---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 10/19/14: 8 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 01:22 AM - Re: Re: Strange characters (Graeme Hart) 2. 03:32 AM - Re: Should a tripped circuit breaker be reset in flight? (mmayfield) 3. 05:30 AM - Re: High oil temp...or instrumentation? (user9253) 4. 08:11 AM - Re: High oil temp...or instrumentation? (Charlie England) 5. 09:10 AM - Re: Re: Should a tripped circuit breaker be reset in flight? (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 6. 09:18 AM - Re: Strange characters (Eric M. Jones) 7. 09:22 AM - Re: Re: High oil temp...or instrumentation? (Bob McCallum) 8. 12:20 PM - Re: High oil temp...or instrumentation? (Jack) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 01:22:34 AM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Strange characters From: Graeme Hart Sorry, I didn't realise that email listservs hadn't made the transition to handling HTML. On Sun, Oct 19, 2014 at 4:22 PM, Kelly McMullen wrote: > > > You absolutely do NOT want to send in HTML. It will result in blank messages > on most email listservs such as this one. > Almost all are set to strip out all html. > Plain text is the best way to ensure your message comes through clear with > no loss of content and no extra characters, > > On 10/18/2014 7:38 PM, Graeme Hart wrote: >> >> >> >> >> The other option is to send in HTML. >> >> These options are found under the "Format Text" menu in Outlook 2013 >> (when sending a message). You can also change it for all emails under >> "File / Options / Mail / Compose Messages" >> >> They exist in the earlier versions of Outlook too but Microsoft >> occasionally move them around. >> >> On Sun, Oct 19, 2014 at 1:41 PM, Kelly McMullen >> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> The primary problem with all versions of Outlook is that it defaults to >>> sending messages in Rich Text Format, in other words formatted text, with >>> all those characters as the encoding for formatting . If you are savvy >>> enough, you can change to setting in Outlook to send in plain text only, >>> but >>> it is not an easy change to find. The reason everything looks fine in >>> Outlook is because it is set to receive what other Outlook users send. >>> Most >>> other email programs give you a choice of what fype of formatting to >>> send. >>> Problems arise with email listserv transmissions because they usually >>> strip >>> off most of the html encoding to conserve space. >>> On 10/18/2014 10:48 AM, Rob Housman wrote: >>>> >>>> RE: AeroElectric-List: Re: Strange characters >>>> >>>> My posts on this list(and the Europa-List)have always been posted from >>>> various versions of Outlook (currently 2010) and when I view those posts >>>> using Outlook there are no strange characters. I don't know why some >>>> messages include some or many strange characters but I have assumed it >>>> was >>>> more likely the use of a different ASCII character set by the posters' >>>> software or O/S.Consistently, though perhaps not always, posts >>>> originating >>>> outside of North Americahave an odd combination of characters where it >>>> is >>>> obvious that an apostrophe should be. Perhaps someone more knowledgeable >>>> in >>>> these things can comment and offer a real solution, if one exists. >>>> >>>> Best regards, >>>> >>>> Rob Housman >>>> >>>> Irvine, California >>>> >>>> Europa XS >>>> >>>> Rotax 914 >>>> >>>> S/N A070 >>>> >>>> Airframe complete >>>> >>>> Avionics in progress >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com >>>> [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of >>>> user9253 >>>> Sent: Saturday, October 18, 2014 5:52 AM >>>> To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com >>>> Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Strange characters >>>> >>>> > >>>> >>>> I do not know what causes the strange characters. Your posts, that are >>>> included in the Matronics daily digest that is emailed to me, contain >>>> ALL >>>> garbage, not just at the end. I have to go to the Matronics website to >>>> read >>>> your posts. >>>> >>>> The workaround for you is to NOT use Outlook. Instead, go >>>> tohttp://forums.matronics.com/viewforum.php?f=3and click on the thread >>>> of >>>> interest, then click, "PostReply". >>>> >>>> Joe >>>> >>>> -------- >>>> >>>> Joe Gores >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Read this topic online here: >>>> >>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=432003#432003 >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> more: >>>> >>>> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List >>>> >>>> great content also available via the Web Forums! >>>> >>>> http://forums.matronics.com >>>> >>>> Thank you for your generous support! >>>> >>>> http://www.matronics.com/contribution >>>> >>>> >>>> * >>>> >>>> >>>> * >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> > > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 03:32:11 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Should a tripped circuit breaker be reset in flight? From: "mmayfield" nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect wrote: > Visual inspection any circuit protective device offers no assurance whatsoever of any system's operational integrity.Bob . . . I recall at least one occasion in particular where the failure to visually detect a tripped circuit breaker before flight had no preflight consequences in a B767, but subsequently led to significant inflight consequences and an air safety incident report. In fact it was taken so seriously by my (very large airline) company, that proper preflight inspection of circuit breakers was elevated to a major assessment item in annual flight reviews/check rides. I recall the pilot who failed to complete the CB check as required in the Ops Manual being quite distraught about the consequences. Preflight exercising of each individual protected system is not necessarily practical or achievable, but in the case I mentioned, correct checking of CBs before getting airborne would've saved the subsequent tea and biscuits meeting with the Chief Pilot. Also, we had systems which required both preflight exercising, and a subsequent specific check that the system CBs had not tripped during the testing/exercising process, as it was possible for them to do so without any obvious symptoms until after takeoff. So it's a habit, and not an unhealthy one, which has been ingrained into my psyche. ("You're cordially invited to tea and biscuits with the Chief Pilot - cold tea, bring your own biscuits - you better make your explanation a good one.") -------- Mike Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=432028#432028 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:30:55 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: High oil temp...or instrumentation? From: "user9253" Bill Bradburry, The Savvy Analysis data link that you posted is not publicly accessible. The vast majority of electrical problems are due to bad connections. The cause of more than one instrumentation problem is likely due to a bad ground connection. I suggest that all ground wires and cables, related to the engine and to engine sensors, be disconnected at both ends, cleaned, inspected, and reconnected. A thin film of grease on terminals will help prevent future corrosion. Joe -------- Joe Gores Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=432030#432030 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:11:14 AM PST US From: Charlie England Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: High oil temp...or instrumentation? On 10/18/2014 11:30 PM, Bill Bradburry wrote: > > A friend has been fighting high oil temps for several months on his O-320. > The last flight he saw a sudden drop in temp followed a few minutes later by > a spike which went away and the temps were then fine for the rest of the > flight. I thought that the oil cooler bypass might have been stuck and then > opened but the temp dropped too fast I think for this to be a real temp > change. It seems to me that it may be instrumentation. > > He is also having obvious instrumentation problems with EGT#1. It is very > erratic. I hope some of you can give him a few ideas as to how he can > troubleshoot these problems and hopefully get them resolved. > > Here is a link to a Savvy Analysis data dump that he made on the last > flight. > > https://www.savvyanalysis.com/flight/741039/7be0f496-4815-45d2-9eee-4455fc4f > 5e98 > > Any ideas would be appreciated. > > Thanks, > Bill > Unless he had an obvious very bad miss, the egt reading had to be sensor or instrument related. ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 09:10:24 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Should a tripped circuit breaker be reset in flight? At 05:30 2014-10-19, you wrote: nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect wrote: > Visual inspection any circuit protective device offers no assurance whatsoever of any system's operational integrity.Bob . . . I recall at least one occasion in particular where the failure to visually detect a tripped circuit breaker before flight had no preflight consequences in a B767, but subsequently led to significant inflight consequences and an air safety incident report. In fact it was taken so seriously by my (very large airline) company, that proper preflight inspection of circuit breakers was elevated to a major assessment item in annual flight reviews/check rides. I recall the pilot who failed to complete the CB check as required in the Ops Manual being quite distraught about the consequences. Preflight exercising of each individual protected system is not necessarily practical or achievable, but in the case I mentioned, correct checking of CBs before getting airborne would've saved the subsequent tea and biscuits meeting with the Chief Pilot. Also, we had systems which required both preflight exercising, and a subsequent specific check that the system CBs had not tripped during the testing/exercising process, as it was possible for them to do so without any obvious symptoms until after takeoff. So it's a habit, and not an unhealthy one, which has been ingrained into my psyche. We're talking about two VERY different kinds of airplanes. At the same time, your narrative illustrates the fact that heavy-iron pilots (indeed C-172 pilots too) are in a what- you-see-is-what-you get situation with respect to system architectures, consequences of inadequate FMEA by the designers and/or hind-sight reactions to an 'in-flight consequence' arising from failure to perform in the cockpit. The idea that any system's integrity is assured by making sure it's breaker is closed speaks to poor system design. If it's a critical system with no pre-flight detectable tell-tales, the folks getting worked over with the wet-noodles and stern mentors should NOT be the flight crews - but the folks on the drawing boards. Overhauling crews for missing one critical breaker condition on an acres-of-breakers panel is like dinging a TSA agent for letting grandma get through with an unchecked water-bottle. You don't effectively address known, critical items in preflight with broad brush checklist items like "Copilot's breaker panel - CHECK" or "Old lady water bottle - CHECK." You identify every critical breaker by name and give each a separate check-list bullet:" "#2 Slats Warn Breaker - CHECK IN". That way, perhaps two or three critical breakers out of dozens will get the special attention they need . . . because for reasons unexplained, those systems have no active notification for loss of integrity other that to see that they're powered up. The idea that those same systems never exhibit failures that do not open their breakers lacks credibility. ("You're cordially invited to tea and biscuits with the Chief Pilot - cold tea, bring your own biscuits - you better make your explanation a good one.") Your tag-line is illustrative of far to many institutional knee-jerk/CYA responses to incidents rooted in poor attention to physics and human- factors. I have analyzed the narratives of many "dark-n-stormy" night stories published in the aviation journals. Two examples: http://tinyurl.com/lk9d9sm http://tinyurl.com/mrsnutr Here's a third one that was the lead-in story to Chapter 17 in the AeroElectric Connection. http://tinyurl.com/otzkjft http://tinyurl.com/n8x8bsc I cannot recall a single story that cited poor behavior on the part of designers and procedures writers . . . instead the thrust of EVERY article was to increase pilot awareness of the potential for experiencing the same or similar design shortfall all over again. The foundation for my assertions here on the List is built on the fact that OUR airplanes are not (or at least should not be) products of the time, talents and resources of Boeing, Cessna, Podunk Airlines, the FAA or any other institution who's after-market response to a design shortfall is too often limited to writing more paragraphs into the POH or adding new features to the pilot training syllabus. The way you avoid becoming a passenger in the left seat of your own airplane is SIMPLE . . . not necessarily easy but quite SIMPLE. As you cut wires, crimp terminals, mount electro- whizzies to your airplane, be constantly analyzing the following: How can this part fail? How can/will I know that the part has failed? Is its functionality critical to comfortable termination of flight (CTCTOF)? Is the failure pre-flight detectable? If CTCTOF = TRUE then what considerations are best applied to (1) actively annunciate failure and (2) provide a Plan-B should loss of that item become a reality? Scanning the circuit breaker panel or putting LEDs on the fuses is a close cousin to the "TSA approach" to air travel security. You must PROFILE every component of your airplane to assess (1) its CTCTOF factor and (2) DO SOMETHING that mitigates the risk. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 09:18:59 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Strange characters From: "Eric M. Jones" Here's the answer: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=outlook+mail+weird+characters -------- Eric M. Jones www.PerihelionDesign.com 113 Brentwood Drive Southbridge, MA 01550 (508) 764-2072 emjones(at)charter.net Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=432035#432035 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 09:22:54 AM PST US From: Bob McCallum Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Re: High oil temp...or instrumentation? I had no problem bring up the information. It appears accessible to me. The link is split in the original e-mail and I had to enter the last 3 characters manually after clicking the link. (E98) Bob McC > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list- > server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of user9253 > Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 8:30 AM > To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com > Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: High oil temp...or instrumentation? > > > Bill Bradburry, > The Savvy Analysis data link that you posted is not publicly accessible. > The vast majority of electrical problems are due to bad connections. The cause of more > than one instrumentation problem is likely due to a bad ground connection. I suggest > that all ground wires and cables, related to the engine and to engine sensors, be > disconnected at both ends, cleaned, inspected, and reconnected. A thin film of grease on > terminals will help prevent future corrosion. > Joe > > -------- > Joe Gores > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=432030#432030 > > > > > > > > _- > ===================================================== > ===== > _- > ===================================================== > ===== > _- > ===================================================== > ===== > _- > ===================================================== > ===== > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 12:20:05 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: High oil temp...or instrumentation? From: Jack Had similar OT readings; OT needs good engine ground return. Found all Van's cable swages incomplete; battery ground pulled loose as I disconnect battery. Check swages and cable connections; easy fix. John RV7A Sent from my iPhone > On Oct 18, 2014, at 9:30 PM, Bill Bradburry wrote: > > > A friend has been fighting high oil temps for several months on his O-320. > The last flight he saw a sudden drop in temp followed a few minutes later by > a spike which went away and the temps were then fine for the rest of the > flight. I thought that the oil cooler bypass might have been stuck and then > opened but the temp dropped too fast I think for this to be a real temp > change. It seems to me that it may be instrumentation. > > He is also having obvious instrumentation problems with EGT#1. It is very > erratic. I hope some of you can give him a few ideas as to how he can > troubleshoot these problems and hopefully get them resolved. > > Here is a link to a Savvy Analysis data dump that he made on the last > flight. > > https://www.savvyanalysis.com/flight/741039/7be0f496-4815-45d2-9eee-4455fc4f > 5e98 > > Any ideas would be appreciated. > > Thanks, > Bill > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message aeroelectric-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/aeroelectric-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/aeroelectric-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.