Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:56 AM - Re: Question about monitoring output in two alternator configura (user9253)
2. 08:19 AM - Failing over voltage module (Rob Henderson)
3. 08:43 AM - Re: Question about monitoring output in two alternator configura (jonlaury)
4. 09:09 AM - Raise internal reg. Alternator voltage (Tim Olson)
5. 10:11 AM - Using the quote button (jonlaury)
6. 10:14 AM - Re: Failing over voltage module (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
7. 11:52 AM - Re: Failing over voltage module (Rob Henderson)
8. 11:57 AM - Re: Raise internal reg. Alternator voltage (Rene)
9. 12:46 PM - Re: Raise internal reg. Alternator voltage (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
10. 12:54 PM - Re: Raise internal reg. Alternator voltage (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
11. 01:23 PM - Re: Raise internal reg. Alternator voltage (C&K)
12. 05:10 PM - Re: Using the quote button (user9253)
13. 09:27 PM - Re: Re: Question about monitoring output in two alternator configura (Dan Charrois)
Message 1
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Subject: | Re: Question about monitoring output in two alternator |
configura
Becoming used to seeing zero amps on the standby alternator is of no concern because
an EFIS can be setup to alarm at user selected parameters. In other words,
you would setup the EFIS to alarm when the standby alternator current is NOT
zero. Also, many EFIS allow the user to choose what to display on the main
page. So, display the standby alternator current on another page, not the main
page.
The purpose of having two alternators is for redundancy in case one fails. If
the two alternators share one shunt, redundancy is defeated. Would both alternators
be disconnected if the main alternator current limiter blows?
An ammeter on the standby alternator is not a necessity. In the event of main
alternator failure, the voltmeter can be just as useful to help the pilot shed
non essential loads. Just shut off loads one at a time until system voltage
rises up to 13 volts (like Bob suggested).
Joe
--------
Joe Gores
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=438300#438300
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Subject: | Failing over voltage module |
Bob
I purchased 1 of your OVM 2 years ago and have been flying with it for a
year
I have a Glastar with a Subaru 2.5L and IR 70 Amp alternator using Z19RB as
a platform
I modified the alt field circuit to use the OVM and installed a relay in the
B lead using the Z24 interim
The circuit breaker for the alt field started to randomly trip and during
troubleshooting I found the OVM was tripping even on battery only
operations.
Can I send the part back for analysis?
Thanks
-Rob
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Subject: | Re: Question about monitoring output in two alternator |
configura
[/quote]
Of course, the next question I'd have for them is whether their hall effect sensor
is big enough to accommodate both alternator B-leads..
Thanks for your response!
Dan
---
Dan Charrois
President, Syzygy Research & Technology
Phone: 780-961-2213[/quote]
Dan,
I set up my 2 alt system for the AFS 4500 using their HE sensor. I was able to
fit #8 & #10 tefzel covered wires through it. The short # 10 wire (Alt 2) can
easily handle the 25 amps for keeping my ED (EFI, EI) ship afloat.
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=438309#438309
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Subject: | Raise internal reg. Alternator voltage |
I've got an oddball question that I've been pondering
for a while.
I have an older Plane Power 70A internal regulated alternator.
The output voltage is always 13.9V at least as detected by
my engine monitor
Since it's internally regulated, and has it's own overvoltage
module, and ties to the bus through I think a 5A
breaker, I'm not sure what I would be able to do to
raise the output voltage. They told me that
the regulator is fixed and non-adjustable, so on the
alternator end I'm sure there's not much I could do.
Now I've flown with it for almost 1,100 hours now and
it's never been an issue, but I do use an Odyssey battery
as my primary and some AGM batteries in my aux bus.
So I think ideally I'd raise the voltage up to
something just slightly higher if I wanted to optimize
my battery charge state.
Is there any simple way of tricking the alternator
into thinking the bus voltage is slightly lower than it
is so that it raises the output slightly?
I envision some way to drop voltage on the sense line
so that it jacks it up another .5V or so.
Just wondering what kinds of ideas anyone has, or if
maybe anyone else has done it and knows what would work.
Tim
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Subject: | Using the quote button |
Other than quoting from an original post, my attempts at using the quote button
have had mixed results in getting the selected text to appear with the characteristic
blue background.
Tried looking in the Matronics Email Lists FAQ, but no joy.
Can someone point me to an explanation of how to quote from a post that is already
filled with quotes, so that my selection appears with blue background in my
reply ?
Thanks,
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=438313#438313
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Subject: | Re: Failing over voltage module |
At 10:18 2015-02-13, you wrote:
Bob
I purchased 1 of your OVM 2 years ago and have been flying with it for a year
I have a Glastar with a Subaru 2.5L and IR 70 Amp alternator using
Z19RB as a platform
I modified the alt field circuit to use the OVM and installed a relay
in the B lead using the Z24 interim
The circuit breaker for the alt field started to randomly trip and
during troubleshooting I found the OVM was tripping even on battery
only operations.
Can I send the part back for analysis?
Thanks
-Rob
Absolutely! Please do. It will be repaired/replaced
under our lifetime warranty. It's a rare circumstance
that I can get the carcass back on a fielded failure
to perform.
Box 130, Medicine Lodge, KS 67104-0130
Bob . . .
Message 7
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Subject: | Failing over voltage module |
Thanks
I will try to get it out today
-Rob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert L.
Nuckolls, III
Sent: Friday, February 13, 2015 10:13 AM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Failing over voltage module
--> <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
At 10:18 2015-02-13, you wrote:
Bob
I purchased 1 of your OVM 2 years ago and have been flying with it for a
year I have a Glastar with a Subaru 2.5L and IR 70 Amp alternator using
Z19RB as a platform I modified the alt field circuit to use the OVM and
installed a relay in the B lead using the Z24 interim The circuit breaker
for the alt field started to randomly trip and during troubleshooting I
found the OVM was tripping even on battery only operations.
Can I send the part back for analysis?
Thanks
-Rob
Absolutely! Please do. It will be repaired/replaced
under our lifetime warranty. It's a rare circumstance
that I can get the carcass back on a fielded failure
to perform.
Box 130, Medicine Lodge, KS 67104-0130
Bob . . .
Message 8
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Subject: | Raise internal reg. Alternator voltage |
Tim, depending on if you have an e-bus.
I see the same thing on my GRT EIS. It is on my e-bus. If I look at the power
bus, then it is 14.2. Just recently I added a GRT Sport (long story) as my backup
and it is NOT on my ebus and it showed 14.2 all the way to Vegas and back
this week (first real flight with it). I never tried to measure my power bus
before and my other EFIS is on the e-bus. I had the same concern as you until
this week.
One way to check, is to turn on your e-bus and see what happens. When I did, my
EIS and EFIS (SPORT) voltage reading was the same. Only 500 hours...not a 1000
like you....and I finally figured it out.
I did not think the diode was supposed to drop the voltage that much.....but it
sure appears to. My normal full power voltage reading on the EIS is 13.9 or
sometimes 14.0.
Rene'
801-721-6080
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Olson
Sent: Friday, February 13, 2015 10:08 AM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Raise internal reg. Alternator voltage
I've got an oddball question that I've been pondering for a while.
I have an older Plane Power 70A internal regulated alternator.
The output voltage is always 13.9V at least as detected by my engine monitor
Since it's internally regulated, and has it's own overvoltage module, and ties
to the bus through I think a 5A breaker, I'm not sure what I would be able to
do to raise the output voltage. They told me that the regulator is fixed and
non-adjustable, so on the alternator end I'm sure there's not much I could do.
Now I've flown with it for almost 1,100 hours now and it's never been an issue,
but I do use an Odyssey battery as my primary and some AGM batteries in my aux
bus.
So I think ideally I'd raise the voltage up to something just slightly higher if
I wanted to optimize my battery charge state.
Is there any simple way of tricking the alternator into thinking the bus voltage
is slightly lower than it is so that it raises the output slightly?
I envision some way to drop voltage on the sense line so that it jacks it up another
.5V or so.
Just wondering what kinds of ideas anyone has, or if maybe anyone else has done
it and knows what would work.
Tim
Message 9
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Subject: | Re: Raise internal reg. Alternator voltage |
Is there any simple way of tricking the alternator
into thinking the bus voltage is slightly lower than it
is so that it raises the output slightly?
I envision some way to drop voltage on the sense line
so that it jacks it up another .5V or so.
Just wondering what kinds of ideas anyone has, or if
maybe anyone else has done it and knows what would work.
It depends on where the internal regulator senses
bus voltage. If it gets data from the b-lead terminal,
there's nothing you can do but swap out the regulator
and hope the new one is more SVLA-friendly.
Try putting a 1N540x diode in series with the
control wire off the 5A breaker. If it senses
voltage through this lead, then the approx 0.5
volt drop in the diode will spoof the regulator
into boosting output voltage at the b-lead.
Bob . . .
Message 10
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Subject: | Raise internal reg. Alternator voltage |
At 13:55 2015-02-13, you wrote:
Tim, depending on if you have an e-bus.
I see the same thing on my GRT EIS. It is on my e-bus. If I look at
the power bus, then it is 14.2. Just recently I added a GRT Sport
(long story) as my backup and it is NOT on my ebus and it showed 14.2
all the way to Vegas and back this week (first real flight with
it). I never tried to measure my power bus before and my other EFIS
is on the e-bus. I had the same concern as you until this week.
Ah . . . . but of course. It didn't occur to me that
his voltage sample was coming off a diode-isolated
e-bus.
One way to check, is to turn on your e-bus and see what
happens. When I did, my EIS and EFIS (SPORT) voltage reading was the
same. Only 500 hours...not a 1000 like you....and I finally figured it out.
I did not think the diode was supposed to drop the voltage that
much.....but it sure appears to. My normal full power voltage
reading on the EIS is 13.9 or sometimes 14.0.
The typical drop across a silicon rectifier is
0.6 to 0.7 volts. A Schottky rectifier will be
a little less. Rene's suggestion to close the
e-bus alternate feed will, of course, bypass
the normal feed path diode and raise the e-bus
voltage.
If this describes your situation, then all
is right with the universe and the 13.9 volt
reading is predictable and acceptable.
Bob . . .
Message 11
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Subject: | Re: Raise internal reg. Alternator voltage |
If this is not simply an e-buss issue, how much capacity and life is
actually being lost?
There is likely some temperature compensation in the regulator if it is
running hot. Is the EIS accurate? I know mine (different model) is off
by a couple of tenths.
I would be happy with 13.9 volts on an AGM battery in hot conditions as
there is no need for a fast charge in my aircraft. Different story today
with subzero temperatures here. Admittedly I don't worry much about my
batteries with Z14 architecture.
Ken
On 13/02/2015 3:45 PM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote:
> <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
>
> Is there any simple way of tricking the alternator
> into thinking the bus voltage is slightly lower than it
> is so that it raises the output slightly?
> I envision some way to drop voltage on the sense line
> so that it jacks it up another .5V or so.
>
> Just wondering what kinds of ideas anyone has, or if
> maybe anyone else has done it and knows what would work.
>
> It depends on where the internal regulator senses
> bus voltage. If it gets data from the b-lead terminal,
> there's nothing you can do but swap out the regulator
> and hope the new one is more SVLA-friendly.
>
> Try putting a 1N540x diode in series with the
> control wire off the 5A breaker. If it senses
> voltage through this lead, then the approx 0.5
> volt drop in the diode will spoof the regulator
> into boosting output voltage at the b-lead.
>
>
> Bob . . .
>
>
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Subject: | Re: Using the quote button |
> Can someone point me to an explanation of how to quote from a post that is already
filled with quotes, so that my selection appears with blue background in
my reply ?"
First of all I go to the matronics website:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewforum.php?f=3
and click on a topic. Then I select the text to be quoted. Then copy it. Then
click on the PostReply button. Then click on the QUOTE button. Then paste.
Then click on the QUOTE button again.
Then click on PREVIEW to see what it looks like before posting it.
Joe
--------
Joe Gores
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=438336#438336
Message 13
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Subject: | Re: Question about monitoring output in two alternator |
configura
> I have an electrical system with dual alternators (primary and backup) and have
a question with regards to monitoring their output current.
Thanks, everyone, for your clarification and insight on this. I can definitely
see how running both alternators through a single shunt for current monitoring,
though it would work electrically, does introduce a single point of failure
that really doesn't need to be there. A hall sensor does seem the more sensible
choice if I were to want to monitor the output of both alternators with a
single sensor, or like Bob and others suggested, perhaps current monitoring of
the backup alternator isn't even necessary considering that voltage monitoring
of the bus is the primary indicator of electrical health anyway.
Dan
---
Dan Charrois
President, Syzygy Research & Technology
Phone: 780-961-2213
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