---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 08/25/16: 18 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 04:29 AM - Connectors for Wing Roots (Art Zemon) 2. 04:55 AM - Radio transmission problem (Carlos Trigo) 3. 05:13 AM - Re: Connectors for Wing Roots (Bob Verwey) 4. 05:21 AM - Re: EFIS power switch - part 2 (user9253) 5. 05:30 AM - Re: Radio transmission problem (user9253) 6. 05:57 AM - Re: Connectors for Wing Roots (Art Zemon) 7. 07:12 AM - Re: Connectors for Wing Roots (Charlie England) 8. 07:44 AM - Re: Connectors for Wing Roots (Kent or Jackie Ashton) 9. 08:28 AM - Re: Re: Silent-Hektik Regulator (Ken Ryan) 10. 09:42 AM - Re: Re: Battery charging (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 11. 09:51 AM - Re: Connectors for Wing Roots (Bob Verwey) 12. 09:59 AM - Re: Silent-Hektik Regulator (user9253) 13. 10:03 AM - Re: Radio transmission problem (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 14. 10:12 AM - Re: Connectors for Wing Roots (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 15. 11:25 AM - Re: Connectors for Wing Roots (Art Zemon) 16. 11:25 AM - Re: Connectors for Wing Roots (Art Zemon) 17. 01:07 PM - Re: Battery charging (Steve Kelly) 18. 06:47 PM - Re: Re: Battery charging (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:29:15 AM PST US From: Art Zemon Subject: AeroElectric-List: Connectors for Wing Roots *From the The-Nice-Thing-About-Standards-Is-There-Are-So-Many-To-Choose-From Department:* I need to choose the connectors to use at the wing roots of my BD-4C. The wings will come off annually for inspection, which means at least one cycle per year for these connectors. There was a thread here recently about Molex connectors being good for long term use but not designed for many operational cycles. That has me shying away from Molex because I don't understand the failure mode, especially how to recognize a connector that is nearing end-of-life. The AMP CPC series looks solid but seems kind of pricey for a device that I need to operate just once per year http://www.aircraftspruce.com/categories/aircraft_parts/ap/menus/el/cablecableaccessories_cpc.html Is that CPC right choice? Is there something else that you would recommend? I need 9 pins in the left wing. 2 @ 10 amps and all of the others are low current. I need 6 pins in the right wing, all low current. Thanks, -- Art Z. -- http://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ *"If I am not for myself, who is for me? And if I am only for myself, what am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel* ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 04:55:44 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Radio transmission problem From: Carlos Trigo Bob and all A friend of mine has a Cessna 182 Skylane, and in the last flights ATC people complained that his transmissions were barely readable. Trying to find out the problem, I tested with a small simple Tx tester, and it seems to be 5x5. Then I tried with a handheld on the ground, some 300 ft away from the airplane, and it received very well. What should I test further? After those tests, I also noticed that the electric altimeter is getting interference (needle moves) when I press the PTT. Further, since I don't find any nut there, can somebody explain how to uninstall the yoke mounted PTT switch? Thanks Carlos ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:13:16 AM PST US From: Bob Verwey Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Connectors for Wing Roots handshake connectors On Thursday, 25 August 2016, Art Zemon wrote: > *From the > The-Nice-Thing-About-Standards-Is-There-Are-So-Many-To-Choose-From > Department:* > > I need to choose the connectors to use at the wing roots of my BD-4C. The > wings will come off annually for inspection, which means at least one cycle > per year for these connectors. There was a thread here recently about Molex > connectors being good for long term use but not designed for many > operational cycles. That has me shying away from Molex because I don't > understand the failure mode, especially how to recognize a connector that > is nearing end-of-life. > > The AMP CPC series looks solid but seems kind of pricey for a device that > I need to operate just once per year > http://www.aircraftspruce.com/categories/aircraft_parts/ap/menus/el/ > cablecableaccessories_cpc.html > > Is that CPC right choice? Is there something else that you would recommend? > > I need 9 pins in the left wing. 2 @ 10 amps and all of the others are low > current. > I need 6 pins in the right wing, all low current. > > Thanks, > -- Art Z. > > -- > http://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ > > *"If I am not for myself, who is for me? And if I am only for myself, what > am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel* > -- Best... Bob Verwey ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 05:21:32 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: EFIS power switch - part 2 From: "user9253" I do not understand the problem. Why do you prefer to draw current from the TCW battery when the secondary alternator is operating? If the secondary alternator is not capable of supplying the desired load current, then the alternator voltage will drop until it is equal to the battery voltage; at which point current will be drawn from both the battery and alternator. -------- Joe Gores Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=459874#459874 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 05:30:06 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Radio transmission problem From: "user9253" Check the radio antenna ground and check both ends of the coax for tightness and for corrosion. -------- Joe Gores Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=459876#459876 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 05:57:07 AM PST US From: Art Zemon Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Connectors for Wing Roots Bob, Do you mean these things: http://www.elliottelectronicsupply.com/connectors/crimp-solderless-terminals/insulated/hand-shake-connectors.html Those look like something to use in lieu of a splice, not something to be disconnected/reconnected when the wing is removed for inspection and reinstalled after the annual. -- Art Z. On Thu, Aug 25, 2016 at 7:11 AM, Bob Verwey wrote: > handshake connectors > > On Thursday, 25 August 2016, Art Zemon wrote: > >> *From the >> The-Nice-Thing-About-Standards-Is-There-Are-So-Many-To-Choose-From >> Department:* >> >> I need to choose the connectors to use at the wing roots of my BD-4C. The >> wings will come off annually for inspection, which means at least one cycle >> per year for these connectors. There was a thread here recently about Molex >> connectors being good for long term use but not designed for many >> operational cycles. That has me shying away from Molex because I don't >> understand the failure mode, especially how to recognize a connector that >> is nearing end-of-life. >> >> The AMP CPC series looks solid but seems kind of pricey for a device that >> I need to operate just once per year >> http://www.aircraftspruce.com/categories/aircraft_parts/ap/m >> enus/el/cablecableaccessories_cpc.html >> >> Is that CPC right choice? Is there something else that you would >> recommend? >> >> I need 9 pins in the left wing. 2 @ 10 amps and all of the others are low >> current. >> I need 6 pins in the right wing, all low current. >> >> Thanks, >> -- Art Z. >> >> -- >> http://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ >> >> *"If I am not for myself, who is for me? And if I am only for myself, >> what am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel* >> > > > -- > Best... > Bob Verwey > > -- http://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ *"If I am not for myself, who is for me? And if I am only for myself, what am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel* ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 07:12:16 AM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Connectors for Wing Roots From: Charlie England On 8/25/2016 6:26 AM, Art Zemon wrote: > /From the > The-Nice-Thing-About-Standards-Is-There-Are-So-Many-To-Choose-From > Department:/ > > I need to choose the connectors to use at the wing roots of my BD-4C. > The wings will come off annually for inspection, which means at least > one cycle per year for these connectors. There was a thread here > recently about Molex connectors being good for long term use but not > designed for many operational cycles. That has me shying away from > Molex because I don't understand the failure mode, especially how to > recognize a connector that is nearing end-of-life. > > The AMP CPC series looks solid but seems kind of pricey for a device > that I need to operate just once per year > http://www.aircraftspruce.com/categories/aircraft_parts/ap/menus/el/cablecableaccessories_cpc.html > > Is that CPC right choice? Is there something else that you would > recommend? > > I need 9 pins in the left wing. 2 @ 10 amps and all of the others are > low current. > I need 6 pins in the right wing, all low current. > > Thanks, > -- Art Z. > > -- > http://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ > > /"If I am not for myself, who is for me? And if I am only for myself, > what am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel/ Art, My go-to connector is almost always the standard sub-D, using crimp style machined pins. For the 10A loads, just parallel a pair of pins using 6" pigtails (details in the book). They've been around for decades, any number of pins you would reasonably need (pick a shell with a half dozen extra slots for future expansion), they are rock solid reliable (gold plated pins), reasonably priced, common affordable installation tools (that you'll need for your avionics, anyway), and you can find them almost anywhere. As long as you don't position them in a steady stream of water, they should be great. Charlie ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 07:44:14 AM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Connectors for Wing Roots From: Kent or Jackie Ashton For wing connectors, there is always something suitable at the FLAPS. I use a 4-wire round rubber connector that is pretty water resistant. Flat trailer connectors would work. For a show-horse, Anderson Powerpole. -Kent > > On 8/25/2016 6:26 AM, Art Zemon wrote: >> From the The-Nice-Thing-About-Standards-Is-There-Are-So-Many-To-Choose-From Department: ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 08:28:53 AM PST US From: Ken Ryan Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Silent-Hektik Regulator Joe, When you conducted this test, did you have the specified capacitor installed? Ken On Mon, Jul 11, 2016 at 9:45 AM, user9253 wrote: > > As an experiment, I connected a wire from the load side of the battery > contactor to terminal "C" of the Ducati regulator. I went flying. At > cruise speed, I turned off the master switch which disconnected the battery > from the electrical system. As expected, nothing changed. Everything > electrical kept right on working. Shutting off the master switch had no > affect, except for an intermittent high voltage alarm. When the alarm > sounded on the D-180, I was reluctant to increase the RPM, not wanting to > destroy any avionics. Back on the ground, I downloaded the Dynon D-180 > data to my computer to analyze. The maximum voltage of 14.7 occurred at > about 5200 RPM. The voltage fluctuated between 13.25 and 14.7 > So once enabled, the Ducati regulator will remain enabled by its own > output voltage. The Ducati does not need a battery to continue operating. > However, a connected battery will have a stabilizing affect on system > voltage. Without a battery, the system voltage varied plus or minus 3/4 of > a volt or 1.5 volts total. > Based on this experiment, the Rotax charging system needs a battery for > stability. > > -------- > Joe Gores > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=458077#458077 > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 09:42:50 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Battery charging At 08:42 PM 8/24/2016, you wrote: > >Okay, some more info. >I have a glastar with an O-320 and a B&C 40 amp alternator and LR3C. >The main battery is an Odyssey 680 mounted on the firewall. >Battery #2 is the 9 ah located in the back behind the baggage >compartment. A #14 wire runs from batt #2 forward to the on-off-on >switch, then to the aux bus. The charging wire is a separate #20 >with the diode that runs from the main bus to Batt #2. > The main current draws are the com- .6A recieve and 3A transmit, > and the GRT Sport. Don't know the draw on this offhand, it has a > 3A fuse. Cockpit lite is a small led. Other equipment in the > panel is a GTX327 and a GRT EIS4000. > I have been doing test and setup on the com and flight display > but haven't paid attention to the time to discharge. If I got an > hour that would be plenty. How about putting an ammeter in the line, turn all the goodies on and measure it? But assuming 5a, you can certainly expect a hour of support from this battery. But why a 9 a.h. battery at about 8 pounds when you can have UNLIMITED support of those same loads and have 3A left over . . . for about 1/2 the weight? An SD-8 on your vacuum pump pad will give you 8A+ at cruise. If you had Z13/8 installed, simply closing the alternate feed switch would give you an hour of ground ops and still start the engine. Better yet, the design problems you're wrestling with go away along with the preventative maintenance and periodic replacement costs of a second battery. If it were my airplane with a un-used vacuum pump pad, Z13/8 would be my first choice. It's a two-layer system with exceedingly low risk. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 09:51:56 AM PST US From: Bob Verwey Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Connectors for Wing Roots Indeed! Art they are very reliable. slip a piece of clear tubing over each joint and cable tie to keep in place. SOP for many OEM's On Thursday, 25 August 2016, Art Zemon wrote: > Bob, > > Do you mean these things: http://www.elliottelectronicsupply.com/ > connectors/crimp-solderless-terminals/insulated/hand-shake-connectors.html > Those look like something to use in lieu of a splice, not something to be > disconnected/reconnected when the wing is removed for inspection and > reinstalled after the annual. > > -- Art Z. > > > On Thu, Aug 25, 2016 at 7:11 AM, Bob Verwey > wrote: > >> handshake connectors >> >> On Thursday, 25 August 2016, Art Zemon > > wrote: >> >>> *From the >>> The-Nice-Thing-About-Standards-Is-There-Are-So-Many-To-Choose-From >>> Department:* >>> >>> I need to choose the connectors to use at the wing roots of my BD-4C. >>> The wings will come off annually for inspection, which means at least one >>> cycle per year for these connectors. There was a thread here recently about >>> Molex connectors being good for long term use but not designed for many >>> operational cycles. That has me shying away from Molex because I don't >>> understand the failure mode, especially how to recognize a connector that >>> is nearing end-of-life. >>> >>> The AMP CPC series looks solid but seems kind of pricey for a device >>> that I need to operate just once per year >>> http://www.aircraftspruce.com/categories/aircraft_parts/ap/m >>> enus/el/cablecableaccessories_cpc.html >>> >>> Is that CPC right choice? Is there something else that you would >>> recommend? >>> >>> I need 9 pins in the left wing. 2 @ 10 amps and all of the others are >>> low current. >>> I need 6 pins in the right wing, all low current. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> -- Art Z. >>> >>> -- >>> http://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ >>> >>> *"If I am not for myself, who is for me? And if I am only for myself, >>> what am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel* >>> >> >> >> -- >> Best... >> Bob Verwey >> >> >> > > > -- > http://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ > > *"If I am not for myself, who is for me? And if I am only for myself, what > am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel* > -- Best... Bob Verwey ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 09:59:18 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Silent-Hektik Regulator From: "user9253" Yes, the 22,000 microfarad capacitor is soldered to Van's Control Board in my RV-12. > When you conducted this test, did you have the specified capacitor installed? Ken > -------- Joe Gores Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=459897#459897 ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 10:03:48 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Radio transmission problem At 06:53 AM 8/25/2016, you wrote: > >Bob and all > >A friend of mine has a Cessna 182 Skylane, and in the last flights >ATC people complained that his transmissions were barely readable. > >Trying to find out the problem, I tested with a small simple Tx >tester, and it seems to be 5x5. > >Then I tried with a handheld on the ground, some 300 ft away from >the airplane, and it received very well. > >What should I test further? > >After those tests, I also noticed that the electric altimeter is >getting interference (needle moves) when I press the PTT. Check SWR on the antenna feedline AT THE RADIO. It sounds like you've got a coax shield open at one end. The hand-held from 300 feet way would hear the ship's radio if then antenna were a wet string. But your observation of heretofore non-existent interference to panel mounted goodies strongly suggests the cockpit is being flooded with RF that is not being constrained INSIDE the feedline. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 10:12:58 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Connectors for Wing Roots At 07:55 AM 8/25/2016, you wrote: >Bob, > >Do you mean these things:=C2 >http://www.elliottelectronicsupply.c om/connectors/crimp-solderless-terminals/insulated/hand-shake-connectors.htm l >Those look like something to use in lieu of a >splice, not something to be >disconnected/reconnected when the wing is >removed for inspection and reinstalled after the annual. Those would be fine . . . but don't buy them there. See: http://tinyurl.com/jgcub5e Also, consider the flat, 4-wire trailer light connectors. Emacs! Cheap, easy to spice onto ship's harness using heat-shrink/solder-lap-joints. Robust and inexpensive. If you have more than 5 wires, use a two sets of connectors with the polarity sense swapped so that you cannot mis-connect them. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 11:25:34 AM PST US From: Art Zemon Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Connectors for Wing Roots ... woops... and Charie. -- Art Z. -- http://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ *"If I am not for myself, who is for me? And if I am only for myself, what am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel* ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 11:25:39 AM PST US From: Art Zemon Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Connectors for Wing Roots DB connectors and trailer light connectors. Two good suggestions. Thank you, Bob & Bob. -- Art Z. -- http://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ *"If I am not for myself, who is for me? And if I am only for myself, what am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel* ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 01:07:14 PM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Battery charging From: "Steve Kelly" So, I put the ammeter in line as you suggested. Interesting results. With everything in the cockpit on, even the transponder, engine monitor and all the lites it only drew 3.1 amps. Add 3 more when transmitting. Only things not included were the strobes and nav lites as the wing tips are sitting on the bench. That's the first I've heard of the SD-8. Looks like nice backup system. Actually the small battery only weighs about 5-1/2 lbs, and cost only $22. I will probably just replace it at annuals so the maintenance is just about zero. It should also help some on the wt and balance as the plans called for the battery to go in the back. Again, the main use for this is on the ground. It was quite useful as I was working on the panel. Also I've already walked away forgetting to turn off the switch, and I haven't even taxied the plane yet. Steve -------- Steve Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=459906#459906 ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 06:47:14 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Battery charging At 03:05 PM 8/25/2016, you wrote: > >So, I put the ammeter in line as you suggested. Interesting >results. With everything in the cockpit on, even the transponder, >engine monitor and all the lites it only drew 3.1 amps. Good data. > Add 3 more when transmitting. Only things not included were the > strobes and nav lites as the wing tips are sitting on the bench. > That's the first I've heard of the SD-8. Looks like nice backup system. Do you have a copy of the 'Connection? You can download it at http://tinyurl.com/pt97pha or purchase a paper copy at http://tinyurl.com/cgr42l5 Suggest you review chapter 17 and Figure Z13/8 in the back of the book. Your existing battery, if prudently maintained, is the most reliable source of energy in your airplane. See chapter on batteries. Using the vacuum pump pad for something besides a parking place for a cover plate makes a great deal of sense in an all-electric airplane. Z13/8 has been in publication now for about 20 years so it has a well received track record. If the original design calls for a battery in the back, I would seriously consider putting your 680 back there. You've got an all electric panel . . . Z13/8 offers system reliability on a par with Lears and King Airs. If you need ground power for development and checkout work, consider an ac mains power supply. http://tinyurl.com/zwmvcpp All the machinations involved in smoothly integrating a second, small battery in a remote location will go away . . . If it were my airplane, it would be architectured with Z-13/8. Bob . . . ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message aeroelectric-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/aeroelectric-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/aeroelectric-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.