Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:57 AM - Re: Fat wires and plumber's solder (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
2. 06:02 AM - Re: Fat wires and plumber's solder (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
3. 08:46 AM - Re: Fat wires and plumber's solder (B Tomm)
4. 09:27 AM - Re: Fat wires and plumber's solder (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
5. 10:17 AM - Re: Fat wires and plumber's solder (Gerry van Dyk)
6. 10:20 AM - Re: Fat wires and plumber's solder (Roger & Jean)
7. 01:51 PM - Re: Fat wires and plumber's solder (Russ & Marilyn)
8. 02:24 PM - Re: Fat wires and plumber's solder (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Fat wires and plumber's solder |
At 05:48 PM 2/14/2014, you wrote:
>
>
>Bob,
>
>I am in the process of integrating a power input module (Cole Hersee 11041)
>see http://www.colehersee.com/home/item/cat/248/11041/ and am wondering
>about the best method for connecting a heavy wire to it.
See http://tinyurl.com/m85ohwx
>It might be a good time to have a discussion on plumbing solder and why it
>should or should not be used for electrical stuff.
"Plumbing" solder is not a very definitive
term. Solders come in all sorts of alloys
including the modern lead-free versions. They
each have a unique set of behaviors for joining
parts.
The best-we-know-how-to-do solders are 63/37
Tin-Lead alloys popular with the electronics
industry among others.
63/37 is, perhaps not the optimum structural
alloy but it has some over-riding properties
that make it the joining material of choice
for the things we do.
Lowest melting point of all tin-lead ratios
known as 'eutectic'. This property promotes
joining with the least possible heat stress
on parts and their surrounding insulators.
Nearly zero plastic range . . . it moves
quickly between solid and liquid phases
during temperature excursions. Hence, you
have to work at it to get a 'cold' solder
joint. See Chapter 8 of The 'Connection.
When the occasional task calls for soldering
fat wires to equally fat terminals, I pull off
6 feet or so of my fine-wire, 63/37 and
fold it into a 6-8 strand, twisted bundle.
This offers a nice does of flux into the
joint while increasing the delivery rate
of solder into the melt.
Bob . . .
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Fat wires and plumber's solder |
Nearly zero plastic range . . . it moves
quickly between solid and liquid phases
during temperature excursions. Hence, you
have to work at it to get a 'cold' solder
joint. See Chapter 8 of The 'Connection.
CORRECTION: CHAPTER 9
Bob . . .
Message 3
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| Subject: | Fat wires and plumber's solder |
Thanks Bob and all,
I was concerned that 63/37 may add too much flux causing undesirable
effects. Twisting is together is an excellent idea.
Thanks
Bevan
_____
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert L.
Nuckolls, III
Sent: Saturday, February 15, 2014 5:56 AM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Fat wires and plumber's solder
At 05:48 PM 2/14/2014, you wrote:
Bob,
I am in the process of integrating a power input module (Cole Hersee 11041)
see http://www.colehersee.com/home/item/cat/248/11041/ and am wondering
about the best method for connecting a heavy wire to it.
See http://tinyurl.com/m85ohwx
It might be a good time to have a discussion on plumbing solder and why it
should or should not be used for electrical stuff.
"Plumbing" solder is not a very definitive
term. Solders come in all sorts of alloys
including the modern lead-free versions. They
each have a unique set of behaviors for joining
parts.
The best-we-know-how-to-do solders are 63/37
Tin-Lead alloys popular with the electronics
industry among others.
63/37 is, perhaps not the optimum structural
alloy but it has some over-riding properties
that make it the joining material of choice
for the things we do.
Lowest melting point of all tin-lead ratios
known as 'eutectic'. This property promotes
joining with the least possible heat stress
on parts and their surrounding insulators.
Nearly zero plastic range . . . it moves
quickly between solid and liquid phases
during temperature excursions. Hence, you
have to work at it to get a 'cold' solder
joint. See Chapter 8 of The 'Connection.
When the occasional task calls for soldering
fat wires to equally fat terminals, I pull off
6 feet or so of my fine-wire, 63/37 and
fold it into a 6-8 strand, twisted bundle.
This offers a nice does of flux into the
joint while increasing the delivery rate
of solder into the melt.
Bob . . .
Message 4
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| Subject: | Fat wires and plumber's solder |
At 10:46 AM 2/15/2014, you wrote:
>Thanks Bob and all,
>
>I was concerned that 63/37 may add too much flux causing undesirable
>effects. Twisting is together is an excellent idea.
>
>Thanks
>
>Bevan
The 'service life' of flux in electronic
solder is measured in seconds. The active
features in the chemistry evaporate pretty
quickly as they dissolve the products of
corrosion from surfaces to be joined. The
residuals do not add to the appearance
of the finished joint but it'a all on
the surface. It wipes off with a rag wetted
with lacquer thinner or acetone. I keep
cans of "carburetor cleaner" around for
spray de-greasing and de-fluxing of work
product.
But there's no risk of deleterious effects
for having left it in place . . .
Bob . . .
Message 5
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| Subject: | Fat wires and plumber's solder |
However the acid core of structural solder would have a lasting
corrosive
effect on electronics. By all means be sure you use electrical solder.
The specific alloy percentages have little bearing on weather it's
electronic or structural solder, the application determines what flux
you
need to use.
Gerry
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Robert L.
Nuckolls, III
Sent: February 15, 2014 10:27 AM
Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Fat wires and plumber's solder
At 10:46 AM 2/15/2014, you wrote:
Thanks Bob and all,
I was concerned that 63/37 may add too much flux causing undesirable
effects. Twisting is together is an excellent idea.
Thanks
Bevan
The 'service life' of flux in electronic
solder is measured in seconds. The active
features in the chemistry evaporate pretty
quickly as they dissolve the products of
corrosion from surfaces to be joined. The
residuals do not add to the appearance
of the finished joint but it'a all on
the surface. It wipes off with a rag wetted
with lacquer thinner or acetone. I keep
cans of "carburetor cleaner" around for
spray de-greasing and de-fluxing of work
product.
But there's no risk of deleterious effects
for having left it in place . . .
Bob . . .
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Fat wires and plumber's solder |
The 'service life' of flux in electronic
solder is measured in seconds. The active
features in the chemistry evaporate pretty
quickly as they dissolve the products of
corrosion from surfaces to be joined. The
residuals do not add to the appearance
of the finished joint but it'a all on
the surface. It wipes off with a rag wetted
with lacquer thinner or acetone. I keep
cans of "carburetor cleaner" around for
spray de-greasing and de-fluxing of work
product.
But there's no risk of deleterious effects
for having left it in place . . .
Question: If one were to use plumbers solder and plumbers flux on a join
t and thouroughly cleaned it with acetone or lacquor thinner, would this be
acceptable? I am just not aware of the chemistry involved, or if anyone h
as done any experimentation with this process.
Roger
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Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Fat wires and plumber's solder |
One thing to remember with the 95-5 Tin / Antimony Solder is that it does
not fill gaps well. It was common practice when using 95/5 to flood the
joint with 50/50 solder after first adding the 95/5. Another point is that
real "Silver Solder" AKA "Silver Braze" has 35 of 45 % silver with the
remainder being bronze and melts typically around 1100 degrees f or more.
Plumbers "silver solder" is basically a 95/5 solder with a little silver so
it will fill gaps better and melts around 450 f. I have used rosin core
solder to tin a joint then add the plumbers silver solder to complete the
connection.
Russ
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Fat wires and plumber's solder |
>
>Question: If one were to use plumbers solder and plumbers flux on a
>joint and thouroughly cleaned it with acetone or lacquor thinner,
>would this be acceptable? I am just not aware of the chemistry
>involved, or if anyone has done any experimentation with this process.
My sense is that the chemistry that promotes
corrosion in the "perfect joint" is all on
the outside and easily neutralized and/or
cleaned. The biggest risk to joint longevity
probably has more to do with alloy than with
removal of residual flux.
>
>Roger
>
>
>----------
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Bob . . .
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