AeroElectric-List Digest Archive

Mon 07/01/13


Total Messages Posted: 5



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 03:51 AM - Re: Re: Landing Light Aim (Bill Watson)
     2. 10:20 AM - BlackBerry Z10 ----- $350 (aneale)
     3. 02:31 PM - Re: Master Switch/Contactor and Starter Questions (dgaldrich)
     4. 11:01 PM - Official AeroElectric-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) (Matt Dralle)
     5. 11:04 PM - Official AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines (Matt Dralle)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 03:51:12 AM PST US
    From: Bill Watson <Mauledriver@nc.rr.com>
    Subject: Re: Landing Light Aim
    I've been operating off a rather dimly lit grass strip for 15 years or so. First with a tailwheel Maule (hundreds of landings) then an RV10 (1 dozen night ops). Some observations: * The Maule's incandescent wing mounted landing light was aimed roughly so that the landing area was lit when on a 'normal' short final. I never adjusted it. * During landing, the runway lights provide most of the visual information. * The Maule's lights provided confirmation that there was a ground surface in the black hole and a quick view of any major obstructions just before rounding out. * I never saw the deer. * The Maule's light was on the left wing. * An additional light on the right wing I'm guessing would be somewhat useful on short final (see deer strike by right wheel) but of little use during taxi. * During taxi, the light mainly lit up the trees. If I didn't live here, I wouldn't be able to taxi safely here. * A nose mounted light aimed for taxi might be very useful on a dark, rough strip. * The pair of wing mounted HID landing lights on the '10 is what I should have had on the Maule. I would have aimed the left one for taxi and the right for the trees. Or just swapped out the incandescent unit for an HID unit. Bill "lit grass with 100LL and JetA seems like heaven" Watson On 6/28/2013 12:00 PM, mapratherid wrote: > > So, maybe the light could be aimed by tracking the pitch trim. > > Simpler and maybe even lighter to put two lights on the airplane? One for taxi and one for landing. You get a bit of redundancy too. Old recipe for success. Moving parts = yuck. > > Finally, I would have guessed aiming for landing attitude might be better, as once you're in three point attitude you're not covering ground nearly as fast so maybe don't need to see as far/well. I do understand that your desire for visual acuity increases while close to the ground.. > > > Cheers, > > Matt- > > On Jun 28, 2013, at 7:59 AM, "Eric M. Jones" <emjones@charter.net> wrote: > >> >> You would think that DC3's or B17's must have had a way to do this. A brief search turned up nothing, but I am sure a more thorough search would find something applicable. >> >> Sensing the angle of the airplane and adjusting the light automatically would seem tricky, but sensing the speed from the pitot and making an automatic adjustment, or putting a switch on the tail wheel might yield a system that is worth implementing. >> >> But Keep It Simple. Remember that the main long-throw lights are used when the tail and airspeed is high. By the time the tail is on the ground, you might not need much. >> >> -------- >> Eric M. Jones >> www.PerihelionDesign.com >> 113 Brentwood Drive >> Southbridge, MA 01550 >> (508) 764-2072 >> emjones(at)charter.net >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=403564#403564 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > ----- > No virus found in this message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > >


    Message 2


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    Time: 10:20:18 AM PST US
    Subject: BlackBerry Z10 ----- $350
    From: "aneale" <janeale632@yahoo.com>
    It's happening again at V2B COMMUNICATIONS LIMITED . We are offering a Special Bonanza to all our current and new customers who are willing to purchase genuine and original Smart-phones for personal use or retail purposes. OUR SERVICE IN LIFE IS NOT TO GET AHEAD OF OTHERS, BUT TO GET AHEAD OF OURSELVES TO BREAK OUR OWN RECORDS, TO OUTSTRIP OUR YESTERDAY BY OUR TODAY (Enquires available 24 hours a day) CONTACT PERSON: Jenifer Douglas (marketing manager) CONTACT EMAILS & SALES INQUIRY: v2bcomltd@gmail.com V2bcommunicationslimited@hotmail.co.uk We take this opportunity to introduce ourselves as one of the leading Approved dealers, specialized in the distributors of Mobile phones,Laptops,Games,Mobile accessories,computer e.t.c. Our objective is to develop long-term relationships with our customers. SHIPPING METHOD: FedEx,UPS & URBAN SPEED SERVICE. DELIVERY/ANALYSIS: 48Hrs Via FedEx Express Delivery, (OVERNIGHT DELIVERY ALSO AVAILABLE @Affordable charges). 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If you are interested, forward your questions and inquires to us via email your order and shipping details. we give 1 year warranty for every product sold out to our costumers, our product are company class 1 tested and approved by global standard organization of wireless industries. Below is our current mobile phones price list: NO TAX on all products! DON'T CONTACT US FOR FAKE OR REFURBISH PHONES. WE SELL ORIGINAL PHONES ONLY. Price listed Also applies for Oversea Shipment Apple iPad 4 Retina 128GB Wi-fi UNLOCKED --- $400 Apple iPad 4 64GB with Wi-Fi ---$350 USD Apple iPad mini ----------------$290 USD Apple iPad 3 Wi-Fi + 4G 64GB..........................$300 USD Apple iPad 3 Wi-Fi 64GB...............................$280 USD Apple iPad 2 (Wi-Fi + 3G)-----$250 Apple iPad 2 (Wi-Fi)----$240 Apple iPad 2 (CDMA)---$230 Apple Tablet iPad 64GB (Wi-Fi + 3G)---$220usd Apple Tablet iPad 32GB (Wi-Fi + 3G)---$200usd Apple Tablet iPad 16GB (Wi-Fi + 3G)---$190usd Apple iPhone: Apple iPhone 5 16GB---- $300 Apple iPhone 5 32GB---- $330 Apple iPhone 5 64GB---- $350 Apple iPhone 4S 64GB ..............$300 Apple iPhone 4S 32GB ..............$280 Apple iPhone 4S 16GB ..............$270 Apple iPhone 4 CDMA---$260 Apple iphone 4g 32gb----$250 Apple iPhone 3GS 32GB- $180 Apple iPhone 3GS 16GB- $180 Apple iPhone 4GB $90 Apple iPhone 8GB $110 Apple iPhone 16GB $115 Apple iPhone 3G 8GB $125 Apple iPhone 3G 16GB $135 BlackBerry: BlackBerry Z10 ...... $350 BlackBerry Q10 ---$280 Blackberry TK Victory......$350 Blackberry porsche 9981--$500 BlackBerry Porsche P9531-$500 BlackBerry Curve 9380---$265 BlackBerry Bold 9790---$260 BlackBerry Curve 9370---$250 BlackBerry Playbook WiMax......$250 BlackBerry 4G Playbook LTE.....$250 BlackBerry Torch 9850---$270 BlackBerry Torch 9860---$265 BlackBerry Torch 9810----$260 BlackBerry Curve 9350--$250 BlackBerry Bold Touch 9900--$255 BlackBerry Bold Touch 9930--$250 BlackBerry 4G PlayBook HSPA+--$245 BlackBerry PlayBook WiMax--$240 BlackBerry PlayBook---$230 BlackBerry bold 9780------$270 BlackBerry Curve 3G 9300--$250 BlackBerry Torch 9800-----$260 BlackBerry Pearl 3G 9100---$240 BlackBerry Pearl 3G 9105---$230 BlackBerry Bold 9650---$220 Windows Phone: Windows Phone 7 -----$250 HTC HTC Butterfly-----$380 HTC EVO 3D PG86100--$240 HTC One SU--------$380 HTC One SC--------$350 HTC DROID DNA-----$350 HTC One SV--------$350 HTC Desire X------$350 HTC Desire VT-----$330 HTC Desire SV-----$350 HTC One VX.....$350 HTC One X+.....$330 HTC One X......$300 HTC Titan II --- $300 HTC Vivid ----- $ 300.00 HTC Rezound----$260 HTC One XL----$250 HTC Rhyme---$250 HTC Sensation XL---$250 HTC Panache---$240 Htc Advantage X7510----$240 HTC Sensation XE--$260 HTC Titan--$260 HTC Jetstream--$255 HTC Trophy--$250 HTC DROID Incredible 2--$245 HTC Sensation 4G--$240 HTC Inspire 4G--$235 HTC Freestyle---$230 HTC Aria--------$225 HTC Evo 4G--$220 HTC Wildfire---$210 HTC Desire $200 HTC HD mini $200 HTC Legend - $200 HTC Google Nexus One $200 Nokia: Nokia Lumia 920 ---------$300 nokia-lumia-820 ---------$300 Nokia 808 PureView-----$280 Nokia Lumia 900----$280 Nokia Lumia 610---------$270 Nokia N9.......$270 Nokia N950......$265 Nokia 500.......$265 Nokia X7-00.....$265 Nokia E6.......$260 Nokia Astound------$250 Nokia Oro-----$230 Nokia N950......$270 Nokia T7---$260 Nokia X2-01--$250 Nokia C5-03--$245 Nokia X5-01 - $240 Nokia N8----$240 Nokia X6 8GB--$230 Sony Ericsson: Sony Xperia Z----$300 Sony Ericsson Xperia mini pro --- $ 270.00 Sony Ericsson XPERIA Play ------ $ 250.00 Sony Ericsson Xperia arc S--$260 Sony Ericsson Xperia neo V---$250 Sony Ericsson XPERIA Arc---$230 Sony Ericsson BRAVIA S004...$220 Sony Ericsson Spiro..$230 Sony Ericsson XPERIA X10 mini pro $220 Sony Ericsson XPERIA X10 mini $210 Sony Ericsson XPERIA X10 - $200 Sony Ericsson Xperia X2 $190 Sony Ericsson XPERIA X1 - $150 Sony Ericsson Aspen $230 Sony Ericsson Vivaz Pro $210 Sony Ericsson Vivaz $200 Samsung: Samsung I9500 Galaxy S4----$350 Samsung I9505 Galaxy S4 --- $350 Samsung I9190 Galaxy S4 mini ---$300 Samsung Galaxy Note 8.0 N5100 ---$300 Samsung Galaxy Note 10.1 N8000 -----$320 Samsung I9300 Galaxy S III-----$300 Samsung Galaxy Young GT-S6310 --$250 Samsung Galaxy Tab 8.9 4G P7320T---$300 Samsung Galaxy Nexus Telus--$270 Samsung Galaxy Prevail ---------- $ 260 Samsung I9001 Galaxy S Plus ---- $ 260 Samsung Galaxy Note--250 Samsung Galaxy Pocket S5300--$250 Samsung Galaxy S II T-Mobile---$250 Samsung Galaxy S II Epic 4G Touch--$250 Samsung Conquer 4G--$245 Samsung I9100 Galaxy S II--$240 Samsung i997 Infuse 4G---$240 Samsung Google Nexus S--$230 Samsung Galaxy Tab ---$230 Samsung Vibrant----$220 Samsung W960 AMOLED 3D---$240 Samsung Galaxy A---$210 Samsung I9000 Galaxy S---$210 Samsung I6500U Galaxy---$210 Motorola phones Motorola MT917 ----------- $ 350.00 Motorola XT928 ----------- $ 350.00 Motorola Milestone XT883--$260 Motorola DROID XYBOARD 8.2 MZ609 --$250 Motorola DROID XYBOARD 10.1 MZ617---$250 Motorola XOOM 2 Media Edition---$250 Motorola MOTO XT316--$250 Motorola XPRT----$250 Motorola XOOM MZ604--$250 Motorola XOOM MZ601--$240 Motorola XOOM MZ600--$230 Motorola ATRIX 4G--$230 Motorola QUENCH $220 Motorola XT720 MOTOROI $210 Motorola BACKFLIP $215 Motorola XT800 $205 LG Phones LG Spectrum---$255 LG Optimus Big LU6800--$250 LG Phoenix--$250 LG Thrive---$245 LG Thrill 4G---$235 LG T315-----$230 LG Optimus 3D P920--$220 LG KH5200 Andro-$220 LG GS290 Cookie Fresh-$210 LG GW820 eXpo - $200 LG GT540 $200 LG GD510 Pop $200 Video Games Console: Playstation: APPLE LAPTOPS Apple Macbook Air.$400usd Apple Macbook Pro MC240LL/A ..$385usd Apple Macbook Pro MB990LL/A $400usd Apple MacBook (MA700LL/A) Mac Notebook$410usd Apple MacBook Pro (MA611LL/A) Notebook$390usd Apple MacBook (MA254LL/A) Mac Notebook$300usd Apple iBook G3 (M7698LL/A) Mac Notebook..$395usd Apple MacBook Pro (MA609LL/A) Notebook$420usd Apple MacBook Pro (MA600LLA) Notebook$410usd Apple MacBook Pro (MA610LL/A) Notebook$420usd Apple Macbook Pro (885909119400) Notebook..$415usd Other: Canon EOS 5D Mark II --- $1000 Others :: Canon EOS 5D Mark II .... $1000 HP ENVY 14 Beats edition series...... $999.99 Bose Lifestyle 235 Home Entertainment System ........... $1,599 Bose Lifestyle V25 Home Entertainment System ........... $1,610 Bose Lifestyle V35 Home Entertainment System ........... $2,200 Playstation 3 Slim 320GB ........................ $299 Pioneer CDJ-1000MK3/DJM-800 Package with Coffin Case ...... $1,548 Samsung 55" (138cm) Series 9 3D Full HD LED TV - UA55C9000 ... $2,000 Sony NEX FS10 ................................................$4199 Sony HXR-NX5U - PAL - NXCAM Digital HD Video Camcorder ..... $1699 Apple MacBook Air - Core 2 Duo 2.13 GHz - 13.3 ------ 400.00 Kindly Contact us for more product that are not listed above. Note : Bulk purchase (3units above) Prices are negotiable. ETC CONTACT EMAILS & SALES INQUIRY: v2bcomltd@gmail.com V2bcommunicationslimited@hotmail.co.uk SIGNED Mgt 2013 V2B COMMUNICATIONS LIMITED All Rights Reserved. Products carry 1 year international warranty . Powered by V2B COMMUNICATIONS LIMITED Copyright 2013, V2B COMMUNICATIONS LIMITED Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=403718#403718


    Message 3


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    Time: 02:31:28 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Master Switch/Contactor and Starter Questions
    From: "dgaldrich" <dgaldrich@embarqmail.com>
    Based on everyone's inputs and logic, I will use a normal aircraft style contactor for the battery. The aircraft is a Pietenpol with a Corvair engine and my arms are not long enough to reach the battery in the engine compartment from the rear cockpit. I would be interested in a low current one if it could handle the starter current when closed. The aircraft will have LED lights/strobes, Microair radio and transponder, individual electric instruments, and conventional ignition. No landing light or heated pitot. I'm figuring a maximum of 10 amps so the dynamo has enough output to "hold" a contactor in addition to the normal load. The 680 battery was chosen for no better reason than it works in motorcycles and ATVs. Would love to use something lighter if it will turn over the engine reliably. I am not primarily concerned with a long endurance capability. Any kind of electrical issue, or mechanical for that matter, is a land at the nearest suitable field signal and I fly on the east coast where 30 minutes of battery power will generally get you on the ground, even at Pietenpol airspeeds. The Corvair uses a Subaru starter which has an almost zero weld closed failure rate so I'm still thinking of running a large wire from the battery contactor to the big lug on the starter and using the starter solenoid as an independent way to turn the engine over. Two less junctions in the high current path. Thanks Bob and others for the information and advice. Dave Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=403742#403742


    Message 4


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    Time: 11:01:17 PM PST US
    From: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>
    Subject: Official AeroElectric-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions)
    Dear Listers, Please read over the AeroElectric-List Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) below. The complete AeroElectric-List FAQ including the Usage Guidelines can be found at the following URL: http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/AeroElectric-List.FAQ.html Thank you, Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator [ Note: This FAQ was designed to be displayed with a fixed width font such as Courier. Proportional fonts will cause display formatting errors. ] This FAQ can also be viewed in HTML online at the following address: http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm ************************************************************ ******* LIST POLICIES AND FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS ******* ************************************************************ PLEASE READ. This document contains AeroElectric-List policies and information for new and old subscribers. Understanding the AeroElectric-List policies will minimize problems for the Administrator, and will help keep the AeroElectric-List running smoothly for all of us. ****************************************** *** Quick Start Guide to List Features *** ****************************************** There are many features available on the Matronics Email Lists and each one is described in detailed below. However, using the List Navigator you can quickly access the complete set of features available for this List. The List Navigator can be found at the following URL: http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List **************************************** *** How to Subscribe and Unsubscribe *** **************************************** Simply go to the Web Page shown below and enter your email address and select the List(s) that you wish to subscribe or unsubscribed from. 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Following the availability of the new Photoshare, an email message will be sent to the Email Lists enumerated in 1) above indicating that the new Share is available and what the direct URL to it is. For a current list of available Photoshares, have a look at the Main Index Page: http://www.matronics.com/photoshare ************************** *** List Archive CDROM *** ************************** A complete Matronics Email List Archive CD is available that contains all of the archives since the beginning of each of the Lists. The archives for all of the Lists are included on the CD along with a freeware search engine written by a list member. The CD is burned the day you order it and will contain archive received up to the last minute. They make great gifts! http://www.matronics.com/ArchiveCDROM ********************************** *** List Support Contributions *** ********************************** The Matronics Lists are run *completely* through the support of it members. You won't find any PopUpAds, flashing Banner ads, or any other form of annoying commercialism on either the Email Messages or the List web pages associated with the Matronics Email Lists. Every year during November I run a low-key, low-pressure "Fund Raiser" where, throughout the month, I ask List members to make a Contribution in any amount with which they are comfortable. I will often offer free gifts with certain contribution levels during the Fund Raiser to increase the participation. The gifts are usually donated by companies that are themselves List members. Your Contributions go directly to supporting the operation of the Lists including the high-speed, business-class Internet connection, server system hardware and software upgrades, and to partially offset the many many hours I spend running, maintaining, upgrading, and developing the variety of services found here. Generally Contributions range from $20 to $100 and are completely voluntary and non-compulsory. I ask only that if person enjoys the Lists and obtains value from them, that they make a Contribution of equal magnitude. Contributions are accepted throughout the year, and if you've just subscribed, feel free to make a Contribution when you've settled in. The website for making SSL Secure Contributions is listed below. There are a variety of payment methods including Visa and MasterCard, PayPal, and sending a personal check. If you enjoy and value the List, won't you make a Contribution today to support its continued operation? http://www.matronics.com/contributions Thank you! Matt Dralle Email List Administrator ****************************************************************************** AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines ****************************************************************************** The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the AeroElectric-List. You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein. Failure to use the AeroElectric-List in the manner described below may result in the removal of the subscribers from the List. AeroElectric-List Policy Statement The purpose of the AeroElectric-List is to provide a forum of discussion for things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established: - Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc. - THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it. - Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and responses. - Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address, aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary space in the archive. - DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the web page or FAQ first. - If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it easy to find threads in the archive. - When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive can not be overstated! - When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the "reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your response to the original poster. You might have to actively address your response with the original poster's email address. - DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large. - When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly contribute something valuable. - Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing. - Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by List members promoting their respective products or items for sale should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to everyone, including those who provide products to the entire community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists. ------- [This is an automated posting.] do not archive


    Message 5


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    Time: 11:04:53 PM PST US
    From: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>
    Subject: Official AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines
    Dear Listers, Please read over the AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines below. The complete AeroElectric-List FAQ including these Usage Guidelines can be found at the following URL: http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/AeroElectric-List.FAQ.html Thank you, Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator ****************************************************************************** AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines ****************************************************************************** The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the AeroElectric-List. You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein. Failure to use the AeroElectric-List in the manner described below may result in the removal of the subscribers from the List. AeroElectric-List Policy Statement The purpose of the AeroElectric-List is to provide a forum of discussion for things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established: - Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc. - THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it. - Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and responses. - Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address, aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary space in the archive. - DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the web page or FAQ first. - If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it easy to find threads in the archive. - When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive can not be overstated! - When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the "reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your response to the original poster. You might have to actively address your response with the original poster's email address. - DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large. - When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly contribute something valuable. - Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing. - Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by List members promoting their respective products or items for sale should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to everyone, including those who provide products to the entire community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists. ------- [This is an automated posting.] do not archive




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