AeroElectric-List Digest Archive

Thu 06/28/18


Total Messages Posted: 13



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 03:38 AM - IMPORTANCE OF ESSAY WRITING (christopherkates)
     2. 05:43 AM - Re: DC motors (Bob Verwey)
     3. 05:43 AM - Re: IMPORTANCE OF ESSAY WRITING (Robert Reed)
     4. 05:57 AM - Re: IMPORTANCE OF ESSAY WRITING (Tim Olson)
     5. 07:43 AM - Re: IMPORTANCE OF ESSAY WRITING (John Tipton)
     6. 01:23 PM - Z-14 Question (Rocketman1988)
     7. 04:09 PM - Re: Z-14 Question (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
     8. 04:51 PM - Re: Z-14 Question (user9253)
     9. 05:10 PM - Re: Z-14 Question (Bill Watson)
    10. 06:30 PM - Re: Z-14 Question (Rocketman1988)
    11. 06:57 PM - Re: Z-14 Question (Charlie England)
    12. 07:20 PM - Re: Z-14 Question (Kelly McMullen)
    13. 08:54 PM - Re: IMPORTANCE OF ESSAY WRITING (FLYaDIVE)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 03:38:54 AM PST US
    Subject: IMPORTANCE OF ESSAY WRITING
    From: "christopherkates" <christopherkates035@gmail.com>
    Essay writing is a vital part of your academic year. Students think of essay writing as a boring and valueless activity but essay writing tends to hold much value. Writing essays involves serious thinking. It is not a difficult task to search for the material for an essay but what is complicated is the arrangement of the information gathered while writing an essay. Accumulating and creating a flow of writing an essay is an art to be owned. Students get no of assignments in various subjects to write essays on different topics. To write their paper on different subjects is a challenging task, as they need to gather all the required information and then they need to assemble it in a well and organized manner. Many students find it boring since they don't have that creative mind in gathering the information and accumulating them to write their paper. So they approach the professional people from custom essay writing service (https://essaycaptains.com/) that helps them in writing essay as per their requirements. Students just give them the topic and the required information title to be included in their paper. The writers gather the information and prepare the best and unique paper for them. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=481245#481245


    Message 2


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    Time: 05:43:53 AM PST US
    From: Bob Verwey <bob.verwey@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: DC motors
    Bob thanks for that very coherent expose of the dark secrets of DC motors <lol> Neophytes such as I benefit greatly from your missives... Best... Bob Verwey 082 331 2727 On 28 June 2018 at 04:54, Robert L. Nuckolls, III < nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com> wrote: > I've had a couple of queries about observed motor > behaviors wherein the writer was certain they > observed situations where motors struggling under > low voltage caused protection devices to operate. > > It's easy to characterize the physics of a DC motor. > A motor reveals most of its secrets when you measure > three characteristics: (1) The motor's DC resistance; > it's torque constant (Kt) wherein you measure the > output torque when excited by some value of test > current. From this you can derive In-Oz of torque > per amp of current draw; (3) the counter EMF constant > (Ke) in RPM/Volt by spinning the motor at some known > RPM and measuring the motor's output voltage as > a generator. > > Once you have these three numbers you can construct > a plot of motor performance at various voltages. An exemplar > plot is shown below: > > > [image: Emacs!] > > Applying 10V to this hypothetical motor with a locked rotor > would produce a stall current of 20 amps. If a torque watch > were attached to the immobilized shaft it would read 60 in-oz. > This experiment yields a motor resistance of 0.5 ohms and > Kt - 3.0 in-oz/amp. > > Okay, now spin hte motor with a drill motor. Measure the > RPM and voltage at the power leads. In this case we would > find that the motor 'generates' 1.0 volts per 300 RPM > of the shaft. This number lets us put a counter-emf scale > alongside the RPM scale. > > Note that the family of voltage lines are parallel > to each other. The SLOPE of these lines is proportional > to the motor's DC resistance. If the motor's resistance > were 1.0 ohms, then stall current at the lower end of each > voltage line would be 1/2 that presently illustrated. > I.e. a new family of lines having 2x the slope of the > 0.5 ohm lines shown. > > Let's take a hypothetical application where we operate > this motor at 15.0 volts applied and a load of 38 in-oz. > The plotted characteristics tells us that the motor will > run at 2600 RPM and draw a current of about 12.6 Amps. > 15 Volts applied across an Rm = 0.5 ohms yields an inrush > current of 30A . . . which could be added to the plot > above if I extended it another 5A to the right. > > You can pick any spot on the face of the plot, draw a 0.5 > ohm load line thorough it and you have a new applied voltage, > running current, RPM and stall current. > > But without increasing the load on the motor shaft, there > is no way we can make the motor draw MORE current by > reducing its applied voltage. > > > Bob . . . >


    Message 3


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    Time: 05:43:58 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: IMPORTANCE OF ESSAY WRITING
    From: Robert Reed <robertr237@att.net>
    What exactly does this have to do with Aircraft electrical systems? Bob Reed Sent from my iPhone > On Jun 28, 2018, at 5:38 AM, christopherkates <christopherkates035@gmail.com> wrote: > > > Essay writing is a vital part of your academic year. Students think of essay writing as a boring and valueless activity but essay writing tends to hold much value. Writing essays involves serious thinking. It is not a difficult task to search for the material for an essay but what is complicated is the arrangement of the information gathered while writing an essay. Accumulating and creating a flow of writing an essay is an art to be owned. Students get no of assignments in various subjects to write essays on different topics. To write their paper on different subjects is a challenging task, as they need to gather all the required information and then they need to assemble it in a well and organized manner. > Many students find it boring since they don't have that creative mind in gathering the information and accumulating them to write their paper. So they approach the professional people from custom essay writing service (https://essaycaptains.com/) that helps them in writing essay as per their requirements. Students just give them the topic and the required information title to be included in their paper. The writers gather the information and prepare the best and unique paper for them. > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=481245#481245 > > > > > > > > >


    Message 4


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    Time: 05:57:10 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: IMPORTANCE OF ESSAY WRITING
    From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
    I'm sure his email account is probably just compromised. Tim On 6/28/2018 7:43 AM, Robert Reed wrote: > > What exactly does this have to do with Aircraft electrical systems? > > Bob Reed > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Jun 28, 2018, at 5:38 AM, christopherkates <christopherkates035@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> >> Essay writing is a vital part of your academic year. Students think of essay writing as a boring and valueless activity but essay writing tends to hold much value. Writing essays involves serious thinking. It is not a difficult task to search for the material for an essay but what is complicated is the arrangement of the information gathered while writing an essay. Accumulating and creating a flow of writing an essay is an art to be owned. Students get no of assignments in various subjects to write essays on different topics. To write their paper on different subjects is a challenging task, as they need to gather all the required information and then they need to assemble it in a well and organized manner. >> Many students find it boring since they don't have that creative mind in gathering the information and accumulating them to write their paper. So they approach the professional people from custom essay writing service (https://essaycaptains.com/) that helps them in writing essay as per their requirements. Students just give them the topic and the required information title to be included in their paper. The writers gather the information and prepare the best and unique paper for them. >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=481245#481245 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > >


    Message 5


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    Time: 07:43:22 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: IMPORTANCE OF ESSAY WRITING
    From: John Tipton <jmtipton@btopenworld.com>
    Or is it to help some write a decent comprehensible email message Sent from my iPad ----x--O--x---- > On 28 Jun 2018, at 1:56 pm, Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com> wrote: > > > I'm sure his email account is probably just compromised. > Tim > > >> On 6/28/2018 7:43 AM, Robert Reed wrote: >> What exactly does this have to do with Aircraft electrical systems? >> Bob Reed >> Sent from my iPhone >>> On Jun 28, 2018, at 5:38 AM, christopherkates <christopherkates035@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>> >>> Essay writing is a vital part of your academic year. Students think of essay writing as a boring and valueless activity but essay writing tends to hold much value. Writing essays involves serious thinking. It is not a difficult task to search for the material for an essay but what is complicated is the arrangement of the information gathered while writing an essay. Accumulating and creating a flow of writing an essay is an art to be owned. Students get no of assignments in various subjects to write essays on different topics. To write their paper on different subjects is a challenging task, as they need to gather all the required information and then they need to assemble it in a well and organized manner. >>> Many students find it boring since they don't have that creative mind in gathering the information and accumulating them to write their paper. So they approach the professional people from custom essay writing service (https://essaycaptains.com/) that helps them in writing essay as per their requirements. Students just give them the topic and the required information title to be included in their paper. The writers gather the information and prepare the best and unique paper for them. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Read this topic online here: >>> >>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=481245#481245 > > >


    Message 6


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    Time: 01:23:24 PM PST US
    Subject: Z-14 Question
    From: "Rocketman1988" <Rocketman@etczone.com>
    All, I am going to use the Z-14 layout for my RV-10. The -10 has aft mounted batteries, so I will need to run the main buss wires from the back to the front, where all of the electronics are. My question is: Do these wires need to have individual current limiters on them? The distance from the batteries to the battery buss location is about 8 1/2 feet. I am planning on using #8 AWG wire to feed each respective battery buss. Thoughts? Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=481258#481258


    Message 7


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    Time: 04:09:46 PM PST US
    From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
    Subject: Re: Z-14 Question
    At 03:22 PM 6/28/2018, you wrote: ><Rocketman@etczone.com> > >All, > >I am going to use the Z-14 layout for my RV-10. The -10 has aft >mounted batteries, so I will need to run the main buss wires from >the back to the front, where all of the electronics are. > >My question is: Do these wires need to have individual current >limiters on them? The distance from the batteries to the battery >buss location is about 8 1/2 feet. I am planning on using #8 AWG >wire to feed each respective battery buss. > >Thoughts? put the crossfeed contactor on the firewall and use it as the grand-central-station for fat wires. Then all you need running back to the batteries is a pair of cranking feeders. 4AWG would be fine for these as you'll have the the pair in parallel for engine cranking. Bob . . .


    Message 8


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    Time: 04:51:30 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Z-14 Question
    From: "user9253" <fransew@gmail.com>
    Current limiters should not be used in the start circuit because they will drop the voltage to the starter motor. -------- Joe Gores Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=481261#481261


    Message 9


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    Time: 05:10:15 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Z-14 Question
    From: Bill Watson <Mauledriver@nc.rr.com>
    On 6/28/2018 7:08 PM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote: > At 03:22 PM 6/28/2018, you wrote: >> <Rocketman@etczone.com> >> >> All, >> >> I am going to use the Z-14 layout for my RV-10. The -10 has aft >> mounted batteries, so I will need to run the main buss wires from the >> back to the front, where all of the electronics are. >> >> My question is: Do these wires need to have individual current >> limiters on them? The distance from the batteries to the battery >> buss location is about 8 1/2 feet. I am planning on using #8 AWG >> wire to feed each respective battery buss. >> >> Thoughts? > > put the crossfeed contactor on the firewall and use it as > the grand-central-station for fat wires. Then all you > need running back to the batteries is a pair > of cranking feeders. 4AWG would be fine for these > as you'll have the the pair in parallel for > engine cranking. > > Bob . . . > I have a Z-14 in an RV10. Bob's approach sounds great. I like the symmetry. Not having asked the question 10 years ago when laying my Z-14 out, I took a different approach. I have the Xfeed mounted with the other two contactors back on the battery tray. 2 AWG links them all up. Then I have a single 2AWG lead going to the starter Contactor. The other side has an 8AWG link going forward to one fuse panel (bus) and an 8AWG link going from the starter contactor to the other fuse panel (bus). The current limiters on mounted on the firewall and protect the lines going from the 2 alternators to the 2 main bus feeds. I've attached a schematic with the locations of devices implied. Bill "I love my Z-14" Watson --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus


    Message 10


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    Time: 06:30:59 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Z-14 Question
    From: "Rocketman1988" <Rocketman@etczone.com>
    Thanks! That is pretty much what I am going to do...all three contractors near battery, one #2 to starter solenoid, two #8 battery buss feeders going forward... Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=481263#481263


    Message 11


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    Time: 06:57:03 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Z-14 Question
    From: Charlie England <ceengland7@gmail.com>
    On 6/28/2018 7:01 PM, Bill Watson wrote: > On 6/28/2018 7:08 PM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote: >> At 03:22 PM 6/28/2018, you wrote: >>> <Rocketman@etczone.com> >>> >>> All, >>> >>> I am going to use the Z-14 layout for my RV-10. The -10 has aft >>> mounted batteries, so I will need to run the main buss wires from >>> the back to the front, where all of the electronics are. >>> >>> My question is: Do these wires need to have individual current >>> limiters on them? The distance from the batteries to the battery >>> buss location is about 8 1/2 feet. I am planning on using #8 AWG >>> wire to feed each respective battery buss. >>> >>> Thoughts? >> >> put the crossfeed contactor on the firewall and use it as >> the grand-central-station for fat wires. Then all you >> need running back to the batteries is a pair >> of cranking feeders. 4AWG would be fine for these >> as you'll have the the pair in parallel for >> engine cranking. >> >> Bob . . . >> > I have a Z-14 in an RV10. Bob's approach sounds great. I like the > symmetry. Not having asked the question 10 years ago when laying my > Z-14 out, I took a different approach. > > I have the Xfeed mounted with the other two contactors back on the > battery tray. 2 AWG links them all up. Then I have a single 2AWG > lead going to the starter Contactor. The other side has an 8AWG link > going forward to one fuse panel (bus) and an 8AWG link going from the > starter contactor to the other fuse panel (bus). > > The current limiters on mounted on the firewall and protect the lines > going from the 2 alternators to the 2 main bus feeds. > > I've attached a schematic with the locations of devices implied. > > Bill "I love my Z-14" Watson > Bill, Your install is obviously working, but it should be noted that your alternator B lead protection should be on the other end. If there's a fault in that wire, it should be big enough to handle everything the alternator can throw at it, but it'll never be big enough to handle everything the battery(s) can throw at it. FWIW, Charlie --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus


    Message 12


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    Time: 07:20:12 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Z-14 Question
    From: Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com>
    Having a flying IFR RV-10 myself I question the benefits of dual batteries along with dual alternators, etc. Almost all EFIS panels these days offer a backup battery, good for 1 hour or more. I have one for each of my EFIS screens. Most ship's batteries these days are good for an hour or more of minimized current. An Ipad can provide hours of moving map and GPS, and with some extras a nearly full EFIS screen. I can see if you choose to have dual electronic ignition systems that then you are vulnerable to lack of electrons for at least one. It seems to me that the SD-20 alternator for a backup source of power, with a small, Odessey 680 or less mounted on the firewall should handle any of those needs. You only need one good sized battery, such as the Odessey 925 mounted in stock rear location, for starter operation.s Or just keep one magneto for the backup, and eliminate need for dual electric power sources. You get 85% of the electronic ignition by replacing one mag. Just my opinion, but I would strive to keep the design as simple as possible, and avoid having totally dual everything just because you can. Just thinking your goals might be achieved with a simpler system. Kelly On 6/28/2018 6:56 PM, Charlie England wrote: >>> >> I have a Z-14 in an RV10. Bob's approach sounds great. I like the >> symmetry. Not having asked the question 10 years ago when laying my >> Z-14 out, I took a different approach. >> >> I have the Xfeed mounted with the other two contactors back on the >> battery tray. 2 AWG links them all up. Then I have a single 2AWG >> lead going to the starter Contactor. The other side has an 8AWG link >> going forward to one fuse panel (bus) and an 8AWG link going from the >> starter contactor to the other fuse panel (bus). >> >> The current limiters on mounted on the firewall and protect the lines >> going from the 2 alternators to the 2 main bus feeds. >> >> I've attached a schematic with the locations of devices implied. >> >> Bill "I love my Z-14" Watson >> > Bill, > > Your install is obviously working, but it should be noted that your > alternator B lead protection should be on the other end. If there's a > fault in that wire, it should be big enough to handle everything the > alternator can throw at it, but it'll never be big enough to handle > everything the battery(s) can throw at it. > > FWIW, > > Charlie >


    Message 13


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    Time: 08:54:59 PM PST US
    From: FLYaDIVE <flyadive@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: IMPORTANCE OF ESSAY WRITING
    HMmmmm... Do you think the subject of the posted mail was 'essay' writing? Hard to say - They only repeated the word 'essay' 10 times in one paragraph of 10 sentences. Ya can't say they deivated off topic! That's OK, in my day it was called Technical Writing. AND... Because of the type of people that read technical reports and made Dollar Deci$ion$ based on them - You HAD to emphasize the important points by constantly repeating the key facts. ALSO! You had to make sure their minds did not wander by substituting pronouns for nouns. On Thu, Jun 28, 2018 at 6:38 AM, christopherkates < christopherkates035@gmail.com> wrote: > christopherkates035@gmail.com> > > Essay writing is a vital part of your academic year. Students think of > essay writing as a boring and valueless activity but essay writing tends to > hold much value. Writing essays involves serious thinking. It is not a > difficult task to search for the material for an essay but what is > complicated is the arrangement of the information gathered while writing an > essay. Accumulating and creating a flow of writing an essay is an art to be > owned. Students get no of assignments in various subjects to write essays > on different topics. To write their paper on different subjects is a > challenging task, as they need to gather all the required information and > then they need to assemble it in a well and organized manner. > Many students find it boring since they don't have that creative mind in > gathering the information and accumulating them to write their paper. So > they approach the professional people from custom essay writing service ( > https://essaycaptains.com/) that helps them in writing essay as per their > requirements. Students just give them the topic and the required > information title to be included in their paper. The writers gather the > information and prepare the best and unique paper for them. > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=481245#481245 > >




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