---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 04/30/16: 10 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:11 AM - carling s700 (Michael Lazarowicz) 2. 06:55 AM - Re: carling s700 (user9253) 3. 09:09 AM - Re: Intermittent Alternator Noise (Neal George) 4. 12:15 PM - Re: Intermittent Alternator Noise (John Tipton) 5. 12:20 PM - Re: carling s700 (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 6. 12:43 PM - Re: Intermittent Alternator Noise (Lyle Peterson) 7. 12:52 PM - Re: carling s700 (another question) (John Tipton) 8. 01:26 PM - Re: carling s700 (another question) (user9253) 9. 01:59 PM - Re: carling s700 (another question) (Bob McCallum) 10. 02:08 PM - Re: Intermittent Alternator Noise (Kent or Jackie Ashton) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:11:39 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: carling s700 From: Michael Lazarowicz For some reason I am really getting confused about the. Batt/master switch and how it is wired. I am using a clarling toggle, S2077 I believe. It has three positions. I think this switch is a On/On/On type. You want one position for everything off. One for Battery only and one for Battery and Alternator. When I look at the diagram of the switch for page Z-11 it appears that one position connects the Battery only, one connects the battery and the Alt. and one is off. It appears that the one position connects with Term 3 and six which are used as the off position. Am I even close on this ? Mike ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:55:28 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: carling s700 From: "user9253" Mike, Your analysis seems correct to me. I could not find part number S2077. B&C part number is S700-2-10. Since no wires are connected to terminals 3 and 6, that position (down) must be off. Terminal 1 is connected with the switch either centered or fully up. Terminal 4 is connected only with the switch fully up. -------- Joe Gores Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=455675#455675 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 09:09:55 AM PST US From: Neal George Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Intermittent Alternator Noise Now that's funny... Neal George Sent from my iPhone > On Apr 30, 2016, at 2:11 AM, Hal Benjamin wrote: > > > Fluke is a good meter....Sorta like a Simpson meter was before Bart came along! > > Sent from my iPad > >> On Apr 29, 2016, at 6:43 PM, Lyle Peterson wrote: >> >> >> It is a meter that measures the number of flukes in a given period of time. >> >> >>> On 4/29/2016 3:10 PM, Rene wrote: >>> >>> It is what you call a bad multi-meter when you are in mixed company. :) >>> >>> Do not archive. >>> >>> Rene' >>> 801-721-6080 >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com >>> [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lyle >>> Peterson >>> Sent: Friday, April 29, 2016 1:25 PM >>> To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com >>> Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Intermittent Alternator Noise >>> >>> --> >>> >>> Fluke is a brand of a series of multi-meters usually considered to be of >>> high quality. >>> >>> >>>> On 4/29/2016 2:07 PM, John Tipton wrote: >>> >>>> What's a 'fluke meter' >>>> >>>> John >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> ----x--O--x---- >>>> >>>>> On 29 Apr 2016, at 07:18 pm, Justin Jones >>> wrote: >>> >>>>> Need help troubleshooting an intermittent noise. >>>>> >>>>> My aircraft is wired per Bob's 13-8 diagram. When the primary alternator >>> (60A Lycoming alternator) is running, all is well. Everything works, the >>> EFII programmer reads 14.3-14.5 volts and the Dynon EMS-D180 reads 13.8. >>>>> When I turn off the main alternator and test the B&C-410H there is an >>> intermittent noise (wine and static in the intercom). Associated with the >>> noise is a low voltage indication on the Dynon (11.5 volts) but the EFII >>> programmer still reads 14.3-14.5 volts. After a few minutes, the noise goes >>> away and the voltage comes up to 13.8 on the Dynon. The situation will >>> continue to cycle with no predictable pattern. Every time I get the noise, >>> the Dynon display voltage drops and every time the noise goes away the Dynon >>> display voltage rises. >>>>> After performing an hour long test flight on the B&C alternator and >>> watching this cycle, I shut the aircraft down and a fluke meter showed 12.9 >>> volts on the battery. >>>>> The regulators are both solid state VR166 as Bob suggests in the >>> Aeroelectric Connection. >>>>> Thoughts or suggestions? >>>>> >>>>> Thanks! >>>>> >>>>> Justin > > > > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 12:15:48 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Intermittent Alternator Noise From: John Tipton What's a 'Simpson meter' John Sent from my iPad ----x--O--x---- > On 30 Apr 2016, at 05:08 pm, Neal George wrote: > > > Now that's funny... > > Neal George > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Apr 30, 2016, at 2:11 AM, Hal Benjamin wrote: >> >> >> Fluke is a good meter....Sorta like a Simpson meter was before Bart came along! >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >>> On Apr 29, 2016, at 6:43 PM, Lyle Peterson wrote: >>> >>> >>> It is a meter that measures the number of flukes in a given period of time. >>> >>> >>>> On 4/29/2016 3:10 PM, Rene wrote: >>>> >>>> It is what you call a bad multi-meter when you are in mixed company. :) >>>> >>>> Do not archive. >>>> >>>> Rene' >>>> 801-721-6080 >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com >>>> [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lyle >>>> Peterson >>>> Sent: Friday, April 29, 2016 1:25 PM >>>> To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com >>>> Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Intermittent Alternator Noise >>>> >>>> --> >>>> >>>> Fluke is a brand of a series of multi-meters usually considered to be of >>>> high quality. >>>> >>>> >>>>> On 4/29/2016 2:07 PM, John Tipton wrote: >>>> >>>>> What's a 'fluke meter' >>>>> >>>>> John >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> ----x--O--x---- >>>>> >>>>>> On 29 Apr 2016, at 07:18 pm, Justin Jones >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>>> Need help troubleshooting an intermittent noise. >>>>>> >>>>>> My aircraft is wired per Bob's 13-8 diagram. When the primary alternator >>>> (60A Lycoming alternator) is running, all is well. Everything works, the >>>> EFII programmer reads 14.3-14.5 volts and the Dynon EMS-D180 reads 13.8. >>>>>> When I turn off the main alternator and test the B&C-410H there is an >>>> intermittent noise (wine and static in the intercom). Associated with the >>>> noise is a low voltage indication on the Dynon (11.5 volts) but the EFII >>>> programmer still reads 14.3-14.5 volts. After a few minutes, the noise goes >>>> away and the voltage comes up to 13.8 on the Dynon. The situation will >>>> continue to cycle with no predictable pattern. Every time I get the noise, >>>> the Dynon display voltage drops and every time the noise goes away the Dynon >>>> display voltage rises. >>>>>> After performing an hour long test flight on the B&C alternator and >>>> watching this cycle, I shut the aircraft down and a fluke meter showed 12.9 >>>> volts on the battery. >>>>>> The regulators are both solid state VR166 as Bob suggests in the >>>> Aeroelectric Connection. >>>>>> Thoughts or suggestions? >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks! >>>>>> >>>>>> Justin > > > > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 12:20:36 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: carling s700 At 07:09 AM 4/30/2016, you wrote: >For some reason I am really getting confused >about the.=C2 Batt/master switch and how it is >wired.=C2 I am using a clarling toggle,=C2 S2077 I >believe. It has three positions.=C2 I think this >switch is a On/On/On type.=C2 You want one >position for everything off.=C2 One for Battery >only and one for Battery and Alternator.=C2 When >I look at the diagram of the switch for page >Z-11 it appears that one position connects the >Battery only, one connects the battery and the >Alt. and one is off. It appears that the one >position connects with Term 3 and six which are used as the off position. > >Am I even close on this ? Z13/8 doesn't show a progressive transfer battery master. It shows a simple DC master ON/OFF wherein the alternator can be disabled by pulling the field breaker. The switch called out is the simple DPDT/ON-ON S700-2-3 device (B&C part number) Emacs! Figure Z-11 shows the progressive transfer S700-2-10 switch that emulated the split rocker switch popularized on many single engine aircraft over the years. Emacs! Examination of the schematic symbol illustrates internal functionality of the DP3T/ON-ON-ON device. EITHER style of switch can be used . . . ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 12:43:20 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Intermittent Alternator Noise From: Lyle Peterson Another brand of meter. The one I have is an analog meter. It is about 3" x 6" x 8" and used those old fashioned carbon zinc batteries. Alkaline replacements work. They were also considered good meters in their time. I don't know if Simpson still makes any measuring equipment. It won't count the number of the Simpson's appearances on TV because I change the channel before they get to the introductions. On 4/30/2016 2:13 PM, John Tipton wrote: > > What's a 'Simpson meter' > > John > > > Sent from my iPad > > ----x--O--x---- > >> On 30 Apr 2016, at 05:08 pm, Neal George wrote: >> >> >> Now that's funny... >> >> Neal George >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>> On Apr 30, 2016, at 2:11 AM, Hal Benjamin wrote: >>> >>> >>> Fluke is a good meter....Sorta like a Simpson meter was before Bart came along! >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>>> On Apr 29, 2016, at 6:43 PM, Lyle Peterson wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> It is a meter that measures the number of flukes in a given period of time. >>>> >>>> >>>>> On 4/29/2016 3:10 PM, Rene wrote: >>>>> >>>>> It is what you call a bad multi-meter when you are in mixed company. :) >>>>> >>>>> Do not archive. >>>>> >>>>> Rene' >>>>> 801-721-6080 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com >>>>> [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lyle >>>>> Peterson >>>>> Sent: Friday, April 29, 2016 1:25 PM >>>>> To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com >>>>> Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Intermittent Alternator Noise >>>>> >>>>> --> >>>>> >>>>> Fluke is a brand of a series of multi-meters usually considered to be of >>>>> high quality. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> On 4/29/2016 2:07 PM, John Tipton wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> What's a 'fluke meter' >>>>>> >>>>>> John >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> >>>>>> ----x--O--x---- >>>>>> >>>>>>> On 29 Apr 2016, at 07:18 pm, Justin Jones >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>> Need help troubleshooting an intermittent noise. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> My aircraft is wired per Bob's 13-8 diagram. When the primary alternator >>>>> (60A Lycoming alternator) is running, all is well. Everything works, the >>>>> EFII programmer reads 14.3-14.5 volts and the Dynon EMS-D180 reads 13.8. >>>>>>> When I turn off the main alternator and test the B&C-410H there is an >>>>> intermittent noise (wine and static in the intercom). Associated with the >>>>> noise is a low voltage indication on the Dynon (11.5 volts) but the EFII >>>>> programmer still reads 14.3-14.5 volts. After a few minutes, the noise goes >>>>> away and the voltage comes up to 13.8 on the Dynon. The situation will >>>>> continue to cycle with no predictable pattern. Every time I get the noise, >>>>> the Dynon display voltage drops and every time the noise goes away the Dynon >>>>> display voltage rises. >>>>>>> After performing an hour long test flight on the B&C alternator and >>>>> watching this cycle, I shut the aircraft down and a fluke meter showed 12.9 >>>>> volts on the battery. >>>>>>> The regulators are both solid state VR166 as Bob suggests in the >>>>> Aeroelectric Connection. >>>>>>> Thoughts or suggestions? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Thanks! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Justin >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 12:52:30 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: carling s700 (another question) From: John Tipton Sorry to hijack the thread --- But while were are talking switches: I thought I could sort any 2-10 wiring o ut: but I have a problem, is it possible to wire this 'wig-wag' device http://www.periheliondesign.com/wigwagmnl.htm to give me, with a three position switch: Off - on (both) - wig-wag with a 2-10 or any switch for that matter Regards John Sent from my iPad ----x--O--x---- > On 30 Apr 2016, at 08:18 pm, "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" wrote: > > At 07:09 AM 4/30/2016, you wrote: >> For some reason I am really getting confused about the.=C3=82 Batt/maste r switch and how it is wired.=C3=82 I am using a clarling toggle,=C3=82 S2 077 I believe. It has three positions.=C3=82 I think this switch is a On/On /On type.=C3=82 You want one position for everything off.=C3=82 One for Ba ttery only and one for Battery and Alternator.=C3=82 When I look at the dia gram of the switch for page Z-11 it appears that one position connects the B attery only, one connects the battery and the Alt. and one is off. It appear s that the one position connects with Term 3 and six which are used as the o ff position. >> >> Am I even close on this ? > > Z13/8 doesn't show a progressive transfer battery > master. It shows a simple DC master ON/OFF wherein > the alternator can be disabled by pulling the field > breaker. The switch called out is the simple > DPDT/ON-ON S700-2-3 device (B&C part number) > > <8b672cc.jpg> > > > Figure Z-11 shows the progressive transfer > S700-2-10 switch that emulated the split rocker > switch popularized on many single engine aircraft > over the years. > <8b67339.jpg> > > Examination of the schematic symbol illustrates > internal functionality of the DP3T/ON-ON-ON > device. > > EITHER style of switch can be used . . . ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 01:26:13 PM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: carling s700 (another question) From: "user9253" It seems that you want to wire the wig wag as shown in Eric's diagram "B". You can use a DP3T ON-ON-ON switch as shown in the diagram. Down position will be off. Mouser part number 633-M204401. Do NOT use the 2-10 progressive transfer switch. Or you can use a 3 position ON-OFF-ON DPDT switch with center off. Make sure there are no parentheses in the ON-OFF-ON description because parentheses indicate a momentary switch position. -------- Joe Gores Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=455691#455691 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 01:59:48 PM PST US From: "Bob McCallum" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: carling s700 (another question) Diagram =93B=94 on the page you linked gives the operation you=92ve described. Bob McC _____ From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Tipton Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2016 3:51 PM Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: carling s700 (another question) Sorry to hijack the thread --- But while were are talking switches: I thought I could sort any 2-10 wiring out: but I have a problem, is it possible to wire this 'wig-wag' device http://www.periheliondesign.com/wigwagmnl.htm to give me, with a three position switch: Off - on (both) - wig-wag with a 2-10 or any switch for that matter Regards John Sent from my iPad ----x--O--x---- On 30 Apr 2016, at 08:18 pm, "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" wrote: At 07:09 AM 4/30/2016, you wrote: For some reason I am really getting confused about the.=C2 Batt/master switch and how it is wired.=C2 I am using a clarling toggle,=C2 S2077 I believe. It has three positions.=C2 I think this switch is a On/On/On type.=C2 You want one position for everything off.=C2 One for Battery only and one for Battery and Alternator.=C2 When I look at the diagram of the switch for page Z-11 it appears that one position connects the Battery only, one connects the battery and the Alt. and one is off. It appears that the one position connects with Term 3 and six which are used as the off position. Am I even close on this ? Z13/8 doesn't show a progressive transfer battery master. It shows a simple DC master ON/OFF wherein the alternator can be disabled by pulling the field breaker. The switch called out is the simple DPDT/ON-ON S700-2-3 device (B&C part number) <8b672cc.jpg> Figure Z-11 shows the progressive transfer S700-2-10 switch that emulated the split rocker switch popularized on many single engine aircraft over the years. <8b67339.jpg> Examination of the schematic symbol illustrates internal functionality of the DP3T/ON-ON-ON device. EITHER style of switch can be used . . . ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 02:08:53 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Intermittent Alternator Noise From: Kent or Jackie Ashton Ha! http://www.simpsonelectric.com > On Apr 30, 2016, at 3:13 PM, John Tipton wrote: > > > What's a 'Simpson meter? >>> >>> Fluke is a good meter....Sorta like a Simpson meter was before Bart came along! ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message aeroelectric-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/aeroelectric-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/aeroelectric-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.