---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 10/02/12: 7 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 03:53 AM - Re: Compatable Shunt (user9253) 2. 09:20 AM - Re: Re: Compatable Shunt (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 3. 12:37 PM - Re: Re: Compatable Shunt (Carlos W Jazun) 4. 01:03 PM - Re: Compatable Shunt (user9253) 5. 07:07 PM - Re: Re: Compatable Shunt (fedico94@mchsi.com) 6. 07:09 PM - Re: Re: Compatable Shunt (fedico94@mchsi.com) 7. 07:11 PM - Re: Re: Compatable Shunt (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 03:53:53 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Compatable Shunt From: "user9253" > The G3X manual you refer to lists the calibration procedure for Hall effect sensor on page 12020. Cn this be used with the Shunt ? I suspect there is no calibration for the shunt. I do not know if the calibration procedure is for only Hall Effect sensors or for both Hall Effect and Shunts. The manual is not clear on this point. You could ask Garmin support. If there is no calibration procedure for shunts, then only a +/-50mV, 100amp shunt can be used, if you want the display to be accurate. Easier than calling Garmin would be to try calibrating per page 12-20. What do you have to lose except a little time? If it doesn't work, you can reset the parameters back to default. Joe -------- Joe Gores Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=384452#384452 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 09:20:56 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Compatable Shunt At 05:52 AM 10/2/2012, you wrote: > > > > The G3X manual you refer to lists the calibration procedure for > Hall effect sensor on page 12020. Cn this be used with the Shunt ? > I suspect there is no calibration for the shunt. > >I do not know if the calibration procedure is for only Hall Effect >sensors or for both Hall Effect and Shunts. The manual is not clear >on this point. You could ask Garmin support. If there is no >calibration procedure for shunts, then only a +/-50mV, 100amp shunt >can be used, if you want the display to be accurate. In a customer's airplane, cutting wires and splicing back requires different levels of inspection than simply Pushing the pin out of a connector to route a wire through the hall device. The AMPLOC hall sensors are really handy. I've used them many times especially when I needed to measure current in a wire for which I was discouraged from doing damage. Over the years, I developed some tools that offered a quick-n-dirty access to current-in-the-wire . . . http://tinyurl.com/8n6fo2n http://tinyurl.com/8zqqetc The KEY series AMPLOC devices http://tinyurl.com/8gtrsru Are more user friendly for getting electrons-per-second counted in fat wires. They do have the disadvantage of needing power to operate . . . and it must be well regulated since the output is ratiometric to the supply voltage. They are bi-directional devices . . . meaning that zero amps is some value close to 1/2 that of the applied power. Hence the need for a wide range of offset programming to move from shunts (zero volts at zero amps) to hall effect sensors (some volts at zero amps). http://tinyurl.com/8suspug I suspect that the Garmin display value for AMPS is derived from analog data which is then massaged for offset and scale factor. Given the extensive references for 50mv/100A shunts for both wiring and discussion of AMPS sensing, I'd bet that the default programming assumes a 50mv/100A shunt. The resolution of their a/d system would allow the 100A shunt to be used virtually anywhere . . . even in series with an SD-8, without adjustment to default offset and scale factors. I don't recall if the subject problem was "no reading" or inaccurate reading. Of course, no reading could be either wiring error . . . or there's no actual current flowing to be measured and displayed. Inaccurate reading could be due to 60A shunt being used without re-calibration for the higher scale-factor value. A more detailed study of symptoms and conditions is called for. I suspect that either of the shunts in hand will do the job . . . just need to learn the correct incantation and wave of the wand to get the hardware's attention. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 12:37:59 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Compatable Shunt From: Carlos W Jazun Hello Bob, Got the book, good job, I'm really enjoying it. Quick question, how do I un-suscribe from the forum??? I get about 30 email s an hour! hard to keep up with it. Thanks Regards Walter -----Original Message----- From: Robert L. Nuckolls, III Sent: Mon, Oct 1, 2012 9:54 pm Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Compatable Shunt At 09:43 PM 10/1/2012, you wrote: > >The G3X manual you refer to lists the calibration procedure for Hall >effect sensor on page 12020. Cn this be used with the Shunt ? I >suspect there is no calibration for the shunt. >Thanks for the reference, I have to keep up on the manual revisions >as they add new devices all the time. After initial test flights I >will have to update the software as well. I downloaded the g3x manual. A search of the book cites 82 instances of the word "shunt" where the expected device is a 50mv/100A device. There are also 8 instances of Hall Effect where it appears you can use AmpLoc KEY100 style sensors. Paragraph 8.3 speaks to the use of either. I was unable to find any schematic references to hall devices. They have 3 wire connections and need a source of clean power. Also, hall effect sensors are noted for their variability in both offset and scale factor . . . they require individual calibration for accuracy. Shunts are precision, two wire devices that are very predictable. Suggest you stay with the 100A shunt. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 01:03:14 PM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Compatable Shunt From: "user9253" > Of course, no reading could be > either wiring error . . . or there's no actual current > flowing to be measured and displayed. It is too bad that we are so far from the aircraft. It would be fun to do some troubleshooting in person. The original posting said that there was zero amperage displayed. And he said that the 60amp shunt was installed. If anything, the 60 amp shunt should read higher current than a 100amp shunt. It would be helpful to know the millivolts across the shunt compared to the millivolts at the input to the G3X. If those voltages are equal and above zero and there is no amperage displayed, then the problem is the G3X, perhaps a software setup problem. Joe -------- Joe Gores Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=384503#384503 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:07:17 PM PST US From: fedico94@mchsi.com Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Compatable Shunt With the 80 pin (read delicate) connector I am reluctant to pull it. The information I have from Garmin implies that the G3X will not read unless it has 5 milliohm resister (rather than 8.3) Job one is to test fly with voltmeter. andswap out the shunt in the next few weeks. will recheck wiring tomorrow ----- Original Message ----- From: user9253 Sent: Tue, 2 Oct 2012 15:02:29 -0500 (CDT) Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Compatable Shunt > Of course, no reading could be > either wiring error . . . or there's no actual current > flowing to be measured and displayed. It is too bad that we are so far from the aircraft. It would be fun to do some troubleshooting in person. The original posting said that there was zero amperage displayed. And he said that the 60amp shunt was installed. If anything, the 60 amp shunt should read higher current than a 100amp shunt. It would be helpful to know the millivolts across the shunt compared to the millivolts at the input to the G3X. If those voltages are equal and above zero and there is no amperage displayed, then the problem is the G3X, perhaps a software setup problem. Joe -------- Joe Gores Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=384503#384503 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 07:09:21 PM PST US From: fedico94@mchsi.com Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Compatable Shunt The readout has a red "X" through it meaning inoperable, no scale is displayed ----- Original Message ----- From: user9253 Sent: Tue, 2 Oct 2012 15:02:29 -0500 (CDT) Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Compatable Shunt > Of course, no reading could be > either wiring error . . . or there's no actual current > flowing to be measured and displayed. It is too bad that we are so far from the aircraft. It would be fun to do some troubleshooting in person. The original posting said that there was zero amperage displayed. And he said that the 60amp shunt was installed. If anything, the 60 amp shunt should read higher current than a 100amp shunt. It would be helpful to know the millivolts across the shunt compared to the millivolts at the input to the G3X. If those voltages are equal and above zero and there is no amperage displayed, then the problem is the G3X, perhaps a software setup problem. Joe -------- Joe Gores Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=384503#384503 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 07:11:02 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Compatable Shunt At 02:36 PM 10/2/2012, you wrote: >Hello Bob, > >Got the book, good job, I'm really enjoying it. > >Quick question, how do I un-suscribe from the forum??? I get about >30 emails an hour! hard to keep up with it. > >Thanks > >Regards > >Walter 30 an hour? I don't think I get 30 a day. In any case, they're very easy to delete if the topic is uninteresting to you. I have submitted an un-subscription request. When it arrives in your email, click on the link within the e-mail to confirm your request. 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