Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 08:39 AM - Re: Re: Request for some direction and advise (Bill Bradburry)
2. 11:06 AM - Re: Re: Request for some direction and advise (Bill Bradburry)
3. 11:40 AM - Wiring portable transceiver through audio panel? (Andy Elliott)
4. 02:10 PM - Re: Wiring portable transceiver through audio panel? (Charlie England)
5. 11:22 PM - Official AeroElectric-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) (Matt Dralle)
6. 11:36 PM - Official AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines (Matt Dralle)
Message 1
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Subject: | RE: Request for some direction and advise |
One other thing that I just thought of that may be a factor. The
backing
plate through connectors that the radio slides into when it is inserted
into
the tray are very wobbly. It is very easy to make a circle with them
that
is at least 1/8 inch in radius. I have never thought about these
connectors
before because I thought that they were wobbly in order to line up with
the
radio when in is inserted. But now thinking about it, it seems to me
that
they should firm up when the radio is inserted because they are making
rigid
contact with the radio?? Mine are still wobbly after the radio is
inserted.
Could these connectors or the backing plate be somehow incorrectly
installed?
Does anyone know if these connectors should be firm after the radio is
installed? Could this be where I have a bad connection with the shield?
What about the other shield grounds described below? Would they be a
factor
if that card edge connector does not make a firm connection? There is a
boss just to the side of this card edge connector that I am considering
using to run a separate ground wire from the backing plate to the
"forest of
tabs" ground block. Are there any opinions on this idea?
Bill
_____
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill
Bradburry
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2015 8:51 PM
Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: RE: Request for some direction and
advise
I checked the connectors at the two ends of the com coax. They were
both
well connected to the shield and I couldn't pull them off the cable.
The, I
guess you would call it the barrel, of the connector at the radio end
was a
little difficult to twist after the connector was removed. I twisted it
back and forth a little and it seemed to loosen up. I suppose there
could
have been some corrosion where it rotates, but I didn't see anything.
I checked and found the radio backing plate had continuity with ground.
There is a card edge connector that is used as a shield ground connector
at
the backing plate that seemed to me to be a loose fit. I mean it was
easy
to remove it from the plate it connects to. It is held in place by a
couple
of screws so there was no danger of it falling off, but it was a loose
fit
so I suppose that some of the pins could have not been making good
contact.
I don't know if any of the shields that are in this connector could have
caused the problem.
I wonder if I should try and bend the pins so that they make a tighter
fit?
Also should the edge it slips over be brightened up some? It is the
same
grey color as the backing plate?
I found another RG-400 cable with connectors on both ends that I could
use
to hook up the other antenna I have to see if that helps. I don't know
if
the spare cable will reach to the existing antenna. If it does I could
try
that as well.
Bill
_____
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Robert L.
Nuckolls, III
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2015 10:40 AM
Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: RE: Request for some direction and
advise
At 10:15 PM 8/30/2015, you wrote:
I saw where someone else on the list a while back was discussing adding
that
connector to their TruTrak at the company=12s suggestion. It is
supposed to
keep RFI out as I recall.
The antenna is glassed in and not removable, I tried to attach it with
tape,
but I could not get it to stay in place so I just glassed it in. I do
have
a second antenna that I could try if I don=12t find anything with the
coax. I
only have a Volt-Ohm meter so I don=12t think I could bench test the
antenna.
I feel your 'pain' . . . more than once
I have been presented with a conundrum
with tools and test equipment out of reach.
Do the touchy-feely things with the
feed line first. Then consider building
a test antenna. A simple dipole, fed at
center with a length of coax fited with
BNC cable-female to reach across the
aircraft to the opposite side where
you can tape it in place.
See if the problem resolves.
I don't know any specifics about the antenna
you have installed. I have been made aware
of several products like it wherein the
manufacturer thought it a good idea to
include a balun/matching transformer in
that little potted box at the center.
On such product could not handle the
power from the transmitter and failed
the balun after some hours in service.
We're grasping at straws here but one
of those straws IS the short one. Without
useful diagnostic tools . . . it's
the best we can do.
But if it's any consolation, I've encountered
ONLY ONE EMC problem on an airplane wherein
root cause could NOT be resolved . . . only
swapped out.
Emacs!
Seems that some really nifty technology advances
in communications hardware were installed
on an aircraft being manufactured to still
adequate methods designed 40 years ago.
A technology that placed NEW and exceedingly
difficult requirements on the airframe.
From that time to this day, the aircraft has
suffered a host of EMC problems that occur
at intervals, sometimes in small batches,
and will never be resolved except that the
old wire-type antennas be re-installed.
I'm not suggesting that your situation is
intractable . . . only that not all combinations
of hardware are plug-n-play in all airframes
and yours is fixable.
Only spent a few hundred $K tracking the
other one down . . . yours will be MUCH
less expensive.
Bob . . .
Message 2
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Subject: | RE: Request for some direction and advise |
I just spoke with Garmin field support. Pretty nice guy when you
finally
get through to him. He had a radio in front of him. He said that while
he
could move the through connectors with the radio installed, they were
not
very loose, pretty firm. Also the card edge connector came off pretty
easily after the two screws were removed, similar to mine.
I plan to remove the radio and backing plate and connect them outside of
the
tray to see if a better connection to the backing plate helps the
problem.
I also plan to raise the card edge contacts a little to help make a
better
connection there as well. If the better connection to the backing plate
works, I will have to determine why the connection is not sufficient
when
the radio is in the tray.
Are there any suggestions, or comments?
Bill
_____
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill
Bradburry
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2015 10:34 AM
Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: RE: Request for some direction and
advise
One other thing that I just thought of that may be a factor. The
backing
plate through connectors that the radio slides into when it is inserted
into
the tray are very wobbly. It is very easy to make a circle with them
that
is at least 1/8 inch in radius. I have never thought about these
connectors
before because I thought that they were wobbly in order to line up with
the
radio when in is inserted. But now thinking about it, it seems to me
that
they should firm up when the radio is inserted because they are making
rigid
contact with the radio?? Mine are still wobbly after the radio is
inserted.
Could these connectors or the backing plate be somehow incorrectly
installed?
Does anyone know if these connectors should be firm after the radio is
installed? Could this be where I have a bad connection with the shield?
What about the other shield grounds described below? Would they be a
factor
if that card edge connector does not make a firm connection? There is a
boss just to the side of this card edge connector that I am considering
using to run a separate ground wire from the backing plate to the
"forest of
tabs" ground block. Are there any opinions on this idea?
Bill
_____
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill
Bradburry
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2015 8:51 PM
Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: RE: Request for some direction and
advise
I checked the connectors at the two ends of the com coax. They were
both
well connected to the shield and I couldn't pull them off the cable.
The, I
guess you would call it the barrel, of the connector at the radio end
was a
little difficult to twist after the connector was removed. I twisted it
back and forth a little and it seemed to loosen up. I suppose there
could
have been some corrosion where it rotates, but I didn't see anything.
I checked and found the radio backing plate had continuity with ground.
There is a card edge connector that is used as a shield ground connector
at
the backing plate that seemed to me to be a loose fit. I mean it was
easy
to remove it from the plate it connects to. It is held in place by a
couple
of screws so there was no danger of it falling off, but it was a loose
fit
so I suppose that some of the pins could have not been making good
contact.
I don't know if any of the shields that are in this connector could have
caused the problem.
I wonder if I should try and bend the pins so that they make a tighter
fit?
Also should the edge it slips over be brightened up some? It is the
same
grey color as the backing plate?
I found another RG-400 cable with connectors on both ends that I could
use
to hook up the other antenna I have to see if that helps. I don't know
if
the spare cable will reach to the existing antenna. If it does I could
try
that as well.
Bill
_____
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Robert L.
Nuckolls, III
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2015 10:40 AM
Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: RE: Request for some direction and
advise
At 10:15 PM 8/30/2015, you wrote:
I saw where someone else on the list a while back was discussing adding
that
connector to their TruTrak at the company=12s suggestion. It is
supposed to
keep RFI out as I recall.
The antenna is glassed in and not removable, I tried to attach it with
tape,
but I could not get it to stay in place so I just glassed it in. I do
have
a second antenna that I could try if I don=12t find anything with the
coax. I
only have a Volt-Ohm meter so I don=12t think I could bench test the
antenna.
I feel your 'pain' . . . more than once
I have been presented with a conundrum
with tools and test equipment out of reach.
Do the touchy-feely things with the
feed line first. Then consider building
a test antenna. A simple dipole, fed at
center with a length of coax fited with
BNC cable-female to reach across the
aircraft to the opposite side where
you can tape it in place.
See if the problem resolves.
I don't know any specifics about the antenna
you have installed. I have been made aware
of several products like it wherein the
manufacturer thought it a good idea to
include a balun/matching transformer in
that little potted box at the center.
On such product could not handle the
power from the transmitter and failed
the balun after some hours in service.
We're grasping at straws here but one
of those straws IS the short one. Without
useful diagnostic tools . . . it's
the best we can do.
But if it's any consolation, I've encountered
ONLY ONE EMC problem on an airplane wherein
root cause could NOT be resolved . . . only
swapped out.
Emacs!
Seems that some really nifty technology advances
in communications hardware were installed
on an aircraft being manufactured to still
adequate methods designed 40 years ago.
A technology that placed NEW and exceedingly
difficult requirements on the airframe.
From that time to this day, the aircraft has
suffered a host of EMC problems that occur
at intervals, sometimes in small batches,
and will never be resolved except that the
old wire-type antennas be re-installed.
I'm not suggesting that your situation is
intractable . . . only that not all combinations
of hardware are plug-n-play in all airframes
and yours is fixable.
Only spent a few hundred $K tracking the
other one down . . . yours will be MUCH
less expensive.
Bob . . .
Message 3
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Subject: | Wiring portable transceiver through audio panel? |
The wood/fiberglass aircraft I bought has a single NAV-COM (KX-155A) and
a single embedded comm antenna. It also has an 2002-vintage PS
Engineering PMA-7000B audio panel. I would like to add another comm
radio to the aircraft and was considering something like the Yaesu
FTA-550. This radio has provision for a headset connector and for
10=B10.5V power input.
I was wondering if it is possible to splice the headset connections from
the portable into the audio panel as COM2, and get =93normal=94 comm
radio
functionality, specifically
1. Can the mike output from the audio panel drive the portable?
2. Can the stick mounted PTT, through the audio panel, key the
portable?
3. Can the portable headset output be used as input to the audio panel?
4. What might be a recommended way to get the 10V feed for the
portable?
And if it is possible, what kind of special connections/modifications
might need to be made?
Thanks,
Andy
------------------------
Andy Elliott, CL:480-695-9568
N729LS, GP-4
Message 4
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Subject: | Re: Wiring portable transceiver through audio panel? |
On 9/1/2015 1:39 PM, Andy Elliott wrote:
>
> The wood/fiberglass aircraft I bought has a single NAV-COM (KX-155A)
> and a single embedded comm antenna. It also has an 2002-vintage PS
> Engineering PMA-7000B audio panel. I would like to add another comm
> radio to the aircraft and was considering something like the Yaesu
> FTA-550. This radio has provision for a headset connector and for
> 100.5V power input.
>
> I was wondering if it is possible to splice the headset connections
> from the portable into the audio panel as COM2, and get normal comm
> radio functionality, specifically
>
> 1.Can the mike output from the audio panel drive the portable?
>
The portable should accept any typical aviation mic level input
(assuming it has mic/PTT/headset jacks). Normally, an audio panel 'feeds
through' the mic signal to the transmitter selected by the audio panel's
transmit selector switch. So, yes.
>
> 2.Can the stick mounted PTT, through the audio panel, key the portable?
>
Assuming that the portable has 'standard' headset and mic/PTT jacks
(either full size or miniature), then any external PTT should key the
portable. (Transmit select switch should route PTT in addition to mic
signal to the correct radio.)
>
> 3.Can the portable headset output be used as input to the audio panel?
>
Should be the same level & impedance range as any other radio's headset
output, so, yes.
>
> 4.What might be a recommended way to get the 10V feed for the portable?
>
Check with the mfgr 1st; it's possible that the radio will accept a
typical 14v input from the a/c power buss. If it won't, then the mfgr
should have a 14V-10V adapter to power the radio from ship's power.
>
> And if it is possible, what kind of special connections/modifications
> might need to be made?
>
If it's a typical aviation handheld transceiver, all you should need is
plugs/wiring to connect the mic, PTT, headset, and power jacks to the
audio panel's ins/outs and to the ship's power buss.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Andy
>
> ------------------------
>
> Andy Elliott, CL:480-695-9568
>
> N729LS, GP-4
>
>
Charlie
Message 5
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Subject: | Official AeroElectric-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) |
Dear Listers,
Please read over the AeroElectric-List Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) below.
The
complete AeroElectric-List FAQ including the Usage Guidelines can be found at the
following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/AeroElectric-List.FAQ.html
Thank you,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
[ Note: This FAQ was designed to be displayed with a fixed width font such as
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Often someone produces a particularly useful posting in email one one of the
Lists that would be of general interest. In that case Matronics may take that
post and convert it into a Wiki page.
*********************
*** List Archives ***
*********************
A file containing of all of the previous postings to the AeroElectric-List is
available on line. The archive file information is available via the
Web and FTP in a number of forms. Each are briefly described below:
* AeroElectric-List.FAQ
- Latest version of the AeroElectric-List Frequently Asked Question
page (this document).
* AeroElectric-Archive.digest.complete
- Complete file with most of the email header info removed and
page breaks inserted between messages.
* AeroElectric-Archive.digest.vol-??
- Same as the file above, but broken up into small sections that
can more easily handled.
* AeroElectric-Archive.digest.complete.zip
- Same as the AeroElectric-Archive.digest.complete file above, but
in PKZIP format. Use "binary" data transfer methods.
* AeroElectric-Archive.digest.complete.Z
- Same as the AeroElectric-Archive.digest.complete file above, but
in
UNIX compress format. Use "binary" data transfer methods.
Download Via FTP
----------------
The archive file is available via anonymous FTP from ftp.matronics.com
in the "/pub/Archives" directory. It is updated daily and can be found in
a number of formats as described above. (All filenames are case sensitive.)
ftp://ftp.matronics.com/pub/Archives
Download Via Web
----------------
The archives are also available via a web listing. These can be found
toward the bottom of the following web page:
http://www.matronics.com/archives
******************************************
*** Complete List Web Archive Browsing ***
******************************************
All messages posted to the AeroElectric-List are also available using the
Email List Archive Browsing feature. With this utility, all messages
in the List are indexed, and individual sub-archives can be browsed.
http://www.matronics.com/archive/archive-index.cgi?AeroElectric
*****************************************
**** High-Speed Archive Search Engine ***
*****************************************
You can use the custom, high-performance Matronics Email List Search Engine
to quickly locate and browse any messages that have been posted to the
List. The Engine allows the user to easily search any of the currently
available List archives.
http://www.matronics.com/search
****************************
*** File and Photo Share ***
****************************
With the Matronics Email List File and Photo Share you can share pictures
and other data with members of the List without having to forward a
copy of it to everyone. To share your Files and Photos, simply email
them to:
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!! ==> Please including the following information with each submission:
1) Email Lists that they are related to.
2) Your Full Name.
3) Your Email Address.
4) One line Subject description.
5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic.
6-x) One-line Description of each photo or file
Prior to public availability of the files and photos, each will be scanned
for viruses. Please also note that the process of making the files and
photos available on the web site is a pseudo-manual process, and I try to
process them every few days.
Following the availability of the new Photoshare, an email message will be
sent to the Email Lists enumerated in 1) above indicating that the new
Share is available and what the direct URL to it is.
For a current list of available Photoshares, have a look at the Main
Index Page:
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
**************************
*** List Archive CDROM ***
**************************
A complete Matronics Email List Archive CD is available that contains
all of the archives since the beginning of each of the Lists. The archives
for all of the Lists are included on the CD along with a freeware search
engine written by a list member. The CD is burned the day you order it
and will contain archive received up to the last minute. They make
great gifts!
http://www.matronics.com/ArchiveCDROM
**********************************
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******************************************************************************
AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines
******************************************************************************
The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the AeroElectric-List.
You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein.
Failure to use the AeroElectric-List in the manner described below may result
in the removal of the subscribers from the List.
AeroElectric-List Policy Statement
The purpose of the AeroElectric-List is to provide a forum of discussion for
things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals
are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver
high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie
among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals
requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of
the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established:
- Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit
posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long
lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc.
- THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be
relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it.
- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive
that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and
terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and
responses.
- Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address,
aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line
about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid
bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary
space in the archive.
- DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is
easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the
web page or FAQ first.
- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of
your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it
easy to find threads in the archive.
- When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your
response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the
reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that
quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive
can not be overstated!
- When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT
then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the
"reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your
response to the original poster. You might have to actively address
your response with the original poster's email address.
- DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something
to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I
agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent
to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large.
- When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to
comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly
contribute something valuable.
- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone
polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack
other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously
controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that
will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.
- Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly
subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by
List members promoting their respective products or items for sale
should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble
a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but
is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to
everyone, including those who provide products to the entire
community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the
operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists.
-------
[This is an automated posting.]
do not archive
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|
Subject: | Official AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines |
Dear Listers,
Please read over the AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines below. The complete
AeroElectric-List FAQ including these Usage Guidelines can be found at the
following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/AeroElectric-List.FAQ.html
Thank you,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
******************************************************************************
AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines
******************************************************************************
The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the AeroElectric-List.
You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein.
Failure to use the AeroElectric-List in the manner described below may result
in the removal of the subscribers from the List.
AeroElectric-List Policy Statement
The purpose of the AeroElectric-List is to provide a forum of discussion for
things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals
are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver
high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie
among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals
requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of
the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established:
- Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit
posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long
lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc.
- THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be
relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it.
- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive
that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and
terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and
responses.
- Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address,
aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line
about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid
bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary
space in the archive.
- DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is
easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the
web page or FAQ first.
- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of
your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it
easy to find threads in the archive.
- When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your
response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the
reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that
quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive
can not be overstated!
- When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT
then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the
"reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your
response to the original poster. You might have to actively address
your response with the original poster's email address.
- DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something
to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I
agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent
to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large.
- When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to
comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly
contribute something valuable.
- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone
polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack
other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously
controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that
will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.
- Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly
subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by
List members promoting their respective products or items for sale
should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble
a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but
is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to
everyone, including those who provide products to the entire
community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the
operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists.
-------
[This is an automated posting.]
do not archive
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