Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 07:06 AM - Not receiving posts (Richard Girard)
2. 07:23 AM - Re: Not receiving posts (GTH)
3. 08:01 AM - Asleep? (Henry Roden)
4. 08:13 AM - Re: Asleep? (Rene)
5. 08:14 AM - Re: Asleep? (Roger)
6. 08:15 AM - Re: Asleep? (Sebastien)
7. 08:38 AM - Re: Asleep? (Bob Verwey)
8. 08:48 AM - Asleep...now waking up (Bob Verwey)
9. 09:28 AM - Re: Asleep...now waking up (yellowduckduo)
10. 09:56 AM - Re: Asleep...now waking up (Ernest Christley)
11. 11:55 AM - Re: Asleep...now waking up (Charlie England)
12. 03:00 PM - Re: Asleep...now waking up (Trent Heidtke)
13. 04:18 PM - Re: Asleep...now waking up (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
14. 05:46 PM - 1/4 watt Panasonic resistors (dj_theis)
15. 08:45 PM - Re: 1/4 watt Panasonic resistors (Charlie England)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Not receiving posts |
Has the list gone dark? All of a sudden I stopped receiving posts. I
checked the Matronics site to make sure I'm still subscribed and my email
account to make sure it wasn't inadvertently blocked. Anyone else having
this problem?
Rick
--
=9CBlessed are the cracked, for they shall let in the light.=9D
Groucho Marx
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Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Not receiving posts |
/Le 07/03/2018 16:05, Richard Girard a crit:
/
> /Has the list gone dark? All of a sudden I stopped receiving posts. I
> checked the Matronics site to make sure I'm still subscribed and my
> email account to make sure it wasn't inadvertently blocked. Anyone
> else having this problem?/
>
Hi,
Same as you, nothing received since the last days of February.
--
Best regards,
Gilles
http://contrails.free.fr
http://lapierre.skunkworks.free.fr
Message 3
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Has everyone gone to sleep or is it just me that has seen no new messages
in the last week or so?
Henry
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Message 4
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Still listening..just nothing to say. :)
Rene'
801-721-6080
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
<owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com> On Behalf Of Henry Roden
Sent: Wednesday, March 07, 2018 9:01 AM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Asleep?
Has everyone gone to sleep or is it just me that has seen no new
messages in the last week or so?
Henry
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It=99s just you Henry!!
From: Henry Roden
Sent: Wednesday, March 7, 2018 11:04 AM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Asleep?
Has everyone gone to sleep or is it just me that has seen no new messages i
n the last week or so?
Henry
Virus-free. www.avast.com
Message 6
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I have not had any messages in a while.
On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 8:00 AM, Henry Roden <krazydoc33@gmail.com> wrote:
> Has everyone gone to sleep or is it just me that has seen no new messages
> in the last week or so?
> Henry
>
>
> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=icon> Virus-free.
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> <#m_3007989193900063144_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>
>
Message 7
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I think it's everyone. ..
On 07 Mar 2018 6:10 PM, "Henry Roden" <krazydoc33@gmail.com> wrote:
> Has everyone gone to sleep or is it just me that has seen no new messages
> in the last week or so?
> Henry
>
>
> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=icon> Virus-free.
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Message 8
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| Subject: | Asleep...now waking up |
So then let me put a question out there. To do with using ECM's...on
automotive engine conversions...what kind of signal is derived from the
Lamda sensor?
What I am wondering is how one can influence mixture by changing the
feedback from said sensor to the ECM....IOW fooling it into changing the
mixture....say with a rheostat?
On 07 Mar 2018 6:19 PM, "Rene" <rene@felker.com> wrote:
Still listening..just nothing to say. :)
Rene'
801-721-6080 <(801)%20721-6080>
*From:* owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com <
owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com> *On Behalf Of *Henry Roden
*Sent:* Wednesday, March 07, 2018 9:01 AM
*To:* aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
*Subject:* AeroElectric-List: Asleep?
Has everyone gone to sleep or is it just me that has seen no new messages
in the last week or so?
Henry
<https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_c
ampaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=icon>
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Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Asleep...now waking up |
It depends on the ECM and what sensor is being used.
Older narrow band sensors rapidly switch between about 0 volts and about 1
volt and the ecm generally will throw a fault code if it does not switch
back and forth quite frequently.
Newer units use wide band sensors that require fairly complex controllers
that often generate up to 5 volts output.
It is difficult to use any of the sensor modifications for long term
mixture control with an automotive ecm. They are smart enough to start
throwing fault codes and various limp modes if a signal is out of range for
very long.
Ken
On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 11:47 AM, Bob Verwey <bob.verwey@gmail.com> wrote:
> So then let me put a question out there. To do with using ECM's...on
> automotive engine conversions...what kind of signal is derived from the
> Lamda sensor?
> What I am wondering is how one can influence mixture by changing the
> feedback from said sensor to the ECM....IOW fooling it into changing the
> mixture....say with a rheostat?
>
> On 07 Mar 2018 6:19 PM, "Rene" <rene@felker.com> wrote:
>
> Still listening..just nothing to say. :)
>
>
> Rene'
>
> 801-721-6080 <(801)%20721-6080>
>
>
> *From:* owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com <
> owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com> *On Behalf Of *Henry Roden
> *Sent:* Wednesday, March 07, 2018 9:01 AM
> *To:* aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* AeroElectric-List: Asleep?
>
>
> Has everyone gone to sleep or is it just me that has seen no new messages
> in the last week or so?
>
> Henry
>
>
> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm
_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=icon>
>
> Virus-free. www.avast.com
> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm
_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=link>
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Asleep...now waking up |
Lead poisons the sensors fairly quickly for control use. =C2-It will rema
in useful for manual mixture control for quite a while, but the lead=C2-s
lows=C2-the response to changes. =C2-Most ECMs needs millisecond update
s to keep the mixture under control, but the lead will slow it to tenths of
seconds.
I use a narrowband gauge for mixture control, and that does work quite well
.
On Wednesday, March 7, 2018 12:29 PM, yellowduckduo <yellowduckduo@gmai
l.com> wrote:
It depends on the ECM and what sensor is being used.
Older narrow band sensors rapidly switch between about 0 volts and about 1
volt and the ecm generally will throw a fault code if it does not switch ba
ck and forth quite frequently.
Newer units use wide band sensors that require fairly complex controllers t
hat often generate up to 5 volts output.
It is difficult to use any of the sensor modifications for long term mixtur
e control with an automotive ecm. They are smart enough to start throwing f
ault codes and various limp modes if a signal is out of range for very long
.
Ken
On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 11:47 AM, Bob Verwey <bob.verwey@gmail.com> wrote:
So then let me put a question out there. To do with using ECM's...on automo
tive engine conversions...what kind of signal is derived from the Lamda sen
sor?=C2-=C2-What I am wondering is how one can influence mixture by cha
nging the feedback from said sensor to the ECM....IOW fooling it into chang
ing the mixture....say with a rheostat?=C2-
On 07 Mar 2018 6:19 PM, "Rene" <rene@felker.com> wrote:
Still listening..just nothing to say.=C2- :)=C2-Rene'801-721-6
080=C2-From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server @matronics.com <owner-aeroele
ctric-list-serve r@matronics.com> On Behalf Of Henry Roden
Sent: Wednesday, March 07, 2018 9:01 AM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Asleep?=C2-Has everyone gone to sleep or is i
t just me that has seen no new messages in the last week or so?Henry=C2-
| | Virus-free. www.avast.com |
=C2-
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Asleep...now waking up |
Before using a stock auto controller, ask yourself if you have the source c
ode and the software engineering chops to analyze & clean the code=2E Witho
ut both, you'll never know when the cpu will decide something isn't right &
go into limp home mode=2E
Charlie
On Mar 7, 2018, 12:34 PM, at 12:34 P
M, yellowduckduo <yellowduckduo@gmail=2Ecom> wrote:
>It depends on the ECM
and what sensor is being used=2E
>Older narrow band sensors rapidly switch
between about 0 volts and
>about 1
>volt and the ecm generally will throw a
fault code if it does not
>switch
>back and forth quite frequently=2E
>
>N
ewer units use wide band sensors that require fairly complex
>controllers
>
that often generate up to 5 volts output=2E
>
>It is difficult to use any o
f the sensor modifications for long term
>mixture control with an automotiv
e ecm=2E They are smart enough to start
>throwing fault codes and various l
imp modes if a signal is out of range
>for
>very long=2E
>
>Ken
>
>On Wed,
Mar 7, 2018 at 11:47 AM, Bob Verwey <bob=2Everwey@gmail=2Ecom>
>wrote:
>
>>
So then let me put a question out there=2E To do with using ECM's=2E=2E=2E
on
>> automotive engine conversions=2E=2E=2Ewhat kind of signal is derived
from
>the
>> Lamda sensor?
>> What I am wondering is how one can influence
mixture by changing the
>> feedback from said sensor to the ECM=2E=2E=2E=2E
IOW fooling it into changing
>the
>> mixture=2E=2E=2E=2Esay with a rheostat
?
>>
>> On 07 Mar 2018 6:19 PM, "Rene" <rene@felker=2Ecom> wrote:
>>
>> Sti
ll listening=2E=2Ejust nothing to say=2E :)
>>
>>
>>
>> Rene'
>>
>> 801-721-6080 <(801)%20721-6080>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* owner-aeroelectric-l
ist-server@matronics=2Ecom <
>> owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics=2E
com> *On Behalf Of *Henry
>Roden
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, March 07, 2018 9:01
AM
>> *To:* aeroelectric-list@matronics=2Ecom
>> *Subject:* AeroElectric-Li
st: Asleep?
>>
>>
>>
>> Has everyone gone to sleep or is it just me that ha
s seen no new
>messages
>> in the last week or so?
>>
>> Henry
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
><https://www=2Eavast=2Ecom/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=li
nk&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=icon>
>>
>> Vi
rus-free=2E www=2Eavast=2Ecom
>>
><https://www=2Eavast=2Ecom/sig-email?utm_
medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=web
mail&utm_term=link>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Asleep...now waking up |
It is true that lead fouls the sensor fairly quickly, probably less than
100 hours in my investigation and experience. That said a couple things
1. In my case I am using an Innovate Motorsports MTX-L gauge
paired with a wideband Bosch sensor. I have cleaned the sensor in MEK
once and recalibrated it once as well. This seems to extend the life by
a little bit but in the end, I have already planned for frequent sensor
replacement. I look at it as the cost of flying and for having chosen a
Mazda 3-Rotor with ECU controlled injectors (ala Tracy Crook).
2. Most =9Cmodern=9D ECUs will accept input from a
wideband sensor and =9Cself adjust=9D based on the readings.
Even the =9Cold school=9D Tracy Crook ECU actually does use
the O2 sensor input which makes programming it a little better. There
is a knob on his unit that allows manual mixture adjustments and it does
work but am not sure what electronics are involved in the process
(rheostat?)
3. Analog output (basically voltage) on my MTX-L (2 independent
channels/leads) is programmable and I have one wired to Tracy=99s
ECU and the other to the EFIS. Both are set to wideband 0v to 5v and
corresponding A/F ratio. NOTE =93 I am taking output
AFTER the gauge does what it does to the sensor signal. I gave up
trying to intercept the signal and do anything productive with
it
Not sure any of this helps, but for what it is worth, I am WAY happier
KNOWING my A/F mixture and making minor tweaks (again Tracy Crook EC3)
along the way.
Trent
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Ernest Christley
Sent: Wednesday, March 07, 2018 10:56 AM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Asleep...now waking up
Lead poisons the sensors fairly quickly for control use. It will remain
useful for manual mixture control for quite a while, but the lead slows
the response to changes. Most ECMs needs millisecond updates to keep
the mixture under control, but the lead will slow it to tenths of
seconds.
I use a narrowband gauge for mixture control, and that does work quite
well.
On Wednesday, March 7, 2018 12:29 PM, yellowduckduo
<yellowduckduo@gmail.com> wrote:
It depends on the ECM and what sensor is being used.
Older narrow band sensors rapidly switch between about 0 volts and about
1 volt and the ecm generally will throw a fault code if it does not
switch back and forth quite frequently.
Newer units use wide band sensors that require fairly complex
controllers that often generate up to 5 volts output.
It is difficult to use any of the sensor modifications for long term
mixture control with an automotive ecm. They are smart enough to start
throwing fault codes and various limp modes if a signal is out of range
for very long.
Ken
On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 11:47 AM, Bob Verwey <bob.verwey@gmail.com>
wrote:
So then let me put a question out there. To do with using ECM's...on
automotive engine conversions...what kind of signal is derived from the
Lamda sensor?
What I am wondering is how one can influence mixture by changing the
feedback from said sensor to the ECM....IOW fooling it into changing the
mixture....say with a rheostat?
On 07 Mar 2018 6:19 PM, "Rene" <rene@felker.com> wrote:
Still listening..just nothing to say. :)
Rene'
801-721-6080
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server @matronics.com
<mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com>
<owner-aeroelectric-list-serve r@matronics.com
<mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com> > On Behalf Of
Henry Roden
Sent: Wednesday, March 07, 2018 9:01 AM
<mailto:aeroelectric-list@matronics.com>
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Asleep?
Has everyone gone to sleep or is it just me that has seen no new
messages in the last week or so?
Henry
<https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm
_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=icon>
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Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Asleep...now waking up |
At 10:47 AM 3/7/2018, you wrote:
>So then let me put a question out there. To do
>with using ECM's...on automotive engine
>conversions...what kind of signal is derived from the Lamda sensor?=C2 =C2
>What I am wondering is how one can influence
>mixture by changing the feedback from said
>sensor to the ECM....IOW fooling it into
>changing the mixture....say with a rheostat?=C2
The 'lambda sensor' detects the presense
of oxygen in the engine's exhaust gasses.
It outputs a 0-1000 millivolt level DC signal
that is indicative of oxygen the exhaust
stream.
Here's a general run-down on the technology
and practice.
https://goo.gl/dKy9JW
Depending on which type of O2 sensors
are in your system, they'll present
a voltage on the order of 450 millvolts
at stoichiometric fuel mixture. You
can 'spoof' the signal into the ECM
by applying a 'bias current' to the sensor's
output . . . the magnitude depends on the
sensor's output impedance.
I wasn't able to find any mention of output
impedance for these devices . . . but it
isn't difficult to measure. Is your system
installed and running?
Bob . . .
Message 14
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| Subject: | 1/4 watt Panasonic resistors |
I am building the Audio Isolation Amplifier detailed on the Aeroelectric Connection.
I purchased some of the residual boards from Bob Nuckolls in late 2017.
It's been a while since I've done any board level work but I have enough self
confidence (justified or not) and experience to not have many concerns with
the project.
Anyway, a recent shoulder surgery provided the "free time" to stop working on my
plane and spend some quality time with a soldering iron. I ordered components
from Digikey and received the completed order in just a few days. I was surprised
to find the 1/4 watt resistors appear to be (what I remember from years
past) as about the size of 1/8 resistors (i.e. just under 4 mm in length).
These are mostly Panasonic resistors and when I go to the Panasonic datasheet (also
available on the Digikey site) the specification shows that yes, their 1/4
resistors are about the size of what I recall (from years back) as being 1/8
watt resistors.
So, what gives? Every reference I find on the "web" (other than the Panasonic
specification document) shows 1/4 watt resistors about the size of what they were
when I last visited a "walk in" Radio Shack store (6 to 8 mm long).
I don't want to go through the trouble of assembling the amplifier if I'm just
making an expensive smoke generator.
Any comments the forum can provide would be much appreciated.
Dan Theis.
Sonex 1362
Plans building and enjoying every year of it...
--------
Scratch building Sonex #1362
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=478491#478491
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: 1/4 watt Panasonic resistors |
Could be something other than traditional carbon=2E I wouldn't worry about
it=2E Most of them could probably be smaller than 1/8 watt, anyway=2E
Char
lie
On Mar 7, 2018, 8:50 PM, at 8:50 PM, dj_theis <djtheis58@gmail=2Ecom
> wrote:
><djtheis58@g
mail=2Ecom>
>
>I am building the Audio Isolation Amplifier detailed on the
>Aeroelectric Connection=2E I purchased some of the residual boards from
>
Bob Nuckolls in late 2017=2E It's been a while since I've done any
>board
level work but I have enough self confidence (justified or not)
>and exper
ience to not have many concerns with the project=2E
>
>Anyway, a recent sho
ulder surgery provided the "free time" to stop
>working on my plane and spe
nd some quality time with a soldering iron=2E
>I ordered components from D
igikey and received the completed order in
>just a few days=2E I was surp
rised to find the 1/4 watt resistors appear
>to be (what I remember from ye
ars past) as about the size of 1/8
>resistors (i=2Ee=2E just under 4 mm in
length)=2E
>
>These are mostly Panasonic resistors and when I go to the P
anasonic
>datasheet (also available on the Digikey site) the specification
shows
>that yes, their 1/4 resistors are about the size of what I recall (f
rom
>years back) as being 1/8 watt resistors=2E
>
>So, what gives? Every r
eference I find on the "web" (other than the
>Panasonic specification docum
ent) shows 1/4 watt resistors about the
>size of what they were when I last
visited a "walk in" Radio Shack
>store (6 to 8 mm long)=2E
>
>I don't want
to go through the trouble of assembling the amplifier if
>I'm just making
an expensive smoke generator=2E
>
>Any comments the forum can provide would
be much appreciated=2E
>
>Dan Theis=2E
>
>Sonex 1362
>Plans building and e
njoying every year of it=2E=2E=2E
>
>--------
>Scratch building Sonex #1362
>
>
>Read this topic online here:
>
>http://forums=2Ematronics=2Ecom/v
iewtopic=2Ephp?p=478491#478491
>
>
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