---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Wed 07/27/16: 17 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 04:52 AM - Re: Switch For Thermocouple Wires (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 2. 05:06 AM - Re: G5 <-> S-Tec Sys 50 () 3. 06:08 AM - Re: Switch For Thermocouple Wires (Charlie England) 4. 06:27 AM - Re: Switch For Thermocouple Wires (Bill Boyd) 5. 06:31 AM - Re: Switch For Thermocouple Wires (Alec Myers) 6. 07:54 AM - Re: Switch For Thermocouple Wires (Daniel Hooper) 7. 10:18 AM - Re: Switch For Thermocouple Wires (William Hunter) 8. 10:34 AM - Re: Switch For Thermocouple Wires (William Hunter) 9. 11:20 AM - Re: Switch For Thermocouple Wires (Eric Page) 10. 02:03 PM - Re: Switch For Thermocouple Wires (ARGOLDMAN@aol.com) 11. 02:14 PM - Re: Switch For Thermocouple Wires (Eric Page) 12. 02:40 PM - Re: G5 <-> S-Tec Sys 50 (Peter Pengilly) 13. 03:19 PM - Re: G5 <-> S-Tec Sys 50 () 14. 04:48 PM - Re: G5 <-> S-Tec Sys 50 (Ralph E. Capen) 15. 05:05 PM - Re: Intermittent Battery Failure (user9253) 16. 08:31 PM - Tin Contact Finish (Art Zemon) 17. 11:04 PM - Re: Tin Contact Finish (Bob Verwey) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:52:14 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Switch For Thermocouple Wires At 12:31 AM 7/27/2016, you wrote: >On Jul 26, 2016, at 5:29 PM, William Hunter ><billhuntersemail@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>I am somewhat interested in knowing how hot a fire is... > >For gasoline, ignition temp is 232=C2=B0C and flame >temp varies from ~945=C2=B0C to 1,950=C2=B0C depending on conditions. > >Eric It's been about 30 years since I fiddled with fire detection techniques. We looked at them as a potential product for Electro-Mech about 1980. No software back then . . . all discrete jelly beans. There were two techniques that showed promise. One involved temperature sensors at ram air inlet and cooling outlet ports and circuitry that watched for (1) outlet to exceed xx degrees along with (2) a rate of rise in the differential between the two. The other technique, and the one most popular with our customers involved routing a kind of linear thermistor around the engine's potential hot spots during a fire. The 'thermistor' looked for all the world like a piece of semi-rigid coax cable. Thin metal jacket (stainless I think). Center conductor of solid metal. A 'dielectric' of thermistor material. Looking into the end of the 'coax' one would see an infinite number of thermistors all tied in parallel. But should any portion of the 'coax' be exposed to flame, the thermistor material in that area would present a sharp drop in resistance which was detected by the electronics. We never did pursue the opportunity beyond the gee-what-if stage. I went off to work the servoed pitch trim controller for the Lears . . . Dean did an APU controller for Duncan Aviation. The long, temperature sensitive 'coax' was kinda cool. You could route it as needed in the engine space but it was a specialty product that was custom-manufactured to the design. Breathtaking start-up costs. With software one could place one or more temperature sensors about the engine spaces and write scanning/interpretation routines to identify abnormal temperature profiles. For an OBAM aviation project, I can see a kind of universal fire detection system that is first installed in a 'learn' mode and flown for xx hours. Once 'normal' temperatures are identified and cataloged, a 'operate' mode would raise a flag if conditions markedly outside the normal parameters was detected. It's an interesting design study that was very low on Electro-Mech's totem pole of market opportunities. Under the cowl fires just don't figure into a significant percentage of bad-days-in-the-cockpit. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:06:12 AM PST US From: Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: G5 <-> S-Tec Sys 50 I am not sure if it's myopia or strategy. They already have it approved for cert. AC (the signs were that they would not; or not so fast). BTW "not designed to interface with 3rd party autopilots" could, but does not necessarily mean "not able". Will keep digging. Rumen do not archive ---- "Ralph E. Capen" wrote: ============ It's a shame they're blind in the foresight department: This device could replace every $12,000 HSI installation when the internal gyros fail. This device could get every homebuilder into glass screens. This device could salvage Garmin's monopolistic reputation... Remember IBM's MicroChannel architecture - and the Sony BetaMax VCR's...both were proprietary monopolistic versions of other devices that nearly cost these companies their existence. -----Original Message----- From: Peter Pengilly Sent: Jul 26, 2016 5:17 PM Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: G5 <-> S-Tec Sys 50 Garmin says the G5 is not designed to interface with 3rd party autopilots ... On 26 Jul 2016 19:46, wrote: Hi all, The S-Tec Sys 50 Auto Pilot has a dedicated DG for heading mode and a dedicated TC for leveling. The new Garmin G5 interfaces with Garmin's GMC 30X AP interface. Does anyone know, if G5 (used as stand alone) can interface with Sys 50 AP in terms of steering Sys 50 via the heading bug (Sys 50 heading mode) and to serve as its Turn Coordinator ? Rumen ========== - Electric-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List ========== FORUMS - eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com ========== WIKI - errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com ========== b Site - -Matt Dralle, List Admin. rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution ========== ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:08:18 AM PST US From: Charlie England Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Switch For Thermocouple Wires On Wed, Jul 27, 2016 at 6:49 AM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III < nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com> wrote: > At 12:31 AM 7/27/2016, you wrote: > > On Jul 26, 2016, at 5:29 PM, William Hunter < billhuntersemail@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > I am somewhat interested in knowing how hot a fire is... > > > For gasoline, ignition temp is 232=C3=82=C2=B0C and flame temp varies fro m ~945=C3=82=C2=B0C > to 1,950=C3=82=C2=B0C depending on conditions. > > Eric > > > It's been about 30 years since I fiddled with > fire detection techniques. We looked at them as > a potential product for Electro-Mech about 1980. > > No software back then . . . all discrete jelly > beans. There were two techniques that showed > promise. One involved temperature sensors at > ram air inlet and cooling outlet ports and > circuitry that watched for (1) outlet to > exceed xx degrees along with (2) a rate > of rise in the differential between the > two. > > The other technique, and the one most popular > with our customers involved routing a kind > of linear thermistor around the engine's > potential hot spots during a fire. The > 'thermistor' looked for all the world like > a piece of semi-rigid coax cable. Thin > metal jacket (stainless I think). Center > conductor of solid metal. A 'dielectric' > of thermistor material. > > Looking into the end of the 'coax' one > would see an infinite number of thermistors > all tied in parallel. But should any portion > of the 'coax' be exposed to flame, the thermistor > material in that area would present a sharp > drop in resistance which was detected by > the electronics. > > We never did pursue the opportunity beyond > the gee-what-if stage. I went off to work > the servoed pitch trim controller for the > Lears . . . Dean did an APU controller for > Duncan Aviation. > > The long, temperature sensitive 'coax' was > kinda cool. You could route it as needed in > the engine space but it was a specialty > product that was custom-manufactured to > the design. Breathtaking start-up costs. > > With software one could place one or more > temperature sensors about the engine spaces > and write scanning/interpretation routines > to identify abnormal temperature profiles. > > For an OBAM aviation project, I can see > a kind of universal fire detection system > that is first installed in a 'learn' mode > and flown for xx hours. Once 'normal' > temperatures are identified and cataloged, > a 'operate' mode would raise a flag if > conditions markedly outside the normal > parameters was detected. > > It's an interesting design study that > was very low on Electro-Mech's totem pole > of market opportunities. Under the cowl > fires just don't figure into a significant > percentage of bad-days-in-the-cockpit. > > > Bob . . . > A number of years ago, there were a few guys playing with optical flame sensors (triggered by the light spectrum of actual flame, instead of heat). Idea was quicker & more discriminating detection of actual fire, vs just high temps. Conversation kinda faded away, so I don't know if they ever got it implemented. IIRC, the detectors were a bit pricey, so given the rather low odds of fire, I never pursued it for myself. William may have more motivation, flying a pusher. Charlie ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:27:55 AM PST US From: Bill Boyd Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Switch For Thermocouple Wires I'm thinking extreme analog/tinker-toy technology, here, but why not a cotton string across the cowl outlet that holds open a spring-loaded N.O. switch. Fire would presumably burn it through quickly. A cross-check with a cowl air temp indicator would help confirm actual fire vs. "the old string finally rotted-through between annuals." Since we now fly in the digital age, the obvious modern solution is a belly cam to show the flames licking out of the cowl exit. -Stormy On Wed, Jul 27, 2016 at 7:49 AM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III < nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com> wrote: > At 12:31 AM 7/27/2016, you wrote: > > On Jul 26, 2016, at 5:29 PM, William Hunter < billhuntersemail@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > I am somewhat interested in knowing how hot a fire is... > > > For gasoline, ignition temp is 232=C3=82=C2=B0C and flame temp varies fro m ~945=C3=82=C2=B0C > to 1,950=C3=82=C2=B0C depending on conditions. > > Eric > > > It's been about 30 years since I fiddled with > fire detection techniques. We looked at them as > a potential product for Electro-Mech about 1980. > > No software back then . . . all discrete jelly > beans. There were two techniques that showed > promise. One involved temperature sensors at > ram air inlet and cooling outlet ports and > circuitry that watched for (1) outlet to > exceed xx degrees along with (2) a rate > of rise in the differential between the > two. > > The other technique, and the one most popular > with our customers involved routing a kind > of linear thermistor around the engine's > potential hot spots during a fire. The > 'thermistor' looked for all the world like > a piece of semi-rigid coax cable. Thin > metal jacket (stainless I think). Center > conductor of solid metal. A 'dielectric' > of thermistor material. > > Looking into the end of the 'coax' one > would see an infinite number of thermistors > all tied in parallel. But should any portion > of the 'coax' be exposed to flame, the thermistor > material in that area would present a sharp > drop in resistance which was detected by > the electronics. > > We never did pursue the opportunity beyond > the gee-what-if stage. I went off to work > the servoed pitch trim controller for the > Lears . . . Dean did an APU controller for > Duncan Aviation. > > The long, temperature sensitive 'coax' was > kinda cool. You could route it as needed in > the engine space but it was a specialty > product that was custom-manufactured to > the design. Breathtaking start-up costs. > > With software one could place one or more > temperature sensors about the engine spaces > and write scanning/interpretation routines > to identify abnormal temperature profiles. > > For an OBAM aviation project, I can see > a kind of universal fire detection system > that is first installed in a 'learn' mode > and flown for xx hours. Once 'normal' > temperatures are identified and cataloged, > a 'operate' mode would raise a flag if > conditions markedly outside the normal > parameters was detected. > > It's an interesting design study that > was very low on Electro-Mech's totem pole > of market opportunities. Under the cowl > fires just don't figure into a significant > percentage of bad-days-in-the-cockpit. > > > Bob . . . > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:31:58 AM PST US From: Alec Myers Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Switch For Thermocouple Wires >> The other technique, and the one most popular with our customers involved routing a kind of linear thermistor around the engine's potential hot spots during a fire. The 'thermistor' looked for all the world like a piece of semi-rigid coax cable. Thin metal jacket (stainless I think). Center conductor of solid metal. A 'dielectric' of thermistor material. -There's something that looks a lot like this run in a circle around the wheel wells of various jet transport aircraft I've see, presumably to detect brake/tire fires when the undercarriage is retracted. ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 07:54:42 AM PST US From: Daniel Hooper Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Switch For Thermocouple Wires That=92s an interesting idea=85 If you=92re just looking at an =91extreme rise=92 temperature, you could put a bunch of NTCs* in parallel down a length of wire, and when the impedance drops somewhere, you would get an indication. Electrically it=92s pretty similar to the thermistor snake. Probably a good bit of fab work, but just the cost of some wire, heatshrink, and a handful of NTCs!** *Negative thermal coefficient thermistors > On Jul 27, 2016, at 6:49 AM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote: > > The other technique, and the one most popular > with our customers involved routing a kind > of linear thermistor around the engine's > potential hot spots during a fire. ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 10:18:17 AM PST US From: "William Hunter" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Switch For Thermocouple Wires Good information and great ideas (I especially like the string idea)!!! The Velocity design is such that the engine cooling air gets ducted to the top of the engine via NACA ducts on the top aft portion of the airplane roof. This cooling air flows through sealed ducting to a plenum on top of the engine and then the air is forced down through the cylinder cooling fins to the bottom of the engine where the exhaust system is located. The air then flows around the exhaust system and then gets sucked out through the aft cowling holes by the propeller. Like in a traditional Cessna, the air at the top half of the engine is cool ambient air and then as it flows down through the engine and flows against the exhaust pipes it heats up. The Velocity engine compartment can get rather hot in the front of the engine between the engine and the firewall (especially at the top) because the air can stagnate. I am working on designing cooling louvers in the bottom cowling so as to help draw the hot air out of the forward section of the engine compartment. Here is a picture of a really professional installation I stole from the internet so you can get the idea. Mounted directly to the firewall on the passenger compartment side (cold side) of the firewall is a 5 gallon fuel collector tank made of fiberglass. Since this booger might want to turn into a Molotov Cocktail if the conditions are right (by "right" I really mean "really.REALLY.WRONG") I am keenly interested in proactively monitoring the engine cowling temperature. On a tractor airplane, if there is a fire in the engine compartment the cowling will belch smoke and the paint will bubble and flames would be visible.On a pusher airplane.not so much. I think my strategy will be to install a thermocouple at the top of the firewall on a "L" bracket with the thermocouple sensor end pointing down and I will cover the wires in Aeroquip fire sleeve from the probe all the way to the firewall penetration pass through. I will then place the cowling temperature digital readout on the Skyview screen in a location under the CHT readouts. The digital readout will just look like "COWL 285F" in white text. I will monitor the readout for a few flights and if the temp routinely gets to 300F but no higher I will then set the Skyview system to change the digits from white to yellow at 400F and then to red at 500F as a wake up. If I am ever flying along fat, dumb, and happy and I see the digits rapidly change from white to yellow to red as the indication shoots up to the 4 digits.and then.the digits begin to display "XXXX" then I guess the day has become bad and I am still fat.and dumb.but no longer happy. THANKS AGAIN for your advice!!! .. Cheers!!! Bill Hunter From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Daniel Hooper Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2016 7:53 AM Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Switch For Thermocouple Wires That's an interesting idea. If you're just looking at an 'extreme rise' temperature, you could put a bunch of NTCs* in parallel down a length of wire, and when the impedance drops somewhere, you would get an indication. Electrically it's pretty similar to the thermistor snake. Probably a good bit of fab work, but just the cost of some wire, heatshrink, and a handful of NTCs!** *Negative thermal coefficient thermistors On Jul 27, 2016, at 6:49 AM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III > wrote: The other technique, and the one most popular with our customers involved routing a kind of linear thermistor around the engine's potential hot spots during a fire. ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 10:34:25 AM PST US From: "William Hunter" Subject: AeroElectric-List: RE: Switch For Thermocouple Wires Good information and great ideas (I especially like the string idea)!!! I think my strategy will be to install a thermocouple at the top of the firewall on a "L" bracket with the thermocouple sensor end pointing down and I will cover the wires in Aeroquip fire sleeve from the probe all the way to the firewall penetration pass through. I will then place the cowling temperature digital readout on the Skyview screen in a location under the CHT readouts. The digital readout will just look like "COWL 285F" in white text. I will monitor the readout for a few flights and if the temp routinely gets to 300F but no higher I will then set the Skyview system to change the digits from white to yellow at 400F and then to red at 500F as a wake up. If I am ever flying along fat, dumb, and happy and I see the digits rapidly change from white to yellow to red as the indication shoots up to the 4 digits.and then.the digits begin to display "XXXX" then I guess the day has become bad and I am still fat.and dumb.but no longer happy. THANKS AGAIN for your advice!!! .. Cheers!!! Bill Hunter From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Daniel Hooper Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2016 7:53 AM Subject: Re: Switch For Thermocouple Wires That's an interesting idea. If you're just looking at an 'extreme rise' temperature, you could put a bunch of NTCs* in parallel down a length of wire, and when the impedance drops somewhere, you would get an indication. Electrically it's pretty similar to the thermistor snake. Probably a good bit of fab work, but just the cost of some wire, heatshrink, and a handful of NTCs!** *Negative thermal coefficient thermistors On Jul 27, 2016, at 6:49 AM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III > wrote: The other technique, and the one most popular with our customers involved routing a kind of linear thermistor around the engine's potential hot spots during a fire. ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 11:20:52 AM PST US From: Eric Page Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Switch For Thermocouple Wires On Jul 27, 2016, at 4:49 AM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote: > The other technique, and the one most popular with our customers involved r outing a kind of linear thermistor around the engine's potential hot spots d uring a fire. The 'thermistor' looked for all the world like a piece of semi -rigid coax cable. Thin metal jacket (stainless I think). Center conductor o f solid metal. A 'dielectric' of thermistor material. > > Looking into the end of the 'coax' one would see an infinite number of the rmistors all tied in parallel. But should any portion of the 'coax' be expo sed to flame, the thermistor material in that area would present a sharp dro p in resistance which was detected by the electronics. That's the technique that Bombardier uses in their products (at least the on es I flew). The thermistor loops are installed around the hot section and p ylon of each engine, along the anti-ice bleed air ducts, inside the APU encl osure and on the ceiling of the main wheel wells. Unfortunately I no longer have access to the electronic manuals and my hard copy is in a box somewher e, so I can't post the technical description. Boeing took a different route that, to my mind, seems a bit more fiddly and l ess robust. See the attached PDF excerpt from the B-737NG systems manual. I 'm not sure if this system is a relic from the original 1960's design, or a l ater revision. Eric P.S. In case the PDF doesn't come through, here's the pertinent text: "Eac h engine contains two overheat/fire detector loops. Each loop provides both f ire and overheat detection. When the temperature reaches the Overheat Set Po int, the gas in the detector loop expands, closing the Overheat Pressure Swi tch. This decreases the resistance of the detector. The Engine and APU Fire D etection Module uses the decrease in resistance to set the overheat conditio n. As temperature increases to the Fire Set Point, the gas continues to expa nd and closes the Fire Pressure Switch, further decreasing the resistance. T he Engine and APU Fire Detection Module uses the decrease in resistance to s et the fire condition." ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 02:03:04 PM PST US From: ARGOLDMAN@aol.com Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Switch For Thermocouple Wires Of course you could always use the technique that Burt Rutan used in the SS1 engine.. I think that he wrapped a copper (or other low fusing wire around the engine, ran a small current through it and if there were a bre ach in the containment vessel, the wire would burn through and open the circuit. Alternately use an EGT probe in the area of question. Rich In a message dated 7/27/2016 1:23:55 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, sportav8r@gmail.com writes: I'm thinking extreme analog/tinker-toy technology, here, but why not a cotton string across the cowl outlet that holds open a spring-loaded N.O. switch. Fire would presumably burn it through quickly. A cross-check wi th a cowl air temp indicator would help confirm actual fire vs. "the old strin g finally rotted-through between annuals." Since we now fly in the digital age, the obvious modern solution is a belly cam to show the flames licking out of the cowl exit. -Stormy On Wed, Jul 27, 2016 at 7:49 AM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III <_nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com_ (mailto:nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com) > wrote: At 12:31 AM 7/27/2016, you wrote: On Jul 26, 2016, at 5:29 PM, William Hunter <_ billhuntersemail@gmail.com_ (mailto:billhuntersemail@gmail.com) > wrote: I am somewhat interested in knowing how hot a fire is... For gasoline, ignition temp is 232=C2=B0C and flame temp varies from ~945 =C2=B0C to 1,950=C2=B0C depending on conditions. Eric It's been about 30 years since I fiddled with fire detection techniques. We looked at them as a potential product for Electro-Mech about 1980. No software back then . . . all discrete jelly beans. There were two techniques that showed promise. One involved temperature sensors at ram air inlet and cooling outlet ports and circuitry that watched for (1) outlet to exceed xx degrees along with (2) a rate of rise in the differential between the two. The other technique, and the one most popular with our customers involved routing a kind of linear thermistor around the engine's potential hot spots during a fire. The 'thermistor' looked for all the world like a piece of semi-rigid coax cable. Thin metal jacket (stainless I think). Center conductor of solid metal. A 'dielectric' of thermistor material. Looking into the end of the 'coax' one would see an infinite number of thermistors all tied in parallel. But should any portion of the 'coax' be exposed to flame, the thermistor material in that area would present a sharp drop in resistance which was detected by the electronics. We never did pursue the opportunity beyond the gee-what-if stage. I went off to work the servoed pitch trim controller for the Lears . . . Dean did an APU controller for Duncan Aviation. The long, temperature sensitive 'coax' was kinda cool. You could route it as needed in the engine space but it was a specialty product that was custom-manufactured to the design. Breathtaking start-up costs. With software one could place one or more temperature sensors about the engine spaces and write scanning/interpretation routines to identify abnormal temperature profiles. For an OBAM aviation project, I can see a kind of universal fire detection system that is first installed in a 'learn' mode and flown for xx hours. Once 'normal' temperatures are identified and cataloged, a 'operate' mode would raise a flag if conditions markedly outside the normal parameters was detected. It's an interesting design study that was very low on Electro-Mech's totem pole of market opportunities. Under the cowl fires just don't figure into a significant percentage of bad-days-in-the-cockpit. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 02:14:06 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Switch For Thermocouple Wires From: Eric Page On Jul 27, 2016, at 4:49 AM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote: > The other technique, and the one most popular with our customers involved routing a kind of linear thermistor around the engine's potential hot spots during a fire. The 'thermistor' looked for all the world like a piece of semi-rigid coax cable. Thin metal jacket (stainless I think). Center conductor of solid metal. A 'dielectric' of thermistor material. > > Looking into the end of the 'coax' one would see an infinite number of thermistors all tied in parallel. But should any portion of the 'coax' be exposed to flame, the thermistor material in that area would present a sharp drop in resistance which was detected by the electronics. That's the technique that Bombardier uses in their products (at least the ones I flew). The thermistor loops are installed around the hot section and pylon of each engine, along the anti-ice bleed air ducts, inside the APU enclosure and on the ceiling of the main wheel wells. Unfortunately I no longer have access to the electronic manuals and my hard copy is in a box somewhere, so I can't post the technical description. Boeing took a different route; one that, to my mind, seems a bit more fiddly and less robust. The following is an excerpt from the B-737NG systems manual. I'm not sure if this system is a relic of the original 1960's design, or a later revision. >>> Each engine contains two overheat/fire detector loops. Each loop provides both fire and overheat detection. When the temperature reaches the Overheat Set Point, the gas in the detector loop expands, closing the Overheat Pressure Switch. This decreases the resistance of the detector. The Engine and APU Fire Detection Module uses the decrease in resistance to set the overheat condition. As temperature increases to the Fire Set Point, the gas continues to expand and closes the Fire Pressure Switch, further decreasing the resistance. The Engine and APU Fire Detection Module uses the decrease in resistance to set the fire condition. <<< Eric ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 02:40:08 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: G5 <-> S-Tec Sys 50 From: Peter Pengilly Grand Rapids Mini looks like potentially a more flexible device. I have had one for 18 months, so far reliable. Peter On 27 Jul 2016 13:21, wrote: > > I am not sure if it's myopia or strategy. They already have it approved > for cert. AC (the signs were that they would not; or not so fast). > BTW "not designed to interface with 3rd party autopilots" could, but does > not necessarily mean "not able". Will keep digging. > Rumen > do not archive > > ---- "Ralph E. Capen" wrote: > > ============ > recapen@earthlink.net> > > It's a shame they're blind in the foresight department: > This device could replace every $12,000 HSI installation when the internal > gyros fail. > This device could get every homebuilder into glass screens. > > This device could salvage Garmin's monopolistic reputation... > > Remember IBM's MicroChannel architecture - and the Sony BetaMax > VCR's...both were proprietary monopolistic versions of other devices that > nearly cost these companies their existence. > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Peter Pengilly > > Sent: Jul 26, 2016 5:17 PM > > To: Aeroelectric List > > Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: G5 <-> S-Tec Sys 50 > > > Garmin says the G5 is not designed to interface with 3rd party autopilots > ... > > On 26 Jul 2016 19:46, wrote: > > > Hi all, > > > The S-Tec Sys 50 Auto Pilot has a dedicated DG for heading mode and a > dedicated TC for leveling. > > > The new Garmin G5 interfaces with Garmin's GMC 30X AP interface. > > > Does anyone know, if G5 (used as stand alone) can interface with Sys 50 AP > in terms of steering Sys 50 via the heading bug (Sys 50 heading mode) and > to serve as its Turn Coordinator ? > > > Rumen > > > ========== > > - > > Electric-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank"> > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List > > ========== > > FORUMS - > > eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com > > ========== > > WIKI - > > errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com > > ========== > > b Site - > > -Matt Dralle, List Admin. > > rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > ========== > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 03:19:32 PM PST US From: Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: G5 <-> S-Tec Sys 50 Tx, will check it out. R ---- Peter Pengilly wrote: ============ Grand Rapids Mini looks like potentially a more flexible device. I have had one for 18 months, so far reliable. Peter On 27 Jul 2016 13:21, wrote: > > I am not sure if it's myopia or strategy. They already have it approved > for cert. AC (the signs were that they would not; or not so fast). > BTW "not designed to interface with 3rd party autopilots" could, but does > not necessarily mean "not able". Will keep digging. > Rumen > do not archive > > ---- "Ralph E. Capen" wrote: > > ============ > recapen@earthlink.net> > > It's a shame they're blind in the foresight department: > This device could replace every $12,000 HSI installation when the internal > gyros fail. > This device could get every homebuilder into glass screens. > > This device could salvage Garmin's monopolistic reputation... > > Remember IBM's MicroChannel architecture - and the Sony BetaMax > VCR's...both were proprietary monopolistic versions of other devices that > nearly cost these companies their existence. > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Peter Pengilly > > Sent: Jul 26, 2016 5:17 PM > > To: Aeroelectric List > > Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: G5 <-> S-Tec Sys 50 > > > Garmin says the G5 is not designed to interface with 3rd party autopilots > ... > > On 26 Jul 2016 19:46, wrote: > > > Hi all, > > > The S-Tec Sys 50 Auto Pilot has a dedicated DG for heading mode and a > dedicated TC for leveling. > > > The new Garmin G5 interfaces with Garmin's GMC 30X AP interface. > > > Does anyone know, if G5 (used as stand alone) can interface with Sys 50 AP > in terms of steering Sys 50 via the heading bug (Sys 50 heading mode) and > to serve as its Turn Coordinator ? > > > Rumen > > > ========== > > - > > Electric-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank"> > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List > > ========== > > FORUMS - > > eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com > > ========== > > WIKI - > > errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com > > ========== > > b Site - > > -Matt Dralle, List Admin. > > rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > ========== > > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 04:48:39 PM PST US From: "Ralph E. Capen" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: G5 <-> S-Tec Sys 50 I'm looking at it right now as well. Trying to determine if it will interface with my S-Tec-30 using ARINC-429.... -----Original Message----- >From: rd2@dejazzd.com >Sent: Jul 27, 2016 6:17 PM >To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com >Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: G5 <-> S-Tec Sys 50 > > >Tx, will check it out. >R >---- Peter Pengilly wrote: > >============ >Grand Rapids Mini looks like potentially a more flexible device. I have had >one for 18 months, so far reliable. >Peter > >On 27 Jul 2016 13:21, wrote: > >> >> I am not sure if it's myopia or strategy. They already have it approved >> for cert. AC (the signs were that they would not; or not so fast). >> BTW "not designed to interface with 3rd party autopilots" could, but does >> not necessarily mean "not able". Will keep digging. >> Rumen >> do not archive >> >> ---- "Ralph E. Capen" wrote: >> >> ============ >> recapen@earthlink.net> >> >> It's a shame they're blind in the foresight department: >> This device could replace every $12,000 HSI installation when the internal >> gyros fail. >> This device could get every homebuilder into glass screens. >> >> This device could salvage Garmin's monopolistic reputation... >> >> Remember IBM's MicroChannel architecture - and the Sony BetaMax >> VCR's...both were proprietary monopolistic versions of other devices that >> nearly cost these companies their existence. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> >> From: Peter Pengilly >> >> Sent: Jul 26, 2016 5:17 PM >> >> To: Aeroelectric List >> >> Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: G5 <-> S-Tec Sys 50 >> >> >> >> Garmin says the G5 is not designed to interface with 3rd party autopilots >> ... >> >> On 26 Jul 2016 19:46, wrote: >> >> >> >> Hi all, >> >> >> >> The S-Tec Sys 50 Auto Pilot has a dedicated DG for heading mode and a >> dedicated TC for leveling. >> >> >> >> The new Garmin G5 interfaces with Garmin's GMC 30X AP interface. >> >> >> >> Does anyone know, if G5 (used as stand alone) can interface with Sys 50 AP >> in terms of steering Sys 50 via the heading bug (Sys 50 heading mode) and >> to serve as its Turn Coordinator ? >> >> >> >> Rumen >> >> >> >> >> >> ========== >> >> - >> >> Electric-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank"> >> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List >> >> ========== >> >> FORUMS - >> >> eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com >> >> ========== >> >> WIKI - >> >> errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com >> >> ========== >> >> b Site - >> >> -Matt Dralle, List Admin. >> >> rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> >> ========== >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 05:05:18 PM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Intermittent Battery Failure From: "user9253" Bob, You might try cooling the battery. If that does not bring it to life, try some gentle pounding with your fists. -------- Joe Gores Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=458806#458806 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 08:31:26 PM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Tin Contact Finish From: Art Zemon Folks, This has nothing to do with airplanes. I was idling away my evening browsing through digikey.com (don't ask me why this is fun!) and noticed some connectors are brass colored and others, like http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/te-connectivity-amp-connectors/170032-5/A100888CT-ND/2259557 , are grey. By carefully reading the specs, I see that the grey one is brass with a tin "contact finish". Why would you choose all brass vs. brass with a tin contact finish? Thanks, -- Art Z. http://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ "If I am not for myself, who is for me? And if I am only for myself, what am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 11:04:19 PM PST US From: Bob Verwey Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Tin Contact Finish Art my guess would be that the brass wants to go back to the sea when there is a hint of moisture...it turns green with envy, which leads to other problems! On Thursday, 28 July 2016, Art Zemon wrote: > Folks, > > This has nothing to do with airplanes. > > I was idling away my evening browsing through digikey.com (don't ask me > why this is fun!) and noticed some connectors are brass colored and others, > like > http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/te-connectivity-amp-connectors/170032-5/A100888CT-ND/2259557 > , are grey. By carefully reading the specs, I see that the grey one is > brass with a tin "contact finish". > > Why would you choose all brass vs. brass with a tin contact finish? > > Thanks, > -- Art Z. > > http://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ > > "If I am not for myself, who is for me? And if I am only for myself, what > am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel > -- Best... Bob Verwey ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message aeroelectric-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/aeroelectric-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/aeroelectric-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.