---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 12/23/13: 11 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 01:53 AM - Re: Switch schematic (JOHN TIPTON) 2. 01:57 AM - Re: Switch schematic (JOHN TIPTON) 3. 02:13 AM - Re: Switch schematic (Carlos Trigo) 4. 07:38 AM - Re: Re: Any know is there a typical faliure mode for Soild State R (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 5. 08:46 AM - Re: Re: Any know is there a typical faliure mode for Soild State R (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 6. 09:03 AM - Re: Any know is there a typical faliure mode for Soild State Relays (Eric Page) 7. 09:41 AM - Re: Any know is there a typical faliure mode for Soild State Relays (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 8. 10:08 AM - Re: Any know is there a typical faliure mode for Soild State Relays (Jeff Luckey) 9. 10:32 AM - Re: Any know is there a typical faliure mode for Soild State Relays (Eric Page) 10. 11:29 AM - Re: Landing Lights (Eric M. Jones) 11. 03:56 PM - Re: Any know is there a typical faliure mode for Soild State Relays (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 01:53:47 AM PST US From: JOHN TIPTON Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Switch schematic Hi Carlos=0A=0AYes: that would certainly do what you want, they do do one w here the switch is not locked out in the on position, convenient for a quic k flip to switch off=0A=0AJohn ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 01:57:47 AM PST US From: JOHN TIPTON Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Switch schematic PS: I may have one which you can have - away at the moment (day after Boxin g Day) will let you know=0A=0AJohn ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 02:13:03 AM PST US From: "Carlos Trigo" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Switch schematic Thank you John Merry Christmas! Carlos From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of JOHN TIPTON Sent: segunda-feira, 23 de Dezembro de 2013 09:57 Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Switch schematic PS: I may have one which you can have - away at the moment (day after Boxing Day) will let you know John _____ From: Carlos Trigo ; Subject: AeroElectric-List: Switch schematic Sent: Sun, Dec 22, 2013 6:11:10 PM Guys Since I am not sure if this switch will suite my need can somebody please post a drawing of its eletric schematic. Thanks Carlos P.S. =93 I am looking for a switch for the fuel pump that can be powered from 2 independent power sources, being the middle position the OFF position ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 07:38:07 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Any know is there a typical faliure mode for Soild State R At 08:08 PM 12/22/2013, you wrote: > >There is arguably no "typical" failure mode for anything at all. > >If there were, the engineers would be happy to see it because it >would be an easy fix. > >A failure can be "typical" if a device is being misused. "Hey, the >device typically fails if being misused!" I'll bet there are a >million engineering stories there. PRECISELY!!!! Further, it's an incomplete analysis for all the concerns if one does not also consider installation generated failures. Screw fell out, wire pulled out of terminal, fault in the controlling circuitry, etc. etc. Doing an FMEA seems like a daunting task but it gets easier if you ignore all the detail reasons WHY it might fail and concentrate on HOW if fails: (1) doesn't close on command or (2) closed without command. The WHY is irrelevant. Take those two conditions and run them through the failure detection and response tree. What are your options for dealing with either of those two failures in flight . . . and can the failure 'hide' . . . is it pre-flight detectable such that you don't take off with an already failed component. The SAFE airplane is one that produces benign and/or predictably managed failures. If parts on airplanes never failed, FBOs would be out of business. Your prime directive as the one and only flight safety manager for your project is to design for failure tolerance. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 08:46:47 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Any know is there a typical faliure mode for Soild State R I wrote: The SAFE airplane is one that produces benign and/or predictably managed failures. If parts on airplanes never failed, FBOs would be out of business. A pox on my head! . . . I've been trying to eliminate the word 'safe' from the lexicon of airplanespeak . . . but the damned word is so terribly embedded in the utopian quest by those-who-know-more- about-airplanes-that-we-do that the thing just slips out now and then. I will suggest that no airplane ever was or ever will be safe . . . Safe adj. saf=B7er, saf=B7est 1. Secure from danger, harm, or evil. 2. Free from danger or injury; unhurt: safe and sound. 3. Free from risk; sure: a safe bet. 4. Affording protection: a safe place. 5. Baseball Having reached a base without being put out, as a batter or base runner. An airplane is one component of a transportation system with strict limits for operation . . . limits that impose harsh penalties for failure to respect. The things we do in the name of 'safety' can only go to the reduction of risk. Admittedly, some efforts may produce huge reductions in risk . . . like making sure those strut bolts are Grade 8 and not pulled from the bin of stove bolts at the hardware store. The Feb 2014 issue of Kitplanes has several articles that speak to the art and science of risk reduction. One article in particular is written by a pilot who crashed his RV10 and lived to write about it. However, unlike the vast majority of what I call 'dark-n-stormy-night' stories popular with the journals, THIS article stands out as being especially introspective and analytical as to cause/effect and RISK REDUCTION. I'm going to check with Paul about archiving these articles on our website too. They are exceedingly germane to the thought processes that we strive to promote here on the List. We cannot build a safe airplane but we can build one and operate it in a manner that offers very low risk. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 09:03:47 AM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Any know is there a typical faliure mode for Soild State Relays From: Eric Page On Dec 22, 2013, at 10:51 PM, Jeff Luckey wrote: > they sure are pricey - $130 ea. @ Mouser, ouch! eBay is your friend. A search for "SSR 100A" returns 91 hits, including app ropriate heatsinks, starting at ~$9 delivered. This presumes the words "China" and "Hong Kong" don't scare you. For solid s tate devices like these, I wouldn't lose any sleep. Eric ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 09:41:30 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Any know is there a typical faliure mode for Soild State Relays At 11:02 AM 12/23/2013, you wrote: >On Dec 22, 2013, at 10:51 PM, Jeff Luckey ><jluckey@pacbell.net> wrote: >>they sure are pricey - $130 ea. @ Mouser, ouch! > >eBay is your friend. A search for "SSR 100A" returns 91 hits, >including appropriate heatsinks, starting at ~$9 delivered. > >This presumes the words "China" and "Hong Kong" don't scare >you. For solid state devices like these, I wouldn't lose any sleep. Yes . . . but take care that you get a DC/DC device . . . they LOOK just like the DC/AC. Emacs! Note the 5-60vdc rating on the output terminals of this one. I've ordered one of these to ponder and perhaps bash on a bit . . . http://tinyurl.com/l73b6lf Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 10:08:18 AM PST US From: Jeff Luckey Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Any know is there a typical faliure mode for Soild State Relays what are the power dissipation stats on these devices?- I didn't see any data on this in the EBay link...=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A____________________________ ____=0A From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" =0AT o: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com =0ASent: Monday, December 23, 2013 9:40 AM=0ASubject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Any know is there a typical faliure mode for Soild State Relays=0A =0A=0A=0AAt 11:02 AM 12/23/2013, you wrote: =0A=0AOn Dec 22, 2013, at 10:51 PM,=0AJeff Luckey=0A =0Awrote:=0A>=0A>they sure are pricey - $130 ea.=0A@ Mouser, ouch!=0A>eBay is your friend.- A search for "SSR 100A" returns 91=0Ahits, including app ropriate heatsinks, starting at ~$9=0Adelivered.=0A>=0A>This presumes the w ords "China" and "Hong Kong" don't=0Ascare you.- For solid state devices like these, I wouldn't lose any=0Asleep.=0A- Yes . . . but take care that you get a DC/DC=0A- device . . . they LOOK just like the DC/AC.=0A=0A =0A=0A- Note the 5-60vdc rating on the output terminals=0A- of this one .=0A=0A- I've ordered one of these to ponder and =0A- perhaps bash on a bit . . .=0A=0Ahttp://tinyurl.com/l73b6lf=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A- Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 10:32:55 AM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Any know is there a typical faliure mode for Soild State Relays From: Eric Page Good catch! Eric do not archive On Dec 23, 2013, at 10:40 AM, "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" wrote: > Yes . . . but take care that you get a DC/DC device . . . they LOOK just like the DC/AC. ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 11:29:18 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Landing Lights From: "Eric M. Jones" AR111 are the same as PAR-36, which are common aircraft lights. You can check these guys and the attached PDF. I have no connection to these guys. Caveat Emptor. LED Orientalight Co., Limited Website: http://www.orientalighting.com Email: info@orientalighting.com; There are a zillion makers of LED lights now. I always advise builders to buy LEDs last. They will continue to get better every month. As always, you can make your own with DIY parts see: DX.com -------- Eric M. Jones www.PerihelionDesign.com 113 Brentwood Drive Southbridge, MA 01550 (508) 764-2072 emjones(at)charter.net Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=416145#416145 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/ar111_dims_251.pdf http://forums.matronics.com//files/ar111_led_light_12v_151.pdf ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 03:56:32 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Any know is there a typical faliure mode for Soild State Relays At 12:07 PM 12/23/2013, you wrote: >what are the power dissipation stats on these devices? I didn't see >any data on this in the EBay link... You'll have to get your hands on one and measure it. I bought a similar one a couple years ago and after seeing how high the on-resistance was, I pitched it. I'm betting they're getting better. In any case, they are CERTAINLY suited to switching mundane loads with just mounting surface as a heat sink . . . the question is . . . how many calories do you need to handle at high current. Even so, as a relay controlling a hydraulic pump for landing gear, simpler mass-sinking would probably suffice given the intermittent duty service in a landing gear system. Will let you know what I find out when my sample part gets here. I've got a 100A power supply around here somewhere . . . Bob . . . ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message aeroelectric-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/aeroelectric-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/aeroelectric-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.