Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:58 AM - Re: Re: Which crimper for Big AWG's on both HB *and* Certified? (Harley)
2. 06:08 AM - Re: 28V to 15.6V @ 5A (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
3. 06:16 AM - Re: Wire sizes to E-Bus? (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
4. 06:29 AM - Re: 28V to 15.6V @ 5A (Eric M. Jones)
5. 06:36 AM - Re: LED strip lighting for panels (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
6. 06:43 AM - Re: Mic jack problem (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
7. 06:50 AM - Re: 28V to 15.6V @ 5A (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
8. 07:00 AM - Re: Shorai Battery Review (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
9. 08:27 AM - Re: 28V to 15.6V @ 5A (Jeff Page)
10. 08:59 AM - Re: 28V to 15.6V @ 5A (Jay Hyde)
11. 10:25 AM - Radio interference (robintaylor)
12. 02:17 PM - Master / Starter Relay (Peter Pengilly)
13. 02:38 PM - Re: Master / Starter Relay (Peter Pengilly)
14. 02:50 PM - Re: Master / Starter Relay (Peter Pengilly)
15. 03:06 PM - Re: Master / Starter Relay (jan)
16. 05:14 PM - Re: Radio interference (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
Message 1
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Subject: | Re: Which crimper for Big AWG's on both HB *and* |
Certified?
I used the HF crimper as well...had no problems, and as Bob said,
just pick the dies that fit the wire and terminal you are working
with, ignoring the numbers on them. If the crimp doesn't look
good enough, just go to the next smaller size.
Harley Dixon
Long EZ N28EZ
Canandaigua, NY
-----------------------------------------------------------------
On 4/24/2013 9:29 PM, Robert Borger wrote:
>
> Bill,
>
> OK, I'll weight in.
>
> That HF crimper works quite well. No special associated terminal is needed.
Just make sure the terminal properly fits the wire size. And ignore the sizes
marked on the tool, they lie. Just pick a set of jaws that fit the wire and
lug in use.
>
> FWIW, I used Perihelion CCA lightweight Fat Wire and the associated Perihelion
connection lugs. Works great, less weight.
>
> Periheliondesign.com or periheliondesign.com/fatwires.htm
>
> Blue skies & tailwinds,
> Bob Borger
> Europa XS Tri, Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S Prop.
> Little Toot Sport Biplane, Lycoming Thunderbolt AEIO-320 EXP
> 3705 Lynchburg Dr.
> Corinth, TX 76208-5331
> Cel: 817-992-1117
> rlborger@mac.com
>
> On Apr 24, 2013, at 8:11 PM, Builder_Bill <jonesw@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
>
> Yeah, I've seen that TT-500 (or maybe the previous version of it) at SteinAir
maybe.
>
> As for HF, leave it the them to produce a hydraulic crimper south of $1000, way
south [Shocked] . LOL.
>
> Am I wrong to expect that an airworthy crimp tool should have a strict association
with a line of terminals [Rolling Eyes] . As with Amp/Tyco Crimpers & AMP
PIDG terminals.
>
> Neither of these two tools (TT-500 & HF) advertise a matched brand of terminals,
or do they?
> Or an I'm brain washed by the Mil Specs and Standards Groups? :?
>
> Between the two, I lean toward the TT-500, but with a local HF just 1 mile from
me, now I have to go see what $60 in HF $ looks/feels like.
>
>
> Maybe others can weigh in.
>
> Bill Jones
>
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Subject: | Re: 28V to 15.6V @ 5A |
At 03:36 PM 4/24/2013, you wrote:
>
>A friend of mine has a requirement to power a laptop requiring 15.6V
>at 5A from an aircraft with a 28V system.
>
>This unit is almost what is needed, but the spec is only 4A.
>http://www.lonestaraviation.com/Step-Down-Converter-24v-to-16v.html
>
>Is anyone aware of a similar product with a little more power capability ?
These show some promise. You might find that they need to be
packaged in a larger enclosure to accommodate some RFI
filtering.
http://tinyurl.com/a9bhfqn
http://tinyurl.com/axlv3ex
http://tinyurl.com/bbylscr
http://tinyurl.com/a5ncthf
http://tinyurl.com/apxepbq
Bob . . .
Message 3
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Subject: | Re: Wire sizes to E-Bus? |
At 04:38 PM 4/21/2013, you wrote:
>
>I am working with Bob's Z-13/8 and I am confused about the wire size
>between the main -> e-bus. In the drawing he has it as 20AWG. This
>seems way to small to me to power the e-bus.
>
>In my scenario, my load diagram shows the e-bus loads can reach 25A.
>Am I correct in thinking this wire should be 12AWG instead?
>
>Also, the wire from my Batt. bus to the E-Bus is 14AWG on my
>schematic, should that also be 12AWG?
>
>Thanks for the clarification...
>
>- Matt\
The Z-figures are ARCHITECTURE drawings, not
wiring diagrams for any specific task. A load
analysis using your specific constellation of
accessories will set system loads and wire
sizes which may indeed be different than
'suggestions' on the architecture drawings.
Bob . . .
Message 4
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Subject: | Re: 28V to 15.6V @ 5A |
I always recommend Astrodyne power supplies for these in experimental aircraft.
Their similar supplies are $75.
There are bunches of laptop supplies from 12V (cigar lighter type) but not many
from 28V. I have made a couple of these in linear form (no RFI noise), completely
adjustable, 10-37V input. See attached.
--------
Eric M. Jones
www.PerihelionDesign.com
113 Brentwood Drive
Southbridge, MA 01550
(508) 764-2072
emjones(at)charter.net
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=399350#399350
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/5a_avr_168.pdf
Message 5
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Subject: | Re: LED strip lighting for panels |
At 03:18 PM 4/23/2013, you wrote:
>Hi Bob:
>
>After talking with you on the phone and
>receiving this e-mail from you, I ordered the
>LED strip and a couple of dimmer switches from B
>& C. Then I saw something in your e-mail that
>didn=99t quite look right and that was the delta
>voltage you mentioned between the 7.5v and the
>12 volt is 3.5 volts. Actually it=99s 4.5
>volts. Now, I=99m not very smart when it comes
>to electronics but, based on your calculations
>in your e-mail that changes the value of the
>resistors needed to remodel the dimmer. You
>mentioned several resistors of standard value to
>use based on your calculations, should I still
>use them? Or, do I need to change to something
>different? Appreciate your help!
Good catch my friend! Yes. You'll have to
adjust the resistors to achieve the desired
response from the potentiometer.
The first electronic dimmer I was asked to
replace for a customer was a classic potentiometer
voltage divider driving an emitter follower transistor
on a big heatsink. Playing with the thing on the
bench showed that the bottom 40% or so of pot travel
didn't do anything. Voltage to the lamps in this
area was too low to produce visible light. I think
I might have been the first supplier to consider
adding resistance in the bottom of the voltage divider
to set MAX CCW voltage a just below visible light
output from the lamps . . . about 4-5 volts as I recall.
This also kept the lamps 'warm' while 'off' so that
the filaments are more immune to vibration and
inrush fatigue.
Your task is a bit different in that multiple LED
junctions in series raises the MAX CCW voltage
for minimal light output considerably.
Suggest you fiddle with your setup on the bench
and arrive at component values appropriate to
your own design goals. I just received a couple
spools of strip lights yesterday. I'm going to
use a mulit-colored, programmable strip to add
attention grabbing lights to outside of my son's
shaved ice concession trailer . . . and a couple
more spools to augment interior lighting. This
is pretty handy stuff.
Take the calculations I did and plug in correct
numbers. Let the List know what values meet your design
goals.
Bob . . .
Message 6
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Subject: | Re: Mic jack problem |
At 05:01 PM 4/24/2013, you wrote:
>Mr Nuckolls-
>
>If you please I'm having the devil of a time
>trying to get my mic to work. I'm putting in an
>intercom (PS Engineering PM 1200) in a T-6=85 it
>has an audio panel. For some odd reason I
>elected to use the current jacks for the
>intercom and put together a new set for AUX and
>connecting the intercom with the audio panel/airplane.
Not sure I have the correct mental image based on your words.
The AUX mic depicted in the PS1200 manual
Emacs!
. . . is intended to offer access to your ship's transmitter
by the microphone even if the intercom system is broke. This
jack bypasses the intercom and lets your mic talk to the transmitter
directly.
You'll have to give me a complete wiring diagram of what you've
installed before I'll be able to herd the electrons.
>My problem is that I can't get the mic to work
>through the AUX jacks. The Headphone audio works
>fine, the PTT circuit works, you can hear the
>carrier and someone on an external radio reports
>a strong carrier being transmitted=85. but the mic
>does not open, nothing gets transmitted other
>than the carrier. I've tried just about
>everything, even to the point of reversing the
>wires thinking I screwed up the Tip/Ring/Ground
>tracking. I just cannot get the mic to work=85..
>do you have any suggestions for me?
If you already have an audio panel, did it include
microphone wiring and feature a transmitter select
switch too? What kind of audio panel?
Bob . . .
Message 7
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Subject: | 28V to 15.6V @ 5A |
At 12:56 AM 4/25/2013, you wrote:
>
>I would venture that the 4A product would do the trick; laptops do
>not draw that much current- my laptop power supply is rated at 19V 3.16A.
>
>Johannesburg Jay
The wattage requirements tend to be constant. If his
battery is nominally lower in voltage than the common
19 volt devices, then the current requirements might
reasonably be expected to go up proportionally. But
even the rated current values are 'max' numbers that
probably assume that the user is charging a depleted
battery while attempting to use the computer. I have
a 14v to 19v boost regulator for use in our cars.
I've measured some sustained 4+ amp draws during
worst case demands . . . but normal computer usage
with a fully charged battery is much less . . . more
like 2.2 amps.
Larger step-down devices are readily available but
may need some attention to noise issues for use on
the airplane . . .
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: 28V to 15.6V @ 5A
At 03:36 PM 4/24/2013, you wrote:
>
>A friend of mine has a requirement to power a laptop requiring 15.6V
>at 5A from an aircraft with a 28V system.
>
>This unit is almost what is needed, but the spec is only 4A.
>http://www.lonestaraviation.com/Step-Down-Converter-24v-to-16v.html
>
>Is anyone aware of a similar product with a little more power capability ?
These show some promise. You might find that they need to be
packaged in a larger enclosure to accommodate some RFI
filtering.
http://tinyurl.com/a9bhfqn
http://tinyurl.com/axlv3ex
http://tinyurl.com/bbylscr
http://tinyurl.com/a5ncthf
http://tinyurl.com/apxepbq
Bob . . .
Message 8
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Subject: | Re: Shorai Battery Review |
At 08:57 PM 4/22/2013, you wrote:
>Bob, Haven't been on the list for a while and have forgotten how to post.
Just send a message to aeroelectric-list@matroics.com
This will start a new thread of discussion with what ever
topic you put on the subject line . . .
> I have read all the posts on the Shorai batteries and was
> wondering if you have additional opinions as to whether they would
> be suitable in OBAM aircraft since Boeing has "solved" the Lithium
> Ion problems on the 787s.
Actually, Boeing has not solved the Li-Ion battery
problem, they've only contained it. The batteries
are to be enclosed in a titanium box with vents appropriate
to expel the products of combustion assuming that one or
more cells goes into catastrophic self destruction.
I spent a good part of yesterday with Skip Koss and
crew who were representing Concord at a convention in
Wichita. Seems that the major players have given up trying
to quantify reliability numbers for the cells and have
elected to apply a lot of electronic monitoring and
control for managing charge and discharge profiles
of individual cells while closely monitoring temperatures.
It's a case of adding very complex electronic housekeeping
to robust containment for what started out to be a
simple one-for-one replacement of legacy Ni-Cad/Lead-Acid
with Li-Ion.
Pundits in the know are now predicting that a positive
return on investment for Boeing's shift to Li-Ion is
decades out . . . if ever.
The Shorai offering is a study in contradictions. On
one hand, the batteries are offered as drop in
replacement for legacy battery products wherein
responsibility for managing the charge and discharge
profiles are NOT tailored to the product. At the same
time, each battery is fitted with a 5 pin maintenance
port to accommodate a specialty charger. Literature for
the battery says:
**Note:The Shorai LFX battery may not be used with a lead-acid
battery charger with an automatic desulfation mode that cannot be
disabled. We recommend the
<http://www.motorcycle-superstore.com/1/4/60/45381/ITEM/Shorai-LFX-Battery-Charger.aspx>Shorai
LFX Battery Charger to properly charge and perform cell diagnostics
on this high performance battery, or the
<http://www.motorcycle-superstore.com/1/4/60/49850/ITEM/MotoStance-MS1000-Battery-Charger.aspx>MotoStance
MS1000 Battery Charger.
This is the first time I've seen any mention of "desulfation"
features being undesirable in the context of Li-Ion
discussions. I've not read any convincing discussion
on the effectiveness of special desulfation processes
added to chargers or maintainers. Desulfation technologies
are a mixed bag . . . and I'm not sure they're even
applicable to anything other than abusive, deep-discharge
service.
The well cared for aircraft battery NEVER gets deep
discharged. It coughs up 2% of contained energy
to start an engine . . . hundreds of times . . . but
is immediately serviced by a working alternator.
Conditions favorable to lead-sulfate crystal growth
are weak.
In one breath, the Li-Ion guys talk about their specialized
chargers designed to get the most from their product . . .
in the next breath, they say the product is a drop-in
replacement for an SVLA battery that receives less
than specialized charging from an alternator-regulator
that might not even be adjustable!
The Shorai LFX charger offers the ultimate pampering
of the battery while a MotoStance MS1000 is just
an SVLA charger/maintainer . . . I'm westling with
the logic that says they can have it both ways.
Bob . . .
Message 9
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Subject: | 28V to 15.6V @ 5A |
Jay,
I agree that most of the time the laptop would draw less than four
amps. However, if the laptop battery is quite low, it will draw more
power trying to charge it and might reach the current draw specified
on the bottom of the laptop.
If there are no alternatives, I will try to get one of their laptops
and measure it. However, if there is a similar product available with
a little more output, that would be the best thing to do.
Jeff
> From: "Jay Hyde" <jay@horriblehyde.com>
> Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: 28V to 15.6V @ 5A
>
>
> I would venture that the 4A product would do the trick; laptops do
> not draw that
> much current- my laptop power supply is rated at 19V 3.16A.
>
> Johannesburg Jay
Message 10
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Subject: | 28V to 15.6V @ 5A |
Hey there Jeff,
I agree; my opinion was ventured on the basis that the other product might be difficult
to find and/or get your hands on- probably more of an issue here in SA
than in the USA. In that case the current draw might be high for a while, if
the battery was flat, but lower later. Then one might be able to work within
those limits- for example, make sure that your battery is properly charged before
flight and the power supply then only supplies top up power.
I also agree with Bob regarding the higher current draw for lower voltage given
the same power (W) requirement - basic electrical theory. Looking at my laptop
power supply and using transformer theory as a rough calculation estimate my
laptop would draw 3.9A at 15.5V.
Not ideal, but if the product you sourced was all that you had to hand, odds are
it would be fine. Throw in some usage parameters (take a charged laptop on
board) and you'd most likely never have a problem.
But of course, in the land of the big PX ;-) you can just get the right bit...
We can get them here too, but its a pain in the butt, you will probably have
to wait longer and it'll cost more.
Nice almost relevant story: My mate was commissioning plant in Tanzania and needed
some resistors which would have been difficult and time consuming to order
from there- and then you'd have to wait for delivery (just 10 were required).
There is a large bit of plant waiting and your client is hounding you- and
your company will be hit with penalties for lateness. Solution- go and buy a
couple of cheap battery powered radios that abound in the small general dealers
and source your resisters off their boards....
Johannesburg Jay
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jeff Page
Sent: 25 April 2013 05:26 PM
Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: 28V to 15.6V @ 5A
Jay,
I agree that most of the time the laptop would draw less than four amps. However,
if the laptop battery is quite low, it will draw more power trying to charge
it and might reach the current draw specified on the bottom of the laptop.
If there are no alternatives, I will try to get one of their laptops and measure
it. However, if there is a similar product available with a little more output,
that would be the best thing to do.
Jeff
> From: "Jay Hyde" <jay@horriblehyde.com>
> Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: 28V to 15.6V @ 5A
>
>
> I would venture that the 4A product would do the trick; laptops do not
> draw that much current- my laptop power supply is rated at 19V 3.16A.
>
> Johannesburg Jay
Message 11
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Subject: | Radio interference |
I am getting radio interference which seems to be from the alternator.
I am flight testing my homebuilt RV9A. It has a new Lycoming O320 engine which
has a Plane Power AL12 alternator.
The interference is a pulse or beep at an interval of about two per second. Its
interval changes with the engine speed and it ceases when the alternator is disabled.
Please can you suggest the cause and a solution.
RobinT :(
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=399371#399371
Message 12
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Subject: | Master / Starter Relay |
Does anyone have any thoughts on the suitability of these devices from
Tyco for our applications, although may be a little expensive (70 =
$110, both + tax)? How are they supposed to be mounted?
http://uk.farnell.com/te-connectivity/v23130c2021a412/relay-battery-disconnect-12v/dp/1770635
http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/477184.pdf
Looks like it already has diodes installed.
If the coil has a resistance of 4.7 ohms, will this pull 3 amps
continuously?
Connector is here
http://uk.farnell.com/te-connectivity-amp/184046-1/housing-plug-ssc-a-key-4-way/dp/2309162?ref=lookahead
http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/1697200.pdf
Peter
Message 13
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Subject: | Re: Master / Starter Relay |
Perhaps this is better as a master relay - mounting lugs included,
current draw is around 0.4A, cost is 50, $77
http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/1670678.pdf
On 25/04/2013 22:14, Peter Pengilly wrote:
> <peter@sportingaero.com>
>
> Does anyone have any thoughts on the suitability of these devices from
> Tyco for our applications, although may be a little expensive (70 =
> $110, both + tax)? How are they supposed to be mounted?
>
> http://uk.farnell.com/te-connectivity/v23130c2021a412/relay-battery-disconnect-12v/dp/1770635
>
>
> http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/477184.pdf
>
> Looks like it already has diodes installed.
> If the coil has a resistance of 4.7 ohms, will this pull 3 amps
> continuously?
>
> Connector is here
>
> http://uk.farnell.com/te-connectivity-amp/184046-1/housing-plug-ssc-a-key-4-way/dp/2309162?ref=lookahead
>
>
> http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/1697200.pdf
>
>
> Peter
>
>
Message 14
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Subject: | Re: Master / Starter Relay |
2nd try, this is the 12v version, 62 = $96, requires 0.3A hold on current.
http://uk.farnell.com/te-connectivity/v23132a2001b200/relay-high-current-150a-12v/dp/2076581
Peter
On 25/04/2013 22:14, Peter Pengilly wrote:
> <peter@sportingaero.com>
>
> Does anyone have any thoughts on the suitability of these devices from
> Tyco for our applications, although may be a little expensive (70 =
> $110, both + tax)? How are they supposed to be mounted?
>
> http://uk.farnell.com/te-connectivity/v23130c2021a412/relay-battery-disconnect-12v/dp/1770635
>
>
> http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/477184.pdf
>
> Looks like it already has diodes installed.
> If the coil has a resistance of 4.7 ohms, will this pull 3 amps
> continuously?
>
> Connector is here
>
> http://uk.farnell.com/te-connectivity-amp/184046-1/housing-plug-ssc-a-key-4-way/dp/2309162?ref=lookahead
>
>
> http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/1697200.pdf
>
>
> Peter
>
>
Message 15
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Subject: | Master / Starter Relay |
Very modern and expensive (We use Tyco at work ..all good stuff) ... but
what is wrong with $ 20,- from Vans ?
http://www.vansaircraft.com/cgi-bin/store.cgi?ident=1366927288-350-189&brows
e=electrical&product=master-sw
Jan
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Peter
Pengilly
Sent: 25 April 2013 22:48
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Master / Starter Relay
<peter@sportingaero.com>
2nd try, this is the 12v version, 62 = $96, requires 0.3A hold on current.
http://uk.farnell.com/te-connectivity/v23132a2001b200/relay-high-current-150
a-12v/dp/2076581
Peter
On 25/04/2013 22:14, Peter Pengilly wrote:
> <peter@sportingaero.com>
>
> Does anyone have any thoughts on the suitability of these devices from
> Tyco for our applications, although may be a little expensive (70 =
> $110, both + tax)? How are they supposed to be mounted?
>
>
http://uk.farnell.com/te-connectivity/v23130c2021a412/relay-battery-disconne
ct-12v/dp/1770635
>
>
> http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/477184.pdf
>
> Looks like it already has diodes installed.
> If the coil has a resistance of 4.7 ohms, will this pull 3 amps
> continuously?
>
> Connector is here
>
>
http://uk.farnell.com/te-connectivity-amp/184046-1/housing-plug-ssc-a-key-4-
way/dp/2309162?ref=lookahead
>
>
> http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/1697200.pdf
>
>
> Peter
>
>
Message 16
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Subject: | Re: Radio interference |
At 12:21 PM 4/25/2013, you wrote:
><robintaylor@airteccc.co.uk>
>
>I am getting radio interference which seems to be from the alternator.
>I am flight testing my homebuilt RV9A. It has a new Lycoming O320
>engine which has a Plane Power AL12 alternator.
>The interference is a pulse or beep at an interval of about two per
>second. Its interval changes with the engine speed and it ceases
>when the alternator is disabled.
>Please can you suggest the cause and a solution.
>RobinT :(
Does the noise get louder if you turn everything
on and/or softer with everything but the radio
off?
Can you describe your ground system for us?
Bob . . .
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