---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 06/16/13: 9 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:19 AM - Hanger Antenna (Mark Banus) 2. 08:21 AM - Re: Hanger Antenna (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 3. 08:48 AM - Re: Hanger Antenna (H. Marvin Haught) 4. 10:16 AM - Re: Hanger Antenna (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 5. 10:36 AM - Re: Hanger Antenna (H. Marvin Haught) 6. 11:09 AM - Re: Hanger Antenna (Bill Putney) 7. 11:16 AM - Re: Hanger Antenna (Bill Putney) 8. 11:34 AM - Re: Hanger Antenna (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 9. 11:35 AM - Re: Hanger Antenna (H. Marvin Haught) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:19:37 AM PST US From: Mark Banus Subject: AeroElectric-List: Hanger Antenna Yes, the Ramsey AA7C looks as inconspicuous as I could get. I'll order one and give it an OPEVAL. Thanks Mark ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 08:21:02 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Hanger Antenna At 07:18 AM 6/16/2013, you wrote: >Yes, the Ramsey AA7C looks as inconspicuous as I could get. I'll >order one and give it an OPEVAL. Thanks >Mark Okay. Some further considerations for the utility of this product. It will come as a kit so assembly required. It's designed to offer GAIN which may not be useful in your situation. Your task is to get energy from a short whisker antenna (e-field probe) coupled into a low impedance feedline. I suspect that signal strengths OUTSIDE your hangar are adequate so adding gain brings some risks for overload from local strong signals. Is there a tower or unicom station on the field? The kit is for an INDOOR accessory designed to sit on a desk. It's BATTERY powered and designed to be locally controlled by means of front panel switches and knobs. http://tinyurl.com/lrrylbk Mounting this outside calls for hardening against the elements. Sealed plastic or aluminum box? The kit version has both HF and VHF/UHF capability and all you need is VHF/UHF. Further, the ECB is rather BIG for the small amount of electronics you want to exploit. Here's Van Roon's schematic trimmed down for VHF/UHF remote mounting. Emacs! It looks like you could move R5, R4, C4, C5 and C6 to the other end of the coax feedline. This would let you run 9v up to the amplifier on the same coax that brings the signals down. This circuit could be built on a very tiny board to be mounting inside a die-cast aluminum enclosure possibly sealed with RTV. There's only three components in the box on the roof. The 2SC2570 is a leaded plastic device 2SC2570 - 2SC2570 NPN High Frequency Transistor The transistor, resistor and capacitor could probably be 'spider webbed' between two BNC connectors in the roof mounted box. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 08:48:16 AM PST US From: "H. Marvin Haught" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Hanger Antenna Bob, - I am interested in this antenna too, but need the HF as one of my available stations is an HF signal. Can the antenna be mounted outside and enclosure remain inside? M. Haught On Jun 16, 2013, at 10:19 AM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote: > At 07:18 AM 6/16/2013, you wrote: >> Yes, the Ramsey AA7C looks as inconspicuous as I could get. I'll order one and give it an OPEVAL. Thanks >> Mark > > Okay. Some further considerations for the utility of > this product. It will come as a kit so assembly required. > It's designed to offer GAIN which may not be useful in > your situation. > > Your task is to get energy from a short whisker antenna > (e-field probe) coupled into a low impedance feedline. > I suspect that signal strengths OUTSIDE your hangar are > adequate so adding gain brings some risks for overload > from local strong signals. Is there a tower or unicom > station on the field? > > The kit is for an INDOOR accessory designed to sit > on a desk. It's BATTERY powered and designed to be > locally controlled by means of front panel switches > and knobs. > > http://tinyurl.com/lrrylbk > > Mounting this outside calls for hardening against > the elements. Sealed plastic or aluminum box? > > The kit version has both HF and VHF/UHF capability > and all you need is VHF/UHF. Further, the ECB is > rather BIG for the small amount of electronics you > want to exploit. Here's Van Roon's schematic > trimmed down for VHF/UHF remote mounting. > > <181d66a.jpg> > > > It looks like you could move R5, R4, C4, C5 and > C6 to the other end of the coax feedline. This would let > you run 9v up to the amplifier on the same coax that > brings the signals down. > > This circuit could be built on a very tiny board to be > mounting inside a die-cast aluminum enclosure possibly > sealed with RTV. > > There's only three components in the box on the roof. > The 2SC2570 is a leaded plastic device > > The transistor, resistor and capacitor could probably > be 'spider webbed' between two BNC connectors in the > roof mounted box. > > > Bob . . . > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 10:16:56 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Hanger Antenna At 10:47 AM 6/16/2013, you wrote: >Bob, - > >I am interested in this antenna too, but need the HF as one of my >available stations is an HF signal. Can the antenna be mounted >outside and enclosure remain inside? > >M. Haught Sure. There are lots of HF active antenna products and DIY designs out there. Are you looking to build or buy one? What's your range of interest for frequencies? What is the nature of the proposed outside antenna and feedline? Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 10:36:59 AM PST US From: "H. Marvin Haught" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Hanger Antenna I do not know even enough to talk intelligently about the subject! I would like a single antenna to where I can improve TV reception, FM radio reception, and use as a receiver antenna for my hand held aircraft radio. Only receive, not transmit. I have a "wiring closet" with the hangar wall immediate to that location. I would run the coax out an up the wall to the antenna mounted at the edge of the roof, right straight up from the wiring closet, and house the enclosure in that closet. Was looking at the Ramsey AA&C for that purpose, but with an externally mounted antenna. Or is there a better alternative? Oh, I live in a 60 x 60 metal hangar, and reception inside is pretty poor. M. Haught On Jun 16, 2013, at 12:16 PM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote: > At 10:47 AM 6/16/2013, you wrote: >> Bob, - >> >> I am interested in this antenna too, but need the HF as one of my available stations is an HF signal. Can the antenna be mounted outside and enclosure remain inside? >> >> M. Haught > > Sure. There are lots of HF active antenna products > and DIY designs out there. Are you looking to build > or buy one? What's your range of interest for frequencies? > What is the nature of the proposed outside antenna > and feedline? > > > Bob . . . > > > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 11:09:12 AM PST US From: Bill Putney Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Hanger Antenna When had a Port-A-Port hangar in Oakland, CA I had a similar problem. These are T hangars and the corrugated roof has about a 4" overhang on the back edge. I punched a hole for a whip I cut to the aircraft band for the scanner I used to listen to ATIS and Tower frequencies and punched another hole and mounted a car radio antenna for everything else. Since the holes were in the overhang area there was never a problem with leaks. The coaxial from the antennas I just brought in at a high spot in the corrugations. If you're in a metropolitan area this should work. If you're out in the countryside somewhere, you'll need a TV antenna pointed toward where the TV transmitters are. If you send me your airport ICAO code I'll tell you what you need and where to point the antennas. Bill Putney Navion owner A&P/IA WB6RFW Chief Engineer - KPTZ FM Port Townsend, WA On 6/16/13 10:36 AM, H. Marvin Haught wrote: > I do not know even enough to talk intelligently about the subject! I > would like a single antenna to where I can improve TV reception, FM > radio reception, and use as a receiver antenna for my hand held > aircraft radio. Only receive, not transmit. > > I have a "wiring closet" with the hangar wall immediate to that > location. I would run the coax out an up the wall to the antenna > mounted at the edge of the roof, right straight up from the wiring > closet, and house the enclosure in that closet. Was looking at the > Ramsey AA&C for that purpose, but with an externally mounted antenna. > Or is there a better alternative? Oh, I live in a 60 x 60 metal > hangar, and reception inside is pretty poor. > > M. Haught > On Jun 16, 2013, at 12:16 PM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote: > >> At 10:47 AM 6/16/2013, you wrote: >>> Bob, - >>> >>> I am interested in this antenna too, but need the HF as one of my >>> available stations is an HF signal. Can the antenna be mounted >>> outside and enclosure remain inside? >>> >>> M. Haught >> >> Sure. There are lots of HF active antenna products >> and DIY designs out there. Are you looking to build >> or buy one? What's your range of interest for frequencies? >> What is the nature of the proposed outside antenna >> and feedline? >> >> >> Bob . . . >> >> * >> >> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List >> href="http://forums.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com >> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> >> * > > * > > > * ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 11:16:28 AM PST US From: Bill Putney Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Hanger Antenna On my hangar in Oakland I installed a screwdriver antenna (the one I had was from in the middle of the roof and ran the coax and control wire down to the edge and under the High Sierra one I bought at HRO but they're all about the same. Worked well with my ICOM IC-706. Bill Putney On 6/16/13 10:16 AM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote: > At 10:47 AM 6/16/2013, you wrote: >> Bob, - >> >> I am interested in this antenna too, but need the HF as one of my >> available stations is an HF signal. Can the antenna be mounted >> outside and enclosure remain inside? >> >> M. Haught > > Sure. There are lots of HF active antenna products > and DIY designs out there. Are you looking to build > or buy one? What's your range of interest for frequencies? > What is the nature of the proposed outside antenna > and feedline? > > > Bob . . . > > * > > > * ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 11:34:32 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Hanger Antenna At 12:36 PM 6/16/2013, you wrote: I do not know even enough to talk intelligently about the subject! I would like a single antenna to where I can improve TV reception, FM radio reception, and use as a receiver antenna for my hand held aircraft radio. Only receive, not transmit. Okay, that's what I have been discussing with Mark. In his situation, and it sounds like for most of your situation, the VHF active antenna I described in schematic for (a subset of the AA7C) would do for 30 Mhz and up. What is your HF frequency of interest? I have a "wiring closet" with the hangar wall immediate to that location. I would run the coax out an up the wall to the antenna mounted at the edge of the roof, right straight up from the wiring closet, and house the enclosure in that closet. Was looking at the Ramsey AA&C for that purpose, but with an externally mounted antenna. Or is there a better alternative? Oh, I live in a 60 x 60 metal hangar, and reception inside is pretty poor. Active antennas like the AA7C pretty much expect for the 'antenna' to be a conductor exposed to signals of interest with no intervening feedline. The conductor is expected to be short with respect to any resonance at frequencies of interest. In other words NOT suited to drive a transmission line . . . hence the need for some active device to adapt the poorly performing, short antenna to a feedline. You only mentioned VHF signals . . . for 30 Mhz and above, the antenna Mark is needing sounds like what you need too. Your situation does not sound like an AA7C inside wired to an antenna outside would be the best opportunity for the AA7C to do its magic. A 'whisker' stuck up through metal roofing with an active adapter box on the under side sounds like as close to ideal for an active antenna as you can get. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 11:35:58 AM PST US From: "H. Marvin Haught" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Hanger Antenna I am located at H34. M. Haught On Jun 16, 2013, at 1:08 PM, Bill Putney wrote: > When had a Port-A-Port hangar in Oakland, CA I had a similar problem. These are T hangars and the corrugated roof has about a 4" overhang on the back edge. I punched a hole for a whip I cut to the aircraft band for the scanner I used to listen to ATIS and Tower frequencies and punched another hole and mounted a car radio antenna for everything else. Since the holes were in the overhang area there was never a problem with leaks. The coaxial from the antennas I just brought in at a high spot in the corrugations. If you're in a metropolitan area this should work. If you're out in the countryside somewhere, you'll need a TV antenna pointed toward where the TV transmitters are. > > If you send me your airport ICAO code I'll tell you what you need and where to point the antennas. > > Bill Putney > Navion owner > A&P/IA > WB6RFW > Chief Engineer - KPTZ FM > Port Townsend, WA > > On 6/16/13 10:36 AM, H. Marvin Haught wrote: >> I do not know even enough to talk intelligently about the subject! I would like a single antenna to where I can improve TV reception, FM radio reception, and use as a receiver antenna for my hand held aircraft radio. Only receive, not transmit. >> >> I have a "wiring closet" with the hangar wall immediate to that location. I would run the coax out an up the wall to the antenna mounted at the edge of the roof, right straight up from the wiring closet, and house the enclosure in that closet. Was looking at the Ramsey AA&C for that purpose, but with an externally mounted antenna. Or is there a better alternative? Oh, I live in a 60 x 60 metal hangar, and reception inside is pretty poor. >> >> M. Haught >> On Jun 16, 2013, at 12:16 PM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote: >> >>> At 10:47 AM 6/16/2013, you wrote: >>>> Bob, - >>>> >>>> I am interested in this antenna too, but need the HF as one of my available stations is an HF signal. Can the antenna be mounted outside and enclosure remain inside? >>>> >>>> M. Haught >>> >>> Sure. There are lots of HF active antenna products >>> and DIY designs out there. Are you looking to build >>> or buy one? What's your range of interest for frequencies? >>> What is the nature of the proposed outside antenna >>> and feedline? >>> >>> >>> Bob . . . >>> >>> >>> >>> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List">http://www.m atronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List >>> href="http://forums.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com >>> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/co ntribution >>> >> >> >> >> > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message aeroelectric-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/aeroelectric-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/aeroelectric-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.