Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:01 AM - Re: KIS-List: weights and balances- battery (Owen Baker)
2. 05:23 AM - Over-voltage Circuit Breaker Trips (Jack Haviland)
3. 05:29 AM - Re: Re: KIS-List: weights and balances- battery (Harley)
4. 08:22 AM - Re: Over-voltage Circuit Breaker Trips (Ken)
5. 01:43 PM - Solid state trim controller (Martymason)
6. 02:41 PM - Re: Solid state trim controller (The Kuffels)
7. 03:44 PM - Re: Over-voltage Circuit Breaker Trips (John MacCallum)
8. 04:09 PM - Re: grounding procedures (John MacCallum)
9. 06:01 PM - Re: Solid state trim controller (bob-tcw)
10. 07:34 PM - How to Use Your iPhone with Your Garmin Audio Panel (Bob Falstad)
11. 09:10 PM - Re: How to Use Your iPhone with Your Garmin Audio Panel (Tim Andres)
12. 10:26 PM - Re: Over-voltage Circuit Breaker Trips (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: KIS-List: weights and balances- battery |
7/16/2012
Hello Keith, You wrote: "My 10 year old Concorde battery ( CB35) finally
gave up last winter........"
10 years old -- Wow, how did it "give up"? When a car battery finally
"gives up" the scenario is usually that one can not get the starter to crank
the engine. There is the usual inconvenience of getting a jump start, then
driving to a battery supply source, replacing the battery, and proceeding
on one's merry way. No great harm done.
When an airplane battery can no longer crank the engine that battery has
long since previously lost its capacity to supply electrical power to
operate any essential electrical devices in the airplane for any significant
period of time should the alternator fail. If inability to operate any
essential electrical devices for the period of time needed to get the
airplane safely on the ground is unacceptable then the pilot has a much more
serious problem than just getting a jump start.
In that "inability to operate" scenario, flying with a clapped out battery
(which can provide no electrical reserve) is analogous to flying with
essentially no fuel reserve and expecting to always being able to safely
land and taxi to a fuel source before the propeller stops cooling the
pilot -- not good.
So using successful engine cranking as the sole indicator of an airplane's
battery's health (reserve capacity) can be deleterious to the pilot's
health. What can one do to ensure that there is sufficient electrical
capacity remaining in the battery for
essential / endurance needs when just cranking the engine is not a good
indicator of battery actual capacity? There are two methods:
1) Use a battery capacity tester to determine the reserve capacity of the
battery. Here is just one example:
http://www.gillbatteries.com/capacitytesters.aspx
2) Just arbitrarily replace the airplane's battery at some periodic
interval -- say every two years?
Bob Nuckolls, our great electrical guru, has touched on this subject in his
postings on the Matronics aeroelectric-list many times. His thoughts on the
subject can be researched through the list archival search capacity.
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator/?AeroElectric-List
His Jun 09, 2005 posting on battery testing gives his philosophy on
preferring this second course of action.
OC
===============================================================================
From: Keith.Miller@esa.int
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 3:59 AM
Subject: Re: KIS-List: weights and balances- battery
--> KIS-List message posted by: Keith.Miller@esa.int
Jesse
My 10 year old Concorde battery ( CB35) finally gave up last winter and I
replaced it with an Aerovoltz Lithium Iron phosphate battery weighing just
3Lbs, So far It has spun up the engine without any problems , but only time
can tell if its as reliable as my old lead acid , this solution moved my
Cof
G forward without any need to rewire or move hardware.
Keith
Message 2
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| Subject: | Over-voltage Circuit Breaker Trips |
Bob N./Fred S./et al,
Thanks for the suggestions!
My OV device was in heavy shrink wrap (not "potted") so it must be the B&C Specialities
version. I exposed the trim pot and tried turning it 1.5 turns CCW and
(later) 3 turns CW but the CB still trips. Since the circuit breaker and voltage
regulator have been replaced the cause appears to be some hidden fault in
the wiring or internal to the alternator.
The Van's alternator came with a removable plastic connector for the field wire
but no positive method for securing the connector to the alternator. I made the
field wire connection using an Amp female push tab. It feels secure but I'll
try crimping the working end of the terminal slightly tighter on the alternator
lug and revising the wire support strategy. The voltage regulator is grounded
to a block of tabs on the firewall and the other connections appear secure
and continuous.
Any further thoughts will be greatly appreciated.
Jack H.
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: KIS-List: weights and balances- battery |
<bakerocb@cox.net>
> 7/16/2012
> 1) Use a battery capacity tester to determine the reserve
> capacity of the battery. Here is just one example:
> www.gillbatteries.com/capacitytesters.aspx
Whoah! $1252! You can do at least 25 years of two year battery
exchanges for that much money! If you really want a battery
capacity tester, how about the one form Harbor Freight:
www.harborfreight.com/500-amp-carbon-pile-load-tester-91129.html
Less than the cost of 1 battery (BTW, I have an iron in this
fire...I have one of these...so far no complaints...except it
does get pretty warm when using it!)
Harley
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Over-voltage Circuit Breaker Trips |
Jack
If wired correctly understand that the OV CB can not be your problem. It
does nothing unless the OV triggers it. When the crowbar OV circuit
activates, it shorts the CB to ground and the CB pops. Bob does have a
little test procedure published on how to test or set the trip point of
the OV module. I would suggest checking the trigger voltage or replacing
the OV module.
There were a few homemade modules that were overly sensitive to small
voltage excursions and were nuisance tripping. Turning on or off any
electrical switch would often trip that unit in my aircraft. There was a
capacitor added to stabilize the voltage reference in the OV module to
fix that issue several years ago. Mine have never tripped since that
circuit mod.
I think you are doing the right thing by tracking this down just in case
the trips are being caused by a real over voltage. If you are still
confident that the regulator is OK then I'd probably dissemble and clean
every connection between the alternator, regulator, and battery. I have
not had any trouble using a PIDG connector on my alternator.
Ken
On 16/07/2012 8:22 AM, Jack Haviland wrote:
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jack
> Haviland<jgh2@charter.net>
>
> Bob N./Fred S./et al,
>
> Thanks for the suggestions!
>
> My OV device was in heavy shrink wrap (not "potted") so it must be
> the B&C Specialities version. I exposed the trim pot and tried
> turning it 1.5 turns CCW and (later) 3 turns CW but the CB still
> trips. Since the circuit breaker and voltage regulator have been
> replaced the cause appears to be some hidden fault in the wiring or
> internal to the alternator.
>
> The Van's alternator came with a removable plastic connector for the
> field wire but no positive method for securing the connector to the
> alternator. I made the field wire connection using an Amp female push
> tab. It feels secure but I'll try crimping the working end of the
> terminal slightly tighter on the alternator lug and revising the wire
> support strategy. The voltage regulator is grounded to a block of
> tabs on the firewall and the other connections appear secure and
> continuous.
>
> Any further thoughts will be greatly appreciated.
>
> Jack H.
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Solid state trim controller |
Lectric' Bob,
Have you done anything with the two channel solid-state trim controller? If so
when might a circuit board be available?
I downloaded the PDF drawing of the circuit but could not find anything on the
AE Connection web site. A three channel board would be useful for those with rudder
trim.
Marty Mason
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378436#378436
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Solid state trim controller |
Marty,
<< two channel solid-state trim controller? >>
Over a year ago Kitplanes accepted my article for a "no-etch" circuit board
version of just such a gizmo. If their editor got some emails telling them
there is a market need for this article maybe they will print it soon.
Meanwhile, don't know why I couldn't email you a copy of the schematic,
board and manuscript privately especially if you promise to buy/subscribe to
Kitplanes anyway. Because of the dual ICs used, adding 2 more channels is
easier than just one but a third would still not be a big deal. Email me
off-list if you want the details.
Tom Kuffel
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Over-voltage Circuit Breaker Trips |
As an experiment I would obtain two .01 mfd ceramic capacitors and bypass the Terminals
of the CB to ground. One on each terminal to ground and see if that fixes
the problem.
Cheers
John MacCallum
Rv10 41016
Sent from my iPad
On 16/07/2012, at 22:22, Jack Haviland <jgh2@charter.net> wrote:
>
> Bob N./Fred S./et al,
>
> Thanks for the suggestions!
>
> My OV device was in heavy shrink wrap (not "potted") so it must be the B&C Specialities
version. I exposed the trim pot and tried turning it 1.5 turns CCW
and (later) 3 turns CW but the CB still trips. Since the circuit breaker and voltage
regulator have been replaced the cause appears to be some hidden fault
in the wiring or internal to the alternator.
>
> The Van's alternator came with a removable plastic connector for the field wire
but no positive method for securing the connector to the alternator. I made
the field wire connection using an Amp female push tab. It feels secure but I'll
try crimping the working end of the terminal slightly tighter on the alternator
lug and revising the wire support strategy. The voltage regulator is grounded
to a block of tabs on the firewall and the other connections appear secure
and continuous.
>
> Any further thoughts will be greatly appreciated.
>
> Jack H.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: grounding procedures |
Interesting read but I think largely urban myth. It is certainly possible to get
a spark produced through rectification of RF by a bad joint in a wire or even
sheet metal. That is the main reason you can not have a transmitter around explosives.
A Cell phone is just a fancy two way radio and it is connected to and talking to
the Network whenever it is turned on. So it is possible for a cellphone to transmit
without you doing anything.
Just having it in your pocket would be a hazard if we accept the urban myth.
For example, The led display turning on will not induce a static charge in anything.
I think it is much more likely those types of events described in the warnings
are because of the types of clothes that people were wearing and that they were
ungrounded until they touched something on the vehicle.
To be safe you should ground yourself and the vehicle before you take the fuel
cap off.
I try to remember to touch the fuel hose to the car before I take the fuel cap
off.
Cheers
John MacCallum
Sent from my iPad
On 14/07/2012, at 1:01, Ron Walker <n520tx@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I agree that cell phone usage while fueling a car is not wise (you
> should be paying attention to the task at hand), this specific "Warning
> from Shell" is an internet urban legend.
>
> http://www.snopes.com/autos/hazards/gasvapor.asp
>
>
> On Fri, 2012-07-13 at 07:49 -0700, Richard wrote:
>> WARNING FROM SHELL OIL COMPANY DO NOT DELETE, PLEASE READ
>>
>>
>> MUST READ, EVEN IF YOU DON'T OWN A CAR
>>
>>
>> Shell Oil Comments - A MUST READ!
>>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Solid state trim controller |
I'm all for people experimenting, however, if you aren't looking for a
project, just wanted to make sure you know that we sell one and two axis
solid state trim controllers. They provide run-away trim prevention, two
adjustable speeds and allow for pilot and copilot control switches. For
all the details visit www.tcwtech.com and click on the Safety-Trim
picture. We'll be at Oshkosh, booth 4095 if you want a demo.
Thanks,
Bob Newman
RV-10 N541RV
-----Original Message-----
From: Martymason
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 4:42 PM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Solid state trim controller
<captainmarty@bellsouth.net>
Lectric' Bob,
Have you done anything with the two channel solid-state trim controller? If
so when might a circuit board be available?
I downloaded the PDF drawing of the circuit but could not find anything on
the AE Connection web site. A three channel board would be useful for those
with rudder trim.
Marty Mason
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378436#378436
Message 10
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| Subject: | How to Use Your iPhone with Your Garmin Audio Panel |
Folks,
Rather than ask a question, I thought I'd pass on one solution I came up with if
you want/need to plug your iPhone into your Garmin Audio Panel (my audio panel
is the non-TSO'd GMA 240 but I assume this approach will work with other Garmin
audio panels, at least). I need this capability to call ATC for IFR clearances
from uncontrolled fields where there aren't other communication capabilities.
Best regards,
Bob
GlaStar N248BF
~460 Hours
Per "Peter" at Garmin Tech Support, the three conductors in the 2.5 mm patch cord
that plugs into the audio panel have the following functions:
Tip = Mic
Ring = Audio
Sleeve = Common/Ground.
He had access to documentation for the iPhone's four-conductor, 3.5 mm plug/receptacle
and he said it is wired up like this:
Tip = R.H. Audio Channel
Ring No. 1 = L.H. Audio Channel
Ring No. 2 = Common/Ground
Sleeve = Mic.
I found the following item (iPhone TTY Adapter) on Apple's on-line store. http://store.apple.com/us/product/MA854G/A?fnode=MTY1NDAzOQ#overview (The part number is MA854G/A.) Our local Apple store had one in stock so I bought it. It is pretty spendy at $19 but it is an Apple, not third-party, product and the build quality looks good (it is very small and could get lost easily). You may be able to find another source that is less expensive.
I checked it out with my ohmmeter. Here are the results:
Male 3.5 mm Plug Female 2.5 mm Receptacle
Tip (open)
Ring No. 1 Ring
Ring No. 2 Sleeve
Sleeve Tip
I tested it out tonight with the 2.5mm patch cord that came with the audio panel
and it works just fine. I got mono audio in both ears on my Bose headset.
My wife said she could hear me just fine (this was a ground test without the engine
running) and I could hear her just fine. As you place the call, you do
hear all the normal ringing sounds as the call goes through.
So now you know where to get an item that will allow iPhone users to plug their
phone into their Garmin audio panels.
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: How to Use Your iPhone with Your Garmin Audio Panel |
Thanks Bob!
I've been meaning to figure this out myself. I have a PSE panel but Im going
to assume there is some sort of standard on these and just order the adapte
r from Amazon. I see them there all the way from the genuine apple product a
t $14 down to some that cost less than the shipping.
Tim
Sent from my iPad
On Jul 16, 2012, at 7:33 PM, Bob Falstad <bobair@me.com> wrote:
> Folks,
>
> Rather than ask a question, I thought I'd pass on one solution I came up w
ith if you want/need to plug your iPhone into your Garmin Audio Panel (my au
dio panel is the non-TSO'd GMA 240 but I assume this approach will work with
other Garmin audio panels, at least). I need this capability to call ATC f
or IFR clearances from uncontrolled fields where there aren't other communic
ation capabilities.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Bob
> GlaStar N248BF
> ~460 Hours
>
> Per "Peter" at Garmin Tech Support, the three conductors in the 2.5 mm pat
ch cord that plugs into the audio panel have the following functions:
>
> Tip = Mic
>
> Ring = Audio
>
> Sleeve = Common/Ground.
>
> He had access to documentation for the iPhone's four-conductor, 3.5 mm plu
g/receptacle and he said it is wired up like this:
>
> Tip = R.H. Audio Channel
>
> Ring No. 1 = L.H. Audio Channel
>
> Ring No. 2 = Common/Ground
>
> Sleeve = Mic.
>
> I found the following item (iPhone TTY Adapter) on Apple's on-line store. h
ttp://store.apple.com/us/product/MA854G/A?fnode=MTY1NDAzOQ#overview (Th
e part number is MA854G/A.) Our local Apple store had one in stock so I bou
ght it. It is pretty spendy at $19 but it is an Apple, not third-party, pro
duct and the build quality looks good (it is very small and could get lost e
asily). You may be able to find another source that is less expensive.
>
> I checked it out with my ohmmeter. Here are the results:
>
> Male 3.5 mm Plug Female 2.5 mm Receptacle
>
> Tip (open)
>
> Ring No. 1 Ring
>
> Ring No. 2 Sleeve
>
> Sleeve Tip
>
> I tested it out tonight with the 2.5mm patch cord that came with the audio
panel and it works just fine. I got mono audio in both ears on my Bose hea
dset. My wife said she could hear me just fine (this was a ground test with
out the engine running) and I could hear her just fine. As you place the ca
ll, you do hear all the normal ringing sounds as the call goes through.
>
> So now you know where to get an item that will allow iPhone users to plug t
heir phone into their Garmin audio panels.
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Over-voltage Circuit Breaker Trips |
At 07:22 AM 7/16/2012, you wrote:
>
>Bob N./Fred S./et al,
>
>Thanks for the suggestions!
>
>My OV device was in heavy shrink wrap (not "potted") so it must be
>the B&C Specialities version. I exposed the trim pot and tried
>turning it 1.5 turns CCW and (later) 3 turns CW but the CB still
>trips. Since the circuit breaker and voltage regulator have been
>replaced the cause appears to be some hidden fault in the wiring or
>internal to the alternator.
Hmmmm . . . the fact that adjusting the
screw had no observable effects is mystifying.
If the OV module you have is fitted with a
muti-turn pot, it sounds like one of mine.
In any case, I'd like to see the one you
have. I don't have a mailing address for you
in my sales data base . . . irrespective of
where it came from, I'd like to trade with
you. Give me an address to mail you a new
one along with a stamped envelope to return
the old one to me.
Bob . . .
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