Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:29 AM - AW: Automatic header tank filling (Peter Sokolowski)
2. 05:35 AM - Re: Dsub Connector Shell With Female Threaded (Charlie England)
3. 05:45 AM - Re: Automatic header tank filling (Charlie England)
4. 06:52 AM - Re: Dsub Connector Shell With Female Threaded (William Hunter)
5. 04:34 PM - Can Westach Use 5VDC? (William Hunter)
6. 11:13 PM - Re: Can Westach Use 5VDC? (Rob Turk)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Automatic header tank filling |
Thanks Bob for the answer.
I agree with you that adding complexity/automatism adds possible failures to
the ac. And yes, I am aware that it may fail and thinking about backups like
my - already independent - low level warning light.
In addition I already installed an aviation approved switch with which I can
select manually between automatic and manual filling.
Also there is a drain (standard for Lancair header tanks) in case you
overfill - it just goes overboard.
Would you mind sharing the schematic you already invented ?
Thanks in advance,
Peter
LNC360 MK II
D-EPSO
Von: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] Im Auftrag von Robert
L. Nuckolls, III
Gesendet: Dienstag, 30. Mai 2017 20:04
An: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
Betreff: Re: AeroElectric-List: Automatic header tank filling
Hi,
I am flying a Lancair 360 with wing tanks and the standard header tank.
Rather thinking every 20 to 30 minutes to fill up the header tank again I
would like to have an automatism filling the tank.
I've done a couple of similar systems. Last
one was for the Piaggio P-180.
I have a capacitive fuel gauge (output 0 to 5 V) and an independent
emergency reminder looking up at the annunciator panel @ about 5 gallons.
The analog output makes the 'control' easy to do.
The dragon to slay is failure mitigation.
Any time you add a automatic feature to the
airplane, it's wise to assume that it will
fail at some point.
What are the ways it can fail? How will you
become aware of the failure? Is the failure
pre-flight detectable? What are plans A, B, etc.
for dealing with the failure(s)?
You have a low level warning light . . . this should
be totally independent of any other function.
Suppose the transfer sticks ON and overfills the
tank. What happens if the tank is over filled;
what happens to excess fuel? Is there a practical
way to add a high level warning?
Rather re-inventing the wheel - is there a circuit diagram out there I can
use for such a fuel filling mimic ?
You can watch the dc voltage from the
fuel gage with a comparator that will,
for example, turn the transfer ON at
3 volts or below and OFF at 4 volts or
above . . . or what ever hysteresis values
seem most practical.
The existing low level warning backs up
a failure to transfer, some kind of high
level warning should back of a failure to
stop transferring.
Bob . . .
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Dsub Connector Shell With Female Threaded |
Google 'dsub latch'. There are several different options for joining dsubs
in-line; screws, sliding latches, and spring bales. My favorite style:
http://www.newark.com/cooper-interconnect/17-529/d-sub-spring-latch/dp/39F1
390?mckv=sPyr8IJjG_dc|pcrid|81605889141|plid||kword||match||slid||product
|39F1390|&gross_price=true&CATCI=pla-164504983461&CAAGID 389674261&
CMP=KNC-GUSA-GEN-SHOPPING-39F1390&CAGPSPN=pla&gclid=CjwKEAjw07nJBRDG_
tvshefHhWQSJABRcE-ZuxQrtf1Qi0xFg5ATYZXSW2anCtcB-ENzwuu27bdAVhoC_Jfw_wcB&CAW
ELAID=120185550001138611
More positive security than screws, because it can't loosen with vibration.
The same latch can be used on chassis mounted connectors, too, as long as
the designer left enough room around the connector to add the springs.
(Can you hear me, Advanced Flight Systems?)
Charlie
On Tue, May 30, 2017 at 10:43 PM, Art Zemon <art@zemon.name> wrote:
> Bill,
>
> I hate those screws. I have seen barrel connectors which are female on
> both ends, stuck between two D-sub shells. They require having a
> screwdriver on both ends, Pain-in-the-a**.
>
> I am planning to use a pair a zip ties in a X in the places where I have
> D-sub connectors in my plane. I would rather cut and replace the zip ties
> than mess around with the screws.
>
> I will be really interested to see if anyone has better ideas.
>
> -- Art Z.
>
>
> On Tue, May 30, 2017 at 9:49 PM, William Hunter <
> billhuntersemail@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi All,
>>
>>
>>
>> I have a couple of instances where I need to mate a male Dsub to a femal
e
>> Dsub end to end within the length of a wire bundle (example: connect the
>> under panel wire harness to the wire harness of the control stick).
>>
>>
>>
>> I already have the male and female Dsub connectors wired up and they are
>> connected end to end and I have the plastic shells (see below) however t
he
>> metal screws of the one shell needs to screw into a threaded bore of the
>> other connector so that the two connectors do not disconnect. Kinda lik
e
>> when you attach the Dsub connector to the back of a computer the plug
>> slides into the receptacle and then the screws on the connector shell
>> thread into the threaded bore of the computer case.
>>
>>
>>
>> How does one (me) do this on an end to end connector?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> [image:
>> http://www.steinair.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/SA-1030-BACKSHELL-DSU
B15-L-DSC09853.jpg]
>>
>>
>>
>> ..
>>
>>
>>
>> Cheers!!!
>>
>>
>>
>> Bill Hunter
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> https://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/
>
> *"If I am not for myself, who is for me? And if I am only for myself, wha
t
> am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel*
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Automatic header tank filling |
On Tue, May 30, 2017 at 1:03 PM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III <
nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I am flying a Lancair 360 with wing tanks and the standard header tank.
> Rather thinking every 20 to 30 minutes to fill up the header tank again I
> would like to have an automatism filling the tank.
>
> I've done a couple of similar systems. Last
> one was for the Piaggio P-180.
>
> I have a capacitive fuel gauge (output 0 to 5 V) and an independent
> emergency reminder looking up at the annunciator panel @ about 5 gallons.
>
> The analog output makes the 'control' easy to do.
> The dragon to slay is failure mitigation.
> Any time you add a automatic feature to the
> airplane, it's wise to assume that it will
> fail at some point.
>
> What are the ways it can fail? How will you
> become aware of the failure? Is the failure
> pre-flight detectable? What are plans A, B, etc.
> for dealing with the failure(s)?
>
> You have a low level warning light . . . this should
> be totally independent of any other function.
> Suppose the transfer sticks ON and overfills the
> tank. What happens if the tank is over filled;
> what happens to excess fuel? Is there a practical
> way to add a high level warning?
>
> Rather re-inventing the wheel =93 is there a circuit diagram out th
ere I can
> use for such a fuel filling mimic ?
>
> You can watch the dc voltage from the
> fuel gage with a comparator that will,
> for example, turn the transfer ON at
> 3 volts or below and OFF at 4 volts or
> above . . . or what ever hysteresis values
> seem most practical.
>
> The existing low level warning backs up
> a failure to transfer, some kind of high
> level warning should back of a failure to
> stop transferring.
>
>
> Bob . . .
>
"Suppose the transfer sticks ON and overfills the
tank. What happens if the tank is over filled;
what happens to excess fuel? Is there a practical
way to add a high level warning?"
The additional issue I never considered (but a research scientist friend
who tests *everything*, did), was what happens to the *tank*. If you have a
typical vent system using -4 (1/4" OD) tubing, when fuel hits the vent, the
transfer pump can cause pressures in the tank to reach 10 psi. In case you
don't know, more than about 2 psi will damage most a/c fuel tanks in planes
like most of us fly.
Dilemma: positive protection from overfilling that can't fail and prevent
transfer.
Secondary dilemma, when using auto-transfer: Especially if there's more
than one aux tank, preventing the transfer pump from running (and
destroying itself) when pumping from an empty tank.
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Dsub Connector Shell With Female Threaded |
Thanks everyone for the advice... I came to the right place.
Bill Hunter
On May 31, 2017 5:40 AM, "Charlie England" <ceengland7@gmail.com> wrote:
> Google 'dsub latch'. There are several different options for joining dsubs
> in-line; screws, sliding latches, and spring bales. My favorite style:
> http://www.newark.com/cooper-interconnect/17-529/d-sub-
> spring-latch/dp/39F1390?mckv=sPyr8IJjG_dc|pcrid|81605889141|plid||kword||
> match||slid||product|39F1390|&gross_price=true&CATCI=pla-
> 164504983461&CAAGID 389674261&CMP=KNC-GUSA-GEN-
> SHOPPING-39F1390&CAGPSPN=pla&gclid=CjwKEAjw07nJBRDG_tvshefHhWQSJABRcE-
> ZuxQrtf1Qi0xFg5ATYZXSW2anCtcB-ENzwuu27bdAVhoC_Jfw_wcB&
> CAWELAID=120185550001138611
>
> More positive security than screws, because it can't loosen with
> vibration. The same latch can be used on chassis mounted connectors, too,
> as long as the designer left enough room around the connector to add the
> springs. (Can you hear me, Advanced Flight Systems?)
>
> Charlie
>
> On Tue, May 30, 2017 at 10:43 PM, Art Zemon <art@zemon.name> wrote:
>
>> Bill,
>>
>> I hate those screws. I have seen barrel connectors which are female on
>> both ends, stuck between two D-sub shells. They require having a
>> screwdriver on both ends, Pain-in-the-a**.
>>
>> I am planning to use a pair a zip ties in a X in the places where I have
>> D-sub connectors in my plane. I would rather cut and replace the zip ties
>> than mess around with the screws.
>>
>> I will be really interested to see if anyone has better ideas.
>>
>> -- Art Z.
>>
>>
>> On Tue, May 30, 2017 at 9:49 PM, William Hunter <
>> billhuntersemail@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi All,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I have a couple of instances where I need to mate a male Dsub to a
>>> female Dsub end to end within the length of a wire bundle (example: connect
>>> the under panel wire harness to the wire harness of the control stick).
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I already have the male and female Dsub connectors wired up and they are
>>> connected end to end and I have the plastic shells (see below) however the
>>> metal screws of the one shell needs to screw into a threaded bore of the
>>> other connector so that the two connectors do not disconnect. Kinda like
>>> when you attach the Dsub connector to the back of a computer the plug
>>> slides into the receptacle and then the screws on the connector shell
>>> thread into the threaded bore of the computer case.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> How does one (me) do this on an end to end connector?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> [image:
>>> http://www.steinair.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/SA-1030-BACKSHELL-DSUB15-L-DSC09853.jpg]
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ..
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Cheers!!!
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Bill Hunter
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> https://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/
>>
>> *"If I am not for myself, who is for me? And if I am only for myself,
>> what am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel*
>>
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Can Westach Use 5VDC? |
I have two Westack capacitance fuel probes and I would like to power them
from PIN 18 of the Dynon Skyview. That pin is a 5 VDC output and the only
other item that this pin will power is a Grand Rapids CS-02 Hall Effect
Sensor.
Any experience would be most appreciated!!!
..
Cheers!!!
Bill Hunter
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Can Westach Use 5VDC? |
From the specifications it doesn't appear you can use 5V to power these
probes. They are specified 12/24V (28V max), with the output being 0-5V.
You should power them from the main bus, or (if your Skyview
installation manual lists it), to the +12V Auxiliary Output pin (pin 15
of the 37-pin connector). Not all SkyView systems appear to have that
pin so double check.
On 6/1/2017 1:33 AM, William Hunter wrote:
>
> I have two Westack capacitance fuel probes and I would like to power
> them from PIN 18 of the Dynon Skyview. That pin is a 5 VDC output and
> the only other item that this pin will power is a Grand Rapids CS-02
> Hall Effect Sensor.
>
> Any experience would be most appreciated!!!
>
> ..
>
> Cheers!!!
>
> Bill Hunter
>
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