---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Wed 05/16/12: 13 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 06:36 AM - Re: Source for new Aerostart connectors? (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 2. 07:02 AM - Re: finding buried ac line (Bill Schertz) 3. 07:34 AM - Slice of history (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 4. 03:31 PM - Re: Re: Ignition Interference (Richard Girard) 5. 03:54 PM - Re: Re: Ignition Interference (Harley) 6. 05:26 PM - Re: Re: Ignition Interference (John MacCallum) 7. 05:29 PM - Challanging and perplexing (fedico94@mchsi.com) 8. 06:36 PM - Re: Challenging and perplexing (Bob McCallum) 9. 07:40 PM - Re: Challenging and perplexing (fedico94@mchsi.com) 10. 07:56 PM - Re: Challenging and perplexing (Jared Yates) 11. 08:03 PM - Re: Challenging and perplexing (Bob McCallum) 12. 08:09 PM - Re: Re: Ignition Interference (David Lloyd) 13. 10:08 PM - Re: Ignition Interference (messydeer) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 06:36:50 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Source for new Aerostart connectors? At 05:58 PM 5/15/2012, you wrote: > >Bob, > >Are these connectors close to or what you can use.... > >http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/jumpercables.php > >http://www.chiefaircraft.com/aircraft/tools/battery-tools.html > >They seemed to be called "Piper" type..... Unfortunately, no. But thanks for looking! The "Piper" style ground power plug is a Cole-Hersee product Emacs! . . . first popularized by Piper for aircraft and adopted by quite a few others. In fact so many that FBO ground power carts are often fitted with mating plugs. The Aerostart product didn't seem to catch on and only made it onto a few production models. It's sort of the 'beta-max' of ground power connectors. Perfectly good and perhaps even superior to the truck connector but alas . . . for lack of a blessing and support by a major manufacturer . . . it's toe hold in the marketplace was tenuous at best. I think if I owned an airplane fitted with an Aerostart, I'd convert it to something more popular. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 07:02:57 AM PST US From: "Bill Schertz" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: finding buried ac line After whatever service you use (JULIE) in my area, still be very careful. Local Power company was installing a new utility pole at the end of my driveway, had the professional marking done, proceeded to start drilling the pole hole, and then a loud =98clang=99 followed by a loud hissing noise, because they broke the natural gas line. Happened at 8 am and it was 3 pm before they got the gas shut off. Bill Schertz KIS Cruiser #4045 N343BS Phase one testing Completed From: ROGER & JEAN CURTIS Sent: Monday, May 14, 2012 7:17 AM Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: finding buried ac line I didn't see any message that answered the question, did I miss it? Yup, you missed it!! Short answer is, call your utility and ask about the free buried utilities locater service. They may not be right, occasionally, but most of the time they hit it. In most cases it is the law that you must contact them before digging or be liable for damages to buried lines. Roger Do not archive ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 07:34:37 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Slice of history I had an opportunity to modernize the landing gear control box for a 1940's era Harlow. Stripped out the guts of the box to make room for modern relays. The wire used in this assembly was cloth over rubber that was in surprisingly good shape . . . although the airplane had not flown in a long time. Emacs! This was the best we knew how to do in 1940 . . . Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 03:31:23 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Ignition Interference From: Richard Girard Borrow a different radio or use a handheld connected through your antenna system. Rick Girard On Wed, May 16, 2012 at 12:05 AM, messydeer wrote: > > I'm having a major problem with RFI in my Jabiru 3300 Sonex. Radio is MGL > V6, just out a few months ago. Antenna is a belly mounted homemade one made > from a CB antenna. It's 22" long with a single bend, mounted ~2' behind the > firewall, ~2' below the com radio. Bob made the cable, RGxxx, double > shielded. I get ignition noise, left mag much worse than the right. > > What I've done > > Replaced spark plugs with resistive type. No difference. > > Disconnected the shielded P leads. No difference. > > Disconnected antenna, which cutout all noise. So I figure the noise is > radiated, not conducted. I think I had the squelch all the way down, but > it's possible it was turned up a little. > > Connected a separate battery. No difference. > > Put beads on coil to distributor leads, antenna, power and ground leads. > No difference. > > Left mag makes 90% of the noise. Turned off left mag and pulled right plug > wires sequentially. The right mag has always made a much slower 'tick' than > the left, but still couldn't isolate it this way. > > Removed jacks and a switch that could have caused ground loops on the > panel. No difference. > > Disconnected comm antenna (on belly, 2' aft of firewall) and connected > radio to ELT antenna on top tailcone ~8-10' further back. Cut down noise, > but still noticeable. > > Replaced left mag spark plug wires with Accel 300+ ferro spiral plug > wires. No difference > > Swapped distributor caps. I was in a hurry to get my pilot up in the air, > so didn't listen. He said there was no difference in flight. His > transmissions were very poor. The only time he was easily understood was > when he throttled back on final. He later told me the left and right were > both noisy. Changing the distributor caps didn't seem to do anything. They > also looked fine on the inside. > > Things I may try > > With the new plug wires in, connect the radio to the ELT antenna 8' > further back on the tailcone. Comm antenna is belly mounted, 2' back of the > firewall. I'd done this before the plug wire upgrade and it made a > significant improvement, but the noise was still very noticeable. > > Connect a handheld to the comm antenna. If the noise goes away, it's gotta > be the radio, since we've already ruled out noise via system conduction. > > Check the SWR. If this is reasonable to do, I'd prolly buy a meter for > $50. My comm antenna is 22" long that I made from a cut down CB antenna. If > it shows >3, I'd fix it or buy a real one. > > I'll make sure athe alternator leads going to the voltage regulator are > twisted. > > Replace the coil to distributor lead with noiseless wire. Some have had > success with this, but most have tamed the noise with beads after using > noiseless plug wires. I don't want to replace this stock coil lead, since > I'm not sure I could make a secure connection and I'm doubtful it would do > any good. > > Any sugestions? > > -------- > Dan > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=373137#373137 > > -- Zulu Delta Mk IIIC Thanks, Homer GBYM It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy. - Groucho Marx ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 03:54:36 PM PST US From: Harley Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Ignition Interference I came across this on the Microaire website today...it's a bit specific for strobe noise, but does go into other possible sources and their elimination. Specifically mentioning ground problems and how they can affect the radios. Even if you can't use it (or already have!) it may make a good check list for others here. www.microair.com.au/admin/uploads/StrobeTroubleShooting1.pdf Harley ----------------------------------------------------------------- On 5/16/2012 6:29 PM, Richard Girard wrote: > Borrow a different radio or use a handheld connected through > your antenna system. > > Rick Girard > > On Wed, May 16, 2012 at 12:05 AM, messydeer > > wrote: > > > > > I'm having a major problem with RFI in my Jabiru 3300 > Sonex. Radio is MGL V6, just out a few months ago. Antenna > is a belly mounted homemade one made from a CB antenna. > It's 22" long with a single bend, mounted ~2' behind the > firewall, ~2' below the com radio. Bob made the cable, > RGxxx, double shielded. I get ignition noise, left mag much > worse than the right. > > What I've done > > Replaced spark plugs with resistive type. No difference. > > Disconnected the shielded P leads. No difference. > > Disconnected antenna, which cutout all noise. So I figure > the noise is radiated, not conducted. I think I had the > squelch all the way down, but it's possible it was turned > up a little. > > Connected a separate battery. No difference. > > Put beads on coil to distributor leads, antenna, power and > ground leads. No difference. > > Left mag makes 90% of the noise. Turned off left mag and > pulled right plug wires sequentially. The right mag has > always made a much slower 'tick' than the left, but still > couldn't isolate it this way. > > Removed jacks and a switch that could have caused ground > loops on the panel. No difference. > > Disconnected comm antenna (on belly, 2' aft of firewall) > and connected radio to ELT antenna on top tailcone ~8-10' > further back. Cut down noise, but still noticeable. > > Replaced left mag spark plug wires with Accel 300+ ferro > spiral plug wires. No difference > > Swapped distributor caps. I was in a hurry to get my pilot > up in the air, so didn't listen. He said there was no > difference in flight. His transmissions were very poor. The > only time he was easily understood was when he throttled > back on final. He later told me the left and right were > both noisy. Changing the distributor caps didn't seem to do > anything. They also looked fine on the inside. > > Things I may try > > With the new plug wires in, connect the radio to the ELT > antenna 8' further back on the tailcone. Comm antenna is > belly mounted, 2' back of the firewall. I'd done this > before the plug wire upgrade and it made a significant > improvement, but the noise was still very noticeable. > > Connect a handheld to the comm antenna. If the noise goes > away, it's gotta be the radio, since we've already ruled > out noise via system conduction. > > Check the SWR. If this is reasonable to do, I'd prolly buy > a meter for $50. My comm antenna is 22" long that I made > from a cut down CB antenna. If it shows >3, I'd fix it or > buy a real one. > > I'll make sure athe alternator leads going to the voltage > regulator are twisted. > > Replace the coil to distributor lead with noiseless wire. > Some have had success with this, but most have tamed the > noise with beads after using noiseless plug wires. I don't > want to replace this stock coil lead, since I'm not sure I > could make a secure connection and I'm doubtful it would do > any good. > > Any sugestions? > > -------- > Dan > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=373137#373137 > > > ========== > -List" > target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List > ========== > http://forums.matronics.com > ========== > le, List Admin. > ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > ========== > > > -- > Zulu Delta > Mk IIIC > Thanks, Homer GBYM > > It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to > be unhappy. > - Groucho Marx > > > * > > > * > > No virus found in this message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Date: 05/16/12 > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 05:26:37 PM PST US From: "John MacCallum" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Re: Ignition Interference Yes the Noise may be being radiated. However it shouldn't affect transmission. If there is a problem with both Transmit and receive then look to the Antenna and Feedline or the radio itself. I think that Jabiru Engines use Honda Lawn Mover Magnetos and Points. Check or change the Suppression Capacitors on the Points. As you have already Replaced the Plug Leads that's about all you can do other than check the Grounding of the Engine to the rest of the Airframe. By the way doing a quick check of a Qtr Wavelength at 120 MHz I get . 300/120=2.5 2.5/4=.625m 625mm/25.4=24.6 Inches 24.6*0.97=23.87 Inches. 127.5 MHz = 22.46 Inches Bending he Antenna towards the ground plane (fuselage) will affect the both the Feed point Impedance and the Resonant frequency. So Get an SWR meter and have look at the SWR over the entire range. 118 to 137 Mhz Cheers John MAcCallum RV10 Builder #41016 VH-DUU From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Harley Sent: Thursday, 17 May 2012 8:53 AM Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Ignition Interference I came across this on the Microaire website today...it's a bit specific for strobe noise, but does go into other possible sources and their elimination. Specifically mentioning ground problems and how they can affect the radios. Even if you can't use it (or already have!) it may make a good check list for others here. www.microair.com.au/admin/uploads/StrobeTroubleShooting1.pdf Harley _____ On 5/16/2012 6:29 PM, Richard Girard wrote: Borrow a different radio or use a handheld connected through your antenna system. Rick Girard On Wed, May 16, 2012 at 12:05 AM, messydeer wrote: I'm having a major problem with RFI in my Jabiru 3300 Sonex. Radio is MGL V6, just out a few months ago. Antenna is a belly mounted homemade one made from a CB antenna. It's 22" long with a single bend, mounted ~2' behind the firewall, ~2' below the com radio. Bob made the cable, RGxxx, double shielded. I get ignition noise, left mag much worse than the right. What I've done Replaced spark plugs with resistive type. No difference. Disconnected the shielded P leads. No difference. Disconnected antenna, which cutout all noise. So I figure the noise is radiated, not conducted. I think I had the squelch all the way down, but it's possible it was turned up a little. Connected a separate battery. No difference. Put beads on coil to distributor leads, antenna, power and ground leads. No difference. Left mag makes 90% of the noise. Turned off left mag and pulled right plug wires sequentially. The right mag has always made a much slower 'tick' than the left, but still couldn't isolate it this way. Removed jacks and a switch that could have caused ground loops on the panel. No difference. Disconnected comm antenna (on belly, 2' aft of firewall) and connected radio to ELT antenna on top tailcone ~8-10' further back. Cut down noise, but still noticeable. Replaced left mag spark plug wires with Accel 300+ ferro spiral plug wires. No difference Swapped distributor caps. I was in a hurry to get my pilot up in the air, so didn't listen. He said there was no difference in flight. His transmissions were very poor. The only time he was easily understood was when he throttled back on final. He later told me the left and right were both noisy. Changing the distributor caps didn't seem to do anything. They also looked fine on the inside. Things I may try With the new plug wires in, connect the radio to the ELT antenna 8' further back on the tailcone. Comm antenna is belly mounted, 2' back of the firewall. I'd done this before the plug wire upgrade and it made a significant improvement, but the noise was still very noticeable. Connect a handheld to the comm antenna. If the noise goes away, it's gotta be the radio, since we've already ruled out noise via system conduction. Check the SWR. If this is reasonable to do, I'd prolly buy a meter for $50. My comm antenna is 22" long that I made from a cut down CB antenna. If it shows >3, I'd fix it or buy a real one. I'll make sure athe alternator leads going to the voltage regulator are twisted. Replace the coil to distributor lead with noiseless wire. Some have had success with this, but most have tamed the noise with beads after using noiseless plug wires. I don't want to replace this stock coil lead, since I'm not sure I could make a secure connection and I'm doubtful it would do any good. Any sugestions? -------- Dan Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=373137#373137 ========== -List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List ========== http://forums.matronics.com ========== le, List Admin. ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution ========== -- Zulu Delta Mk IIIC Thanks, Homer GBYM It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy. - Groucho Marx No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 05/16/12 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 05:29:47 PM PST US From: fedico94@mchsi.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Challanging and perplexing I built my electrical system per Z-13/20. On 2 seperate occassions I found that someone had moved the E-Bus Alt Mater Switch to engage the only the Battery. The first time they turned on the strobes and ran the battery down and this was quikly reversed with recharging the battery (PC680)from 5.6 volts. This occurred a second time probably the radios left on. I had the battery recharged and it shows 12V on the handheld meter. The E-bus Alt Master Switch will not allow the battery solenoid to "click" on (purchased from B & C). I by passed this with an 18ga wire so as to connect the battery positive terminal directly to the main power bus distribution side of the battery contactor. I have 10 volts showing through the main power bus and E-bus. I engaged the avionics fan from the e-bus by pushing in the CB and the fan motor did not engage. I tried the same with the defroster fan at the switch and the motor did not turn on. Both of these are low amperage and both showed 10 amps power with the handheld voltmeter downstream of the CB and Switch. No electrical item (all that I have radios etc will not come on. I do not understand what the problem is ? The person who recharged my battery said it recharged in 2 hours and only drew about 2 amps. ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 06:36:12 PM PST US From: Bob McCallum Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Challenging and perplexing Sounds like your battery is dead. If the battery itself is only showing 12 volts it is not properly charged, it should be significantly higher than that (somewhere in the 12.4 volt range) and if the buss is showing only 10 volts with minimal loads the battery is dead. Try substituting a fully charged known good battery just as a test and probably all will be well. (Assuming everything used to work properly.) A battery which has been discharged as low as 5.6 volts may not recover. Discharging a battery that far can sometimes be a death sentence for the battery. I just went to the garage and measured a battery which has been sitting unused and uncharged for about 18 months and it still measures 12.18 volts so if your freshly charged battery is only 12 volts it has serious issues. Bob McC > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list- > server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of fedico94@mchsi.com > Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 8:29 PM > To: Nuckolls, Robert > Subject: AeroElectric-List: Challanging and perplexing > > > I built my electrical system per Z-13/20. On 2 seperate occassions I found that > someone had moved the E-Bus Alt Mater Switch to engage the only the Battery. The > first time they turned on the strobes and ran the battery down and this was quikly > reversed with recharging the battery (PC680)from 5.6 volts. This occurred a second > time probably the radios left on. I had the battery recharged and it shows 12V on the > handheld meter. The E-bus Alt Master Switch will not allow the battery solenoid to > "click" on (purchased from B & C). I by passed this with an 18ga wire so as to connect > the battery positive terminal directly to the main power bus distribution side of the > battery contactor. I have 10 volts showing through the main power bus and E-bus. I > engaged the avionics fan from the e-bus by pushing in the CB and the fan motor did > not engage. I tried the same with the defroster fan at the switch and the motor did > not turn on. Both of these are low amperage and both showed ! > 10 amps power with the handheld voltmeter downstream of the CB and Switch. No > electrical item (all that I have radios etc will not come on. > > I do not understand what the problem is ? The person who recharged my battery said > it recharged in 2 hours and only drew about 2 amps. > > > _- > ==================================================== > ====== > _- > ==================================================== > ====== > _- > ==================================================== > ====== > _- > ==================================================== > ====== > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 07:40:04 PM PST US From: fedico94@mchsi.com Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Challenging and perplexing That was my first thought, but I would think a samll motor drawing 0.5 amps would still come on with some life. I thought I would inquire first before buying a 25 dollar garden tractor battery. If that works then I will upgrade to the 90 dollar PC680. I did not see any problem with melted wires that supply ground at forest of tabs. A grounding fault was another thought. ----- Original Message ----- From: Bob McCallum Sent: Wed, 16 May 2012 20:34:23 -0500 (CDT) Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Challenging and perplexing Sounds like your battery is dead. If the battery itself is only showing 12 volts it is not properly charged, it should be significantly higher than that (somewhere in the 12.4 volt range) and if the buss is showing only 10 volts with minimal loads the battery is dead. Try substituting a fully charged known good battery just as a test and probably all will be well. (Assuming everything used to work properly.) A battery which has been discharged as low as 5.6 volts may not recover. Discharging a battery that far can sometimes be a death sentence for the battery. I just went to the garage and measured a battery which has been sitting unused and uncharged for about 18 months and it still measures 12.18 volts so if your freshly charged battery is only 12 volts it has serious issues. Bob McC > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list- > server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of fedico94@mchsi.com > Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 8:29 PM > To: Nuckolls, Robert > Subject: AeroElectric-List: Challanging and perplexing > > > I built my electrical system per Z-13/20. On 2 seperate occassions I found that > someone had moved the E-Bus Alt Mater Switch to engage the only the Battery. The > first time they turned on the strobes and ran the battery down and this was quikly > reversed with recharging the battery (PC680)from 5.6 volts. This occurred a second > time probably the radios left on. I had the battery recharged and it shows 12V on the > handheld meter. The E-bus Alt Master Switch will not allow the battery solenoid to > "click" on (purchased from B & C). I by passed this with an 18ga wire so as to connect > the battery positive terminal directly to the main power bus distribution side of the > battery contactor. I have 10 volts showing through the main power bus and E-bus. I > engaged the avionics fan from the e-bus by pushing in the CB and the fan motor did > not engage. I tried the same with the defroster fan at the switch and the motor did > not turn on. Both of these are low amperage and both showed ! > 10 amps power with the handheld voltmeter downstream of the CB and Switch. No > electrical item (all that I have radios etc will not come on. > > I do not understand what the problem is ? The person who recharged my battery said > it recharged in 2 hours and only drew about 2 amps. > > > _- > ==================================================== > ====== > _- > ==================================================== > ====== > _- > ==================================================== > ====== > _- > ==================================================== > ====== > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 07:56:12 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Challenging and perplexing From: Jared Yates Unless you are in the market for a tractor battery, could you not just run jumper cables from your car? On Wed, May 16, 2012 at 10:36 PM, wrote: > > That was my first thought, but I would think a samll motor drawing 0.5 amps would still come on with some life. I thought I would inquire first before buying a 25 dollar garden tractor battery. If that works then I will upgrade to the 90 dollar PC680. I did not see any problem with melted wires that supply ground at forest of tabs. A grounding fault was another thought. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Bob McCallum > To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com > Sent: Wed, 16 May 2012 20:34:23 -0500 (CDT) > Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Challenging and perplexing > > > Sounds like your battery is dead. If the battery itself is only showing 12 > volts it is not properly charged, it should be significantly higher than > that (somewhere in the 12.4 volt range) and if the buss is showing only 10 > volts with minimal loads the battery is dead. > > Try substituting a fully charged known good battery just as a test and > probably all will be well. (Assuming everything used to work properly.) A > battery which has been discharged as low as 5.6 volts may not recover. > Discharging a battery that far can sometimes be a death sentence for the > battery. > > I just went to the garage and measured a battery which has been sitting > unused and uncharged for about 18 months and it still measures 12.18 volts > so if your freshly charged battery is only 12 volts it has serious issues. > > Bob McC > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list- >> server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of fedico94@mchsi.com >> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 8:29 PM >> To: Nuckolls, Robert >> Subject: AeroElectric-List: Challanging and perplexing >> >> >> I built my electrical system per Z-13/20. On 2 seperate occassions I > found that >> someone had moved the E-Bus Alt Mater Switch to engage the only the > Battery. The >> first time they turned on the strobes and ran the battery down and this > was quikly >> reversed with recharging the battery (PC680)from 5.6 volts. This occurred > a second >> time probably the radios left on. I had the battery recharged and it > shows 12V on the >> handheld meter. The E-bus Alt Master Switch will not allow the battery > solenoid to >> "click" on (purchased from B & C). I by passed this with an 18ga wire so > as to connect >> the battery positive terminal directly to the main power bus distribution > side of the >> battery contactor. I have 10 volts showing through the main power bus and > E-bus. I >> engaged the avionics fan from the e-bus by pushing in the CB and the fan > motor did >> not engage. I tried the same with the defroster fan at the switch and the > motor did >> not turn on. Both of these are low amperage and both showed ! >> 10 amps power with the handheld voltmeter downstream of the CB and > Switch. No >> electrical item (all that I have radios etc will not come on. >> >> I do not understand what the problem is ? The person who recharged my > battery said >> it recharged in 2 hours and only drew about 2 amps. >> >> >> _- >> ==================================================== >> ====== >> _- >> ==================================================== >> ====== >> _- >> ==================================================== >> ====== >> _- >> ==================================================== >> ====== >> >> > > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 08:03:21 PM PST US From: Bob McCallum Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Challenging and perplexing Rather than buying a battery for just testing either borrow one or simply use your car battery (with jumper cables if necessary) for a test. Bob McC > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list- > server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of fedico94@mchsi.com > Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 10:37 PM > To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com > Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Challenging and perplexing > > > That was my first thought, but I would think a samll motor drawing 0.5 amps would > still come on with some life. I thought I would inquire first before buying a 25 dollar > garden tractor battery. If that works then I will upgrade to the 90 dollar PC680. I did > not see any problem with melted wires that supply ground at forest of tabs. A > grounding fault was another thought. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Bob McCallum > To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com > Sent: Wed, 16 May 2012 20:34:23 -0500 (CDT) > Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Challenging and perplexing > > > > Sounds like your battery is dead. If the battery itself is only showing 12 > volts it is not properly charged, it should be significantly higher than > that (somewhere in the 12.4 volt range) and if the buss is showing only 10 > volts with minimal loads the battery is dead. > > Try substituting a fully charged known good battery just as a test and > probably all will be well. (Assuming everything used to work properly.) A > battery which has been discharged as low as 5.6 volts may not recover. > Discharging a battery that far can sometimes be a death sentence for the > battery. > > I just went to the garage and measured a battery which has been sitting > unused and uncharged for about 18 months and it still measures 12.18 volts > so if your freshly charged battery is only 12 volts it has serious issues. > > Bob McC > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list- > > server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of fedico94@mchsi.com > > Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 8:29 PM > > To: Nuckolls, Robert > > Subject: AeroElectric-List: Challanging and perplexing > > > > > > I built my electrical system per Z-13/20. On 2 seperate occassions I > found that > > someone had moved the E-Bus Alt Mater Switch to engage the only the > Battery. The > > first time they turned on the strobes and ran the battery down and this > was quikly > > reversed with recharging the battery (PC680)from 5.6 volts. This occurred > a second > > time probably the radios left on. I had the battery recharged and it > shows 12V on the > > handheld meter. The E-bus Alt Master Switch will not allow the battery > solenoid to > > "click" on (purchased from B & C). I by passed this with an 18ga wire so > as to connect > > the battery positive terminal directly to the main power bus distribution > side of the > > battery contactor. I have 10 volts showing through the main power bus and > E-bus. I > > engaged the avionics fan from the e-bus by pushing in the CB and the fan > motor did > > not engage. I tried the same with the defroster fan at the switch and the > motor did > > not turn on. Both of these are low amperage and both showed ! > > 10 amps power with the handheld voltmeter downstream of the CB and > Switch. No > > electrical item (all that I have radios etc will not come on. > > > > I do not understand what the problem is ? The person who recharged my > battery said > > it recharged in 2 hours and only drew about 2 amps. > > > > > > _- > > > ==================================================== > > ====== > > _- > > > ==================================================== > > ====== > > _- > > > ==================================================== > > ====== > > _- > > > ==================================================== > > ====== > > > > > > > > > > > > > _- > ==================================================== > ====== > _- > ==================================================== > ====== > _- > ==================================================== > ====== > _- > ==================================================== > ====== > > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 08:09:15 PM PST US From: "David Lloyd" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Ignition Interference ..joining this thread late... I assume that you have a large, well connected ground cable from the engine case to the aircraft frame...?? D ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Harley To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 3:52 PM Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Ignition Interference I came across this on the Microaire website today...it's a bit specific for strobe noise, but does go into other possible sources and their elimination. Specifically mentioning ground problems and how they can affect the radios. Even if you can't use it (or already have!) it may make a good check list for others here. www.microair.com.au/admin/uploads/StrobeTroubleShooting1.pdf Harley ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- On 5/16/2012 6:29 PM, Richard Girard wrote: Borrow a different radio or use a handheld connected through your antenna system. Rick Girard On Wed, May 16, 2012 at 12:05 AM, messydeer wrote: I'm having a major problem with RFI in my Jabiru 3300 Sonex. Radio is MGL V6, just out a few months ago. Antenna is a belly mounted homemade one made from a CB antenna. It's 22" long with a single bend, mounted ~2' behind the firewall, ~2' below the com radio. Bob made the cable, RGxxx, double shielded. I get ignition noise, left mag much worse than the right. What I've done Replaced spark plugs with resistive type. No difference. Disconnected the shielded P leads. No difference. Disconnected antenna, which cutout all noise. So I figure the noise is radiated, not conducted. I think I had the squelch all the way down, but it's possible it was turned up a little. Connected a separate battery. No difference. Put beads on coil to distributor leads, antenna, power and ground leads. No difference. Left mag makes 90% of the noise. Turned off left mag and pulled right plug wires sequentially. The right mag has always made a much slower 'tick' than the left, but still couldn't isolate it this way. Removed jacks and a switch that could have caused ground loops on the panel. No difference. Disconnected comm antenna (on belly, 2' aft of firewall) and connected radio to ELT antenna on top tailcone ~8-10' further back. Cut down noise, but still noticeable. Replaced left mag spark plug wires with Accel 300+ ferro spiral plug wires. No difference Swapped distributor caps. I was in a hurry to get my pilot up in the air, so didn't listen. He said there was no difference in flight. His transmissions were very poor. The only time he was easily understood was when he throttled back on final. He later told me the left and right were both noisy. Changing the distributor caps didn't seem to do anything. They also looked fine on the inside. Things I may try With the new plug wires in, connect the radio to the ELT antenna 8' further back on the tailcone. Comm antenna is belly mounted, 2' back of the firewall. I'd done this before the plug wire upgrade and it made a significant improvement, but the noise was still very noticeable. Connect a handheld to the comm antenna. If the noise goes away, it's gotta be the radio, since we've already ruled out noise via system conduction. Check the SWR. If this is reasonable to do, I'd prolly buy a meter for $50. My comm antenna is 22" long that I made from a cut down CB antenna. If it shows >3, I'd fix it or buy a real one. I'll make sure athe alternator leads going to the voltage regulator are twisted. Replace the coil to distributor lead with noiseless wire. Some have had success with this, but most have tamed the noise with beads after using noiseless plug wires. I don't want to replace this stock coil lead, since I'm not sure I could make a secure connection and I'm doubtful it would do any good. Any sugestions? -------- Dan Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=373137#373137 ========== -List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List ========== http://forums.matronics.com ========== le, List Admin. ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution ========== -- Zulu Delta Mk IIIC Thanks, Homer GBYM It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy. - Groucho Marx No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 05/16/12 ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 10:08:40 PM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Ignition Interference From: "messydeer" > you have a large, well connected ground cable Yes > . If there is a problem with both Transmit and receive then look to the > Antenna and Feedline or the radio itself. Seems reasonable. A hangar neighbor dropped off his SWR meter. I'll get an adapter and check things tomorrow. Thanks! -------- Dan Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=373209#373209 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message aeroelectric-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/aeroelectric-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/aeroelectric-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.