---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 01/13/13: 20 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:50 AM - Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 9 Msgs - 01/12/13 (Scott Klemptner) 2. 02:03 AM - Bob's HF off-center-fed dipole (Linda Walker) 3. 02:09 AM - Re: Low Cost ELT Antenna (David & Elaine Lamphere) 4. 04:07 AM - Re: Ground connector (was Anderson PowerPole connectors) (James Kilford) 5. 06:13 AM - Re: Bob's HF off-center-fed dipole (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 6. 06:39 AM - Re: Ground connector (was Anderson PowerPole connectors) (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 7. 07:10 AM - Re: Lithium batteries redux (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 8. 07:40 AM - Re: Low Cost ELT Antenna (Kelly McMullen) 9. 08:06 AM - Re: Low Cost ELT Antenna (Harley) 10. 08:48 AM - Re: Low Cost ELT Antenna (Kelly McMullen) 11. 08:50 AM - Re: Ground connector (was Anderson PowerPole connectors) (Gilles Thesee) 12. 08:55 AM - Re: Ground connector (was Anderson PowerPole connectors) (Gilles Thesee) 13. 09:01 AM - Re: Lithium batteries redux (Jan de Jong) 14. 10:38 AM - Re: Ground connector (was Anderson PowerPole connectors) (Jared Yates) 15. 12:41 PM - Re: Low Cost ELT Antenna (David & Elaine Lamphere) 16. 05:13 PM - Re: Ground connector (was Anderson PowerPole connectors) (James Kilford) 17. 07:06 PM - Re: Aeroled wiring (rwtalbot) 18. 07:07 PM - Anderson PowerPole connectors (Paul Millner) 19. 08:35 PM - Re: Resurrecting a battery (rayj) 20. 08:47 PM - parallel batteries on maintainer (rayj) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:50:17 AM PST US From: Scott Klemptner Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 9 Msgs - 01/12/13 piper meridians come from the factory with an anderson connector for chargi ng the main battery =0A=0A=0Abatteryminder sells a model of their charger s pecifically for the meridian with a mating anderson connector=0A=0Ai have u sed the meridian as data to get the faa to approve similar installations on type certified aircraft, =0A=0A=0Asimilarly, i have used beech a36s using anl current limiters as data to install anls in type certified aircraft, el iminating the expensive and large alternator circuit breaker from the instr ument panel when rewiring older aircraft or replacing a failed alternator c ircuit breaker=0A=0A=0Ascott=0A=0A-=0AScott A Klemptner=0Abmwr606 on Yaho o IM=0A=0AThe difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has it s limits- Anonymous=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A>________________________________ =0A>=0A>Time: 11:42:08 AM PST US=0A>From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" =0A>Subject: AeroElectric-List: Anderson PowerPole connectors=0A>=0A>=0A>I don't know if we've talked about these folks=0A>on the List before . . . but I ran across an current=0A>application where thes e connectors appear a great=0A>alternative to knife-splices and perhaps eve n the=0A>Molex/Tyco-Amp white nylon connectors.=0A>=0A>I've uploaded a data package for the Anderson PowerPole=0A>connectors to this page on my websit e:=0A>=0A>http://tinyurl.com/cbe2t87=0A>=0A>On that page you will also find installation instructions,=0A>tools, and a link to the factory outlet wher e you can=0A>buy any quantity of housings, pins and accessories=0A>at reaso nable prices.=0A>=0A>Do a Google on Anderson Powerpole and you'll no doubt =0A>discover many other sources for this unique product=0A>line.=0A>=0A>=0A >- Bob . . . =0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A> ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 02:03:22 AM PST US From: Linda Walker Subject: AeroElectric-List: Bob's HF off-center-fed dipole Bob. I'd be interested in reading more about your off-center-fed dipole when you get around to doing it, please. Good luck with some fair weather! Patrick Elliott. G-LGEZ --------------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------------------------- Time: 12:41:12 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Anderson PowerPole connectors At 02:10 PM 1/12/2013, you wrote: > > >We ham radio guys love them.- If you put a set on your radios you >can pretty much show up anywhere and plug in and get power for your gear! > >----Jeff- - - Yeah, I've been seeing them for years but never - - really sat down and studied the products and their - - technology. Pretty slick. - - I think B&C has been using them in their SD-8 - - installation kits for years. In fact, it was - - a ham radio application that prompted me to revisit - - this product. - - I inherited a Kenwood TS440 in great shape from - - a old friend who was upgrading his station. Got - - a longwire with tuner put up which is marginally - - serviceable. Planning an off-center-fed dipole - - as soon as the weather warms up and roof-crawling - - is not so unfriendly. - - Been honing up the CW skills. Haven't been on HF - - in over 40 years but I've got some grand-children - - who should see what this ham radio stuff is all - - about. ---Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 02:09:59 AM PST US From: David & Elaine Lamphere Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Low Cost ELT Antenna The Cygnet is an experimental homebuilt - I don't believe there is any restrictions as to what he installs. There used to be do-it-yourself plans in several places including the aeroelectric site if you wanted to do that. There are also (in my opinion) affordable stub antennas you can buy. You'll probably have to mount it on an aluminum panel or equivalent ground plane. On my Tailwind I mounted my xpdr antenna on a belly pan. Dave On Jan 12, 2013, at 11:04 PM, Kelly McMullen wrote: > > > > Hate to tell you this, but it is illegal to install an original type > ELT in any aircraft as a new install. If it had a Narco about 20 > years ago, before they were made obsolete by regulation, you could > still replace with same model legally, but you can't use one as a > new install. The ELT10 is a first generation, designed in the early > 70's, and does not meet current requirements, so only old > installations are grandfathered. You are going to need a second > generation ELT, such as the Artex, ACK, or Ameriking. The cheapest > new are a little under 200. You also have to use the antenna it > comes with. > If your aircraft requires an ELT, it must be a TSO ELT of the second > generation or newer, and the TSO requires using the antenna with > which TSO was granted > > On 1/12/2013 8:48 PM, Jerald Folkerts wrote: >> >> Im several weeks away from completing my Cygnet project. The >> aircraft has no electrical system, and Ive installed an older >> Narco ELT 10 as it is theoretically a two seat aircraft. However, I >> dont have an antenna or a plan for one. What would be the simplest >> and least expensive way to go? The Cygnet is steel tube and fabric >> with a wood/fabric covered wing. >> >> Thanks, >> >> Jerry Folkerts >> >> * >> >> >> * > > > ----- > No virus found in this message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 04:07:16 AM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Ground connector (was Anderson PowerPole connectors) From: James Kilford Gilles, I went for the Piper style connector for my Jodel D150 project. Unfortunately, it's not very light, nor, I suppose, aerodynamically clean, but it does have a sprung cover to keep mud, etc. out. As for small, that's subjective. It needs a 2" hole, with two 21/64" holes at 2-15/16" centres. See http://www.aircraftspruce.com/pdf/2013Individual/Cat13519.pdf for details. Despite its downsides, I'm hoping that its ubiquity will be its saving grace. James On 12 January 2013 20:53, Gilles Thesee wrote : > Gilles.Thesee@ac-grenoble.fr> > > Robert L. Nuckolls, III a =C3=A9crit : > >> >> Yeah, I've been seeing them for years but never >> really sat down and studied the products and their >> technology. Pretty slick. >> > > Bob and all, > > Your messages about PowerPole connectors prompted a question : > What type of ground connector would you recommend to easily connect our > Optimate charger to the ship's batteries through the aircraft skin (witho ut > opening the baggage door) ? > Among goals we are aiming at : > - Lightweight > - Small footprint > - Resistance/protection from water, mud, etc. > - As aerodynamically clean as possible > > Any ideas ? > Thanks for any input, > Best regards, > -- > Gilles > http://contrails.free.fr > > =====**=================== ===========**= /www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List> =====**=================== ===========**= =====**=================== ===========**= com/contribution> =====**=================== ===========**= > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:13:24 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Bob's HF off-center-fed dipole At 04:02 AM 1/13/2013, you wrote: >Bob. >I'd be interested in reading more about your off-center-fed dipole >when you get around to doing it, please. >Good luck with some fair weather! >Patrick Elliott. >G-LGEZ Do a google search on OCF dipole You will get a bunch of hits that speak to this class of antenna. Here's one example http://tinyurl.com/cjb4tlj I purchased a 4:1 balun off ebay for $30 postage paid Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 06:39:10 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Ground connector (was Anderson PowerPole connectors) Bob and all, Your messages about PowerPole connectors prompted a question : What type of ground connector would you recommend to easily connect our Optimate charger to the ship's batteries through the aircraft skin (without opening the baggage door) ? Among goals we are aiming at : - Lightweight - Small footprint - Resistance/protection from water, mud, etc. - As aerodynamically clean as possible Any ideas ? Thanks for any input, Best regards, -- Gilles How much current does your charger produce? Is the airplane metal or composite? Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 07:10:25 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Lithium batteries redux > >I would like to know in the meantime what level of battery >monitoring is done on the accident Cessnas and Dreamliners... I cannot speak to specifics of the battery controls and monitoring systems in either airplane. However, I can speak to the qualification process for getting these batteries approved for installation. A number of AIRPLANE companies, not battery companies, have launched into breathtakingly expensive programs to gain some form of approval for use of lithium batteries on their products. These include Cessna, Boeing, Grumman and others. All players in the lithium game are intently aware of the unique risks offered by lithium batteries. They are also aware of the widely publicized litany of events involving lithium battery catastrophic failures. The testing of batteries is a legacy skill finely honed by over a century of field experience and lessons learned. See: http://tinyurl.com/akvhxv6 also http://tinyurl.com/b4f89jh The two airplanes you asked about enjoy a very high degrees of electronic systems management not the least of which are the batteries. Given the intense scrutiny and qualification expense associated with getting Li-Ion products onto both airplanes, it's a pretty sure bet that everyone believed that they'd touched all the bases. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 07:40:48 AM PST US From: Kelly McMullen Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Low Cost ELT Antenna The ELT requirement applies to ALL aircraft that have to have one. Experimental have to use an ELT meeting the TSO requirements, which you are unlikely to be able to meet without actual testing. It is not an area to go cheap. The first generation ELTs had rampant false alarms and frequent failure to activate in crashes. Given the under $200 price of a new, compliant ELT, trying to go cheap with a non-compliant ELT is pennywise, pound foolish, as well as being illegal. You have a different situation with a transponder antenna, in that there is test equipment, used in your certification and bi-annual tests that shows your transponder system, including antenna meets the TSO requirement. On 1/13/2013 3:09 AM, David & Elaine Lamphere wrote: > > > The Cygnet is an experimental homebuilt - I don't believe there is any > restrictions as to what he installs. > > There used to be do-it-yourself plans in several places including the > aeroelectric site if you wanted to do that. There are also (in my > opinion) affordable stub antennas you can buy. You'll probably have to > mount it on an aluminum panel or equivalent ground plane. On my > Tailwind I mounted my xpdr antenna on a belly pan. > > Dave > > On Jan 12, 2013, at 11:04 PM, Kelly McMullen wrote: > >> >> >> Hate to tell you this, but it is illegal to install an original type >> ELT in any aircraft as a new install. If it had a Narco about 20 >> years ago, before they were made obsolete by regulation, you could >> still replace with same model legally, but you can't use one as a new >> install. The ELT10 is a first generation, designed in the early 70's, >> and does not meet current requirements, so only old installations are >> grandfathered. You are going to need a second generation ELT, such as >> the Artex, ACK, or Ameriking. The cheapest new are a little under >> 200. You also have to use the antenna it comes with. >> If your aircraft requires an ELT, it must be a TSO ELT of the second >> generation or newer, and the TSO requires using the antenna with >> which TSO was granted >> >> On 1/12/2013 8:48 PM, Jerald Folkerts wrote: >>> >>> Im several weeks away from completing my Cygnet project. The >>> aircraft has no electrical system, and Ive installed an older Narco >>> ELT 10 as it is theoretically a two seat aircraft. However, I dont >>> have an antenna or a plan for one. What would be the simplest and >>> least expensive way to go? The Cygnet is steel tube and fabric with >>> a wood/fabric covered wing. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Jerry Folkerts >>> >>> * >>> >>> >>> * >> >> >> >> ----- >> No virus found in this message. >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >> >> >> >> >> > > ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 08:06:24 AM PST US From: Harley Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Low Cost ELT Antenna Haven't seen another point addressed yet. Or else I missed it. But, these new multi frequency ELTs that go for around $200-$300 are usually portable units and don't trigger automatically in a crash situation. Are these allowable in experimental aircraft? Do we need to install something that triggers by itself if need be, or are those that have to be manually activated after the "landing" sufficient for the FAA? Harley ----------------------------------------------------------------- On 1/13/2013 10:39 AM, Kelly McMullen wrote: > The ELT requirement applies to ALL aircraft that have to have > one. Experimental have to use an ELT meeting the TSO > requirements, which you are unlikely to be able to meet without > actual testing. It is not an area to go cheap. The first > generation ELTs had rampant false alarms and frequent failure > to activate in crashes. > Given the under $200 price of a new, compliant ELT, trying to > go cheap with a non-compliant ELT is pennywise, pound foolish, > as well as being illegal. > You have a different situation with a transponder antenna, in > that there is test equipment, used in your certification and > bi-annual tests that shows your transponder system, including > antenna meets the TSO requirement. ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 08:48:36 AM PST US From: Kelly McMullen Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Low Cost ELT Antenna The second generation ELTs are TSO-C91A compliant. They must be "installed", but some are removable for portable use. Example Ameri-king AK-450 for ~$190. They are Not PLBs, and they are only 121.5/243.0mhz units. To get a legal 406mhz ELT you are looking at ~$600 minimum such as ACK E-04. On 1/13/2013 9:05 AM, Harley wrote: > Haven't seen another point addressed yet. Or else I missed it. But, > these new multi frequency ELTs that go for around $200-$300 are > usually portable units and don't trigger automatically in a crash > situation. Are these allowable in experimental aircraft? Do we need > to install something that triggers by itself if need be, or are those > that have to be manually activated after the "landing" sufficient for > the FAA? > > Harley > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 08:50:47 AM PST US From: Gilles Thesee Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Ground connector (was Anderson PowerPole connectors) James Kilford a crit : > > I went for the Piper style connector for my Jodel D150 project. > Unfortunately, it's not very light, nor, I suppose, aerodynamically > clean, but it does have a sprung cover to keep mud, etc. out. As for > small, that's subjective. It needs a 2" hole, with two 21/64" holes > at 2-15/16" centres. James, Thank you for responding. Unfortunately the Piper style ground connector is way too bulky, heavy etc. for our airplane. We only need a 0.8-1 amp capacity, and our four-seater empty weight and dimensions are less than those of your Jodel Mascaret, so we're trying to keep weight and drag under strict control. Thanks anyway for the input. Best regards, -- Gilles http://contrails.free.fr ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 08:55:37 AM PST US From: Gilles Thesee Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Ground connector (was Anderson PowerPole connectors) Robert L. Nuckolls, III a crit : > > How much current does your charger > produce? Is the airplane metal or > composite? Bob, Thank you for your response. The current needed is only that supplied by our little charger, of the order of 0.8-1 amp. The aircraft skin and structure are carbon fiber. The idea is to facilitate recharging when in a 'foreign' hangar, without having to leave the door/canopy ajar. Thank you, Best regards, -- Gilles http://contrails.free.fr ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 09:01:18 AM PST US From: Jan de Jong Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Lithium batteries redux Thank you Bob, very interesting. As a follow-on I found this: http://www.gsyuasa-lp.com/aviation-lithium-ion-markets with this: http://www.s399157097.onlinehome.us/SpecSheets/LVP10-65.pdf So - not LiFePO4, not LMO either but LCO - the cathode type for the high energy density but with the bad reputation: http://www.mpoweruk.com/lithium_failures.htm (sorry about the graph without numbers or provenance). I am still not sure whether in operation they do monitor each individual cell (volts, temperature?) before aggregating the result into a status for a whole series chain. The 787 APU starter battery uses 8 cells in series for 32 V no-load (nominal cell voltage 3.7 V vs. about 3.2 V for LiFePO4). Jan de Jong ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 10:38:08 AM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Ground connector (was Anderson PowerPole connectors) From: Jared Yates Is there an air inlet at the bottom of the cowling? I wonder if you could use a pigtail of wire with a 2-pin connector like the one that comes on most trickle chargers. You could make a fastening system out of velcro to hold it up out of the breeze when you don't need it. I suppose this strategy could apply to any number of other air outlets, depending on which is closest to your battery. On Sun, Jan 13, 2013 at 11:55 AM, Gilles Thesee wrote: > > > Robert L. Nuckolls, III a crit : >> >> >> How much current does your charger >> produce? Is the airplane metal or >> composite? > > > Bob, > > Thank you for your response. > The current needed is only that supplied by our little charger, of the order > of 0.8-1 amp. > The aircraft skin and structure are carbon fiber. > The idea is to facilitate recharging when in a 'foreign' hangar, without > having to leave the door/canopy ajar. > > Thank you, > > Best regards, > -- > Gilles > http://contrails.free.fr > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 12:41:35 PM PST US From: David & Elaine Lamphere Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Low Cost ELT Antenna Yes, the ELT has to meet requirements - I was talking about the Transponder antenna - don't know why I didn't see "ELT" - Oh well... I agree <$200 is a reason to go with a new ELT. Not to mention, the new ones can used multiple "D" cell batteries - a big cost savings over time. Dave On Jan 13, 2013, at 10:39 AM, Kelly McMullen wrote: > > > > The ELT requirement applies to ALL aircraft that have to have one. > Experimental have to use an ELT meeting the TSO requirements, which > you are unlikely to be able to meet without actual testing. It is > not an area to go cheap. The first generation ELTs had rampant false > alarms and frequent failure to activate in crashes. > Given the under $200 price of a new, compliant ELT, trying to go > cheap with a non-compliant ELT is pennywise, pound foolish, as well > as being illegal. > You have a different situation with a transponder antenna, in that > there is test equipment, used in your certification and bi-annual > tests that shows your transponder system, including antenna meets > the TSO requirement. > > On 1/13/2013 3:09 AM, David & Elaine Lamphere wrote: >> > >> >> The Cygnet is an experimental homebuilt - I don't believe there is >> any restrictions as to what he installs. >> >> There used to be do-it-yourself plans in several places including >> the aeroelectric site if you wanted to do that. There are also (in >> my opinion) affordable stub antennas you can buy. You'll probably >> have to mount it on an aluminum panel or equivalent ground plane. >> On my Tailwind I mounted my xpdr antenna on a belly pan. >> >> Dave >> >> On Jan 12, 2013, at 11:04 PM, Kelly McMullen wrote: >> >>> > >>> >>> Hate to tell you this, but it is illegal to install an original >>> type ELT in any aircraft as a new install. If it had a Narco about >>> 20 years ago, before they were made obsolete by regulation, you >>> could still replace with same model legally, but you can't use one >>> as a new install. The ELT10 is a first generation, designed in the >>> early 70's, and does not meet current requirements, so only old >>> installations are grandfathered. You are going to need a second >>> generation ELT, such as the Artex, ACK, or Ameriking. The cheapest >>> new are a little under 200. You also have to use the antenna it >>> comes with. >>> If your aircraft requires an ELT, it must be a TSO ELT of the >>> second generation or newer, and the TSO requires using the antenna >>> with which TSO was granted >>> >>> On 1/12/2013 8:48 PM, Jerald Folkerts wrote: >>>> >>>> Im several weeks away from completing my Cygnet project. The >>>> aircraft has no electrical system, and Ive installed an older >>>> Narco ELT 10 as it is theoretically a two seat aircraft. However, >>>> I dont have an antenna or a plan for one. What would be the >>>> simplest and least expensive way to go? The Cygnet is steel tube >>>> and fabric with a wood/fabric covered wing. >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> >>>> Jerry Folkerts >>>> >>>> * >>>> >>>> >>>> * >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- >>> No virus found in this message. >>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > ----- > No virus found in this message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > > ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 05:13:05 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Ground connector (was Anderson PowerPole connectors) From: James Kilford Yes, or could be a socket fixed near to the bottom edge of the firewall. That would be accessible as you suggest. How about Anderson connectors? Nice and small, waterproof covers available. There is some info about them here: http://www.4wdadventurers.com/archive/index.php/t-568.html Not too expensive, and there are grab handle accessories, which might make it easier to connect / disconnect under the cowling. On 13 January 2013 18:36, Jared Yates wrote: m > > > > Is there an air inlet at the bottom of the cowling? I wonder if you > could use a pigtail of wire with a 2-pin connector like the one that > comes on most trickle chargers. You could make a fastening system out > of velcro to hold it up out of the breeze when you don't need it. I > suppose this strategy could apply to any number of other air outlets, > depending on which is closest to your battery. > > On Sun, Jan 13, 2013 at 11:55 AM, Gilles Thesee > wrote: > > > > > > Robert L. Nuckolls, III a =C3=A9crit : > >> > >> > >> How much current does your charger > >> produce? Is the airplane metal or > >> composite? > > > > > > Bob, > > > > Thank you for your response. > > The current needed is only that supplied by our little charger, of the > order > > of 0.8-1 amp. > > The aircraft skin and structure are carbon fiber. > > The idea is to facilitate recharging when in a 'foreign' hangar, withou t > > having to leave the door/canopy ajar. > > > > Thank you, > > > > Best regards, > > -- > > Gilles > > http://contrails.free.fr > > > > > > > > > > > > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 07:06:00 PM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Aeroled wiring From: "rwtalbot" nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect wrote: > At 08:35 AM 1/8/2013, you wrote: > > The 'tick' cited by several writers is probably > a conducted, fast rise current transient coming > out on the power lines. This is a very low energy > event at an audio rate and with imperceptible > radio frequency components. > > Bob, forgive me for coming into this thread late. I also have been having issues with an Aeroleds setup in my RV-7A. I used to have the Whelen System 7 that Vans sold, but the powerpack failed and I decided to install these instead. The noise I have is characterised by: 1.Noticeable dead spot from signals to the rear (at least prior to sorting out a ground as indicated below) 2.Noise on all comm frequencies caused by the NAV lights. It does not break squelch but can be heard when the squelch is disengaged and the navs turned on 3.Reduction in effective range of the Comms over my Whelen System 7. I used to be able to get the ATIS on my home field from 50nm and 7000. I still can with the aeroleds turned off. If they are on I get nothing until I turn the lights off. 4.I can hear Nav and strobe noise in weak comm signals. 5.Navs + Strobe is even worse 6.The whole setup does not compair favourably to Whelen. I use my aircraft for IFR/night etc and have over 500 hours in four years or so, so probably fairly aware of how the systems should work. I spent a few hours in the hanger looking at my Aeroleds on the weekend and some more yesterday. I came to a few conclusions: 1.I have/had wired them as per the instructions. 2.I did find that the tail light was not properly grounded between the case and the black ground wire so I fixed that and it did reduce the noise but still not to where I am happy. (took for a test flight) 3.The wiring scheme suggested by Aeroleds actually looks like it would causes a ground loop between the airframe and the shield (when grounding both ends of the shield) . When connected on the Left wing it reduces the pop from the strobe on right and tail it appears to make no difference. 4.The tail nav is by far the noisiest and virtually impossible to quiet down. I assume because it has a lot more LEDs in it. I reduced noise by disconnecting the ground wire entirely (runs to my aft fuselage bulkhead). This seems to imply that local grounding is required. I may need to look at how I can achieve that with my rudder. 5.The Green (RHS) nav light is the next noisiest, followed by the red one (LHS). Both of these are very quiet in comparison. 6.Shortening the ground lead at the light end is not only impractical it makes little difference. 7.One of these lights causes minimal noise, the combined effect adds up. Worst case is all three plugged in and nav + strobe. 8.Noise can be heard using a portable Airband radio with the squelch disabled. In some cases the lights will break squelch but not often and not with the wiring as per the instructions 9.Noise is still present and can be clearly heard in weak signals (like listening to Sydney Centre on the ground). 10.My tail light gets extremely hot in operation. (burn your hands hot) I had been of the opinion that the noise was most likely caused by a poorly filtered switch mode power supply injecting noise back into the power system. That coupled with the very fast rise time from the strobes when they are turned on leads to the issues. What surprised me was that with my handheld radio I could easily receive the signal when I placed the antenna near the lights, and also when the antenna was placed near my belly mounted Comm antennas. Getting the wiring correct seems to virtually eliminate the emitted RFI. You must be very close to the wing light fixtures with the portable antenna. The tail light is worse but noticably better when grounded. Being IFR I have a few other issues: What about VOR, MKR, GPS etc? How much of this noise could cause issues in electronics such as EFIS? What are these things doing to the airframe ground and could it play havoc with my WX-500 storm scope? I have not noticed any strikes detected but it could perhaps reduce its range or accuracy - especially as the antenna is in the return path from the tail strobe. What happens when the grounds become ineffective due to corrosion under the screws etc? Richard Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392225#392225 ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 07:07:43 PM PST US From: Paul Millner Subject: AeroElectric-List: Anderson PowerPole connectors Thanks, Bob. I've looked at these before. I'm planning to install, from time to time, an electric air conditioner into the aft baggage compartment. It has a maximum draw, the manufacturer says, of 50 amps. I was considering the 75 amp Anderson PowerPole connector, but then saw mention here that 100% lagniappe above expected current flow is best for long connector/crimp connection life. Should I be concerned about my app, or simply accept that, perhaps, I may need to renew these connectors from time to time... hopefully before they start an inflight fire? Paul ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 08:35:13 PM PST US From: rayj Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Resurrecting a battery Greetings, Here's my report on trying to resurrect "killed" lead acid batteries. No success. After 48 hours on the high voltage/current limited setup neither of the lead acid open batteries or a couple of old sealed lead acid batteries I was experimenting with showed any life.I tested them for voltage about 24 hrs after the charge attempts and none read as high as 12V. I used 75W bulb instead of 100 'cause it was the only incandescent bulb I had and I figured a compact fluorescent wasn't going to work:>). I assume that that lowered the current limit but still provided the voltage I was looking for. Bottomline. It was educational and I have one more trick to try on marginal batteries. Thanks to everyone who contributed to the discussion. Sorry I didn't have any success to share. Raymond Julian Kettle River, MN. "And you know that I could have me a million more friends, and all I'd have to lose is my point of view." - John Prine On 09/28/2012 04:42 PM, rayj wrote: > > On 09/28/2012 01:12 PM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote: > > >> You can put a 100w light bulb in series with a diode >> bridge rectifier and use this as a current limited source of >> high voltage to hook to your battery(ies). Watch the voltage across >> the battery. If the chemistry is coming awake, the voltage >> should begin to drop and ultimately level off at normal >> levels expected for a 1 amp constant current charge. > Here's where my ignorance starts showing. Is this setup using mains > voltage? Rectified and current limited? 120+ volts DC, current limited > to 1-2 amps? > > Raymond Julian > Kettle River, MN. > > "And you know that I could have me a million more friends, > and all I'd have to lose is my point of view." - John Prine > > ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 08:47:01 PM PST US From: rayj Subject: AeroElectric-List: parallel batteries on maintainer I am setup to use 1 maintainer to keep 4-5 or more batteries charged over the winter. How can I tell if I've exceeded the capacity of the maintainer? Will the voltage drop? How much of the total amperage of the charger is available for maintaining the batteries? One of my charger/maintainers is rated 6amps. I can't imagine any reasonable number of batteries needing that much current to be kept topped up. The batteries are at outside temp(currently below 0degF). Is this a factor I need to consider? Thanks for any information/opinions/warnings. do not archive -- Raymond Julian Kettle River, MN. "And you know that I could have me a million more friends, and all I'd have to lose is my point of view." - John Prine ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message aeroelectric-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/aeroelectric-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/aeroelectric-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.