AeroElectric-List Digest Archive

Thu 10/23/14


Total Messages Posted: 11



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 06:56 AM - Re: Wiring RV7 with Z13 diagram (2 alternators, 1 battery) (carrollcw)
     2. 09:35 AM - RV-14 (Stoney Ware)
     3. 10:17 AM - Re: RV-14 (Ralph Finch)
     4. 11:12 AM - Re: Re: Wiring RV7 with Z13 diagram (2 alternators, 1 battery) (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
     5. 11:32 AM - Re: Re: Wiring RV7 with Z13 diagram (2 alternators, 1 battery) (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
     6. 02:50 PM - Re: RV-14 (Peter Pengilly)
     7. 08:12 PM - Re: RV-14 (Kelly McMullen)
     8. 09:20 PM - Re: RV-14 (Ben Westfall)
     9. 09:31 PM - Re: RV-14 (Kelly McMullen)
    10. 10:02 PM - Re: RV-14 (Jeff Luckey)
    11. 10:40 PM - Re: RV-14 (Kelly McMullen)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 06:56:08 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Wiring RV7 with Z13 diagram (2 alternators, 1 battery)
    From: "carrollcw" <carrollswa@gmail.com>
    For now, I just want to get it in the air for day/vfr/acro only. However, I will later make it fully night IFR. I am running the dual EFII ignition and fuel injection. Although I will have a mechanical pump, at least one electric pump must be running to sepply sufficient pressure. EI does not have its own power backup. After speaking with Robert at EFII, I am planning on wiring the 2 ECU's, 2 Ignitions, and 2 Fuel pumps to the always hot battery bus with switches for each of them, although I was planning on wiring the fuel pumps with a single dual pole switch. Basic architecture staying the same. Breakers for e-bus, fuses for everything else. Thanks for the help! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=432174#432174


    Message 2


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    Time: 09:35:45 AM PST US
    From: Stoney Ware <sw@apyxx.com>
    Subject: RV-14
    I am a first time builder and building a RV-14. I am trying to plan for th e electrical and backup system now. I will be flying IFR, when necessary. Here is my potential configuration: Lycoming IO-390 with dual P-Mags & 40 Amp B&C Alternator (Purchased) G3X Dual Touchscreen Monitors GMC305 AutoPilot Console GTN650 GPS/Comm GTN200 Comm GMA 240 Audio Panel GTX 23 Transponder So two questions: What should I do for a backup in the case of a loss of the Garmin System? 1. Add a second ADAHRS and battery backup for the EFIS 2. Add a separate system, i.e. GRT Mini, TruTrak Gemini, Dynon D6 3. Use a portable backup like the Garmin 696 or 796? What about additional alternator? My knowledge and experience is only what I have read on-line in the last 6 months and asking a lot of questions, but still very limited. Thanks, Stoney Ware


    Message 3


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    Time: 10:17:45 AM PST US
    From: Ralph Finch <ralphmariafinch@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: RV-14
    40 amps seems somewhat low for what appears to be an all-electric aircraft and IFR use. I installed a 60 amp primary alternator in my all-electric RV-9A for day/night VFR....I'm using Dynon's heated pitot tube and you will want a heated pitot also. You should have a backup alternator. I'm using PlanePower's 20 amp on an accessory pad at the engine rear...they may offer only 30 amp standby alternators now. Then you'll need an eBuss (endurance buss) if your primary alternator fails and you can quickly switch to the second buss and shed unnecessary load. I'm lucky there, I'm using a VP-200, no longer sold, to do all this. Vertical Power still sells the VP-X and maybe that handles an eBuss conveniently. Regardless, get Bob Nuckoll's electrical book (name escapes me) for lots of good ideas. I don't have a second, backup aircraft battery, even though I have electronic ignition (Light Speed). I'm using Dynon for avionics and got their backup battery. I'm also going to have a completely separate, portable backup nav in the form of an iPad with WingX or similar. But if it were IFR, I'd probably install a second AHRS. On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 9:33 AM, Stoney Ware <sw@apyxx.com> wrote: > I am a first time builder and building a RV-14. I am trying to plan for > the electrical and backup system now. I will be flying IFR, when > necessary. Here is my potential configuration: > > > Lycoming IO-390 with dual P-Mags & 40 Amp B&C Alternator (Purchased) > > G3X Dual Touchscreen Monitors > > GMC305 AutoPilot Console > > GTN650 GPS/Comm > > GTN200 Comm > > GMA 240 Audio Panel > > GTX 23 Transponder > > > So two questions: > > > What should I do for a backup in the case of a loss of the Garmin System? > > 1. Add a second ADAHRS and battery backup for the EFIS > > 2. Add a separate system, i.e. GRT Mini, TruTrak Gemini, Dynon D6 > > 3. Use a portable backup like the Garmin 696 or 796? > > > What about additional alternator? > > > My knowledge and experience is only what I have read on-line in the last 6 > months and asking a lot of questions, but still very limited. > > > Thanks, > > > Stoney Ware > > * > > > * > >


    Message 4


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    Time: 11:12:34 AM PST US
    From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
    Subject: Re: Wiring RV7 with Z13 diagram (2 alternators,
    1 battery) >EI does not have its own power backup. After speaking with Robert >at EFII, I am planning on wiring the 2 ECU's, 2 Ignitions, and 2 >Fuel pumps to the always hot battery bus with switches for each of them, That will work Bob . . .


    Message 5


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    Time: 11:32:32 AM PST US
    From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
    Subject: Re: Wiring RV7 with Z13 diagram (2 alternators,
    1 battery) >EI does not have its own power backup. After speaking with Robert >at EFII, I am planning on wiring the 2 ECU's, 2 Ignitions, and 2 >Fuel pumps to the always hot battery bus with switches for each of them, That will work. The next step is to work out your total energy requirements for various phases of flight to both size battery and alternator but to KNOW what your battery-only endurance capabilties are. Bob . . .


    Message 6


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    Time: 02:50:00 PM PST US
    From: Peter Pengilly <peter@sportingaero.com>
    Subject: Re: RV-14
    To answer your specific questions, 1. It would mitigate several potential failure scenarios to add a 2nd ADAHRS and an EFIS battery, and is not that expensive, so I would suggest these are worthwhile additions, especially as the autopilot will use the same AHRS. 2. My experience is that TT ADI and Gemini are not that suitable as back-up IFR instruments as they provide misleading information at low speed. Dynon D6 is quite an old instrument now. GRT Mini seems to fit the bill as an excellent stand-alone back-up, but it is quite new so not much field experience yet. The alternative is something like an RC Allen RCA2600 series attitude indicator - but they are expensive and you would need an ASI & Alt. 3. I don't think many people consider the 'gyro' page provided by a GPS to be anything other than a final back-up life saver. GRT Mini seems like the best bet as there will be much more service experience by the time you are flying. As the previous post mentions, 40A is a bit light and 60A might be more appropriate. I agree a standby alternator also provides a robust back-up capability for a serious IFR aeroplane. Peter On 23/10/2014 17:33, Stoney Ware wrote: > > I am a first time builder and building a RV-14. I am trying to plan > for the electrical and backup system now. I will be flying IFR, when > necessary. Here is my potential configuration: > > Lycoming IO-390 with dual P-Mags & 40 Amp B&C Alternator (Purchased) > > G3X Dual Touchscreen Monitors > > GMC305 AutoPilot Console > > GTN650 GPS/Comm > > GTN200 Comm > > GMA 240 Audio Panel > > GTX 23 Transponder > > So two questions: > > What should I do for a backup in the case of a loss of the Garmin System? > > 1.Add a second ADAHRS and battery backup for the EFIS > > 2.Add a separate system, i.e. GRT Mini, TruTrak Gemini, Dynon D6 > > 3.Use a portable backup like the Garmin 696 or 796? > > What about additional alternator? > > My knowledge and experience is only what I have read on-line in the > last 6 months and asking a lot of questions, but still very limited. > > Thanks, > > Stoney Ware > > * > > > *


    Message 7


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    Time: 08:12:54 PM PST US
    From: Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com>
    Subject: Re: RV-14
    Have you priced your choices vs Dynon Skyview? Including annual database and charts update cost? I think Dynon has been around giving excellent cost effective products and service to the experimental market a lot longer than Garmin; but we all tend to think our choices are superior to other choices. ;-) IMHO the simplest way to reduce your electrical system needs and costs are to go with single ship's battery, backup up battery for each EFIS screen, and dual ADAHRS, That is what I have done with my RV-10 with the following choices: Lycoming IO-540 with dual Bendix 1200 mags, Plane Power 60 amp alternator, Odyssey PC-925 battery. Two Dynon Skyview D1000 screens each with their own backup battery, dual ADAHRS, Dynon autopilot, dynon ADSB transponder and receiver PS Eng PS5000X audio panel GTN-650 SL30. Dynon heated pitot/AOA. Granted the GTN200 was not available when I selected, and the G3X system was priced much higher at the time. PMag still does not have a 6 cyl version, last I checked. Each Dynon EFIS is independently capable of controlling the autopilot servos, each can use either ADAHRS, I am very comfortable with what i have for flying IFR, day or night.I may upgrade one of my screens to touch, but it is not a priority. Since your PMags produce their own power, no dual bus electrical system needed. As long as either of your selected EFIS can operate on a backup battery and provide you enough time to get to VFR or on the ground and supply you the same level of backup as having old mechanical instruments that are required under 91.205 c&d you should be fine. You will want to do a load analysis to see if 40 amps really is enough. While my system is legitimately within the 80% of rated capacity with intermittent use items not considered, with everything on it is very close to 60 amps, even using LED nav and strobe systems. Owen Baker has done an excellent document on distilling the instrumentation required by reg for IFR in amateur built experimentals, certainly contained in archives of this list. Whether you want more than legal minimum is up to you and how much electrical complexity you want. On 10/23/2014 9:33 AM, Stoney Ware wrote: > > I am a first time builder and building a RV-14. I am trying to plan > for the electrical and backup system now. I will be flying IFR, when > necessary. Here is my potential configuration: > > Lycoming IO-390 with dual P-Mags & 40 Amp B&C Alternator (Purchased) > > G3X Dual Touchscreen Monitors > > GMC305 AutoPilot Console > > GTN650 GPS/Comm > > GTN200 Comm > > GMA 240 Audio Panel > > GTX 23 Transponder > > So two questions: > > What should I do for a backup in the case of a loss of the Garmin System? > > 1.Add a second ADAHRS and battery backup for the EFIS > > 2.Add a separate system, i.e. GRT Mini, TruTrak Gemini, Dynon D6 > > 3.Use a portable backup like the Garmin 696 or 796? > > What about additional alternator? > > My knowledge and experience is only what I have read on-line in the > last 6 months and asking a lot of questions, but still very limited. > > Thanks, > > Stoney Ware > > * > > > *


    Message 8


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    Time: 09:20:21 PM PST US
    From: "Ben Westfall" <rv10@sinkrate.com>
    Subject: RV-14
    I'll echo Kelly on this and add my one cent as well. With backup batteries for essential systems I would argue that keeping the simplifications to system designs and reducing the complexities and parts count should hopefully reduce potential failure points. I too am building an RV-10 and I have gone with dual AFS screens and dual AHRS. Each has their own backup battery. I have Bendix mags so no electronic ignition. My e-buss setup is powering things off the TCW backup batteries. I have a VP-X and did not want to add the complexity of switches and fuses to power my essential buss using the ships PC-925 Odyssey battery. Given a battery master contactor failure I will still have 1 hour or more of runtime. If the single 60A alternator fails I will have the ships main battery and then the backup batteries to run things. Yes I'll have to manually load shed but that is a design tradeoff I'm OK with. I did purchase a Dynon D2 as a backup EFIS. This will run for 4 hours of its internal battery. I wrestled with the D2 vs the Gemini or Mini and in the end decided on the D2. The 10 panel did not have a decent location for a backup efis using dual screens. The D2 sits on the top of the dash and mounted where most would put a wet compass. The other benefit I like w/the D2 is given a blocked pitot the D2's GPS groundspeed will be adequate. I'm a big fan of single alt, single battery designs with adequate battery backup. Saves weight wiring complexity. -Ben -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kelly McMullen Sent: Thursday, October 23, 2014 8:11 PM Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: RV-14 --> <kellym@aviating.com> Have you priced your choices vs Dynon Skyview? Including annual database and charts update cost? I think Dynon has been around giving excellent cost effective products and service to the experimental market a lot longer than Garmin; but we all tend to think our choices are superior to other choices. ;-) IMHO the simplest way to reduce your electrical system needs and costs are to go with single ship's battery, backup up battery for each EFIS screen, and dual ADAHRS, That is what I have done with my RV-10 with the following choices: Lycoming IO-540 with dual Bendix 1200 mags, Plane Power 60 amp alternator, Odyssey PC-925 battery. Two Dynon Skyview D1000 screens each with their own backup battery, dual ADAHRS, Dynon autopilot, dynon ADSB transponder and receiver PS Eng PS5000X audio panel GTN-650 SL30. Dynon heated pitot/AOA. Granted the GTN200 was not available when I selected, and the G3X system was priced much higher at the time. PMag still does not have a 6 cyl version, last I checked. Each Dynon EFIS is independently capable of controlling the autopilot servos, each can use either ADAHRS, I am very comfortable with what i have for flying IFR, day or night.I may upgrade one of my screens to touch, but it is not a priority. Since your PMags produce their own power, no dual bus electrical system needed. As long as either of your selected EFIS can operate on a backup battery and provide you enough time to get to VFR or on the ground and supply you the same level of backup as having old mechanical instruments that are required under 91.205 c&d you should be fine. You will want to do a load analysis to see if 40 amps really is enough. While my system is legitimately within the 80% of rated capacity with intermittent use items not considered, with everything on it is very close to 60 amps, even using LED nav and strobe systems. Owen Baker has done an excellent document on distilling the instrumentation required by reg for IFR in amateur built experimentals, certainly contained in archives of this list. Whether you want more than legal minimum is up to you and how much electrical complexity you want. On 10/23/2014 9:33 AM, Stoney Ware wrote: > > I am a first time builder and building a RV-14. I am trying to plan > for the electrical and backup system now. I will be flying IFR, when > necessary. Here is my potential configuration: > > Lycoming IO-390 with dual P-Mags & 40 Amp B&C Alternator (Purchased) > > G3X Dual Touchscreen Monitors > > GMC305 AutoPilot Console > > GTN650 GPS/Comm > > GTN200 Comm > > GMA 240 Audio Panel > > GTX 23 Transponder > > So two questions: > > What should I do for a backup in the case of a loss of the Garmin System? > > 1.Add a second ADAHRS and battery backup for the EFIS > > 2.Add a separate system, i.e. GRT Mini, TruTrak Gemini, Dynon D6 > > 3.Use a portable backup like the Garmin 696 or 796? > > What about additional alternator? > > My knowledge and experience is only what I have read on-line in the > last 6 months and asking a lot of questions, but still very limited. > > Thanks, > > Stoney Ware > > * > > > *


    Message 9


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    Time: 09:31:14 PM PST US
    From: Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com>
    Subject: Re: RV-14
    I visited Dynon booth today at Copperstate fly-in. Their subsidiary AFS has a very nice competitor to VPX and Approach Systems Faststack in one box, handling all the Dynon network connections, a fuse panel and all the switching. AFS or Dynon screens are very equivalent. Many of the unique features of each brand have been shared after Dynon bought AFS. Ken, Dynon's sales manager convinced me that a D1 or D2 would effectively be a secondary level of backup, after both primary screens failed and wasn't all that essential. We each have to decide whether we need belt, suspenders and elastic waist band. 8^) On 10/23/2014 9:18 PM, Ben Westfall wrote: > > I'll echo Kelly on this and add my one cent as well. With backup batteries > for essential systems I would argue that keeping the simplifications to > system designs and reducing the complexities and parts count should > hopefully reduce potential failure points. > > I too am building an RV-10 and I have gone with dual AFS screens and dual > AHRS. Each has their own backup battery. I have Bendix mags so no > electronic ignition. My e-buss setup is powering things off the TCW backup > batteries. I have a VP-X and did not want to add the complexity of switches > and fuses to power my essential buss using the ships PC-925 Odyssey battery. > Given a battery master contactor failure I will still have 1 hour or more of > runtime. If the single 60A alternator fails I will have the ships main > battery and then the backup batteries to run things. Yes I'll have to > manually load shed but that is a design tradeoff I'm OK with. > > I did purchase a Dynon D2 as a backup EFIS. This will run for 4 hours of > its internal battery. I wrestled with the D2 vs the Gemini or Mini and in > the end decided on the D2. The 10 panel did not have a decent location for > a backup efis using dual screens. The D2 sits on the top of the dash and > mounted where most would put a wet compass. The other benefit I like w/the > D2 is given a blocked pitot the D2's GPS groundspeed will be adequate. > > I'm a big fan of single alt, single battery designs with adequate battery > backup. Saves weight wiring complexity. > > -Ben > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kelly > McMullen > Sent: Thursday, October 23, 2014 8:11 PM > To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: RV-14 > > --> <kellym@aviating.com> > > Have you priced your choices vs Dynon Skyview? Including annual database > and charts update cost? > I think Dynon has been around giving excellent cost effective products and > service to the experimental market a lot longer than Garmin; but we all tend > to think our choices are superior to other choices. ;-) IMHO the simplest > way to reduce your electrical system needs and costs are to go with single > ship's battery, backup up battery for each EFIS screen, and dual ADAHRS, > That is what I have done with my RV-10 with the following choices: > Lycoming IO-540 with dual Bendix 1200 mags, Plane Power 60 amp alternator, > Odyssey PC-925 battery. > Two Dynon Skyview D1000 screens each with their own backup battery, dual > ADAHRS, Dynon autopilot, dynon ADSB transponder and receiver PS Eng PS5000X > audio panel > GTN-650 > SL30. > Dynon heated pitot/AOA. > > Granted the GTN200 was not available when I selected, and the G3X system was > priced much higher at the time. > PMag still does not have a 6 cyl version, last I checked. > Each Dynon EFIS is independently capable of controlling the autopilot > servos, each can use either ADAHRS, I am very comfortable with what i have > for flying IFR, day or night.I may upgrade one of my screens to touch, but > it is not a priority. > Since your PMags produce their own power, no dual bus electrical system > needed. As long as either of your selected EFIS can operate on a backup > battery and provide you enough time to get to VFR or on the ground and > supply you the same level of backup as having old mechanical instruments > that are required under 91.205 c&d you should be fine. > You will want to do a load analysis to see if 40 amps really is enough. > While my system is legitimately within the 80% of rated capacity with > intermittent use items not considered, with everything on it is very close > to 60 amps, even using LED nav and strobe systems. > Owen Baker has done an excellent document on distilling the instrumentation > required by reg for IFR in amateur built experimentals, certainly contained > in archives of this list. Whether you want more than legal minimum is up to > you and how much electrical complexity you want. > > On 10/23/2014 9:33 AM, Stoney Ware wrote: >> I am a first time builder and building a RV-14. I am trying to plan >> for the electrical and backup system now. I will be flying IFR, when >> necessary. Here is my potential configuration: >> >> Lycoming IO-390 with dual P-Mags & 40 Amp B&C Alternator (Purchased) >> >> G3X Dual Touchscreen Monitors >> >> GMC305 AutoPilot Console >> >> GTN650 GPS/Comm >> >> GTN200 Comm >> >> GMA 240 Audio Panel >> >> GTX 23 Transponder >> >> So two questions: >> >> What should I do for a backup in the case of a loss of the Garmin System? >> >> 1.Add a second ADAHRS and battery backup for the EFIS >> >> 2.Add a separate system, i.e. GRT Mini, TruTrak Gemini, Dynon D6 >> >> 3.Use a portable backup like the Garmin 696 or 796? >> >> What about additional alternator? >> >> My knowledge and experience is only what I have read on-line in the >> last 6 months and asking a lot of questions, but still very limited. >> >> Thanks, >> >> Stoney Ware >> >> * >> >> >> * > >


    Message 10


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    Time: 10:02:32 PM PST US
    From: Jeff Luckey <jluckey@pacbell.net>
    Subject: Re: RV-14
    I'm not a big fan of each individual component having its own backup battery. I think it makes for future maintenance issues. To be diligent you must test each battery on a regular basis (like at every annual inspection). A full discharge/charge cycle to measure actual remaining battery capacity for each battery. Also, what about keeping a radio, or other important components alive? A well-designed two battery system does not need to be complex or difficult to use. -Jeff On Thursday, October 23, 2014 9:39 PM, Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com> wrote: I visited Dynon booth today at Copperstate fly-in. Their subsidiary AFS has a very nice competitor to VPX and Approach Systems Faststack in one box, handling all the Dynon network connections, a fuse panel and all the switching. AFS or Dynon screens are very equivalent. Many of the unique features of each brand have been shared after Dynon bought AFS. Ken, Dynon's sales manager convinced me that a D1 or D2 would effectively be a secondary level of backup, after both primary screens failed and wasn't all that essential. We each have to decide whether we need belt, suspenders and elastic waist band. 8^) On 10/23/2014 9:18 PM, Ben Westfall wrote: > > I'll echo Kelly on this and add my one cent as well. With backup batteries > for essential systems I would argue that keeping the simplifications to > system designs and reducing the complexities and parts count should > hopefully reduce potential failure points. > > I too am building an RV-10 and I have gone with dual AFS screens and dual > AHRS. Each has their own backup battery. I have Bendix mags so no > electronic ignition. My e-buss setup is powering things off the TCW backup > batteries. I have a VP-X and did not want to add the complexity of switches > and fuses to power my essential buss using the ships PC-925 Odyssey battery. > Given a battery master contactor failure I will still have 1 hour or more of > runtime. If the single 60A alternator fails I will have the ships main > battery and then the backup batteries to run things. Yes I'll have to > manually load shed but that is a design tradeoff I'm OK with. > > I did purchase a Dynon D2 as a backup EFIS. This will run for 4 hours of > its internal battery. I wrestled with the D2 vs the Gemini or Mini and in > the end decided on the D2. The 10 panel did not have a decent location for > a backup efis using dual screens. The D2 sits on the top of the dash and > mounted where most would put a wet compass. The other benefit I like w/the > D2 is given a blocked pitot the D2's GPS groundspeed will be adequate. > > I'm a big fan of single alt, single battery designs with adequate battery > backup. Saves weight wiring complexity. > > -Ben > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kelly > McMullen > Sent: Thursday, October 23, 2014 8:11 PM > To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: RV-14 > > --> <kellym@aviating.com> > > Have you priced your choices vs Dynon Skyview? Including annual database > and charts update cost? > I think Dynon has been around giving excellent cost effective products and > service to the experimental market a lot longer than Garmin; but we all tend > to think our choices are superior to other choices. ;-) IMHO the simplest > way to reduce your electrical system needs and costs are to go with single > ship's battery, backup up battery for each EFIS screen, and dual ADAHRS, > That is what I have done with my RV-10 with the following choices: > Lycoming IO-540 with dual Bendix 1200 mags, Plane Power 60 amp alternator, > Odyssey PC-925 battery. > Two Dynon Skyview D1000 screens each with their own backup battery, dual > ADAHRS, Dynon autopilot, dynon ADSB transponder and receiver PS Eng PS5000X > audio panel > GTN-650 > SL30. > Dynon heated pitot/AOA. > > Granted the GTN200 was not available when I selected, and the G3X system was > priced much higher at the time. > PMag still does not have a 6 cyl version, last I checked. > Each Dynon EFIS is independently capable of controlling the autopilot > servos, each can use either ADAHRS, I am very comfortable with what i have > for flying IFR, day or night.I may upgrade one of my screens to touch, but > it is not a priority. > Since your PMags produce their own power, no dual bus electrical system > needed. As long as either of your selected EFIS can operate on a backup > battery and provide you enough time to get to VFR or on the ground and > supply you the same level of backup as having old mechanical instruments > that are required under 91.205 c&d you should be fine. > You will want to do a load analysis to see if 40 amps really is enough. > While my system is legitimately within the 80% of rated capacity with > intermittent use items not considered, with everything on it is very close > to 60 amps, even using LED nav and strobe systems. > Owen Baker has done an excellent document on distilling the instrumentation > required by reg for IFR in amateur built experimentals, certainly contained > in archives of this list. Whether you want more than legal minimum is up to > you and how much electrical complexity you want. > > On 10/23/2014 9:33 AM, Stoney Ware wrote: >> I am a first time builder and building a RV-14. I am trying to plan >> for the electrical and backup system now. I will be flying IFR, when >> necessary. Here is my potential configuration: >> >> Lycoming IO-390 with dual P-Mags & 40 Amp B&C Alternator (Purchased) >> >> G3X Dual Touchscreen Monitors >> >> GMC305 AutoPilot Console >> >> GTN650 GPS/Comm >> >> GTN200 Comm >> >> GMA 240 Audio Panel >> >> GTX 23 Transponder >> >> So two questions: >> >> What should I do for a backup in the case of a loss of the Garmin System? >> >> 1.Add a second ADAHRS and battery backup for the EFIS >> >> 2.Add a separate system, i.e. GRT Mini, TruTrak Gemini, Dynon D6 >> >> 3.Use a portable backup like the Garmin 696 or 796? >> >> What about additional alternator? >> >> My knowledge and experience is only what I have read on-line in the >> last 6 months and asking a lot of questions, but still very limited. >> >> Thanks, >> >> Stoney Ware >> >> * >> >> >> * > >


    Message 11


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    Time: 10:40:49 PM PST US
    From: Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com>
    Subject: Re: RV-14
    Primary backup is in fact ship's battery. Depending on your navigation needs, a GTN-650 is going to draw between 3.5 and 4 amps, while an SL30 doing VHF nav will only draw less than 1 amp. A Dynon Skyview draws around 3.5-3.8 amps. My total load for my panel, without any exterior lights or pitot heat is around 10 amps. With the PC-925 rated at 28 amp hours I should get at least an hour there. At that point, if I haven't found VFR or got clearance to the nearest suitable airport with an approach I can make, I have done something wrong. The Dynon system has a backup battery charge status available, with a reminder of when it was last tested. It is not fully discharged in the test, but run for 45 min or to a voltage drop that protects the battery. The system gives you the opportunity to push one button and run the test whenever you power off the unit. Thus I have 45 min of EFIS with VFR GPS to get me on the ground after the ship's power has dropped below voltage that will support other radios. Having a total of 3 batteries to test once a year is a whole lot simpler than trying to install dual electric buss with one or two alternators and one or two batteries that will power what besides you flight instruments? You will need to maintain both alternators, both batteries , etc. What is most critical to maintain if the ship's alternator and main battery fail? Not much matters outside your EFIS. I do have an essential buss concept, with the items on the list being powered directly from the master relay whenever master is on. The non-essential are controlled by a single switch. On 10/23/2014 10:01 PM, Jeff Luckey wrote: > I'm not a big fan of each individual component having its own backup > battery. > > I think it makes for future maintenance issues. To be diligent you > must test > each battery on a regular basis (like at every annual inspection). A > full > discharge/charge cycle to measure actual remaining battery capacity for > each battery. > > Also, what about keeping a radio, or other important components alive? > > A well-designed two battery system does not need to be complex or > difficult to use. > > -Jeff > >




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