---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 09/26/13: 7 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:07 AM - Re: De-Slumpifier, Voltage Buffer to Prevent Brownout (Yahoo hasbroucka) 2. 06:36 AM - Re: De-Slumpifier, Voltage Buffer to Prevent Brownout (R. curtis) 3. 08:34 AM - Re: Failed brownout battery experiment (user9253) 4. 09:01 AM - Re: De-Slumpifier, Voltage Buffer to Prevent Brownout (Michael Orth) 5. 11:00 AM - Re: failed (?) brownout experiment (D L Josephson) 6. 01:02 PM - Re: Re: failed (?) brownout experiment (Tcwtech) 7. 09:48 PM - Re: Re: failed (?) brownout experiment (Eric Page) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:07:59 AM PST US From: "Yahoo hasbroucka" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: De-Slumpifier, Voltage Buffer to Prevent Brownout > I built and tested the 12V De-Slumpifier and it behaves very well with no > surprises. OK, I'll bite. What is a De-Slumpifier? > The supercaps behave almost exactly > like a 250,000 uF/20V capacitor bank which used to fit into a suitcase. I' take a stab that this is a replacement for the typical filter Capacitor for Alternator, and if so does your device save weight? Alan , HasbrouckA@yahoo.com SeaRey Amphibian, framework and hull assembled and covered. Working on VFR avionics and wiring (Dynon Skyview full suite)and Paint. Top Priority is keep it light, and place weight forward! > I don't have a publishable test protocol, but for general > purposes this is a good design that can be used for many anti-slump > applications. If there is sufficient interest, I will make a PCB and maybe > a kit of parts. > > Note how much space remains inside the box. The 35W resistor and heatsink > and one diode is under the perf board. > > I added an optional LED indicator. > > -------- > Eric M. Jones > www.PerihelionDesign.com > 113 Brentwood Drive > Southbridge, MA 01550 > (508) 764-2072 > emjones(at)charter.net > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=408239#408239 > > > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/slumpless_12v_buffer_136.pdf > http://forums.matronics.com//files/p1000038_899.jpg > http://forums.matronics.com//files/p1000037_104.jpg > > > > > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:36:04 AM PST US From: "R. curtis" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: De-Slumpifier, Voltage Buffer to Prevent Brownout > OK, I'll bite. What is a De-Slumpifier? It's a device to make us old guys stand up straight!! ;-} Roger -- Do you have a slow PC? Try a Free scan http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 08:34:57 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Failed brownout battery experiment From: "user9253" The 28 volts AC that I measured using a cheap digital meter in the hangar was completely wrong. Testing the DC -DC voltage booster in my home workshop, my Fluke 76 true RMS meter displayed 1.6mv AC. My oscilloscope showed 12mv peak to peak ripple at a frequency of 400KHz. I connected a 1141 automotive lamp (1.4 amp) to the ouput of the voltage booster to simulate the Dynon D-180 load. Even though the voltage booster was set at 13 volts with no load, under load the voltage dropped over time to less than 10 volts. So that is why the Dynon continuously booted up and shut off. The Dynon would see 13 volts and turn on. As the voltage from the booster dropped off, the Dynon would shut off. Next I adjusted the pot on the voltage booster to give 25 volts output with no load. Then I connected the lamp. The voltage immediately dropped to 13 volts, then slowly dropped to less than 10 volts over a period of about 3 minutes. I noticed that negative input and negative output are connected together on the circuit board. It seems that the output voltage drops off as the IC heats up. It does not get hot enough to burn, but it is too hot to hold a finger on. I have concluded that if this voltage booster gets its power from the starter circuit, it should prevent a brownout during engine start. However, it is incapable of supplying power for longer than a few seconds. To Henador, no I never reversed the input polarity. To Bob, since I have bench tested the voltage booster, I will not send it to you unless you still want it. Do you? I will test Eric's DeSlumpifier when it arrives. Joe -------- Joe Gores Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=409274#409274 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 09:01:11 AM PST US From: "Michael Orth" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: De-Slumpifier, Voltage Buffer to Prevent Brownout >It's a device to make us old guys stand up straight!! ;-} Roger Oh, Viagra. Now I get it. Michael -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- -----Original Message----- From: R. curtis Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2013 6:34 AM Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: De-Slumpifier, Voltage Buffer to Prevent Brownout > OK, I'll bite. What is a De-Slumpifier? It's a device to make us old guys stand up straight!! ;-} Roger -- Do you have a slow PC? Try a Free scan http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 11:00:53 AM PST US From: D L Josephson Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: failed (?) brownout experiment The ebay board looks like it uses an LM2577 regulator. I've built a few things with this part and it's sometimes tricky to tame. The characteristics of the inductor, diode and compensation capacitor are critical, see the TI datasheet. At low currents it will work fine with wide variations in components, but once you draw significant current even for a short time the circuit can misbehave. -- David Josephson ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 01:02:27 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: failed (?) brownout experiment From: Tcwtech I realize that many of those on this list are interested in the educational experience of solving some of these interesting problems we run into with our electrically oriented aircraft. I totally respect that. However, I did want to address the issue of brown out protection for some of the critical devices such as efis and engine monitors. We do sell a line of products specifically for this purpose. They are purpose built dc:dc converters that take as little as 4 volts in and boost it to a steady 12 volts. Thereby providing stabilized power to the connected loads. The product line is known as IPS, Intelligent Power Stabilizer and is available in 14 and 24 volt models at various output current levels. Also some of the banter going on regarding the operation at very low voltages is very much true, recognizing that we came up with a creative solution for which we received a US patent that is implemented I'm these products. So our IPS units do operate smoothly and properly to 4 volts and below. All the details are on www.Tcwtech.Com Thanks Bob Newman RV-10. N541RV Sent from my iPhone On Sep 26, 2013, at 1:59 PM, D L Josephson wrote: > > The ebay board looks like it uses an LM2577 regulator. I've built a few things with this part and it's sometimes tricky to tame. The characteristics of the inductor, diode and compensation capacitor are critical, see the TI datasheet. At low currents it will work fine with wide variations in components, but once you draw significant current even for a short time the circuit can misbehave. > > -- > David Josephson > > > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 09:48:17 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: failed (?) brownout experiment From: Eric Page I'm not so sure... The description and photos of the board Joe bought show a buck/boost unit, but the LM2577 is a boost/flyback IC. With the part number obliterated in the eBay photos, we can't really know for sure. That was probably done because the IC is a black market knockoff, which I believe is common on these kinds of inexpensive boards from China. How else do they deliver them halfway around the world for the price of the IC alone? A quick search on Digi-Key revealed a number of adjustable buck/boost ICs from Linear Technologies and ON Semiconductor in the DDPAK/TO-263 package, but none with a 180kHz switching frequency. Hmmm.... Besides the difficulty David mentioned below (in selecting just the right components to support a switching regulator), there's also their sensitivity to board layout. If that isn't done right, even the perfect components can't help. Eric On Sep 26, 2013, at 10:59 AM, D L Josephson wrote: > The ebay board looks like it uses an LM2577 regulator. I've built a few things with this part and it's sometimes tricky to tame. The characteristics of the inductor, diode and compensation capacitor are critical, see the TI datasheet. At low currents it will work fine with wide variations in components, but once you draw significant current even for a short time the circuit can misbehave. > > -- > David Josephson ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message aeroelectric-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/aeroelectric-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/aeroelectric-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.