---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 09/03/15: 12 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 06:35 AM - Re: Tesla Meter App and Magnetism (racerjerry) 2. 07:06 AM - Re: Re: Tesla Meter App and Magnetism (RGent1224@aol.com) 3. 07:54 AM - Electric engine noise problem (Les Goldner) 4. 08:12 AM - Re: Re: Request for some direction and advise (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 5. 08:14 AM - Re: Electric engine noise problem (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 6. 09:55 AM - Degaussing tools (Janet Amtmann) 7. 09:55 AM - Re: Re: Request for some direction and advice (Bill Bradburry) 8. 11:41 AM - Re: Re: Request for some direction and advise (David Lloyd) 9. 12:31 PM - Re: Degaussing tools (DeWitt Whittington) 10. 01:58 PM - OT: Portable LORAN reciever (rayj) 11. 03:29 PM - =?utf-8?Q?_OT:_Portable_LORAN_reciever? () 12. 08:11 PM - Re: OT: Portable LORAN reciever (rayj) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 06:35:39 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Tesla Meter App and Magnetism From: "racerjerry" Electric welding on steel often leaves residual magnetism problems. Yes, the solution is an AC powered degaussing coil. Yes, remove your instruments and radios beforehand. Or forget the whole thing and move your compass to a location where it is less affected. Google how to make a degaussing coil. Careful, most coils get HOT rather quickly. Besides burning your fingers, the coils can melt their wire insulation, burn and cause a short circuit. Most degaussing coils will self-destruct if left powered on too long. Power your coil from a GFCI protected circuit - or mount a household GFCI in an outlet box with a line cord (your own GFCI protected extension cord). SLOWLY move the degaussing coil in a circular motion all around the affected area. While the coil is still energized, slowly move the coil away from the steel. You MUST SLOWLY move the energized coil AWAY from the affected area. Remember that the degaussing coil IS an electromagnet (without a core) and you can magnetize (make it worse or change magnetic polarity) just as easily as demagnetize. .. Test for excessive magnetic attraction using a handheld compass. Repeat degaussing steps as necessary. -------- Jerry King Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=446724#446724 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 07:06:23 AM PST US From: RGent1224@aol.com Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Tesla Meter App and Magnetism In the olden days we used to take a piece of wire that just fit in place of the heating element and the length we needed to do the job for that purpose. Worked good Dick In a message dated 9/3/2015 8:55:08 A.M. Central Daylight Time, fransew@gmail.com writes: --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "user9253" I have not actually tried this but a knowledgeable person told me that a soldering gun (NOT iron) can be used to demagnetize steel. The object to be demagnetized is passed through the soldering gun heating element loop while the gun trigger is pulled. Of course an airframe is too big, but maybe the soldering gun heating element can be removed from the gun, then placed around the steel tube, then connected back onto the soldering gun. Then the soldering gun trigger is pulled while moving the gun back and forth along the steel tube. If that is not feasible, then maybe someone else knows how to make a demagnetizer using the same principle. Here is a youtube movie about making a demagnetizer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8kKTJQTyX-w Joe -------- Joe Gores Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=446707#446707 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 07:54:58 AM PST US From: "Les Goldner" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Electric engine noise problem Bob, I built a small electric motor glider that has a 30+KW DC motor. The motor controller sends electric pulses to the motor at various frequencies to control the motor. The batteries put out about 100 volts and at times 250-amps are going through the controller to the motor. The batteries and controller are not grounded to the frame to prevent potential catastrophic shorts since the lithium pack would put out thousands of amps if shorted. My problem is that these pulses cause extreme radio noise on my hand-held ICOM radio and I cannot hear any communications. Is there an easy fix for this issue? Regards, Les ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:12:39 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: RE: Request for some direction and advise At 11:27 PM 9/2/2015, you wrote: Bob, Success! I thank you for sending me in the proper direction to find this problem. I would never have figured out that it was RF loose in the cockpit. While I was checking for where I could possibly have a loose connection this afternoon, I removed the radio from the tray and measured both the length of the radio and the distance it had to reach to the connectors in the back plate. Whoops! Looks like the radio needs to be seated deeper into the tray! Stupid builder tricks! When I installed the radio, I installed a bezel around them and to make it look nicer, I put the bezel under the faceplate on the radio. The radio passed the test Garmin has for that, (three turns of the screw after the radio powers on) but apparently over time it got looser and looser and started having more and more symptoms. I modified the bezel this afternoon so the radio would properly seat and the problem appears to have resolved. I was getting a huge RF leak from the back of the radio prior to it getting into the coax. I am completing my conditional inspection so it will be a few days before I can fly and see just what symptoms I have fixed. Sounds like the project is moving forward again. Great! Let us know what you discover. As I recall, we still have a receiving noise issue that MIGHT be related to the antenna connector . . . but probably not. We can tackle that one after you've had more time to assess the state of your universe. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 08:14:31 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Electric engine noise problem At 09:54 AM 9/3/2015, you wrote: >Bob, >I built a small electric motor glider that has a 30+KW DC motor. The >motor controller sends electric pulses to the motor at various >frequencies to control the motor. The batteries put out about 100 >volts and at times 250-amps are going through the controller to the >motor. The batteries and controller are not grounded to the frame to >prevent potential catastrophic shorts since the lithium pack would >put out thousands of amps if shorted. >My problem is that these pulses cause extreme radio noise on my >hand-held ICOM radio and I cannot hear any communications. Is there >an easy fix for this issue? >Regards, >Les Probably not. Your project is perhaps the most profound demonstration for why we do a LOT of testing to agreed-upon limits before putting hardware in the airplane. Pulse width modulated controllers from heated seats to blowers to flap systems have offered some challenging situations to designers . . . mostly having to do with RF tight packaging backed up with good filters at the enclosure wall. The last 150+ amps flap controller I had any contact with had about a killobux worth of rather expensive capacitors in a filter array on an etched circuit board. Lacking details on your particular suite of hardware, I'm unable to be more specific. Perhaps pictures, schematics and data on your purchased hardware will lend more insight for offering advice. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 09:55:05 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Degaussing tools From: Janet Amtmann As a watch repairer many years ago I bought a degausser to demagnetize watch tweezers. Nothing like a hairspring hanging on to the tweezers and not letting go. It is (I still have it) a coil of wire around a 3" dia. plastic tube with a zip cord and 115VAC plug on the end and a momentary push button switch. Put the tool into the coil, push the button and slowly withdraw the tool. Voila, no more captive hairsprings. If you release the button with the tool in the coil, depending on the part of the cycle that you released the switch, you may have made a real magnet out of your miniature screw driver. That's the reason for withdrawing the tool slowly, then releasing the switch. Jurgen Amtmann (RV-6A) ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 09:55:59 AM PST US From: "Bill Bradburry" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: RE: Request for some direction and advice Ok, I will report after I know more of what I have fixed..I am wildly optimistic at this point! I did check the coax connector at the antenna and it seemed solid. I really have no way to check the potted box at the antenna, but I do have a spare antenna just like it that I could try if necessary. I also have a piece of RG-400 about 10 ft long with connectors on both ends that I can try with both antennas. Bill _____ From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert L. Nuckolls, III Sent: Thursday, September 03, 2015 10:06 AM Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: RE: Request for some direction and advise At 11:27 PM 9/2/2015, you wrote: Sounds like the project is moving forward again. Great! Let us know what you discover. As I recall, we still have a receiving noise issue that MIGHT be related to the antenna connector . . . but probably not. We can tackle that one after you've had more time to assess the state of your universe. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 11:41:38 AM PST US From: "David Lloyd" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: RE: Request for some direction and advise Some Garmin 430 users (maybe others) have had problems with their comm side suddenly go on the fritz. If the the chassis "tray" is not mounted with its forward lip aligned with the panel front edge or, better, a tad forward of the panel front face, it can loose connections in the rear connection sockets. Many times these chassis are mounted without this fact in mind and are bolted in slightly to the rear. The 430 bezel stops the unit from being pushed fully into this ill mounted chassis. It is also important to use your thumbs to mount the 430 into the chassis and using the chassis locking screw to only complete what your thumbs do to get the 430 fully engaged in the rear connections. Don't force the 430 in using only the chassis locking screw adjuster. D ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Bill Bradburry To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2015 9:27 PM Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: RE: Request for some direction and advise Bob, Success! I thank you for sending me in the proper direction to find this problem. I would never have figured out that it was RF loose in the cockpit. While I was checking for where I could possibly have a loose connection this afternoon, I removed the radio from the tray and measured both the length of the radio and the distance it had to reach to the connectors in the back plate. Whoops! Looks like the radio needs to be seated deeper into the tray! Stupid builder tricks! When I installed the radio, I installed a bezel around them and to make it look nicer, I put the bezel under the faceplate on the radio. The radio passed the test Garmin has for that, (three turns of the screw after the radio powers on) but apparently over time it got looser and looser and started having more and more symptoms. I modified the bezel this afternoon so the radio would properly seat and the problem appears to have resolved. I was getting a huge RF leak from the back of the radio prior to it getting into the coax. I am completing my conditional inspection so it will be a few days before I can fly and see just what symptoms I have fixed. Thanks, Bob! Bill ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert L. Nuckolls, III Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2015 12:53 PM To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: RE: Request for some direction and advise One other thing that I just thought of that may be a factor. The backing plate through connectors that the radio slides into when it is inserted into the tray are very wobbly. It is very easy to make a circle with them that is at least 1/8 inch in radius. I have never thought about these connectors before because I thought that they were wobbly in order to line up with the radio when in is inserted. But now thinking about it, it seems to me that they should firm up when the radio is inserted because they are making rigid contact with the radio?? Mine are still wobbly after the radio is inserted. Could these connectors or the backing plate be somehow incorrectly installed? Tray connectors often 'float' on the tray itself so as to accommodate dimenational differences between tray and radio as the radio is slid into the tray. Similarly, your antenna connectors a the back of the radio may appear 'loose' in spite of having perfect electrical integrity. http://tinyurl.com/qa5hr7l In the image sited above, we see where electrical integrity is achieved as a separate component of mechanical mounting. A BNC connector attached to an appliance. http://tinyurl.com/pmy4hsg In the video above, we see that a connector is "loose" to move in some regard while mantaining electrical integrity of the connection. Does anyone know if these connectors should be firm after the radio is installed? Could this be where I have a bad connection with the shield? The connections I am most concerned about are between the coax shield and it's terminating connector. What about the other shield grounds described below? Would they be a factor if that card edge connector does not make a firm connection? There is a boss just to the side of this card edge connector that I am considering using to run a separate ground wire from the backing plate to the =13forest of tabs=14 ground block. Are there any opinions on this idea? Your symptoms scream of antagonistic disruption of TWO different systems that suggest a problem with the level of RF in the cockpit due to an antenna system problem . . . not with the radio's power/signal wires. Bob . . . http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-Listhttp://forums.matroni cs.comhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 12:31:18 PM PST US From: DeWitt Whittington Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Degaussing tools I have a similar tool, but mine is a rather large coil with a handle. It plugs into 120v AC, also has a button to energize it and was designed to erase magnetic tape for a tape recorder. Worked really well. Guess it would work on magnetized steel tubing too? Dee DeWitt (Dee) Whittington Richmond, VA 804-677-4849 iPhone 804-358-4333 Home On Thu, Sep 3, 2015 at 12:51 PM, Janet Amtmann wrote: > As a watch repairer many years ago I bought a degausser to demagnetize > watch tweezers. Nothing like a hairspring hanging on to the tweezers and > not letting go. It is (I still have it) a coil of wire around a 3" dia. > plastic tube with a zip cord and 115VAC plug on the end and a momentary > push button switch. Put the tool into the coil, push the button and slowly > withdraw the tool. Voila, no more captive hairsprings. If you release the > button with the tool in the coil, depending on the part of the cycle that > you released the switch, you may have made a real magnet out of your > miniature screw driver. That's the reason for withdrawing the tool slowly, > then releasing the switch. > > Jurgen Amtmann (RV-6A) > > * > > > * > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 01:58:12 PM PST US From: rayj Subject: AeroElectric-List: OT: Portable LORAN reciever Greetings, I've got a virtually unused Ray Jeff portable LORAN unit (lucky me) and I'm wondering if anyone knows of any use for it, given that there are no longer any LORAN signals. I figure in any group of people might know, it's this one. do not archive -- Raymond Julian Kettle River, MN The things we admire in men, kindness and generosity, openness, honesty, understanding and feeling are the concomitants of failure in our system. And those traits we detest, sharpness, greed, acquisitiveness, meanness, egotism and self-interest are the traits of success. And while men admire the quality of the first they love the produce of the second. -John Steinbeck, novelist, Nobel laureate (1902-1968) ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 03:29:18 PM PST US From: Subject: =?utf-8?Q?AeroElectric-List:_OT:_Portable_LORAN_reciever? DQoNCkkndmUgZ290IGEgdmlydHVhbGx5IHVudXNlZCBSYXkgSmVmZiBwb3J0YWJsZSBMT1JBTiB1 bml0IChsdWNreSBtZSkgYW5kIA0KSSdtIHdvbmRlcmluZyBpZiBhbnlvbmUga25vd3Mgb2YgYW55 IHVzZSBmb3IgaXQsIGdpdmVuIHRoYXQgdGhlcmUgYXJlIG5vIA0KbG9uZ2VyIGFueSBMT1JBTiBz aWduYWxzLg0KDQpJIGZpZ3VyZSBpbiBhbnkgZ3JvdXAgb2YgcGVvcGxlIG1pZ2h0IGtub3csIGl0 J3MgdGhpcyBvbmUuDQoNCmRvIG5vdCBhcmNoaXZlDQoNCg0KDQpJZiB5b3UgaGF2ZSBhbiBvZmZp Y2Ugd2l0aCBhIGxvdCBvZiBsb29zZSBwYXBlciBhbmQgYW4gb3BlbiB3aW5kb3csIGl0IGNvdWxk IGJlIHVzZWQgdG8ga2VlcCB0aGUgcGFwZXJzIGluIHBsYWNlISEgICAgIOKYuiAgICAg4pi6DQoN Cg0KUm9nZXI ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 08:11:29 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: OT: Portable LORAN reciever From: rayj Considered that, since it's not heavy enough to hold a boat. Raymond Julian Kettle River, MN The things we admire in men, kindness and generosity, openness, honesty, understanding and feeling are the concomitants of failure in our system. And those traits we detest, sharpness, greed, acquisitiveness, meanness, egotism and self-interest are the traits of success. And while men admire the quality of the first they love the produce of the second. -John Steinbeck, novelist, Nobel laureate (1902-1968) On 09/03/2015 05:24 PM, rnjcurtis@charter.net wrote: > > > I've got a virtually unused Ray Jeff portable LORAN unit (lucky me) and > I'm wondering if anyone knows of any use for it, given that there are no > longer any LORAN signals. > > I figure in any group of people might know, it's this one. > > do not archive > > If you have an office with a lot of loose paper and an open window, > it could be used to keep the papers in place!! > > Roger > > ~,gM4Gqz.'8W.+-fZ+`axr^jzZ(j|n)b'!j'+ry'C > { > ,x(ZP!jrrj|-&j',r5h I^rpm 'ojj+W.+-08IaT1 > jgrz{Zi^&lZ+ky+k&j',r+k&j',rhB{ky.+jY^.+-i0fr((nbxm-&j',rr&*''k{w/tml > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message aeroelectric-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/aeroelectric-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/aeroelectric-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.