Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:46 AM - Re: Re: roll my own transponder antenna? (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
2. 06:47 AM - Re: Navman Fuel Flow Meter (Ron Walker)
3. 08:04 AM - Re: Navman Fuel Flow Meter (Tim Andres)
4. 08:08 AM - Re: . . . up from the ashes. (BobsV35B@aol.com)
5. 08:42 AM - Re: Navman Fuel Flow Meter (bob noffs)
6. 08:48 AM - Travel Air 16 (BobsV35B@aol.com)
7. 09:03 AM - Re: . . . up from the ashes. (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
8. 11:57 AM - Re: . . . up from the ashes. (BobsV35B@aol.com)
9. 08:15 PM - KT 76 Installation Manual (Matt Stecher)
10. 08:36 PM - Re: KT 76 Installation Manual (Mauri Morin)
11. 09:22 PM - Re: KT 76 Installation Manual (Bill Putney)
12. 10:02 PM - Re: KT 76 Installation Manual (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
13. 10:04 PM - Operating, installation, service manuals (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
14. 10:26 PM - Re: KT 76 Installation Manual (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: roll my own transponder antenna? |
At 10:34 PM 8/6/2013, you wrote:
>
>I'm disappointed to report that I couldn't solder the coax to the
>adapter fitting. I got the core soldered okay, but the braid stumped
>me. Solder would stick to the braid, but not the fitting. Think it's
>such a big heat sink. I was afraid to hold the iron on the braid too
>long for fear of melting the insulation. But I guess if it's not hot
>enough for the solder to stick to the fitting, it's not going to
>melt the plastic?
If you're using a modern coax (RG-141/142/400) then
soldering temperatures will not harm the insulation.
Sounds like your soldering iron is too small.
Bob . . .
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Navman Fuel Flow Meter |
On Tue, 2013-08-06 at 18:52 -0700, Tim Andres wrote:
> This may be of interest to those running a Navman flow sensor. No
> horse in this race, but its worth reading I think.
> http://www.cozybuilders.org/Glenn_Saunders/Complete_Report.pdf Tim
Interesting report -- I'm always pleased with the detail and content
that is contained within Canadian TSB reports. That said, I still have
questions about the installation and failure mode:
- was a cause of the fire identified ?
- was it the crash that caused the fracture of the meter intake ?
- was the installation of this sensor up or downstream of the fuel
pump ?
It's not specifically called out, but it leaves you to assume that it
was indeed installed within the engine compartment. Not a good idea for
anything made of plastic materials due to the heat, let alone the
vibration.
The fact that manufacturer of the pump specifies "not for use in
aircraft" is no surprise - no one wants the potential liability. I
blindly assumed that since I purchased mine from Spruce that it was OK
to use. With one look at it, even I figured out that it shouldn't go in
the heat of the engine area -- I mounted mine close to the fuel tank,
away from heat and vibration. Heck, even the engine and flight control
push/pull cables that I received from Vans for my RV10 have large tags
on them saying "Not for Aircraft use".
The timing of this topic, though, hits close to home. I already have in
hand a replacement fuel flow sensor from MGL that I am in process of
installing in my 7a in place of this Navman. This thread has me
re-thinking about my intent to sell this device to another aviator.
--Ron
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Navman Fuel Flow Meter |
Ron I cant definitively answer those questions for you. This came up recently on
canard aviators when one popped up for sale and was also discussed much at the
time of the accident.
It my understanding the fitting cracked, broke, leaked, and ignited while airborne
on first flight after a different engine (type) was installed.
Marc Zeitlen can give you a lot more details if you need them, and he may have
been involved in the investigation, I don't recall now, but Im pretty sure I can
say he will advise you park the plane until its removed.
Tim
Sent from my iPad
On Aug 7, 2013, at 6:46 AM, Ron Walker <n520tx@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> On Tue, 2013-08-06 at 18:52 -0700, Tim Andres wrote:
>> This may be of interest to those running a Navman flow sensor. No
>> horse in this race, but its worth reading I think.
>> http://www.cozybuilders.org/Glenn_Saunders/Complete_Report.pdf Tim
>
> Interesting report -- I'm always pleased with the detail and content
> that is contained within Canadian TSB reports. That said, I still have
> questions about the installation and failure mode:
>
> - was a cause of the fire identified ?
> - was it the crash that caused the fracture of the meter intake ?
> - was the installation of this sensor up or downstream of the fuel
> pump ?
>
> It's not specifically called out, but it leaves you to assume that it
> was indeed installed within the engine compartment. Not a good idea for
> anything made of plastic materials due to the heat, let alone the
> vibration.
>
> The fact that manufacturer of the pump specifies "not for use in
> aircraft" is no surprise - no one wants the potential liability. I
> blindly assumed that since I purchased mine from Spruce that it was OK
> to use. With one look at it, even I figured out that it shouldn't go in
> the heat of the engine area -- I mounted mine close to the fuel tank,
> away from heat and vibration. Heck, even the engine and flight control
> push/pull cables that I received from Vans for my RV10 have large tags
> on them saying "Not for Aircraft use".
>
> The timing of this topic, though, hits close to home. I already have in
> hand a replacement fuel flow sensor from MGL that I am in process of
> installing in my 7a in place of this Navman. This thread has me
> re-thinking about my intent to sell this device to another aviator.
>
> --Ron
>
>
>
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: . . . up from the ashes. |
Good Morning Bob,
I do believe the Model 16 was from the Travel Air days and was the last
product before Curtiss Wright elected to shut down the Travel Air Division.
Walter had inspired Ted Wells to come up with a high speed biplane using
the latest NACA data, and that was to be the Travel Air Model 17. When
Curtiss Wright made the decision to dump Travel Air, they offered Walter a job
as
a Vice President of Curtiss Wright. He declined and asked to be able to
take Ted Wells and his design back to Wichita to build under his own name.
That became his severance package!
All of the above is well documented in the Book Staggerwing available in
Tullahoma, Tennessee, from the Beechcraft Heritage Museum folks.
The Travel Air Model 16 was a very nice open cockpit sport biplane.
Happy Skies,
Old Bob
In a message dated 8/1/2013 5:00:31 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com writes:
At 01:21 PM 8/1/2013, you wrote:
Bob -
I imagine a deserved sense of satisfaction on your part - Seeing
some promise in this company in which you invested a fair amount of time.
Yeah, it's sorta like watching some of the
things your kids do after they leave home
and wondering where you went wrong! But
core values, no matter how obscured,
can emerge under the right conditions.
There were times when I would have thought
my children's present achievements were
completely out of reach . . . but after
20 years, mom and I couldn't be more pleased.
Perhaps there's a spark of resurrection
left from this company's legacies.
Just discovered that there was a Model 16 built
out in the Liberal facility. It post dates
the Model 17 by many years. Only one ever
built . . . Olive Ann didn't like it and nixed
the program.
I'll have to see if any pictures of it
still exist. Being a one-of experimental,
it seems unlikely.
Bob . . .
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Navman Fuel Flow Meter |
there are many fuel flo systems out there that use the ''red cube''. the
cube is metal and i have a ''flight data computer'' that uses the red cube.
i little tweaking and it is dead on. my experience with this computer has
been all positive.
bob noffs
On Wed, Aug 7, 2013 at 10:02 AM, Tim Andres <tim2542@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> >
>
> Ron I cant definitively answer those questions for you. This came up
> recently on canard aviators when one popped up for sale and was also
> discussed much at the time of the accident.
> It my understanding the fitting cracked, broke, leaked, and ignited while
> airborne on first flight after a different engine (type) was installed.
> Marc Zeitlen can give you a lot more details if you need them, and he may
> have been involved in the investigation, I don't recall now, but Im pretty
> sure I can say he will advise you park the plane until its removed.
> Tim
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Aug 7, 2013, at 6:46 AM, Ron Walker <n520tx@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >
> > On Tue, 2013-08-06 at 18:52 -0700, Tim Andres wrote:
> >> This may be of interest to those running a Navman flow sensor. No
> >> horse in this race, but its worth reading I think.
> >> http://www.cozybuilders.org/Glenn_Saunders/Complete_Report.pdf Tim
> >
> > Interesting report -- I'm always pleased with the detail and content
> > that is contained within Canadian TSB reports. That said, I still have
> > questions about the installation and failure mode:
> >
> > - was a cause of the fire identified ?
> > - was it the crash that caused the fracture of the meter intake ?
> > - was the installation of this sensor up or downstream of the fuel
> > pump ?
> >
> > It's not specifically called out, but it leaves you to assume that it
> > was indeed installed within the engine compartment. Not a good idea for
> > anything made of plastic materials due to the heat, let alone the
> > vibration.
> >
> > The fact that manufacturer of the pump specifies "not for use in
> > aircraft" is no surprise - no one wants the potential liability. I
> > blindly assumed that since I purchased mine from Spruce that it was OK
> > to use. With one look at it, even I figured out that it shouldn't go in
> > the heat of the engine area -- I mounted mine close to the fuel tank,
> > away from heat and vibration. Heck, even the engine and flight control
> > push/pull cables that I received from Vans for my RV10 have large tags
> > on them saying "Not for Aircraft use".
> >
> > The timing of this topic, though, hits close to home. I already have in
> > hand a replacement fuel flow sensor from MGL that I am in process of
> > installing in my 7a in place of this Navman. This thread has me
> > re-thinking about my intent to sell this device to another aviator.
> >
> > --Ron
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 6
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Good Morning 'Lectric Bob,
I do believe the Model 16 was from the Travel Air days and was the last
product before Curtiss Wright elected to shut down the Travel Air Division.
Walter had inspired Ted Wells to come up with a high speed biplane using
the latest NACA data, and that was to be the Travel Air Model 17. When
Curtiss Wright made the decision to dump Travel Air, they offered Walter a job
as
a Vice President of Curtiss Wright. He declined and asked to be able to
take Ted Wells and his design back to Wichita to build under his own name.
That became his severance package!
All of the above is well documented in the Book Staggerwing available in
Tullahoma, Tennessee, from the Beechcraft Heritage Museum folks.
The Travel Air Model 16 was a very nice open cockpit sport biplane.
Happy Skies,
Old Bob
In a message dated 8/1/2013 5:00:31 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com writes:
At 01:21 PM 8/1/2013, you wrote:
Bob -
I imagine a deserved sense of satisfaction on your part - Seeing
some promise in this company in which you invested a fair amount of time.
Yeah, it's sorta like watching some of the
things your kids do after they leave home
and wondering where you went wrong! But
core values, no matter how obscured,
can emerge under the right conditions.
There were times when I would have thought
my children's present achievements were
completely out of reach . . . but after
20 years, mom and I couldn't be more pleased.
Perhaps there's a spark of resurrection
left from this company's legacies.
Just discovered that there was a Model 16 built
out in the Liberal facility. It post dates
the Model 17 by many years. Only one ever
built . . . Olive Ann didn't like it and nixed
the program.
I'll have to see if any pictures of it
still exist. Being a one-of experimental,
it seems unlikely.
Bob . . .
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: . . . up from the ashes. |
At 10:07 AM 8/7/2013, you wrote:
>Good Morning Bob,
>
>I do believe the Model 16 was from the Travel Air days and was the
>last product before Curtiss Wright elected to shut down the Travel
>Air Division.
>
>Walter had inspired Ted Wells to come up with a high speed biplane
>using the latest NACA data, and that was to be the Travel Air Model
>17. When Curtiss Wright made the decision to dump Travel Air, they
>offered Walter a job as a Vice President of Curtiss Wright. He
>declined and asked to be able to take Ted Wells and his design back
>to Wichita to build under his own name. That became his severance package!
>
>All of the above is well documented in the Book Staggerwing
>available in Tullahoma, Tennessee, from the Beechcraft Heritage Museum folks.
>
>The Travel Air Model 16 was a very nice open cockpit sport biplane.
Hmmmm . . . seems some overlap of information
http://tinyurl.com/mn8huw4
I think some of the Liberal crew from the 1970s
are still around, I'll see if anyone can enlighten
me. Liberal was the site of several production
lines and several skink works kinds of effort.
Our targets guys droned a Musketeer at
Liberal for some military proposal.
Bob . . .
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: . . . up from the ashes. |
Good Afternoon 'Lectric Bob,
Sure could have been a later use of the Model 16 moniker. Beech Aircraft
Corporation did play around with model numbers. No doubt there were some
shenanigans out at Liberal in those days. We always wandered around as much as
we could when picking up Musketeers. I know there were places we were not
allowed to enter. Rumor at that time was that they were messing with an idea
to build a high speed Mousketeer to supplant the Bonanza line. Did not
perform worth a darn so we heard!
There were ten to fifteen of the original Travel Air Model 16s built with
various engines. Mostly Kinners.
Happy Skies,
Old Bob
In a message dated 8/7/2013 12:27:07 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com writes:
At 10:07 AM 8/7/2013, you wrote:
Good Morning Bob,
I do believe the Model 16 was from the Travel Air days and was the last
product before Curtiss Wright elected to shut down the Travel Air Division.
Walter had inspired Ted Wells to come up with a high speed biplane using
the latest NACA data, and that was to be the Travel Air Model 17. When
Curtiss Wright made the decision to dump Travel Air, they offered Walter a job
as a Vice President of Curtiss Wright. He declined and asked to be able to
take Ted Wells and his design back to Wichita to build under his own name.
That became his severance package!
All of the above is well documented in the Book Staggerwing available in
Tullahoma, Tennessee, from the Beechcraft Heritage Museum folks.
The Travel Air Model 16 was a very nice open cockpit sport biplane.
Hmmmm . . . seems some overlap of information
http://tinyurl.com/mn8huw4
I think some of the Liberal crew from the 1970s
are still around, I'll see if anyone can enlighten
me. Liberal was the site of several production
lines and several skink works kinds of effort.
Our targets guys droned a Musketeer at
Liberal for some military proposal.
Bob . . .
Message 9
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| Subject: | KT 76 Installation Manual |
I am in need of the KT 76 transponder installation manual since I can't seem
to find it any place.
I talked with BendixKing today and for some reason they can no longer share
it. I did find the pinout diagram that is on the Aeroelectric site, but I
would like the entire manual to be sure that I don't miss anything.
Thanks everyone and fly safe,
Matt Stecher
Varieze N54EG rebuild
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: KT 76 Installation Manual |
I believe I have one in the hangar, I'll check in the morning and let you
know for sure. If I do, where do you want a copy sent ?
MAURV8
On Wed, Aug 7, 2013 at 9:14 PM, Matt Stecher <mrcc1234@sbcglobal.net> wrote
:
> I am in need of the KT 76 transponder installation manual since I can=92t
> seem to find it any place. ****
>
> ** **
>
> I talked with BendixKing today and for some reason they can no longer
> share it. I did find the pinout diagram that is on the Aeroelectric site,
> but I would like the entire manual to be sure that I don=92t miss anythin
g.*
> ***
>
> ** **
>
> Thanks everyone and fly safe,****
>
> Matt Stecher****
>
> Varieze N54EG rebuild****
>
> *
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
> *
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: KT 76 Installation Manual |
Matt,
Try this. http://www.aea.net/TechPubs/BendixKing/pdf/InstallAndMaint/kt76a78
a_r7/kt76a78a_r7.pdf
Bill
Sent from my iPad
On Aug 7, 2013, at 8:14 PM, "Matt Stecher" <mrcc1234@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> I am in need of the KT 76 transponder installation manual since I can
=99t seem to find it any place.
>
> I talked with BendixKing today and for some reason they can no longer shar
e it. I did find the pinout diagram that is on the Aeroelectric site, but I w
ould like the entire manual to be sure that I don=99t miss anything.
>
> Thanks everyone and fly safe,
> Matt Stecher
> Varieze N54EG rebuild
>
>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: KT 76 Installation Manual |
At 10:35 PM 8/7/2013, you wrote:
>I believe I have one in the hangar, I'll check in the morning and
>let you know for sure. If I do, where do you want a copy sent ?
>MAURV8
If you would copy me too . . . or let me borrow the original
for adding to our archives, I'll scan and return it.
Box 130
Medicine Lodge, KS 67104
Bob . . .
Message 13
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| Subject: | Operating, installation, service manuals |
While we're on that topic, if anyone has
a hard copy or .pdf of a manual for some
piece of avionics they'd like to share,
I'd be pleased to have access to the documents
for addition to the archives at AeroElectric.com
Bob . . .
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: KT 76 Installation Manual |
At 10:35 PM 8/7/2013, you wrote:
>I believe I have one in the hangar, I'll check in the morning and
>let you know for sure. If I do, where do you want a copy sent ?
>MAURV8
>
>
>On Wed, Aug 7, 2013 at 9:14 PM, Matt Stecher
><<mailto:mrcc1234@sbcglobal.net>mrcc1234@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
>I am in need of the KT 76 transponder installation manual since I
>can't seem to find it any place.
>
>
I did find the installation manual for a KT76C
http://tinyurl.com/m2zyr8q
I've added a number of new documents to the Bendix/King
folder at
http://tinyurl.com/kcwmt6f
Bob . . .
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