Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:52 AM - Warm Extension Cord (Art Zemon)
2. 03:43 AM - Re: Warm Extension Cord (racerjerry)
3. 04:21 AM - Re: Warm Extension Cord (bob noffs)
4. 06:06 AM - Re: Warm Extension Cord (Rene)
5. 07:11 AM - Re: Warm Extension Cord (Art Zemon)
6. 08:01 AM - Re: Warm Extension Cord (Neal George)
7. 08:28 AM - Re: Warm Extension Cord (Rene)
8. 08:40 AM - Re: Warm Extension Cord (ARGOLDMAN@aol.com)
9. 08:47 AM - Re: Warm Extension Cord (Robert Reed)
10. 09:19 AM - Re: Warm Extension Cord (Eric Page)
11. 09:25 AM - Re: Warm Extension Cord (John Cox)
12. 10:05 AM - Re: Warm Extension Cord (Lyle Peterson)
13. 10:54 AM - Re: Warm Extension Cord (Charlie England)
14. 11:49 AM - Re: Re: finding the correct crimper (Ken Ryan)
15. 12:41 PM - Re: Warm Extension Cord (Ed Gilroy)
16. 02:19 PM - Re: Warm Extension Cord (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
17. 03:28 PM - Off list contact (Richard Girard)
18. 04:49 PM - Re: Off list contact (Bill)
19. 08:51 PM - Re: Warm Extension Cord (Neal George)
Message 1
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Subject: | Warm Extension Cord |
Folks,
This isn't aero but it is electric so I figure someone here will have an
opinion. When I am away from home, I use an extension cord to charge my
electric car. Tonight, I noticed that the wire (not the connectors) was
warm to the touch when I unplugged the car. The warmth surprised me. Here
are the specs:
- 120V AC
- charger draws 12A
- 16 AWG conductors in the extension cord
- cord is 25 feet long
- cord was advertised as suitable for up to 13A
I'm inclined to replace the cord with one with 14 AWG conductors. Yes?
Thanks,
-- Art Z.
--
http://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ <http://cheerfulcurmudgeon.com/>
*"If I am not for myself, who is for me? And if I am only for myself, what
am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel*
Message 2
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Subject: | Re: Warm Extension Cord |
YES, replace with #14 or heavier. With any heating effects like this, make sure
that you do NOT COIL up any loose ends of the extension cord, or the heat will
be concentrated, causing the cord to melt and short out.
--------
Jerry King
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=456177#456177
Message 3
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Subject: | Re: Warm Extension Cord |
that is at the max for the cord but not over the rating.a few years ago i
made up some extension cords for 1500 watt heaters and used 12 ga. plenty
of margin there. i guess i would feel better with 12ga. sounds like a one
and done purchase.
funny the connectors aren't warm.
bob noffs
On Fri, May 13, 2016 at 3:49 AM, Art Zemon <art@zemon.name> wrote:
> Folks,
>
> This isn't aero but it is electric so I figure someone here will have an
> opinion. When I am away from home, I use an extension cord to charge my
> electric car. Tonight, I noticed that the wire (not the connectors) was
> warm to the touch when I unplugged the car. The warmth surprised me. Here
> are the specs:
>
> - 120V AC
> - charger draws 12A
> - 16 AWG conductors in the extension cord
> - cord is 25 feet long
> - cord was advertised as suitable for up to 13A
>
> I'm inclined to replace the cord with one with 14 AWG conductors. Yes?
>
> Thanks,
> -- Art Z.
>
> --
> http://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ <http://cheerfulcurmudgeon.com/>
>
> *"If I am not for myself, who is for me? And if I am only for myself, what
> am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel*
>
Message 4
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Subject: | Warm Extension Cord |
Was the wire coiled?
Rene'
801-721-6080
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Art
Zemon
Sent: Friday, May 13, 2016 2:50 AM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Warm Extension Cord
Folks,
This isn't aero but it is electric so I figure someone here will have an
opinion. When I am away from home, I use an extension cord to charge my
electric car. Tonight, I noticed that the wire (not the connectors) was
warm to the touch when I unplugged the car. The warmth surprised me.
Here are the specs:
* 120V AC
* charger draws 12A
* 16 AWG conductors in the extension cord
* cord is 25 feet long
* cord was advertised as suitable for up to 13A
I'm inclined to replace the cord with one with 14 AWG conductors. Yes?
Thanks,
-- Art Z.
--
<http://cheerfulcurmudgeon.com/> http://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/
"If I am not for myself, who is for me? And if I am only for myself,
what am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel
Message 5
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Subject: | Warm Extension Cord |
No
-- Art Z.
Sent from my phone so please excuse typos and brevity.
On May 13, 2016 8:30 AM, "Rene" <rene@felker.com> wrote:
> Was the wire coiled?
>
>
> Rene'
>
> 801-721-6080
>
>
> *From:* owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
> owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Art Zemon
> *Sent:* Friday, May 13, 2016 2:50 AM
> *To:* aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* AeroElectric-List: Warm Extension Cord
>
>
> Folks,
>
>
> This isn't aero but it is electric so I figure someone here will have an
> opinion. When I am away from home, I use an extension cord to charge my
> electric car. Tonight, I noticed that the wire (not the connectors) was
> warm to the touch when I unplugged the car. The warmth surprised me. Here
> are the specs:
>
> - 120V AC
> - charger draws 12A
> - 16 AWG conductors in the extension cord
> - cord is 25 feet long
> - cord was advertised as suitable for up to 13A
>
> I'm inclined to replace the cord with one with 14 AWG conductors. Yes?
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> -- Art Z.
>
>
> --
>
> http://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ <http://cheerfulcurmudgeon.com/>
>
> *"If I am not for myself, who is for me? And if I am only for myself, what
> am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel*
>
Message 6
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Subject: | Warm Extension Cord |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ICogICBjb3JkIGlzIDI1IGZlZXQgbG9uZw0KICAqICAgY29yZCB3YXMgYWR2ZXJ0aXNlZCBhcyBz
dWl0YWJsZSBmb3IgdXAgdG8gMTNBDQpJJ20gaW5jbGluZWQgdG8gcmVwbGFjZSB0aGUgY29yZCB3
aXRoIG9uZSB3aXRoIDE0IEFXRyBjb25kdWN0b3JzLiBZZXM/DQpUaGFua3MsDQogICAgLS0gQXJ0
IFouDQo
Message 7
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Subject: | Warm Extension Cord |
First hand experiencethe heat build up can go out of
control. Melted both the cable and a plastic spool it was on. Was on a
camper and the wire did not feel =9Cwarm=9D normally but
left it on the spool because it was a short
distance.spool and wire became one. Needed new spool
and wire..
Rene'
801-721-6080
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Neal
George
Sent: Friday, May 13, 2016 8:55 AM
Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Warm Extension Cord
Even if the extension cord was coiled, paired conductors would
effectively cancel the coil effect
neal
No
-- Art Z.
Sent from my phone so please excuse typos and brevity.
On May 13, 2016 8:30 AM, "Rene" <rene@felker.com> wrote:
Was the wire coiled?
Rene'
801-721-6080
Folks,
This isn't aero but it is electric so I figure someone here will have an
opinion. When I am away from home, I use an extension cord to charge my
electric car. Tonight, I noticed that the wire (not the connectors) was
warm to the touch when I unplugged the car. The warmth surprised me.
Here are the specs:
* 120V AC
* charger draws 12A
* 16 AWG conductors in the extension cord
* cord is 25 feet long
* cord was advertised as suitable for up to 13A
I'm inclined to replace the cord with one with 14 AWG conductors. Yes?
Thanks,
-- Art Z.
Message 8
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Subject: | Re: Warm Extension Cord |
Greetings Art et al.
Advertised as????. Don't know if I would buy that.
Every wire has a certain resistance per foot (inch-nanometer) look at your
aircraft tables. You seem to be overstressing the wire in that as electron
s
pass through any wire, the resistance to the flow not only creates voltag
e
drop, but that resisted energy is expressed as heat. ( energy is not lost
but is converted)
What you are experiencing is that heat, that you can feel, in this case.
the extension chord wire is of too small a gauge or is too long for your
application.
-- unless the heating is acceptable to the insulation.
I would get a better grade (gauge) of extension chord or shorten it as
much as possible (resistance, remember is per foot etc). Don't coil the ch
ord
as the heat buildup may not have the ability to go into the atmosphere wh
ere
it is harmless (that's where the heat of the engine goes... if it cant--
well.)
Rich
In a message dated 5/13/2016 8:29:27 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
rene@felker.com writes:
First hand experiencethe heat build up can go out of co
ntrol. Melted
both the cable and a plastic spool it was on. Was on a camper and the wi
re
did not feel =9Cwarm=9D normally but left it on the spool beca
use it was a
short distance.spool and wire became one. Needed new
spool and wire..
Rene'
801-721-6080
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Neal
George
Sent: Friday, May 13, 2016 8:55 AM
Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Warm Extension Cord
Even if the extension cord was coiled, paired conductors would effectivel
y
cancel the coil effect
neal
No
-- Art Z.
Sent from my phone so please excuse typos and brevity.
On May 13, 2016 8:30 AM, "Rene" <_rene@felker.com_ (mailto:rene@felker.com
)
> wrote:
Was the wire coiled?
Rene'
_801-721-6080_ (tel:801-721-6080)
Folks,
This isn't aero but it is electric so I figure someone here will have an
opinion. When I am away from home, I use an extension cord to charge my
electric car. Tonight, I noticed that the wire (not the connectors) was
warm to
the touch when I unplugged the car. The warmth surprised me. Here are the
specs:
* 120V AC
* charger draws 12A
* 16 AWG conductors in the extension cord
* cord is 25 feet long
* cord was advertised as suitable for up to 13A
I'm inclined to replace the cord with one with 14 AWG conductors. Yes?
Thanks,
-- Art Z.
Message 9
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Subject: | Re: Warm Extension Cord |
My common sense rule says that if the cord gets warm in the intended use the
n a second rule becomes primary which considers the ability to monitor durin
g use. If I can monitor during the entire time of usage then I can take acti
on if it gets too hot. If the usage can not be monitored then it's damn che
ap insurance and common sense to get a higher rated extension cord.
Bob Reed
Sent from my iPhone
> On May 13, 2016, at 10:26 AM, Rene <rene@felker.com> wrote:
>
> First hand experiencethe heat build up can go out of con
trol. Melted both the cable and a plastic spool it was on. Was on a camper
and the wire did not feel =9Cwarm=9D normally but left it on th
e spool because it was a short distance.spool and wire bec
ame one. Needed new spool and wire..
>
> Rene'
> 801-721-6080
>
> From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelect
ric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Neal George
> Sent: Friday, May 13, 2016 8:55 AM
> To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Warm Extension Cord
>
> Even if the extension cord was coiled, paired conductors would effectively
cancel the coil effect
>
> neal
>
> No
>
> -- Art Z.
>
> Sent from my phone so please excuse typos and brevity.
>
> On May 13, 2016 8:30 AM, "Rene" <rene@felker.com> wrote:
> Was the wire coiled?
> Rene'
> 801-721-6080
> Folks,
> This isn't aero but it is electric so I figure someone here will have an o
pinion. When I am away from home, I use an extension cord to charge my elect
ric car. Tonight, I noticed that the wire (not the connectors) was warm to t
he touch when I unplugged the car. The warmth surprised me. Here are the spe
cs:
> 120V AC
> charger draws 12A
> 16 AWG conductors in the extension cord
> cord is 25 feet long
> cord was advertised as suitable for up to 13A
> I'm inclined to replace the cord with one with 14 AWG conductors. Yes?
> Thanks,
> -- Art Z.
Message 10
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Subject: | Re: Warm Extension Cord |
> On May 13, 2016, at 7:55 AM, Neal George <ngeorge@continentalmotors.aero> w
rote:
> Even if the extension cord was coiled, paired conductors would effectively
cancel the coil effect
>
> neal
Avoiding a coil in an extension cord isn't intended to avoid electromagnetic
effects. The problem is that a coiled cord tends to concentrate heat much m
ore than a cord that's stretched out straight.
Eric
Message 11
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Subject: | Re: Warm Extension Cord |
Go for 12AWG stranded and mark the cost increase to common sense insurance.
John Cox
On May 13, 2016 01:58, "Art Zemon" <art@zemon.name> wrote:
> Folks,
>
> This isn't aero but it is electric so I figure someone here will have an
> opinion. When I am away from home, I use an extension cord to charge my
> electric car. Tonight, I noticed that the wire (not the connectors) was
> warm to the touch when I unplugged the car. The warmth surprised me. Here
> are the specs:
>
> - 120V AC
> - charger draws 12A
> - 16 AWG conductors in the extension cord
> - cord is 25 feet long
> - cord was advertised as suitable for up to 13A
>
> I'm inclined to replace the cord with one with 14 AWG conductors. Yes?
>
> Thanks,
> -- Art Z.
>
> --
> http://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ <http://cheerfulcurmudgeon.com/>
>
> *"If I am not for myself, who is for me? And if I am only for myself, what
> am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel*
>
Message 12
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|
Subject: | Re: Warm Extension Cord |
I had the same experience as Rene' with a retractable extension cord. I
was sure I had destroyed a brand new cord but fortunately the swollen
insulation contracted.
I was given a long extension cord recently because it was "twisted." On
inspection I determined that it has been over heating causing the
insulation to swell and get loose letting the three wires shift inside
the insulation, probably when the cord was wound around something for
transport to the next task.
I was shopping for an extension cord and checking each cord's capacity.
I was amazed when I noticed that all the cords claimed the same capacity
regardless of the wire gauge. Marketing must have designed the labels
and neither engineering nor risk management ever saw them.
On 5/13/2016 10:26 AM, Rene wrote:
>
> First hand experiencethe heat build up can go out of control. Melted
> both the cable and a plastic spool it was on. Was on a camper and the
> wire did not feel warm normally but left it on the spool because it
> was a short distance.spool and wire became one. Needed new spool
> and wire..
>
> Rene'
>
> 801-721-6080
>
> *From:*owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of
> *Neal George
> *Sent:* Friday, May 13, 2016 8:55 AM
> *To:* aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* RE: AeroElectric-List: Warm Extension Cord
>
> Even if the extension cord was coiled, paired conductors would
> effectively cancel the coil effect
>
> neal
>
> No
>
> -- Art Z.
>
> Sent from my phone so please excuse typos and brevity.
>
> On May 13, 2016 8:30 AM, "Rene" <rene@felker.com
> <mailto:rene@felker.com>> wrote:
>
> Was the wire coiled?
>
> Rene'
>
> 801-721-6080 <tel:801-721-6080>
>
> Folks,
>
> This isn't aero but it is electric so I figure someone here will have
> an opinion. When I am away from home, I use an extension cord to
> charge my electric car. Tonight, I noticed that the wire (not the
> connectors) was warm to the touch when I unplugged the car. The warmth
> surprised me. Here are the specs:
>
> * 120V AC
> * charger draws 12A
> * 16 AWG conductors in the extension cord
> * cord is 25 feet long
> * cord was advertised as suitable for up to 13A
>
> I'm inclined to replace the cord with one with 14 AWG conductors. Yes?
>
> Thanks,
>
> -- Art Z.
>
On 5/13/2016 10:26 AM, Rene wrote:
>
> First hand experiencethe heat build up can go out of control. Melted
> both the cable and a plastic spool it was on. Was on a camper and the
> wire did not feel warm normally but left it on the spool because it
> was a short distance.spool and wire became one. Needed new spool
> and wire..
>
> Rene'
>
> 801-721-6080
>
> *From:*owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of
> *Neal George
> *Sent:* Friday, May 13, 2016 8:55 AM
> *To:* aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* RE: AeroElectric-List: Warm Extension Cord
>
> Even if the extension cord was coiled, paired conductors would
> effectively cancel the coil effect
>
> neal
>
> No
>
> -- Art Z.
>
> Sent from my phone so please excuse typos and brevity.
>
> On May 13, 2016 8:30 AM, "Rene" <rene@felker.com
> <mailto:rene@felker.com>> wrote:
>
> Was the wire coiled?
>
> Rene'
>
> 801-721-6080 <tel:801-721-6080>
>
> Folks,
>
> This isn't aero but it is electric so I figure someone here will have
> an opinion. When I am away from home, I use an extension cord to
> charge my electric car. Tonight, I noticed that the wire (not the
> connectors) was warm to the touch when I unplugged the car. The warmth
> surprised me. Here are the specs:
>
> * 120V AC
> * charger draws 12A
> * 16 AWG conductors in the extension cord
> * cord is 25 feet long
> * cord was advertised as suitable for up to 13A
>
> I'm inclined to replace the cord with one with 14 AWG conductors. Yes?
>
> Thanks,
>
> -- Art Z.
>
Message 13
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Subject: | Re: Warm Extension Cord |
Hi Art,
I'd assume that if you went to the trouble to buy or build an electric
car, you have at least some focus on efficiency. So here's something to
consider. According to one convenient online calculator,
http://www.calculator.net/voltage-drop-calculator.html?material=copper&wiresize=13.17&voltage=120&phase=ac&noofconductor=1&distance=25&distanceunit=feet&eres=12&x=47&y=17
16 awg 25 ft 120vac 12A will have ~2.4 volts of drop at the load. That
means you're using 2.4*12=28.8 watts to heat the wire (likely a bit more
than that). So, roughly the equivalent of plugging in a small soldering
iron & leaving it running while the car charges.
Same load with 12 awg: 0.95v drop * 12 = 11.4 watts lost to the wire.
To keep it Aeroelectric related, 'the book' has formulas to do the calcs.
Charlie
On 5/13/2016 6:20 AM, bob noffs wrote:
> that is at the max for the cord but not over the rating.a few years
> ago i made up some extension cords for 1500 watt heaters and used 12
> ga. plenty of margin there. i guess i would feel better with 12ga.
> sounds like a one and done purchase.
> funny the connectors aren't warm.
> bob noffs
>
> On Fri, May 13, 2016 at 3:49 AM, Art Zemon <art@zemon.name
> <mailto:art@zemon.name>> wrote:
>
> Folks,
>
> This isn't aero but it is electric so I figure someone here will
> have an opinion. When I am away from home, I use an extension cord
> to charge my electric car. Tonight, I noticed that the wire (not
> the connectors) was warm to the touch when I unplugged the car.
> The warmth surprised me. Here are the specs:
>
> * 120V AC
> * charger draws 12A
> * 16 AWG conductors in the extension cord
> * cord is 25 feet long
> * cord was advertised as suitable for up to 13A
>
> I'm inclined to replace the cord with one with 14 AWG conductors. Yes?
>
> Thanks,
> -- Art Z.
>
> --
> http://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ <http://cheerfulcurmudgeon.com/>
>
> /"If I am not for myself, who is for me? And if I am only for
> myself, what am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel/
>
>
Message 14
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Subject: | Re: finding the correct crimper |
Just to add to this thread, it took some digging but I think I finally
pinpointed the correct tool for removing these terminals: "12093078
terminal removal tool." I have one ordered from Zack Electronics.
On Mon, May 9, 2016 at 11:32 AM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III <
nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com> wrote:
> At 02:26 PM 5/9/2016, you wrote:
>
> The new crimper worked perfectly, first time. Data on crimper: Purchased
> from crimpsupply.com, SKU 37A11001, Metri-Pack/56 Series/Pack-Con
> Crimping Tool #6285847. This crimper does not have a slot for the
> insulation crimp, but one of my other crimpers does. I probably got a
> little aggressive with the insulation crimp, will correct that on futures
.
> The main thing is that the wire crimp worked perfectly, just as it should
,
> giving a strong, tight good looking crimp. Pictures attached.=C3=82
>
>
> Good show!
>
>
> Bob . . .
>
Message 15
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Subject: | Re: Warm Extension Cord |
I used the following table from the J1772 specifications to build my
homemade extension cord for my electric car:
Electrical
=A2 Level 1: 14 AWG - 16A
=A2 Level 2: 10 AWG - 30A
=A2 Level 2: 8 AWG - 31 to 74A
=A2 Level 2: 6 AWG - 75 to 99A
I used 10 gauge, it is always just warm to the touch after a few hours of
charging, but not anything I would call hot. I pull 12A on high and 8A on
low at 120V.
On Fri, May 13, 2016 at 1:55 PM, Charlie England <ceengland7@gmail.com>
wrote:
> Hi Art,
>
> I'd assume that if you went to the trouble to buy or build an electric
> car, you have at least some focus on efficiency. So here's something to
> consider. According to one convenient online calculator,
>
> http://www.calculator.net/voltage-drop-calculator.html?material=copper&
wiresize=13.17&voltage=120&phase=ac&noofconductor=1&distance=25&d
istanceunit=feet&eres=12&x=47&y=17
>
> 16 awg 25 ft 120vac 12A will have ~2.4 volts of drop at the load. That
> means you're using 2.4*12=28.8 watts to heat the wire (likely a bit mor
e
> than that). So, roughly the equivalent of plugging in a small soldering
> iron & leaving it running while the car charges.
>
> Same load with 12 awg: 0.95v drop * 12 = 11.4 watts lost to the wire.
>
> To keep it Aeroelectric related, 'the book' has formulas to do the calcs.
>
> Charlie
>
> On 5/13/2016 6:20 AM, bob noffs wrote:
>
> that is at the max for the cord but not over the rating.a few years ago i
> made up some extension cords for 1500 watt heaters and used 12 ga. plenty
> of margin there. i guess i would feel better with 12ga. sounds like a one
> and done purchase.
> funny the connectors aren't warm.
> bob noffs
>
> On Fri, May 13, 2016 at 3:49 AM, Art Zemon <art@zemon.name> wrote:
>
>> Folks,
>>
>> This isn't aero but it is electric so I figure someone here will have an
>> opinion. When I am away from home, I use an extension cord to charge my
>> electric car. Tonight, I noticed that the wire (not the connectors) was
>> warm to the touch when I unplugged the car. The warmth surprised me. Her
e
>> are the specs:
>>
>> - 120V AC
>> - charger draws 12A
>> - 16 AWG conductors in the extension cord
>> - cord is 25 feet long
>> - cord was advertised as suitable for up to 13A
>>
>> I'm inclined to replace the cord with one with 14 AWG conductors. Yes?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> -- Art Z.
>>
>> --
>> http://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ <http://cheerfulcurmudgeon.com/>
>>
>> *"If I am not for myself, who is for me? And if I am only for myself,
>> what am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel*
>>
>
>
Message 16
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Subject: | Warm Extension Cord |
At 09:55 AM 5/13/2016, you wrote:
>Even if the extension cord was coiled, paired
>conductors would effectively cancel the coil effect=85
You're thinking of magnetic fields around the pair, not
temperature rise. A couple years ago, I was working a
summer fun-fair in a small town south of Wichita with
my son who has a shaved ice business. The curbside
outlet that supplied power to the trailer was only
about 20' away . . . so I only un-rolled about 30'
of 12AWG cord off a stowage reel and hooked up the
trailer. The total load for the trailer was 16A
with the A/C running. Normally, the 12AWG would get
just warm to the touch at that load.
A few hours into the event, the folks working the
booth next to us raised the red flag on smoke rising
from the cord reel. I powered down and unrolled
the cord. The deepest 25 feet of cordage was badly
melted and starting to char in some areas.
The problem was obvious . . . and SHOULD have
been considered by a veteran wire-stringer . . .
but we trashed part of the cord that was MOST
insulated from outside air. Cut it off, replaced
the connector and was back in business about 15
minutes later . . . with remaining cord all laid out
on the ground so it could cool off.
Remember, 20 amps won't burn a 22AWG copper wire
http://tinyurl.com/6qr72fr
in fact, it doesn't even put Tefzel insulation
at risk . . . in the open air. But bundle it up
in any manner that reduces ability to reject heat
and . . .
Emacs!
Here's a bundle of wires that are insulated with the slicone/
fiberglas sleeving. The bundle has two 10AWG conductors that MIGHT
get loaded to 60A under some conditions. Out in the open
air, no sweat . . . or should I say no burn?
I set up a lab test for the boss to deduce the INCREASE in temperature
rise for having been bundled.
Emacs!
Wire under the sleeve was 80 to 115C
hotter than the single strand in open air.
It was hot enough on the outside of the
fiberglas to discolor nylon tie-wraps
Emacs!
and the Tefzel insulation began to loose
its bond at the edges of the wrap
Emacs!
The copper inside was un-affected. As it turns
out, nobody ever installed ALL of the accessories
that would have put the airplane at risk. But it
was more trouble on the drawings to change the
optional equipment list. Only one drawing had
to be changed to upsize the wire. So a mandatory
service bulletin was issued against all aircraft
with that installation and the factory pushed the
upgrade costs off onto the field . . . to fix an
non-issue. Sigh . . .
Anyhow, if you can hold your 14AWG cord in
your hand . . . AND no part of it is deprived
of cooling air . . . then the wire is not
at risk. The weakest link in that system is
the connectors. I've seen several UL approved
15A rated wall outlets fail at 12A loads.
Two in a row in a house I was living in, one
in a house we investigated for a fire of
electrical origins . . . right under where
a 115v window a/c had been installed.
The advice for upsizing is well made . . . to
which would suggest more robust connectors
perhaps of the twist-lock variety.
[]
Bob . . .
Message 17
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Subject: | Off list contact |
Bob, I don't have a correct email for you anymore. Would you please contact
me off list?
Rick Girard
--
=9CBlessed are the cracked, for they shall let in the light.=9D
Groucho Marx
<http://www.goodreads.com/author/show/43244.Groucho_Marx>
Message 18
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Subject: | Re: Off list contact |
Below is the one Bob uses to communicate with us on this list. Is it the
same, or different from your "incorrect" one?
nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com
On Fri, May 13, 2016 at 3:24 PM, Richard Girard <aslsa.rng@gmail.com> wrote
:
> Bob, I don't have a correct email for you anymore. Would you please
> contact me off list?
>
> Rick Girard
>
> --
> =9CBlessed are the cracked, for they shall let in the light.
=9D Groucho Marx
> <http://www.goodreads.com/author/show/43244.Groucho_Marx>
>
>
Message 19
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Subject: | Re: Warm Extension Cord |
Yeah, short, incomplete response. I know better. Mea Culpa. (did I say that
correctly?)
I assumed the resistive thermal rise and lack of cooling from a pile of cabl
e were a given.
I have foggy memories of stories from an ancient electrical instructor, poss
ibly unfounded, of inexperienced electricians separating A/C phases in condu
it resulting in catastrophic thermal failure...
I'm sorry sir, I'll be quiet. :)
Neal
Sent from my iPhone
> On May 13, 2016, at 4:17 PM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III <nuckolls.bob@aeroele
ctric.com> wrote:
>
> At 09:55 AM 5/13/2016, you wrote:
>> Even if the extension cord was coiled, paired conductors would effectivel
y cancel the coil effect=A1=AD
>
> You're thinking of magnetic fields around the pair, not temperature ris
e.
> Bob . . .
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