---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 09/18/18: 8 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:08 PM - Re: Re: IVO current limiter project (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 2. 12:08 PM - Re: Re: Rotax Charging System (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 3. 02:56 PM - Did you install a "battery bus"? (Mickey Coggins) 4. 03:12 PM - Re: Did you install a "battery bus"? (Peter Pengilly) 5. 03:33 PM - Re: Did you install a "battery bus"? (Robert Borger) 6. 06:22 PM - Re: Did you install a "battery bus"? (Sebastien) 7. 06:34 PM - Re: Battery Minder connector (ronaldcox) 8. 08:55 PM - Re: Did you install a "battery bus"? (Art Zemon) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:08:44 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: IVO current limiter project At 09:29 PM 9/17/2018, you wrote: >The last 2 posts I saw on this were these 2: > >Robert L. Nuckolls, III >Fri 7/21/2017, 12:23 PM >Got the board stuffed. > >http://tinyurl.com/ycemckye > >I need to get my pic programmer up and running >for a couple other programs. I'll pop a 9023 chip >and see how critter works. > > Bob . . . > >AND > >Paul A. Fisher >Wed 10/4/2017, 11:53 AM >Bob and all, >Did we ever finish this project? The message attached below was the >last one I heard about it. I don't know if that means it worked, >that it didn't work and we gave up, or everyone just lost interest. >I don't have an IVO prop, so I don't need the limiter. I just >wondered if the software that I contributed needs any additional refinement. >Paul A. Fisher >Q-200, N17PF >RV-7A, N18PF > >If there was a limiter produced I didn't see it. > >Deems Okay guys . . . looks like I dropped the ball on this one. I'll hide behind the 'too many projects' phenomenon. Got another grand-kid living with us for a year to try alternatives to Wichita schools . . . etc. But that's not an excuse. I'll dig around and get that package together. I know Paul had sent me some POC software and I don't recall having loaded it into a chip. We'll get that pot back on a front burner today. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 12:08:45 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Rotax Charging System At 10:24 PM 9/17/2018, you wrote: >>I wonder if that capacitor is an artifact from back when PM >>alternators were operated in vehicles that were designed with no >>battery. Not unlike the avionics master as a holdover from the >>prehistoric germanium semiconductor days. >> >>Charlie > > An excellent hypothesis . . . but it seems > it equally likely that somebody looked at that > full wave rectifier downstream of an AC > source and thought, "Gee, every circuit like > that in the past has had a capacitor across > the output . . . shucks . . . why not?" Let's noodle some of the math that helps us figure out just how effective a capacitor might be for 'filtering' a PM alternator system: A fundamental quality of capacitors is described by this formula: Volts/Second = Amps/Farad meaning that if you apply 1 amp of constant current to a 1 Farad capacitor, you'll see voltage across the capacitor rise at a rate of 1 Volt per Second. How rapidly will the voltage change across at 22,000uF capacitor in a PM alternator system with 10A load assuming the positive excursion has just charged the capacitor to the expected peak voltage? V/S = 10/0.022 = 454 Volts/Second or let's say about 500 mVolts/mSecond. Adding a 500 mV/mS plot to the no-capacitor plot of SD8 performance we see Emacs! By inspection we can deduce that the addition of 22KuF to the output would have no appreciable effect on the voltage plot shown. If we put a 47KuF cap on it (less than 1/2 the slope) we might see a reduction in pk-pk excursion to something on the order of 200mV . . . but why bother? We know that appliances qualified to run in aircraft EXPECT to see noises equal to or perhaps greater than what's depicted above with no capacitor. I might also add that automotive electrical systems are completely devoid of electrical system noise filters that address the spectrum of alternator ripple and switching. So if there is a reason based on physics for adding capacitors to the PM alternators, it's not intuitively clear. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 02:56:26 PM PST US From: Mickey Coggins Subject: AeroElectric-List: Did you install a "battery bus"? Hi, I'm struggling to find anything that really needs to be connected to an always-hot battery bus. I have an io360 with pmags which will power themselves in case of issue with the normal power bus, my mission is vfr day, GRT EFIS, Trig Radio and transponder, some lights (that I don't really need), and that's about it. I could see some value in an always hot cigar lighter-type connection to charge a phone while on the ground, or to send some electrons to the battery, but not much else. Am I missing something or are there others that don't have a battery bus? Mickey Coggins ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 03:12:32 PM PST US From: Peter Pengilly Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Did you install a "battery bus"? Clock is about the only thing From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com On Behalf Of Mickey Coggins Sent: 18 September 2018 13:36 Subject: AeroElectric-List: Did you install a "battery bus"? Hi, I'm struggling to find anything that really needs to be connected to an always-hot battery bus. I have an io360 with pmags which will power themselves in case of issue with the normal power bus, my mission is vfr day, GRT EFIS, Trig Radio and transponder, some lights (that I don't really need), and that's about it. I could see some value in an always hot cigar lighter-type connection to charge a phone while on the ground, or to send some electrons to the battery, but not much else. Am I missing something or are there others that don't have a battery bus? Mickey Coggins ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 03:33:57 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Did you install a "battery bus"? From: Robert Borger Some GPS units have a keep-alive circuit requiring connection to a battery buss. Ensures that the GPS is always ready to go without the usual boot up time. On Sep 18, 2018, at 7:35 AM, Mickey Coggins wrote: Hi, I'm struggling to find anything that really needs to be connected to an always-hot battery bus. I have an io360 with pmags which will power themselves in case of issue with the normal power bus, my mission is vfr day, GRT EFIS, Trig Radio and transponder, some lights (that I don't really need), and that's about it. I could see some value in an always hot cigar lighter-type connection to charge a phone while on the ground, or to send some electrons to the battery, but not much else. Am I missing something or are there others that don't have a battery bus? Mickey Coggins ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 06:22:14 PM PST US From: Sebastien Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Did you install a "battery bus"? I have an always hot plug that I can use to either charge the battery or power an accessory (12v air pump, phone charger). I use automotive connector plugs rather than cigarette lighter plugs but basically one cigarette lighter plug wired directly to the battery can be very handy but I can't figure out a use for anything more. On Sep 18, 2018 16:01, "Mickey Coggins" wrote: Hi, I'm struggling to find anything that really needs to be connected to an always-hot battery bus. I have an io360 with pmags which will power themselves in case of issue with the normal power bus, my mission is vfr day, GRT EFIS, Trig Radio and transponder, some lights (that I don't really need), and that's about it. I could see some value in an always hot cigar lighter-type connection to charge a phone while on the ground, or to send some electrons to the battery, but not much else. Am I missing something or are there others that don't have a battery bus? Mickey Coggins ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 06:34:22 PM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Battery Minder connector From: "ronaldcox" You might try something like one of these. https://www.ebay.com/p/Authentic-Anderson-Sb50-Connector-Kit-Gray-8-AWG-2-Pack-2-Connectors/1856190812?iid=221669705387&chn=ps Designed for golf carts, so would certainly handle the current. You could hard-mount one end flush in the fuselage somewhere, and have a robust one-hand connection. Ron -------- Ron Cox Glasair Super II F/T Under Construction at C77 - Still just about to fly! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=483275#483275 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 08:55:13 PM PST US From: Art Zemon Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Did you install a "battery bus"? Mike, I have a battery bus but it only powers two things: the keep-alive line for my MGL EFIS and an LED ceiling light (which has its own on/off switch). If your EFIS doesn't require any keep-alive then you truly might not need a battery bus. And remember... nothing is forever. If you start without one and change your mind, it's OK. You can add a battery bus. Cheers, -- Art Z. On Tue, Sep 18, 2018 at 5:13 PM Mickey Coggins wrote: > Hi, > > I'm struggling to find anything that really needs to be connected to an > always-hot battery bus. > > I have an io360 with pmags which will power themselves in case of issue > with the normal power bus, my mission is vfr day, GRT EFIS, Trig Radio and > transponder, some lights (that I don't really need), and that's about it. > > I could see some value in an always hot cigar lighter-type connection to > charge a phone while on the ground, or to send some electrons to the > battery, but not much else. > > Am I missing something or are there others that don't have a battery bus? > -- https://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ *"We do not see the world as it is. We see the world as we are."* ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message aeroelectric-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/aeroelectric-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/aeroelectric-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.