AeroElectric-List Digest Archive

Mon 10/08/12


Total Messages Posted: 9



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 06:58 AM - $20 B-crimp tool find (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
     2. 10:22 AM - Right Angle Fast-on (Michael Wynn)
     3. 11:05 AM - Re: Right Angle Fast-on (James Kilford)
     4. 12:19 PM - Re: Right Angle Fast-on (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
     5. 12:28 PM - Re: Right Angle Fast-on (Jeff Luckey)
     6. 06:21 PM - Re: OEM or home-made ELT antennas? (dlj04)
     7. 06:46 PM - Re: Right Angle Fast-on (MLWynn@aol.com)
     8. 09:33 PM - Re: Right Angle Fast-on (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
     9. 09:33 PM - Re: Right Angle Fast-on (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 06:58:40 AM PST US
    From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
    Subject: $20 B-crimp tool find
    A few weeks ago I mentioned a find on eBay for a b-crimp tool for $20 postage paid. Emacs! The picture looked good but you couldn't see die details in the ad. I ordered one and produced the following pictures. Emacs! Emacs! This isn't an AMP or Molex tool but the dies are the right shape. The big disappointment was that I couldn't find a b-crimp terminal anyplace in my goodies with which to try it out. I'll be going to Wichita next weekend for some remodeling supplies, I'll find some terminals and report further. In the mean time, I wouldn't discourage any of you from acquiring one of these. The price is right. I don't the smallest die will close sufficiently to do d-sub b-crimp pins but it should handle everything larger like the AMP strobe supply connectors and possibly down to the .060" miniature pins in Molex connectors. Watch this space . . . Bob . . .


    Message 2


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    Time: 10:22:44 AM PST US
    Subject: Right Angle Fast-on
    From: Michael Wynn <mlwynn@aol.com>
    Hi all, ? I am installing an electronic ignition in my RV 8 and have a place where a coax wire is split to two fast-on's and then into a coil.? The turn is a ri ght angle.? Someone posted on VAF that the right angle bend caused the wire to fatigue at the fast-on and fail.? They suggested re-routing the wires s o that the right angle is eliminated.? I have looked at my installation and can do that, but it will require a lot of brou-ha.? The question is, does anyone make a right angle adaptor for fast-ons?? Something like a female en d, right angle, male end so you could plug one into the coil and then the c oax into the adaptor.? I am not sure how you would crimp one that was just a right angle.? The other option is to crimp it and then bend the fast-on 9 0 degrees.? I am afraid that would weaken the connector in an unacceptable manner. ? Thoughts? ? Michael Wynn RV 8 Finishing San Ramon, CA


    Message 3


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    Time: 11:05:11 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Right Angle Fast-on
    From: James Kilford <james@etravel.org>
    Hi Michael, I think I see what you're saying... Could you introduce an extra loop of coax shortly before the two connectors, so that the mechanical stress and vibration is taken out of the bend -- like the loop you might put into a copper capillary line from the engine to the panel? Alternatively, is there some way of forcing the 90 bend in the coax into a particular shape with some mechanical support? In bonsai you wrap thick copper wire around young branches to guide them, and it strikes me that something similar might be fashioned for your coax? FWIW. James On 8 October 2012 18:20, Michael Wynn <mlwynn@aol.com> wrote: > Hi all, > > I am installing an electronic ignition in my RV 8 and have a place where a > coax wire is split to two fast-on's and then into a coil. The turn is a > right angle. Someone posted on VAF that the right angle bend caused the > wire to fatigue at the fast-on and fail. They suggested re-routing the > wires so that the right angle is eliminated. I have looked at my > installation and can do that, but it will require a lot of brou-ha. The > question is, does anyone make a right angle adaptor for fast-ons? > Something like a female end, right angle, male end so you could plug one > into the coil and then the coax into the adaptor. I am not sure how you > would crimp one that was just a right angle. The other option is to crimp > it and then bend the fast-on 90 degrees. I am afraid that would weaken the > connector in an unacceptable manner. > > Thoughts? > > Michael Wynn > RV 8 Finishing > San Ramon, CA > > * > > * > >


    Message 4


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    Time: 12:19:06 PM PST US
    From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
    Subject: Re: Right Angle Fast-on
    At 01:04 PM 10/8/2012, you wrote: Hi Michael,=C2 I think I see what you're saying...=C2 Could you introduce an extra loop of coax shortly before the two connectors, so that the mechanical stress and vibration =C2 is taken out of the bend -- like the loop you might put into a copper capillary line from the engine to the panel?=C2 Alternatively, is there some way of forcing the 90 bend in the coax into a particular shape with some mechanical support? =C2 In bonsai you wrap thick copper wire around young branches to guide them, and it strikes me that something similar might be fashioned for your coax? FWIW.=C2 James Good thought. I was going to ask if he could "drive past" the termination points on the coils and then do a 270-degree turn to bring the fast-ons back around to the coils with a more generous bend relief. Say about 2" diameter circle? I'm really sorry that this system got coax cable speced into it. Klaus and I got into a little tiff some years back when I suggested ordinary tefzel shielded wire . . . MUCH more user friendly. Got into a 'discussion' about nano-second rise time differences between coax and shielded wire. IMHO insignificant to the design goal of lighting fires in the cylinders. The measurable and demonstrable difference between coax and shielded wire STILL left the system about 100 times better than a magneto . . . which runs the engine just fine but with fixed timing. Be that as it may, your choices are restricted by the selection of wire between power supply and the coils. There ARE right angle fast-on terminals [] Emacs! But they are not PIDG and I'd be reluctant to use them under the cowl. Bob . . .


    Message 5


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    Time: 12:28:44 PM PST US
    From: "Jeff Luckey" <JLuckey@pacbell.net>
    Subject: Right Angle Fast-on
    Michael, Would something like pictured here: http://www.elliottelectric.com/Products/Detail.aspx?v=TAB <http://www.elliottelectric.com/Products/Detail.aspx?v=TAB&c=RA18250A> &c=RA18250A Do what you want? _____ From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael Wynn Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 10:21 Subject: AeroElectric-List: Right Angle Fast-on Hi all, I am installing an electronic ignition in my RV 8 and have a place where a coax wire is split to two fast-on's and then into a coil. The turn is a right angle. Someone posted on VAF that the right angle bend caused the wire to fatigue at the fast-on and fail. They suggested re-routing the wires so that the right angle is eliminated. I have looked at my installation and can do that, but it will require a lot of brou-ha. The question is, does anyone make a right angle adaptor for fast-ons? Something like a female end, right angle, male end so you could plug one into the coil and then the coax into the adaptor. I am not sure how you would crimp one that was just a right angle. The other option is to crimp it and then bend the fast-on 90 degrees. I am afraid that would weaken the connector in an unacceptable manner. Thoughts? Michael Wynn RV 8 Finishing San Ramon, CA No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com


    Message 6


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    Time: 06:21:49 PM PST US
    From: dlj04 <dlj04@josephson.com>
    Subject: Re: OEM or home-made ELT antennas?
    TSO requirements are not necessarily associated with the airframe certification, but in order to operate in the national airspace system certain "approved" items are needed, such as ELTs and transponders. The requirement is in Part 91 (general operating and flight rules), not Part 23 or some other airworthiness requirement so it's the same for all aircraft. Many early ELTs had very primitive circuit designs in order to operate at 121.5 and 243 MHz, which resulted in antennas that didn't look like traditional quarter-wave whips at either frequency. The antenna is part of the design. Also, if you are to operate an aircraft with an ELT installed after March 1998, in order to be "approved" it has to be certified to TSO C91a, not the older C91. Many of the bargain ELTs in flymarkets work, but are illegal to use once they have been removed from the aircraft in which they were originally installed. If you have a C91 ELT there had better be a logbook entry documenting its installation prior to 1998.


    Message 7


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    Time: 06:46:00 PM PST US
    From: MLWynn@aol.com
    Subject: Re: Right Angle Fast-on
    Thank you all for your insights. I have scratched my head about this a bunch. I don't really have two inches from the baffle to coils. It is a little late to try to put them in a different spot. Too much re-engineeri ng. Considering what Bob is saying about the discussion with Klaus, maybe I should terminate the coax an inch or two away and crimp or solder on a sho rt piece of 18 gauge tefzel and us that to make the bend. Add a couple of supports and I should be okay. Does that seem reasonable? Regards, Michael Wynn RV 8 Finishing San Ramon, CA In a message dated 10/8/2012 12:22:08 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com writes: At 01:04 PM 10/8/2012, you wrote: Hi Michael,=C2 I think I see what you're saying...=C2 Could you introduce an extra loop of coax shortly before the two connectors, so that the mechanical stress and vibration =C2 is taken out o f the bend -- like the loop you might put into a copper capillary line from the engin e to the panel?=C2 Alternatively, is there some way of forcing the 90 bend in the coax into a particular shape with some mechanical support? =C2 In bonsai you wrap thic k copper wire around young branches to guide them, and it strikes me that something similar might be fashioned for your coax? FWIW.=C2 James Good thought. I was going to ask if he could "drive past" the termination points on the coils and then do a 270-degree turn to bring the fast-ons back around to the coils with a more generous bend relief. Say about 2" diameter circle? I'm really sorry that this system got coax cable speced into it. Klaus and I got into a little tiff some years back when I suggested ordinary tefzel shielded wire . . . MUCH more user friendly. Got into a 'discussion' about nano-second rise time differences between coax and shielded wire. IMHO insignificant to the design goal of lighting fires in the cylinders. The measurable and demonstrable difference between coax and shielded wire STILL left the system about 100 times better than a magneto . . . which runs the engine just fine but with fixed timing. Be that as it may, your choices are restricted by the selection of wire between power supply and the coils. There ARE right angle fast-on terminals But they are not PIDG and I'd be reluctant to use them under the cowl. Bob . . .


    Message 8


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    Time: 09:33:22 PM PST US
    From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
    Subject: Re: Right Angle Fast-on
    At 08:45 PM 10/8/2012, you wrote: >Thank you all for your insights. I have scratched my head about >this a bunch. I don't really have two inches from the baffle to >coils. It is a little late to try to put them in a different >spot. Too much re-engineering. Considering what Bob is saying >about the discussion with Klaus, maybe I should terminate the coax >an inch or two away and crimp or solder on a short piece of 18 gauge >tefzel and us that to make the bend. Add a couple of supports and I >should be okay. Does that seem reasonable? I wouldn't do that. All coax or all shielded. At the time I published this Shop Note http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/RG58/RG58.html several folks had already replaced RG-58 (suffering from temperature effects under the cowl) with Tefzel shielded wire and were satisfied with the results. I can't speak to the value of sparks jumping 1.5" gaps between coil towers but if that's a performance benchmark, be aware that shielded wire substitution may pollute that particular test result. Bob . . .


    Message 9


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    Time: 09:33:56 PM PST US
    From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
    Subject: Re: Right Angle Fast-on
    Hmmm. . . I overlooked the obvious question: How much room DO you have between coil and baffle? At 08:45 PM 10/8/2012, you wrote: >Thank you all for your insights. I have scratched my head about >this a bunch. I don't really have two inches from the baffle to >coils. It is a little late to try to put them in a different >spot. Too much re-engineering. Considering what Bob is saying >about the discussion with Klaus, maybe I should terminate the coax >an inch or two away and crimp or solder on a short piece of 18 gauge >tefzel and us that to make the bend. Add a couple of supports and I >should be okay. Does that seem reasonable? I wouldn't do that. All coax or all shielded. At the time I published this Shop Note http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/RG58/RG58.html several folks had already replaced RG-58 (suffering from temperature effects under the cowl) with Tefzel shielded wire and were satisfied with the results. I can't speak to the value of sparks jumping 1.5" gaps between coil towers but if that's a performance benchmark, be aware that shielded wire substitution may pollute that particular test result. Bob . . .




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