Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:59 AM - Re: How to Toggle Speed Brakes with Momentary On Switch? (racerjerry)
2. 07:02 AM - Really technical information (Dr. Andrew Elliott)
3. 07:13 AM - Re: Z-12 Essential Bus Questions (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
4. 07:30 AM - Re: How to Toggle Speed Brakes with Momentary On Switch? (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
5. 08:18 AM - How to Toggle Speed Brakes with Momentary On Switch? (Dennis Johnson)
6. 08:56 AM - Re: How to Toggle Speed Brakes with Momentary On Switch? (Bob McCallum)
7. 09:04 AM - Re: How to Toggle Speed Brakes with Momentary On Switch? (Valin & Allyson Thorn)
8. 09:40 AM - Re: Z-12 Essential Bus Questions (Valin & Allyson Thorn)
9. 09:49 AM - Re: Z-12 Essential Bus Questions (Bill Watson)
10. 10:11 AM - Re: Re: How to Toggle Speed Brakes with Momentary On Switch? (Valin & Allyson Thorn)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: How to Toggle Speed Brakes with Momentary On Switch? |
Are you certain that momentary switch controlled speed brakes (latching up and
down) are a good idea? I can see you getting in trouble during a go-around situation
where you are busy applying power/setting flaps/killing carb heat/raising
gear and losing track of speed brake position. During go-around, you are
too darned close to the ground and eyes must be outside the airplane and control
positioning must be achieved by feel.
I have no experience with speed brakes and I could be dead wrong, but I think this
is at least worthy of consideration.
--------
Jerry King
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=416774#416774
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| Subject: | Really technical information |
For a very good reference document about relays, including latching
ones, see
http://tinyurl.com/7738cer
Andy
------------------------
Andy Elliott, CL:480-695-9568
N601GE/Z601XL/TD/Corvair
555 hrs since 11/08
<http://servi-aero.com/n601ge/4sale/> Web Site Link
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| Subject: | Re: Z-12 Essential Bus Questions |
At 04:24 PM 1/10/2014, you wrote:
>Hello Bob N and anyone else with thoughts on this,
>
>Were working to implement your Z-12 power
>grid/distribution architecture (Prime Alt,
>Standby Alt, Single Battery, E-Bus) in our
>Lancair Legacy. Im struggling a bit with
>whether or not to have an Essential Bus. I
>dont see it as saving that much time if the
>alternators go down to load shed with one switch
>vs. just powering down some boxes one by one. I
>see the main advantage of the Essential Bus is
>having a way to get power to critical
>boxes/functions even if the two alternators and the battery contactor fails.
>
>Whats complicating my thinking on this
>architecture is my desire for an Avionics
>Bus. If I remember right, youre not a fan of
>Avionics Buses. My reasoning for one is that we
>have an EFIS system with no dedicated engine
>instruments. So, for engine start well have
>the minimum EFIS components on to monitor the
>engine health and not expose any other avionics
>to the engine start voltage drop and potential
>unnecessary power cycling. One key box Id like
>to protect, as an example, is the $15,000 Garmin
>GTN 750 of course there are others...
>
>So then when I think about what needs to be on
>the E-Bus, a bunch of avionics seems to belong
>there which would expose them to the risk of
>the engine start power cycling It seems like
>Id need an E-Bus off the Main Bus and the Avionics Bus?
>
>When I consider the low probability of both
>alternators and the battery contactor going down
>at the same time, I wonder if its worth the complication.
>
>Would appreciate anyones thoughts on
>this. Below is an excerpt from power grid hybrid schematic.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Valin Thorn
>Lancair Legacy Project
>Boulder, Colorado
You've expressed concerns for "unnecessary power cycling", "voltage drops",
etc. Is it written anywhere that such stresses are to be avoided . . .
particularly by the folks who manufactured and qualified the hardware?
After all, they KNEW it was intended for use in an airplane. They
were obligated to test to all the nasties that DO-160 would throw
at it. If there were things that you should avoid . . . or adopt as
specialized operating practice for their device . . . it seems that
such words would be included in the installation or operating literature.
I am not a fan of avionics busses because they were ill-conceived
in the first place and are certainly unnecessary given the rigorous
testing required to get a device onto a TC airplane.
The Essential Bus is really an ENDURANCE bus . . . and yes,
very unlikely to be needed to back up dual alternator failures.
But it DOES offer a way to power up a minimal suite of electro-whizzies
during pre-flight to get the ATIS and clearance delivery. Some people
put a "clearance delivery" switch feature in the power to the comm
radio for this purpose . . . but as long as you're going to add one
more switch, it might just as well be the E-Bus Alt Feed switch.
I would encourage you to produce drawings not unlike those found
in the back of the service manuals for a Beech, Cessna, Piper
or those found on the aeroelectric.com website. Wirebook schematics are
a language intended to convey meaning . . . you've spent a significant
amount of time and effort to produce the pictograms . . . and while
they are accurate, they are the linguistic equivalent of ebonics
or some other variant of the spoken word.
The schematic processes cited above will convey the meat of your
meaning in a heartbeat. The pictograms take some study and
might give some folks pause to wonder if they should bother.
Bob . . .
Message 4
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| Subject: | How to Toggle Speed Brakes with Momentary On |
Switch?
At 04:04 PM 1/10/2014, you wrote:
>Thanks Bob McC. I'm checking with Precise Flight if maintained
>input is okay. Seems like it would be.
>
>I didn't know that latching relays would toggle the switch without
>changing the polarity at the coil. What does the relay symbol look
>like for that?
>
>Does anyone know of a good source for a 24 VDC SPDT Bi-Stable/Latching Relay?
>
Don't think you want a bi-stable device. These are MECHANICALLY
bi-stable with two coils and would still require some external
electronics to achieve the P-ON/P-OFF behavior.
I don't think you want a device that can remain in the ON state
after power down. My favorite approach to this design problem
is shown here . . .
http://tinyurl.com/jwzaocy
You need a DPDT relay rated at 1/2 your system voltage. If
you've got a 24v system, then a 12v relay. Select resistors
equal to the resistance of the relay. If power is shut off
the relay relaxes and stays in that state.
When power is applied, capacitor C charges to 1/2 system
voltage through the voltage divider of the two resistors.
Pushing the button discharges the capacitor into the relay
coil causing it to energize and latch through the lower
normally open contacts.
In this state, the capacitor finishes discharging to
zero volts through the paralleled resistor. Pushing
the button again causes the capacitor to act like a
momentary short across the relay coil causing it to
de-energize, opening the latching contacts.
If you HOLD the button closed for an OFF cycle the
relay MIGHT re-energize on the approximately 1/3
system voltage applied to the relay coil . . . which
. . . depending on the relay might cause it to re-close
after the capacitor charges up. If this happens, adjust
the resistor across the capacitor downward until this
phenomenon stops. This generally isn't an issue if you
keep the button pushes short.
You will want to fiddle with this a bit and adjust
R across the capacitor as needed. I've used this
circuit many times . . . most recently to convert
a momentary contact radio remote to Push-ON/Push-OFF
for the driveway light on my garage.
Suggest you purge the term "speed brake" from your
language used to talk about this system. It's
a spoiler system that kills lift . . . designed to
INCRASE rate of descent without materially
increasing forward velocity. A speed brake puts
out DRAG intended to slow the forward velocity.
A pilot flying a Lanceair IVP with Precise Flgiht found
himself on short final to the rocks out in California
a few years ago. Check out the narrative paragraph
3 here http://tinyurl.com/m3zxgpw
His deployment of "speed brakes" in fact increased
his downward velocity. The Precise Flight system
is not a speed brake.
Bob . . .
Message 5
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| Subject: | How to Toggle Speed Brakes with Momentary On Switch? |
Hi Valin,
If your Precise Flight speedbrakes are the same as mine, which I think
they are, you need the function of an ON-On switch. That's because
connecting ship's power to pin #6 extends the speedbrakes and keeps them
extended; connecting ship's power to pin #7 retracts the speedbrakes.
You can see this on the attached wiring diagram from my wiring book. (I
drew it in AutoCAD and converting it to PDF screwed it up a little, but
it's still readable.)
I've seen at least one Legacy wired with an ON-OFF switch. It sort of
works because the speedbrakes controller automatically snaps the
speedbrakes closed if all power is removed. But instead of a smooth
powering closed, they snap closed fast and hard from a strong spring
inside them.
To answer one of your questions, power is continuously connected either
to pin #6 or pin #7 at all times. Disconnecting power will
automatically (and almost violently) retract the speedbrakes. It sounds
like an ON-ON latching relay will work fine.
Contact me directly if you want more info on this.
Thanks to Bob N. for his advice to create a Wire Book with one page per
component. I've referred to mine many, many times.
Best,
Dennis
Legacy, 680 hours
Message 6
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| Subject: | How to Toggle Speed Brakes with Momentary On |
Switch?
Bob;
Respectfully beg to differ on your comment below that bi-stable relays are
dual coil devices requiring some additional electronics to operate with a
single button. While this is correct for SOME bi-stable relays others are
single coil devices simply changing state on each subsequent operation,
while still others are single coil devices which change state when alternate
polarities are applied to the coil. The Omron G4Q-212S-xxVDC series for
example are ones which have a single coil which alternates the contacts each
time the coil is momentarily energized.
I don't disagree with the rest of your comment however, but the question
posed was "How do I do this?" and the single coil bi-stable relay is one
simple inexpensive solution. Granted it is one of many and the plusses and
minuses of whatever method is chosen must be assessed before a "best
solution" is decided upon.
Bob McC
> -big snip-
> Don't think you want a bi-stable device. These are MECHANICALLY
> bi-stable with two coils and would still require some external
> electronics to achieve the P-ON/P-OFF behavior.
>
> I don't think you want a device that can remain in the ON state
> after power down. My favorite approach to this design problem
> is shown here . . .
> -another big snip-
> Bob . . .
Message 7
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| Subject: | How to Toggle Speed Brakes with Momentary On |
Switch?
Thanks Bob and everyone for your most excellent help. I'm a novice at
electrical circuit stuff as you can tell - but, eager to learn and willing
to ask questions.
And yes, I agree, "spoilers" is a more accurate term for these lift
disturbing devices - I'll correct that.
Thanks again,
Valin
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert L.
Nuckolls, III
Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2014 8:30 AM
Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: How to Toggle Speed Brakes with Momentary On
Switch?
<mailto:nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com> nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
At 04:04 PM 1/10/2014, you wrote:
>Thanks Bob McC. I'm checking with Precise Flight if maintained
>input is okay. Seems like it would be.
>
>I didn't know that latching relays would toggle the switch without
>changing the polarity at the coil. What does the relay symbol look
>like for that?
>
>Does anyone know of a good source for a 24 VDC SPDT Bi-Stable/Latching
Relay?
>
Don't think you want a bi-stable device. These are MECHANICALLY
bi-stable with two coils and would still require some external
electronics to achieve the P-ON/P-OFF behavior.
I don't think you want a device that can remain in the ON state
after power down. My favorite approach to this design problem
is shown here . . .
<http://tinyurl.com/jwzaocy> http://tinyurl.com/jwzaocy
You need a DPDT relay rated at 1/2 your system voltage. If
you've got a 24v system, then a 12v relay. Select resistors
equal to the resistance of the relay. If power is shut off
the relay relaxes and stays in that state.
When power is applied, capacitor C charges to 1/2 system
voltage through the voltage divider of the two resistors.
Pushing the button discharges the capacitor into the relay
coil causing it to energize and latch through the lower
normally open contacts.
In this state, the capacitor finishes discharging to
zero volts through the paralleled resistor. Pushing
the button again causes the capacitor to act like a
momentary short across the relay coil causing it to
de-energize, opening the latching contacts.
If you HOLD the button closed for an OFF cycle the
relay MIGHT re-energize on the approximately 1/3
system voltage applied to the relay coil . . . which
. . . depending on the relay might cause it to re-close
after the capacitor charges up. If this happens, adjust
the resistor across the capacitor downward until this
phenomenon stops. This generally isn't an issue if you
keep the button pushes short.
You will want to fiddle with this a bit and adjust
R across the capacitor as needed. I've used this
circuit many times . . . most recently to convert
a momentary contact radio remote to Push-ON/Push-OFF
for the driveway light on my garage.
Suggest you purge the term "speed brake" from your
language used to talk about this system. It's
a spoiler system that kills lift . . . designed to
INCRASE rate of descent without materially
increasing forward velocity. A speed brake puts
out DRAG intended to slow the forward velocity.
A pilot flying a Lanceair IVP with Precise Flgiht found
himself on short final to the rocks out in California
a few years ago. Check out the narrative paragraph
3 here <http://tinyurl.com/m3zxgpw> http://tinyurl.com/m3zxgpw
His deployment of "speed brakes" in fact increased
his downward velocity. The Precise Flight system
is not a speed brake.
Bob . . .
www.buildersbooks.com
www.homebuilthelp.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
Message 8
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| Subject: | Z-12 Essential Bus Questions |
Thanks Bob. I read your recent, excellent article on DO-160 testing. With
EAB airplanes, can we count on all the devices installed having seen the
same testing? I'm planning on a bunch of Garmin's experimental avionics
offerings and I'm not sure those boxes see the same testing as their
certified hardware. I've Googled it a few times but can't find anything. I
need to ask Garmin's Team X about it. So that's why I'm a bit shy to risk
putting all the avionics through engine start power cycling.
Good point about the every flight usefulness of at least getting a radio up
without bring all your avionics up - so yes, why not add a few other
essentials and provide a path around the battery contactor as well...
Sorry about my "pictogram schematics" sometimes requiring more study than a
basic schematic. The power grid is a bad example of the benefits in my
wiring drawings. I have about 10 drawing layers covering the various
systems where the wiring schematic is laid out in a kind of topology of the
airplane - a top down view of the airplane in cartoon form. It helps me
visualize where components and wires need to be within the airplane and
where connectors might be most useful. On these drawings are also included
the basic wiring schematic and other key info related to that system like
pin outs for connectors, part numbers, etc.. The power grid example in my
email was an excerpt from its overall page and didn't include the ancillary
stuff. Working them up helps me get my novice head around the problems
involved and collect a lot of key related data in one place.
Thanks again Bob and everyone for your help.
Valin
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert L.
Nuckolls, III
Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2014 8:12 AM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Z-12 Essential Bus Questions
<mailto:nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com> nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
At 04:24 PM 1/10/2014, you wrote:
>Hello Bob N and anyone else with thoughts on this,
>
>We're working to implement your Z-12 power
>grid/distribution architecture (Prime Alt,
>Standby Alt, Single Battery, E-Bus) in our
>Lancair Legacy. I'm struggling a bit with
>whether or not to have an Essential Bus. I
>don't see it as saving that much time if the
>alternators go down to load shed with one switch
>vs. just powering down some boxes one by one. I
>see the main advantage of the Essential Bus is
>having a way to get power to critical
>boxes/functions even if the two alternators and the battery contactor
fails.
>
>What's complicating my thinking on this
>architecture is my desire for an Avionics
>Bus. If I remember right, you're not a fan of
>Avionics Buses. My reasoning for one is that we
>have an EFIS system with no dedicated engine
>instruments. So, for engine start we'll have
>the minimum EFIS components on to monitor the
>engine health and not expose any other avionics
>to the engine start voltage drop and potential
>unnecessary power cycling. One key box I'd like
>to protect, as an example, is the $15,000 Garmin
>GTN 750 - of course there are others...
>
>So then when I think about what needs to be on
>the E-Bus, a bunch of avionics seems to belong
>there - which would expose them to the risk of
>the engine start power cycling. It seems like
>I'd need an E-Bus off the Main Bus and the Avionics Bus.?
>
>When I consider the low probability of both
>alternators and the battery contactor going down
>at the same time, I wonder if it's worth the complication.
>
>Would appreciate anyone's thoughts on
>this. Below is an excerpt from power grid hybrid schematic.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Valin Thorn
>Lancair Legacy Project
>Boulder, Colorado
You've expressed concerns for "unnecessary power cycling", "voltage
drops",
etc. Is it written anywhere that such stresses are to be avoided . . .
particularly by the folks who manufactured and qualified the hardware?
After all, they KNEW it was intended for use in an airplane. They
were obligated to test to all the nasties that DO-160 would throw
at it. If there were things that you should avoid . . . or adopt as
specialized operating practice for their device . . . it seems that
such words would be included in the installation or operating
literature.
I am not a fan of avionics busses because they were ill-conceived
in the first place and are certainly unnecessary given the rigorous
testing required to get a device onto a TC airplane.
The Essential Bus is really an ENDURANCE bus . . . and yes,
very unlikely to be needed to back up dual alternator failures.
But it DOES offer a way to power up a minimal suite of electro-whizzies
during pre-flight to get the ATIS and clearance delivery. Some people
put a "clearance delivery" switch feature in the power to the comm
radio for this purpose . . . but as long as you're going to add one
more switch, it might just as well be the E-Bus Alt Feed switch.
I would encourage you to produce drawings not unlike those found
in the back of the service manuals for a Beech, Cessna, Piper
or those found on the aeroelectric.com website. Wirebook schematics are
a language intended to convey meaning . . . you've spent a significant
amount of time and effort to produce the pictograms . . . and while
they are accurate, they are the linguistic equivalent of ebonics
or some other variant of the spoken word.
The schematic processes cited above will convey the meat of your
meaning in a heartbeat. The pictograms take some study and
might give some folks pause to wonder if they should bother.
Bob . . .
www.buildersbooks.com
www.homebuilthelp.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Z-12 Essential Bus Questions |
On 1/11/2014 10:12 AM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote:
> <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
>
> At 04:24 PM 1/10/2014, you wrote:
>> Hello Bob N and anyone else with thoughts on this,
>>
>> Were working to implement your Z-12 power grid/distribution
>> architecture (Prime Alt, Standby Alt, Single Battery, E-Bus) in our
>> Lancair Legacy. Im struggling a bit with whether or not to have an
>> Essential Bus. I dont see it as saving that much time if the
>> alternators go down to load shed with one switch vs. just powering
>> down some boxes one by one. I see the main advantage of the Essential
>> Bus is having a way to get power to critical boxes/functions even if
>> the two alternators and the battery contactor fails.
>>
>> Whats complicating my thinking on this architecture is my desire for
>> an Avionics Bus. If I remember right, youre not a fan of Avionics
>> Buses. My reasoning for one is that we have an EFIS system with no
>> dedicated engine instruments. So, for engine start well have the
>> minimum EFIS components on to monitor the engine health and not
>> expose any other avionics to the engine start voltage drop and
>> potential unnecessary power cycling. One key box Id like to protect,
>> as an example, is the $15,000 Garmin GTN 750 of course there are
>> others...
>>
>> So then when I think about what needs to be on the E-Bus, a bunch of
>> avionics seems to belong there which would expose them to the risk
>> of the engine start power cycling It seems like Id need an E-Bus
>> off the Main Bus and the Avionics Bus?
>>
>> When I consider the low probability of both alternators and the
>> battery contactor going down at the same time, I wonder if its worth
>> the complication.
>>
>> Would appreciate anyones thoughts on this. Below is an excerpt from
>> power grid hybrid schematic.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Valin Thorn
>> Lancair Legacy Project
>> Boulder, Colorado
Valiln, I had some similar concerns with my RV10 panel. I built a Z-14
(dual batt, dual alt, dual bus - diagram attached) with an avionics
panel containing a full complement of electro whiz-bangs. I had no
avionics bus or additional power switching for any devices that did not
include such a switch. Of note, I have 3 GRT/HX EFISs that power up with
the master switch.
>
> You've expressed concerns for "unnecessary power cycling", "voltage
> drops",
> etc. Is it written anywhere that such stresses are to be avoided . . .
> particularly by the folks who manufactured and qualified the hardware?
GRT does not document any concerns about "unnecessary power cycling" or
"voltage drops". However, in conversations with GRT I was warned that
interruption of the EFIS boot procedure may result in problems. Nothing
definitive beyond that. However, before hearing this, I did expose the 3
units to a number of interrupted boot sequences. And I did have to
return the unit that experienced most of the interrupts for service
during this period though no connection with the interrupts was
necessarily made. (I'd add that I am many software updates past this
experience and any boot/power issues may have been addressed.)
>
> After all, they KNEW it was intended for use in an airplane. They
> were obligated to test to all the nasties that DO-160 would throw
> at it. If there were things that you should avoid . . . or adopt as
> specialized operating practice for their device . . . it seems that
> such words would be included in the installation or operating literature.
Agreed. The procedure I adopted was to insure that the 15sec+ boot
procedure on all 3 units be complete before engine start. Seems obvious
since a display is required for engine parameter display but early on I
did expose 1 unit to cycling during the start because 1 unit would
always lag behind the other 2 due to configuration differences... and I
was unnecessarily impatient.
My EFIS units were still occasionally being cycled during engine start
due to some issues unrelated to the discussion here (thanks to Bob and
GRT for working these thru with me). During the course of getting these
issues under control, I added a TCW Technologies Intelligent Power
Stabilizer (IPS) to my installation. It was connected to some unused
backup power inputs on the EFIS units. Now, no matter how much I 'abuse'
my system, I can rely on my EFIS units to stay up during engine start.
What do I mean by 'abuse'? Running the EFIS units and some other
avionics for an extended period on battery power only and then
attempting a start of a cold engine, on a cold day, and perhaps
forgetting to tie the buses and their batteries together for the start.
At this point I think the IPS is unneeded, but for a period of time, it
stopped some inadvertent power cycling of the units. You might consider
one of these units for your installation to ease your concerns. I know
that some Garmin units have backup power inputs in which case the
addition of an IPS is similar to simply adding a backup battery that you
never need to charge. It will also work with units that only have a
single power input.
>
> I am not a fan of avionics busses because they were ill-conceived
> in the first place and are certainly unnecessary given the rigorous
> testing required to get a device onto a TC airplane.
>
> The Essential Bus is really an ENDURANCE bus . . . and yes,
> very unlikely to be needed to back up dual alternator failures.
> But it DOES offer a way to power up a minimal suite of electro-whizzies
> during pre-flight to get the ATIS and clearance delivery. Some people
> put a "clearance delivery" switch feature in the power to the comm
> radio for this purpose . . . but as long as you're going to add one
> more switch, it might just as well be the E-Bus Alt Feed switch.
>
> I would encourage you to produce drawings not unlike those found
> in the back of the service manuals for a Beech, Cessna, Piper
> or those found on the aeroelectric.com website. Wirebook schematics are
> a language intended to convey meaning . . . you've spent a significant
> amount of time and effort to produce the pictograms . . . and while
> they are accurate, they are the linguistic equivalent of ebonics
> or some other variant of the spoken word.
This electrically challenged builder found the drawings clear and easy
to read.... but then I'm probably fluent in ebonics.
> The schematic processes cited above will convey the meat of your
> meaning in a heartbeat. The pictograms take some study and
> might give some folks pause to wonder if they should bother.
>
>
> Bob . . .
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: How to Toggle Speed Brakes with Momentary On |
Switch?
Hi Jerry,
No I'm not certain having the spoilers on the control sick is the best
approach for the reasons you described =93 especially with my
flying to mostly be from high elevation airports in Colorado.
I take some comfort in that a number of Lancair Legacy pilots have
accidentally landed with the spoilers deployed and it was not an issue.
I'm planning an annunciator high on the instrument panel to help make
its clear they're deployed if the noise and vibration from them does not
make it clear enough.
I struggle with what=99s best to have on the control stick with
few precious switches there. For the spoilers, I imagine that
they=99ll be most useful when precise energy management is need on
approach and landing. So a hand on the throttle to add energy and seems
nice not have to move a hand to speed removing it with the spoilers (and
higher AOA allowed to increase drag, to be technically precise on Bob
N=99s recommendation :)). Although, I=99ll be moving my
hand to deploy flaps The problem with putting flaps on the
stick is if one accidentally hits the flaps button at high speed they
will likely be damaged at the Legacy=99s cruise speeds. Full
flaps max speed in the Legacy is 120 kts, where it cruises at over 200
kts
I=99m still deliberating where the spoiler switch goes
Thanks.
Valin
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
racerjerry
Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2014 4:54 AM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: How to Toggle Speed Brakes with
Momentary On Switch?
<mailto:gki@suffolk.lib.ny.us> gki@suffolk.lib.ny.us>
Are you certain that momentary switch controlled speed brakes (latching
up and down) are a good idea? I can see you getting in trouble during a
go-around situation where you are busy applying power/setting
flaps/killing carb heat/raising gear and losing track of speed brake
position. During go-around, you are too darned close to the ground and
eyes must be outside the airplane and control positioning must be
achieved by =C3=A2=82=AC=CB=9Cfeel.=C3=A2=82=AC=84=A2
I have no experience with speed brakes and I could be dead wrong, but I
think this is at least worthy of consideration.
--------
Jerry King
Read this topic online here:
<http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=416774#416774>
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=416774#416774
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