Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 08:25 AM - Re: Alternator failure mode (zwakie)
2. 10:39 AM - Z-16 Question (Ken Ryan)
3. 10:53 AM - Re: Z-16 Question (Ken Ryan)
4. 11:47 AM - Re: Z-16 Question (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
5. 12:01 PM - Re: Z-16 Question (Ken Ryan)
6. 02:56 PM - Re: Z-16 Question (user9253)
7. 04:07 PM - Re: Intermittent Battery Failure (jrevens)
8. 04:36 PM - Aux power to learn avionics (Phil Hooper)
9. 04:45 PM - Re: Intermittent Battery Failure (user9253)
10. 04:53 PM - Re: Aux power to learn avionics (user9253)
11. 05:01 PM - Proposed Electrical System for SuperSTOL/Rotax 914 (Ken Ryan)
12. 05:04 PM - Re: Aux power to learn avionics (Ralph E. Capen)
13. 05:16 PM - Proposed Electrical System for SuperSTOL / Rotax 914 (Ken Ryan)
14. 07:27 PM - Re: Intermittent Battery Failure (jrevens)
15. 11:01 PM - Official AeroElectric-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) (Matt Dralle)
16. 11:04 PM - Official AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines (Matt Dralle)
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Subject: | Re: Alternator failure mode |
nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect wrote:
> This leaves ACTIVE NOTIFICATION OF LOW voltage as the only really useful function
. . . and you do want to make sure you're going to see it under all anticipated
lighting conditions.
Just a FYI: SparkBright can do custom notifications. I will use one in my new panel
as well, and I have the same reasoning you have Bob: I will have mine go
green once the alternator comes on-line for 30 seconds and then go off, only go
live again when one of the set thresholds is crossed (OV, no-charge, etc.).
--------
Marcel Zwakenberg
XS TG || 912ULS || PH-SBR
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=459026#459026
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The Rotax Installation Manual tells us that when the engine is not running,
the circuit between regulator C terminal and the battery must be broken to
avoid running down the battery. But the Z-16 does not seem to account for
this.
Does the relay that breaks the connection between the "Dynamo" and the
"Voltage Regulator" serve the same purpose? That is, does opening that
relay accomplish the same thing (avoiding battery run down) as would a
relay in the C wire itself?
Thanks.
Ken
Message 3
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Subject: | Re: Z-16 Question |
Sorry guys. I answered my own question. The connection is broken by the
battery contactor. Again, sorry for my error. --Ken
On Mon, Aug 1, 2016 at 9:36 AM, Ken Ryan <keninalaska@gmail.com> wrote:
> The Rotax Installation Manual tells us that when the engine is not
> running, the circuit between regulator C terminal and the battery must be
> broken to avoid running down the battery. But the Z-16 does not seem to
> account for this.
>
> Does the relay that breaks the connection between the "Dynamo" and the
> "Voltage Regulator" serve the same purpose? That is, does opening that
> relay accomplish the same thing (avoiding battery run down) as would a
> relay in the C wire itself?
>
> Thanks.
>
> Ken
>
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Subject: | Re: Z-16 Question |
At 12:49 PM 8/1/2016, you wrote:
>Sorry guys. I answered my own question. The connection is broken by
>the battery contactor. Again, sorry for my error. --Ken
The battery/alternator switch breaks "C"
loose too.
Bob . . .
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Subject: | Re: Z-16 Question |
Bob,
Help me understand this. It looks like the battery/alternator switch opens
the S704-1 relay, which in turns opens the connection between the generator
and the regulator-rectifier. Are you saying that that has the same effect
as actually breaking the C with the battery?
Ken
On Mon, Aug 1, 2016 at 10:46 AM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III <
nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com> wrote:
> At 12:49 PM 8/1/2016, you wrote:
>
> Sorry guys. I answered my own question. The connection is broken by the
> battery contactor. Again, sorry for my error. --Ken
>
>
> The battery/alternator switch breaks "C"
> loose too.
>
>
> Bob . . .
>
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Subject: | Re: Z-16 Question |
> Are you saying that that has the same effect as actually breaking the C with
the battery?
Since the battery contactor and the dynamo relay are controlled by the same switch,
shutting off the master switch disconnects both the battery and dynamo.
Even though regulator terminal "C" has not been disconnected with a dedicated switch,
terminal "C" is no longer receiving voltage because both power sources
(battery & dynamo) have been disconnected.
If only the dynamo relay is shut off, but the battery contactor remains on, then
regulator terminal "C" will still be getting voltage from the battery and
the regulator will still be enabled. However, the regulator can not output any
voltage or current because it is not receiving any AC power from the disconnected
dynamo.
Without alternating power input, the rectifier/regulator can not supply an output
regardless of whether the regulator is enabled via terminal "C" or not.
--------
Joe Gores
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=459052#459052
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Subject: | Re: Intermittent Battery Failure |
I have a friend building a RANS S-19. Not flown yet - new Rotax 912 ULS, PC-680
battery and Dynon panel. The charging voltage seems low. We've measured it at
the battery and it agrees closely with the Dynon readout. The voltage at 1900
rpm today was 13.5 v, but has been seen to be only in the upper 12 v range sometimes
when taxiing. Some other readings - 2000 rpm 13.4 v, 2400 13.7, 3500 13.8,
4000 13.9. We ran the lights and panel for awhile with the engine off to
get the battery voltage down to about 10.5, then started the engine and got similar
readings. The two brand new voltage regulators, the Rotax supplied Ducati
and a Silent Hektik, produced the same results. Electrical is basically as per
Bob's Z-16. Now I'm wondering about the possibility of a bad battery, or possibly
even a weak dynamo. Any thoughts or suggestions for possible tests?
--------
John Evens
Thorp T-18 N71JE (built & flying)
Kitfox SS7 N27JE (building)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=459057#459057
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Subject: | Aux power to learn avionics |
Forgive my naive question which has probably been addressed before on this
list. I did search before posting.
I have purchased a 2001 Cessna T182T. To learn all the systems on the
ground I purchased a Schauer JAC2024H battery charger from Aircraft Spruce,
with the typical Cessna plug for external power.
I hooked it up, turned on the charger, turned on master, then avionics and
sat there studying for a bout 10 minutes when I noticed that the battery
voltage was graducally dropping. I fear I was actually draining the main
battery which is getting close to replacement time.
*Am I doing something wrong? *
I have also purchased a battery minder for continuous, low voltage charging
to keep the battery healthy. Advise will be much appreciated.
--
--
*Phil Hooper*President
*Harvest Development & Media Inc.*
19851 Yorba Linda Blvd., Suite 204
Yorba Linda, CA 92886
*voice:* 714.693.8745
*fax:* 714.777.0134
*web:* http://www.hdmnet.com/
*email:* phil@hdmnet.com
Message 9
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Subject: | Re: Intermittent Battery Failure |
Your voltages sound normal for the Rotax charging system. I have a Van's RV-12
with similar voltages, same engine, same battery. The engine starts so quickly
that the battery does not run down much. 13.8 volts seems to be working fine
for hundreds of flying RV-12s. The bad news is that the Ducati regulators
have a high failure rate.
A John Deere regulator gives a few tenths of a volt more, but the terminals are
swapped around and the mounting holes do not align. Search eBay for AM101406,
or MIA881279, or JDR1406.
--------
Joe Gores
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=459060#459060
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Subject: | Re: Aux power to learn avionics |
I do not know why, but Aircraft Spruce's description says,
> "Not intended for use as a DC power supply."
Without knowing how the Cessna is wired, all I can suggest is to connect the charger
directly to the battery to see if that makes a difference.
--------
Joe Gores
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=459061#459061
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Subject: | Proposed Electrical System for SuperSTOL/Rotax 914 |
Okay, I've finally got something. ALL comments and criticisms are welcome.
Attached to this message are two files:
1. Text as a .pdf file
2. Diagram as a .jpg image
The text contains an overview, load analysis, start up and shut down
procedures, emergency procedures, etc. The diagram hopefully shows all the
necessary detail.
Ken
Message 12
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Subject: | Re: Aux power to learn avionics |
The system that you had turned on was drawing more than the 20 amps that the charger
was able to produce.
If you are going to run your stuff for an extended period, you need a power supply
capable of mainlining a set voltage with the amount of current flowing.
In my RV6A, I can use a good portion of my avionics with a 30 AMP power supply
and maintain voltage sufficient to not discharge the battery.
Right or wrong is not the answer here - with a 20A charger, you have too much stuff
turned on for the charger to keep up.
-----Original Message-----
From: Phil Hooper
Sent: Aug 1, 2016 7:34 PM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Aux power to learn avionics
Forgive my naive question which has probably been addressed before on this list.
I did search before posting.
I have purchased a 2001 Cessna T182T. To learn all the systems on the ground I
purchased a Schauer JAC2024H battery charger from Aircraft Spruce, with the typical
Cessna plug for external power.
I hooked it up, turned on the charger, turned on master, then avionics and sat
there studying for a bout 10 minutes when I noticed that the battery voltage was
graducally dropping. I fear I was actually draining the main battery which
is getting close to replacement time.
Am I doing something wrong?
I have also purchased a battery minder for continuous, low voltage charging to
keep the battery healthy. Advise will be much appreciated.
--
--
Phil Hooper
President
Harvest Development
& Media Inc.
19851 Yorba Linda
Blvd., Suite 204
Yorba Linda, CA 92886
voice:
714.693.8745
fax:
714.777.0134
web: http://www.hdmnet.com/
email: phil@hdmnet.com
Message 13
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Subject: | Proposed Electrical System for SuperSTOL / Rotax 914 |
I tried posting this but it was returned saying the attachments are too
large, although combined they are less than 200k. I will try again...
Okay, I've finally got something. ALL comments and criticisms are welcome.
Attached to this message are two files:
1. Text as a .pdf file
2. Diagram as a .jpg image
The text contains an overview, load analysis, start up and shut down
procedures, emergency procedures, etc. The diagram hopefully shows all the
necessary detail.
Ken
Message 14
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Subject: | Re: Intermittent Battery Failure |
Thanks Joe. The issue came up in our minds because another friend with a new S-19
does seem to be running a few tenths higher with the same engine, etc., and
I was thinking about the recent discussions on this forum stating that 14.2 to
14.5 or so was what you really wanted with these batteries. The one in question
actually is using a different regulator... the Silent Hektik. It's really
a nice looking regulator & rated for much higher amperage. He just swapped it
out with a Ducati to see if there was a difference.
--------
John Evens
Thorp T-18 N71JE (built & flying)
Kitfox SS7 N27JE (building)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=459069#459069
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Subject: | Official AeroElectric-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) |
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http://www.matronics.com/archives
******************************************
*** Complete List Web Archive Browsing ***
******************************************
All messages posted to the AeroElectric-List are also available using the
Email List Archive Browsing feature. With this utility, all messages
in the List are indexed, and individual sub-archives can be browsed.
http://www.matronics.com/archive/archive-index.cgi?AeroElectric
*****************************************
**** High-Speed Archive Search Engine ***
*****************************************
You can use the custom, high-performance Matronics Email List Search Engine
to quickly locate and browse any messages that have been posted to the
List. The Engine allows the user to easily search any of the currently
available List archives.
http://www.matronics.com/search
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With the Matronics Email List File and Photo Share you can share pictures
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!! ==> Please including the following information with each submission:
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4) One line Subject description.
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6-x) One-line Description of each photo or file
Prior to public availability of the files and photos, each will be scanned
for viruses. Please also note that the process of making the files and
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process them every few days.
Following the availability of the new Photoshare, an email message will be
sent to the Email Lists enumerated in 1) above indicating that the new
Share is available and what the direct URL to it is.
For a current list of available Photoshares, have a look at the Main
Index Page:
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*** List Archive CDROM ***
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A complete Matronics Email List Archive CD is available that contains
all of the archives since the beginning of each of the Lists. The archives
for all of the Lists are included on the CD along with a freeware search
engine written by a list member. The CD is burned the day you order it
and will contain archive received up to the last minute. They make
great gifts!
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******************************************************************************
AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines
******************************************************************************
The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the AeroElectric-List.
You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein.
Failure to use the AeroElectric-List in the manner described below may result
in the removal of the subscribers from the List.
AeroElectric-List Policy Statement
The purpose of the AeroElectric-List is to provide a forum of discussion for
things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals
are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver
high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie
among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals
requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of
the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established:
- Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit
posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long
lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc.
- THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be
relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it.
- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive
that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and
terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and
responses.
- Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address,
aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line
about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid
bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary
space in the archive.
- DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is
easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the
web page or FAQ first.
- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of
your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it
easy to find threads in the archive.
- When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your
response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the
reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that
quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive
can not be overstated!
- When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT
then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the
"reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your
response to the original poster. You might have to actively address
your response with the original poster's email address.
- DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something
to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I
agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent
to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large.
- When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to
comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly
contribute something valuable.
- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone
polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack
other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously
controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that
will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.
- Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly
subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by
List members promoting their respective products or items for sale
should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble
a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but
is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to
everyone, including those who provide products to the entire
community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the
operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists.
-------
[This is an automated posting.]
do not archive
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Subject: | Official AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines |
Dear Listers,
Please read over the AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines below. The complete
AeroElectric-List FAQ including these Usage Guidelines can be found at the
following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/AeroElectric-List.FAQ.html
Thank you,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
******************************************************************************
AeroElectric-List Usage Guidelines
******************************************************************************
The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the AeroElectric-List.
You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein.
Failure to use the AeroElectric-List in the manner described below may result
in the removal of the subscribers from the List.
AeroElectric-List Policy Statement
The purpose of the AeroElectric-List is to provide a forum of discussion for
things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals
are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver
high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie
among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals
requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of
the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established:
- Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit
posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long
lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc.
- THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be
relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it.
- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive
that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and
terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and
responses.
- Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address,
aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line
about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid
bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary
space in the archive.
- DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is
easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the
web page or FAQ first.
- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of
your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it
easy to find threads in the archive.
- When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your
response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the
reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that
quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive
can not be overstated!
- When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT
then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the
"reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your
response to the original poster. You might have to actively address
your response with the original poster's email address.
- DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something
to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I
agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent
to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large.
- When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to
comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly
contribute something valuable.
- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone
polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack
other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously
controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that
will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.
- Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly
subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by
List members promoting their respective products or items for sale
should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble
a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but
is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to
everyone, including those who provide products to the entire
community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the
operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists.
-------
[This is an automated posting.]
do not archive
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