reactivity with the atmosphere, which makes it ideal for connector plating (or cladding!). -It is also i deal inside ICs for thin plating and very thin wires, because it is so duct ile.=0A=0AI'd like to point out something, though. -Below you say that si lver is the best conductor, followed by copper then aluminum. Gold actually follows copper and then aluminum. What's really surprising is that calcium follows aluminum. The reasons calcium is not widely used as a conductor ar e reactance to the atmosphere, easy dissolution in water, and insufficient mechanical strength.=0A-=0AHenador Titzoff=0A=0A=0A______________________ __________=0A From: Eric M. Jones =0ATo: aeroelectric- list@matronics.com =0ASent: Thursday, May 3, 2012 11:17 AM=0ASubject: AeroE lectric-List: Re: Aluminum bronze - conductivity=0A =0A--> AeroElectric-Lis t message posted by: "Eric M. Jones" =0A=0A=0A> Why no t send that puppy off to Eric at Perihelion Design to get it copper plated? ...Henador=0A=0A=0AThe copper clad aluminum I sell is not plated. This woul dn't be good, plating always has pinholes and wears off. The Super-CCA I se ll is "clad" which is a process where copper and aluminum are fused togethe r. 10% of the diameter of the crossection is actually copper.- Copperweld Inc., historically made lots of different stuff clad with copper by this p rocess. It is important to know that there is a long history of aluminum wi ring problems, but essentially NO HISTORY of CCA problems. The wire behaves very much like copper=0A=0ASome notes of metals:=0A=0A1) In many applicati ons the conductivity of the metal is less important than the surface reacti vity with atmospheric oxygen (or in the case of- titanium only, with nitr ogen). Impure aluminum oxide is the same as sapphire or corundum and is qui te insulating. Copper oxide looks bad but still conducts electricity well. Same for silver. It can turn black and conduct well. Stainless steel, nicke l, chrome and aluminum looks great initially but turns into an insulator. T his usually happens slowly. Battery contacts made of stainless steel were o nce the bane of cheap electronics.=0A=0A2) See: http://aerospacedefense.tho masnet.com/Asset/MIL-F-14072.pdf- Finishes for Ground Based Electronic Eq uipment. There is probably an aircraft-version of this but it is all the sa me chemistry.=0A=0A3) Gold has zero reactivity with the atmosphere. Gold is only a fairly- good conductor but is great for low voltage electrical cont acts. Silver is the best conductor followed by copper, then aluminum. =0A =0A4) Aluminum has over TWICE the conductivity per unit mass of any other m etal. So learning how to use it can save weight. The electrical power indus try uses far more aluminum than copper outside the home. Aluminum wiring in houses (that used electrical plugs and switches designed for copper) were retrofitted by adding a short pigtail of copper with special grease in a wi renut or crimp connector. =0A=0A5) Galvanic corrosion depends on the Electr ode potential in the electro-chemical series AND presence of an electrolyte --saltwater perhaps but water will do. If you put dissimilar metals togethe r, but keep them air-tight and dry, there is no problem.=0A=0A--------=0AEr ic M. Jones=0Awww.PerihelionDesign.com=0A113 Brentwood Drive=0ASouthbridge, MA 01550=0A(508) 764-2072=0Aemjones(at)charter.net=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=3723 37#372337=0A=0A=0A=0A=0AAttachments: =0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com//fil =========== ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 05:33:40 PM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Aluminum bronze - conductivity From: "Eric M. Jones" Henador, Thanks. Right you are. For elements that can be drawn into wires--Bulk Conductivity: Silver, Copper, Gold, Aluminium. And Mass Conductivity: Aluminum, Copper, Silver, Zinc, Gold. Eric -------- Eric M. Jones www.PerihelionDesign.com 113 Brentwood Drive Southbridge, MA 01550 (508) 764-2072 emjones(at)charter.net Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372522#372522 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message aeroelectric-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/aeroelectric-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/aeroelectric-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.