AeroElectric-List Digest Archive

Sun 09/30/18


Total Messages Posted: 7



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 04:31 AM - Re: LED Noise Filter (William Daniell)
     2. 06:58 AM - Re: LED Noise Filter (Sebastien)
     3. 08:55 AM - Re: LED Noise Filter (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
     4. 11:07 AM - Re: LED Noise Filter (Sebastien)
     5. 04:13 PM - Re: LED Noise Filter (Ernest Christley)
     6. 09:10 PM - Lycoming Knock Sensor ()
     7. 09:52 PM - Re: Lycoming Knock Sensor (Sebastien)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 04:31:11 AM PST US
    From: William Daniell <wdaniell.longport@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: LED Noise Filter
    Having been through this one (cheap chinese landing light)... I bought an USD20 light which completely blocked all comms within 20 feet. I bought another one, American designed made in China for USD30 - and no noise at all. I can dig out the manufacturer if youre interested. Will William Daniell LONGPORT +57 310 295 0744 On Sun, Sep 30, 2018 at 12:16 AM Sebastien <cluros@gmail.com> wrote: > > https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01KJ94Q1K/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 > > If they were the +$300 ones made for aircraft I would call the > manufacturer but these are 15% of the price of the aviation ones so I > understand why the builder chose them. If we can fix this for $20 worth of > parts it makes sense to me. > > On Sat, Sep 29, 2018 at 8:43 PM Robert L. Nuckolls, III < > nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com> wrote: > >> At 03:52 PM 9/29/2018, you wrote: >> >> VHF Radio. Basically background static. On some of the lights it's barely >> noticeable and you have to listen carefully to hear it, on at least one >> light it creates enough VHF noise to break squelch on the radio and creates >> a very noticeable amount of static. >> >> >> Okay, and what is the LED product we're talking about? >> Have you had any conversation wthe the manufacturer? >> >> >> Bob . . . >> >


    Message 2


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    Time: 06:58:00 AM PST US
    From: Sebastien <cluros@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: LED Noise Filter
    Certainly Will. We already have 2 batches of these trying to randomly find some that are better. No noise at all sounds ideal :). On Sun, Sep 30, 2018, 04:35 William Daniell <wdaniell.longport@gmail.com> wrote: > Having been through this one (cheap chinese landing light)... > I bought an USD20 light which completely blocked all comms within 20 feet. > I bought another one, American designed made in China for USD30 - and no > noise at all. I can dig out the manufacturer if youre interested. > Will > William Daniell > LONGPORT > +57 310 295 0744 > > > On Sun, Sep 30, 2018 at 12:16 AM Sebastien <cluros@gmail.com> wrote: > >> >> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01KJ94Q1K/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 >> >> If they were the +$300 ones made for aircraft I would call the >> manufacturer but these are 15% of the price of the aviation ones so I >> understand why the builder chose them. If we can fix this for $20 worth of >> parts it makes sense to me. >> >> On Sat, Sep 29, 2018 at 8:43 PM Robert L. Nuckolls, III < >> nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com> wrote: >> >>> At 03:52 PM 9/29/2018, you wrote: >>> >>> VHF Radio. Basically background static. On some of the lights it's >>> barely noticeable and you have to listen carefully to hear it, on at least >>> one light it creates enough VHF noise to break squelch on the radio and >>> creates a very noticeable amount of static. >>> >>> >>> Okay, and what is the LED product we're talking about? >>> Have you had any conversation wthe the manufacturer? >>> >>> >>> Bob . . . >>> >>


    Message 3


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    Time: 08:55:06 AM PST US
    From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
    Subject: Re: LED Noise Filter
    At 11:12 PM 9/29/2018, you wrote: ><https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01KJ94Q1K/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1>https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01KJ94Q1K/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 > >If they were the +$300 ones made for aircraft I would call the >manufacturer but these are 15% of the price of the aviation ones so >I understand why the builder chose them. If we can fix this for $20 >worth of parts it makes sense to me. Sure . . . didn't know which product we're discussing . . . wanted to know if we were talking a COTS product or and entrepreneurial offering to the OBAM aircraft community. The components cited in the DIY article for filtering this device are problematic. Since our spectrum of interest is VHF, electrolytic capacitors are definitely contra-indicated. The inductor cited has some characteristics that are also problematic Emacs! Since this is a 18w device powered by what has to be a constant current generator with the 10 to 30v input range, current draw at 14 volts can be estimated as (18w/14v)/0.8 estimated efficiency equals 1.6 amps. While the 'rated' current for the device is 1.6A (meaning it won't burn up) the 'saturation' value for the device is 1.4 amps . . . meaning that its inductance goes to zero at or above 1.4A. I have no doubt that the design offered in the DIY article had some beneficial effects but it was not optimized for the task. There are dozens of more suited devices of this is one example: https://tinyurl.com/y8nrz56k Rated at 5A continuous, it has a nice impedance peak at 100 Mhz (our spectrum of interest). Now we want to team this with capacitors that are similarly suited to VHF energy management. A capacitor of 1000 picofarads has an impedance on the order of 1.6 ohms at 100 MHz. An exemplar component . . . https://tinyurl.com/yd3bh98e These are candidates for a noise abatement experiment. Suggest the pi filter configuration with filter mount on shortest practical leads at the back of the lamp assembly. Since this device has a metal housing, suggest the black power lead be grounded to that housing along with the 'ground' leads of the two capacitors. It may well be that the noise problem is a combination of conducted and radiated so a power line filter may not completely tame the beast but this is a place to start. Bob . . .


    Message 4


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    Time: 11:07:31 AM PST US
    From: Sebastien <cluros@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: LED Noise Filter
    I was wondering about the radiated vs conducted thing but was thinking since it doesn't have any properties of an antenna any radiated noise must radiate from the wires. Further thought makes me realize this makes no sense since the lights are physically connected to a big metal wing and in any case no antenna is necessary to create a VHF signal that travels 15'. Since we have 2 lights per wing, I'm planning on making a little box with short leads and a plug for each light. See diagram below. Bob I'm unsure what you mean by the black power lead being grounded. Unfortunately the aircraft wiring does not include a ground wire to the forest of tabs ground bus behind the panel and simply grounds to the wing. I think you mean I should run a wire from each housing to a common ground point with the ground on my diagram. Is this correct? [image: IMG_20180930_110009.jpg] On Sun, Sep 30, 2018, 09:00 Robert L. Nuckolls, III < nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com> wrote: > At 11:12 PM 9/29/2018, you wrote: > > > https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01KJ94Q1K/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 > > If they were the +$300 ones made for aircraft I would call the > manufacturer but these are 15% of the price of the aviation ones so I > understand why the builder chose them. If we can fix this for $20 worth of > parts it makes sense to me. > > > Sure . . . didn't know which product we're > discussing . . . wanted to know if we > were talking a COTS product or and > entrepreneurial offering to the OBAM > aircraft community. > > The components cited in the DIY article for > filtering this device are problematic. Since > our spectrum of interest is VHF, electrolytic > capacitors are definitely contra-indicated. > The inductor cited has some characteristics > that are also problematic > > [image: Emacs!] > > Since this is a 18w device powered by what > has to be a constant current generator with the > 10 to 30v input range, current draw at 14 > volts can be estimated as (18w/14v)/0.8 > estimated efficiency equals 1.6 amps. > > While the 'rated' current for the device > is 1.6A (meaning it won't burn up) the > 'saturation' value for the device is > 1.4 amps . . . meaning that its inductance > goes to zero at or above 1.4A. > > I have no doubt that the design offered in > the DIY article had some beneficial effects > but it was not optimized for the task. There > are dozens of more suited devices of this > is one example: > > https://tinyurl.com/y8nrz56k > > Rated at 5A continuous, it has a nice > impedance peak at 100 Mhz (our spectrum > of interest). Now we want to team this > with capacitors that are similarly > suited to VHF energy management. A > capacitor of 1000 picofarads has an > impedance on the order of 1.6 ohms > at 100 MHz. An exemplar component . . . > > https://tinyurl.com/yd3bh98e > > These are candidates for a noise abatement > experiment. Suggest the pi filter configuration > with filter mount on shortest practical leads > at the back of the lamp assembly. Since this > device has a metal housing, suggest the black > power lead be grounded to that housing along with > the 'ground' leads of the two capacitors. > > It may well be that the noise problem is a > combination of conducted and radiated so a > power line filter may not completely tame the > beast but this is a place to start. > > > Bob . . . >


    Message 5


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    Time: 04:13:41 PM PST US
    From: Ernest Christley <echristley@att.net>
    Subject: Re: LED Noise Filter
    I've had excellent results using these devices.=C2- N167EZ uses them for marker, strobe, taxi and landing lights.=C2- I've inspected them with an oscilloscope.=C2- Nothing but DC.=C2- And, I've never heard radio intef erence from them.=C2-=C2- Especially of interest, I built the strobe by using an electronic=C2- automotive turn signal flasher to alternate betw een two 30W supplies, that each drive an array of three 10W LEDs.=C2- Whi le testing them out in the sunlight, the easiest way to know they were work ing (a 601XL is hard to turn around and look back in) was to take my headse t off and listen for the flasher's clacking. http://www.mpja.com/LED-Driver-30W-Output-12-24VDC-Input/productinfo/31559+ PS/ On Sunday, September 30, 2018 9:58 AM, Sebastien <cluros@gmail.com> wro te: Certainly Will. We already have 2 batches of these trying to randomly find some that are better. No noise at all sounds ideal :). On Sun, Sep 30, 2018, 04:35 William Daniell <wdaniell.longport@gmail.com> w rote: Having been through this one (cheap chinese landing light)...I bought an US D20 light which completely blocked all comms within 20 feet.I bought anothe r one, American designed made in China for USD30 - and no noise at all.=C2 - I can dig out the manufacturer if youre interested.=C2-=C2-WillWill iam Daniell LONGPORT +57 310 295 0744 On Sun, Sep 30, 2018 at 12:16 AM Sebastien <cluros@gmail.com> wrote: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01KJ94Q1K/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s0 0?ie=UTF8&psc=1 If they were the +$300 ones made for aircraft I would call the manufacturer but these are 15% of the price of the aviation ones so I understand why th e builder chose them. If we can fix this for $20 worth of parts it makes se nse to me. On Sat, Sep 29, 2018 at 8:43 PM Robert L. Nuckolls, III <nuckolls.bob@aeroe lectric.com> wrote: At 03:52 PM 9/29/2018, you wrote: VHF Radio. Basically backgroundstatic. On some of the lights it's barely no ticeable and you have tolisten carefully to hear it, on at least one light it creates enough VHFnoise to break squelch on the radio and creates a very noticeable amountof static. =C2- Okay, and what is the LED product we're talking about? =C2- Have you had any conversation wthe the manufacturer? =C2- Bob . . .


    Message 6


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    Time: 09:10:36 PM PST US
    From: <billhuntersemail@gmail.com>
    Subject: Lycoming Knock Sensor
    Hi All, Has anyone installed a knock sensor in their Lycoming? If so what make and model of knock sensor did you install and where did you install the sensor? Also whatever other information/tips/tricks/recommendations would be most appreciated!!! Thanks, Bill Hunter


    Message 7


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    Time: 09:52:37 PM PST US
    From: Sebastien <cluros@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: Lycoming Knock Sensor
    I have never heard of a knock sensor on a Lycoming, even one with electronic mags. I don't see why you couldn't install one in any of the 1/8 NPT primer ports though. On Sun, Sep 30, 2018 at 9:14 PM <billhuntersemail@gmail.com> wrote: > > Hi All, > > Has anyone installed a knock sensor in their Lycoming? > > If so what make and model of knock sensor did you install and where did > you install the sensor? > > Also whatever other information/tips/tricks/recommendations would be most > appreciated!!! > > > > Thanks, > Bill Hunter > > =========== =========== =========== =========== =========== > >




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