---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 09/09/18: 7 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 09:54 AM - Re: Rotax 912iS Electrical Charging System (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 2. 10:59 AM - Re: Arctic super-flex wire (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 3. 01:15 PM - Re: Arctic super-flex wire (Henry Hallam) 4. 01:43 PM - Re: Arctic super-flex wire (Charlie England) 5. 01:48 PM - Re: Arctic super-flex wire (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 6. 02:39 PM - Re: Arctic super-flex wire (Ken Ryan) 7. 02:59 PM - B-lead relay for IR Alternator (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 09:54:36 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Rotax 912iS Electrical Charging System > >The strange thing is the Dynon Skyview default for this engine's >voltage output has 13.5 in the middle of the green band. For a >Lycoming or Continental I put the green band at 14-14.5 An SVLA battery should be run at no less than 14.0 and no more that 14.8 with 14.4 being the nominal "target". Anything below 14.0 has a high probability of failing to top off the battery after a significant discharge. This has nothing to do with the make/model of the engine. >Is anyone here familiar with the 912iS? If this is how the system is >designed, what are the implications for an Odyssey PC680 that spends >most of it's waking life at 13.5 V? If true, that battery is seriously under-served for charging. Your proposal to investigate battery terminal voltage while in flight is a good move. Keep in mind just because a certain voltage is recorded at one place in a system, it's not a sure bet that the same voltage will be recorded elsewhere even tho both points are connected with copper pathways. There are subtle but significant voltage drops in system wiring. Further, if the readings are taken with two different instruments, it's possible that they may not be calibrated to the same accuracy. Irrespective of engine, the voltage regulator's prime directive is TAKE CARE OF A BATTERY. Given that there's a lot of copper monkey-motion between the regulator and battery, the regulator's electronics can only ASSUME that it knows what battery voltage is. For SVLA batteries, voltage in cruising flight with a fully charged battery should be in the 14.2 to 14.6 range. If the alternator is off for any reason, the battery voltage will fall quickly to something under 13.0 volts. when the battery falls to 11.0 volts, it has probably less than 5% of it's maximum capacity remaining. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 10:59:52 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Arctic super-flex wire At 06:14 PM 8/23/2018, you wrote: >Short lengths of 12,10,8 and 4awg are on the way. Let us know what you think. > > >Sent from my Android. Sorry Steve. Got Steve's samples in the mail a few days ago. Pretty nice stuff. Certainly adequate to our fat-wire needs. Flexibility on the same order as welding cable and available at comparable prices. http://aeroelectric.com/Mfgr_Data/Wire/Actic%20UltraFlex/Arctic%20UltraFlex.pdf I did a po' boy's fat-wire terminal installation by the stuff-n-solder method . . . http://aeroelectric.com/articles/big_term.pdf The insulation was well behaved and demonstrated little if any melt-back from the soldering operation. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 01:15:34 PM PST US From: Henry Hallam Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Arctic super-flex wire Bob, My concern with similar high-strand-count wires for aircraft applications has been that the soft silicone insulation doesn't seem to offer much protection against cutting and abrasion. What's your take on that? Just be careful to route and support it properly and avoid nicking it with tools during maintenance? Or is the insulation on this wire superior? Henry On Sun, Sep 9, 2018, 11:07 Robert L. Nuckolls, III < nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com> wrote: > At 06:14 PM 8/23/2018, you wrote: > > Short lengths of 12,10,8 and 4awg are on the way. Let us know what you > think. > > > Sent from my Android. Sorry Steve. > > > Got Steve's samples in the mail a few days ago. > Pretty nice stuff. Certainly adequate to our > fat-wire needs. Flexibility on the same order > as welding cable and available at comparable > prices. > > > http://aeroelectric.com/Mfgr_Data/Wire/Actic%20UltraFlex/Arctic%20UltraFlex.pdf > > > I did a po' boy's fat-wire terminal installation > by the stuff-n-solder method . . . > > http://aeroelectric.com/articles/big_term.pdf > > The insulation was well behaved and demonstrated > little if any melt-back from the soldering operation. > > > Bob . . . > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 01:43:15 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Arctic super-flex wire From: Charlie England I'm not Bob, but if you're talking about the welding cable a lot of us use, do you know any welders? Ever watched what happens to cables on a shop floor, or on a construction site? The bigger (pardon the pun) issue is that the insulation is quite a bit thicker than milspec wire's insulation, so if you're running it from behind the seats to the firewall, it'll fill up the holes in your bulkheads quicker. Not sure about the silicone reference; EPDM seems to be a more common insulator. Charlie On 9/9/2018 3:14 PM, Henry Hallam wrote: > Bob, > > My concern with similar high-strand-count wires for aircraft > applications has been that the soft silicone insulation doesn't seem > to offer much protection against cutting and abrasion. > > What's your take on that? Just be careful to route and support it > properly and avoid nicking it with tools during maintenance? Or is the > insulation on this wire superior? > > Henry > > On Sun, Sep 9, 2018, 11:07 Robert L. Nuckolls, III > > > wrote: > > At 06:14 PM 8/23/2018, you wrote: >> Short lengths of 12,10,8 and 4awg are on the way. Let us know >> what you think. >> >> >> Sent from my Android. Sorry Steve. > > Got Steve's samples in the mail a few days ago. > Pretty nice stuff. Certainly adequate to our > fat-wire needs. Flexibility on the same order > as welding cable and available at comparable > prices. > > http://aeroelectric.com/Mfgr_Data/Wire/Actic%20UltraFlex/Arctic%20UltraFlex.pdf > > > I did a po' boy's fat-wire terminal installation > by the stuff-n-solder method . . . > > http://aeroelectric.com/articles/big_term.pdf > > > The insulation was well behaved and demonstrated > little if any melt-back from the soldering operation. > > > Bob . . . > --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 01:48:32 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Arctic super-flex wire At 03:14 PM 9/9/2018, you wrote: >Bob, > >My concern with similar high-strand-count wires for aircraft >applications has been that the soft silicone insulation doesn't seem >to offer much protection against cutting and abrasion. > >What's your take on that? Just be careful to route and support it >properly and avoid nicking it with tools during maintenance? Or is >the insulation on this wire superior? > >Henry The samples I have don't look/feel like silicone. The product data sheet I posted speaks to properties of the insulation but without mentioning 'silicone'. The same data sheet suggests a spectrum of applications . . . Emacs! I suspect that mechanical risks to insulation failure in airplanes is no greater than many of those applications cited. "Cutting" and "abrasion" distresses will attack ANY insulation. Installation and routing practices should seek to eliminate such risks irrespective of type of insulation. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 02:39:58 PM PST US From: Ken Ryan Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Arctic super-flex wire Thanks for checking it out Bob. Sent from my Android. Sorry Steve. On Sun, Sep 9, 2018, 10:04 Robert L. Nuckolls, III < nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com> wrote: > At 06:14 PM 8/23/2018, you wrote: > > Short lengths of 12,10,8 and 4awg are on the way. Let us know what you > think. > > > Sent from my Android. Sorry Steve. > > > Got Steve's samples in the mail a few days ago. > Pretty nice stuff. Certainly adequate to our > fat-wire needs. Flexibility on the same order > as welding cable and available at comparable > prices. > > > http://aeroelectric.com/Mfgr_Data/Wire/Actic%20UltraFlex/Arctic%20UltraFlex.pdf > > > I did a po' boy's fat-wire terminal installation > by the stuff-n-solder method . . . > > http://aeroelectric.com/articles/big_term.pdf > > The insulation was well behaved and demonstrated > little if any melt-back from the soldering operation. > > > Bob . . . > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 02:59:01 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: AeroElectric-List: B-lead relay for IR Alternator At 10:07 AM 8/23/2018, you wrote: >At 05:36 AM 8/23/2018, you wrote: >>i started wiring my ovm and i have a question >>about auto relays. the contactor i have for the >>lead off my alternator really bugs me that i am >>adding 14 ounces just for this ''switch''. my >>alternator is rated at 37 amps but the 40 and >>even 50 amp auto relays look like that have a >>''faston tab'' for their terminal. are these >>terminals up to carrying the load from the alternator? >>=C2 bob > > You might consider this product: > >https://goo.gl/UAVJMw > > I have no experience with these . . . I'm > going to order one to peek and poke at . . . > but the specs are right. > > I'd wire the b-lead up with 6AWG welding > cable. > >https://goo.gl/BxAj1V I ordered one of those relays in to look at: Here are the 'tear down' photos. https://tinyurl.com/y7aw646a This critter seems nicely built. The resting current for the coil at 14v is about 0.3 amps for an internal dissipation of about 4.5 watts. Not seriously pushing it for this size package. I think I would mount it with the terminals facing down. This would cause any drips or condensate to collect on the closeout panel . . . and facilitate expulsion during the next flight cycle. At 4.5 watts it's too hot to keep your hand on it . . . but battery contactors do that too. Internal 'werks' seem robust enough. The stationary and moveable contacts both feature precious alloy crowns. I think it's worth trying as the b-lead disconnect relay in an ov management system on an internally regulated alternator. Bob . . . ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message aeroelectric-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/aeroelectric-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/aeroelectric-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.