---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Wed 07/17/19: 12 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:07 AM - Re: [OT] IFR-certified GPS Suggestions (Art Zemon) 2. 06:01 AM - Re: Re: Ray Allen trim servo/control: actual wiring schematic needed (Charlie England) 3. 07:30 AM - Re: [OT] IFR-certified GPS Suggestions (Gerald Farek) 4. 08:15 AM - ADS-B Preflight Requirements updated for GA (Harley Dixon) 5. 09:06 AM - Re: [OT] IFR-certified GPS Suggestions (Michael Wynn) 6. 09:17 AM - Re: Ray Allen trim servo/control: actual wiring schematic neede (Eric M. Jones) 7. 10:40 AM - BALUNs and stuff (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 8. 11:30 AM - Re: [OT] IFR-certified GPS Suggestions (donjohnston) 9. 11:59 AM - Re: [OT] IFR-certified GPS Suggestions (Charlie England) 10. 02:03 PM - Re: [OT] IFR-certified GPS Suggestions (Charlie England) 11. 03:25 PM - Re: [OT] IFR-certified GPS Suggestions (Art Zemon) 12. 10:12 PM - Antenna Cable length () ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:07:39 AM PST US From: Art Zemon Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: [OT] IFR-certified GPS Suggestions Mike, Yes, I have an MGL system and their latest GPS, the SP-12 , has the necessary certifications to be an ADS-B source. Rainier has posted the details but they were so detailed that my eyes glazed over while reading them. The bottom line is that the SP-12 is certified but the GPS which is integrated into the EFIS is significantly more accurate. Go figure. I am seeking a navigation radio with a GPS receiver that I can use for flying IFR so I want both the necessary certifications *and* the database with approaches, SIDs, STARs, etc. And I want a proven user interface that someone else has already designed and debugged. I am willing to do a lot of experimenting but, when I am in the clouds, I want to minimize my risk and workload. The MGL SP-12 is only GPS receiver, though. It lacks a front panel display, database, etc etc etc, so it won't meet my needs. -- Art Z. On Tue, Jul 16, 2019 at 11:37 PM wrote: > Hello Art > > > If I remember correctly you have MGL equipment, there was a query on the > MGL forum about this, the answer was that MGL was WAAS certified. > > > Not sure if this was your question or whether you wanted something in > addition to your system > -- https://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ *Love the stranger for you yourselves were strangers in Egypt. *Deut. 10:19 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:01:46 AM PST US From: Charlie England Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Ray Allen trim servo/control: actual wiring schematic needed On Tue, Jul 16, 2019 at 2:15 PM Robert L. Nuckolls, III < nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com> wrote: > Hi Joe, > > I've got the RA cartoon docs. Bob's type of drawing, showing the relay & > switch terminals/internal connections, is what I'm hoping to find for the > RA parts. > > Thanks, > > Charlie > > > Check through the collection of drawings at > > https://tinyurl.com/y6yxkbb8 > > If you're a CAD-driver and can read .dwg > files, I can supply originals for all/any > of those .pdfs > > > Bob . . . > Thanks Bob; the trim.pdf is a good starting point for me. Unfortunately, I haven't had the time yet to become CAD-literate. Charlie ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 07:30:58 AM PST US From: Gerald Farek Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: [OT] IFR-certified GPS Suggestions No, hot GRT , Sent from my iPhone > On Jul 16, 2019, at 11:21 PM, wr ote: > > Hello Art > > If I remember correctly you have MGL equipment, there was a query on the M GL forum about this, the answer was that MGL was WAAS certified. > > Not sure if this was your question or whether you wanted something in addi tion to your system > > Keep well > > Mike > > From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com On Behalf Of Alec Myers > Sent: July 13, 2019 3:18 PM > To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: [OT] IFR-certified GPS Suggestions > > I=99m fond of the Avidyne IFD series > > On Jul 13, 2019, at 08:05, Art Zemon wrote: > > This is somewhat off-topic but I figure y'all know a lot about airplanes s o you might have opinions about avionics, too. > > I reserved space in my panel for a Garmin 430 WAAS or a Garmin 650. Now th at Oshkosh is upon us, perhaps I can save a few pennies on an IFR-certified G PS that will fit in that hole. It doesn=99t have to be a Garmin; that i s just the size hole that I cut when I did the rest of the panel. > > What suggestions do you have, both for equipment and vendor? > > -- Art Z. > > -- > https://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ > > Love the stranger for you yourselves were strangers in Egypt. Deut. 10:19 > > Virus-free. www.avast.com ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:15:35 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: ADS-B Preflight Requirements updated for GA From: Harley Dixon Just saw this on AVWeb... The FAA will issue a Notam on Thursday that will essentially exempt general aviation aircraft operators from an ADS-B preflight requirement when the ADS-B mandate kicks in next January. The Notam specifically exempts ADS-B Out transmitters that use WAAS GPS receivers as a position source from the preflight requirement described in an FAA policy statement that was released earlier this month. The Notam reads: It is not necessary for operators of aircraft equipped with the Wide Area Augmentation System (WAAS) (TSOC145 or TSOC146) receivers to conduct a preflight availability prediction. Garmin spokesman Bill Stone told /AVweb/ the preflight requirement was always intended for airliners, most of which have early-generation GPS systems that are not as reliably precise as those with WAAS. All ADS-B units certified for GA aircraft for the 2020 mandate must use a WAAS GPS receiver as a position source. There are currently zero non-WAAS based ADS-B Out GPS solutions for general aviation aircraft, he said. For GA, its a non-issue. Stone said he suspects the WAAS exemption got lost in the extensive vetting process that policy statements like the preflight requirements included in the recent Federal Register Notice go through. The original intent of the policy statement was to codify exemptions from sanctions for airlines when GPS signals degrade after theyve done the preflight checks and the subsequent lack of compliance is beyond their control. Harley ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 09:06:31 AM PST US From: Michael Wynn Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: [OT] IFR-certified GPS Suggestions Hi Art, I installed a GTN 650 in my RV8 when they first came out.=C2- Could not b e happier with the unit.=C2- It is simple and intuitive to use.=C2- Dat a updates are expensive, but that is the nature things aviation. Michael WynnRV8Livermore, CA -----Original Message----- From: mike Sent: Tue, Jul 16, 2019 9:22 pm Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: [OT] IFR-certified GPS Suggestions #yiv6656459749 #yiv6656459749 -- _filtered #yiv6656459749 {panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;} _filtered #yiv6656459749 {font-family:Calibri;panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;} _filtered #yiv6656459749 {font-family:Georgia;panose-1:2 4 5 2 5 4 5 2 3 3;} #yiv6656459749 #yiv6656459749 p.yiv6656459749MsoNormal, #yiv6656459749 li.yiv6656459749MsoNormal, #yiv6656459749 div.yiv6656459749 MsoNormal {margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:11.0pt;font-family:sa ns-serif;} #yiv6656459749 a:link, #yiv6656459749 span.yiv6656459749MsoHyper link {color:blue;text-decoration:underline;} #yiv6656459749 a:visited, #yiv 6656459749 span.yiv6656459749MsoHyperlinkFollowed {color:purple;text-decora tion:underline;} #yiv6656459749 p.yiv6656459749msonormal0, #yiv6656459749 l i.yiv6656459749msonormal0, #yiv6656459749 div.yiv6656459749msonormal0 {marg in-right:0cm;margin-left:0cm;font-size:11.0pt;font-family:sans-serif;} #yiv 6656459749 span.yiv6656459749EmailStyle18 {font-family:sans-serif;color:win dowtext;} #yiv6656459749 .yiv6656459749MsoChpDefault {font-size:10.0pt;} _f iltered #yiv6656459749 {margin:72.0pt 72.0pt 72.0pt 72.0pt;} #yiv6656459749 div.yiv6656459749WordSection1 {} #yiv6656459749 Hello Art =C2-If I remem ber correctly you have MGL equipment, there was a query on the MGL forum ab out this, the answer was that MGL was WAAS certified. =C2-Not sure if thi s was your question or whether you wanted something in addition to =C2-yo ur system =C2-Keep well =C2-Mike =C2-From: owner-aeroelectric-list-se rver@matronics.com On Behalf Of Alec Myers Sent: July 13, 2019 3:18 PM Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: [OT] IFR-certified GPS Suggestions =C2-I =99m fond of the Avidyne IFD series=C2- On Jul 13, 2019, at 08:05, Art Zemon wrote: This is somewhat off-topic but I figure y'all know a lot about airplanes so you might have opinions about avionics, too. =C2-I reserved space in my panel for a Garmin 430 WAAS or a Garmin 650. Now that Oshkosh is upon us, p erhaps I can save a few pennies on an IFR-certified GPS that will fit in th at hole. It doesn=99t have to be a Garmin; that is just the size hole that I cut when I did the rest of the panel. What suggestions do you have, both for equipment and vendor? =C2-=C2- =C2- -- Art Z. =C2--- https://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ Love the stranger for you yourselves were strangers in Egypt. Deut. 10:19 | | Virus-free. www.avast.com | ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 09:17:31 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Ray Allen trim servo/control: actual wiring schematic neede From: "Eric M. Jones" Hi Charlie, I have a bunch and have posted some over the years. Here is the Trim box. Eric -------- Eric M. Jones www.PerihelionDesign.com 113 Brentwood Drive Southbridge, MA 01550 (508) 764-2072 emjones(at)charter.net Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=490359#490359 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/tscmr_installation_manual_108.pdf ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 10:40:08 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: AeroElectric-List: BALUNs and stuff Got a VNA up and running on a laptop. Will try to get a Jim Wier ELT antenna fabricated over the next few days to see if a common mode choke is really effective/necessary. I'll also look at an exemplar Pawsey Stub and a legacy 'Aviation BALUN' featured in so many anointed documents over the past 50 or so years. By the way, I was curious about how well those little VHF/UHF 'rubber duck' antennas worked on contemporary VHF/UHF hand-helds. Screwed an antenna off my EMS talkie to the VNA and ran a 100 to 500 MHz scan which yielded the following plot: Emacs! Sho 'nuf . . . the little critter has SWR 'dips' that span the frequencies of interest. Pretty cool . . . Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 11:30:51 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: [OT] IFR-certified GPS Suggestions From: "donjohnston" I had the IFR GPS from GRT but they didn't have the software updated. So I went looking for a GNS400W (or 400 that I would upgrade). For the same price I was finding them, Tim and Approach FastStack got me a brand new GTN625. Took me a while to get used to the different UI, but it's pretty nice. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=490363#490363 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 11:59:24 AM PST US From: Charlie England Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: [OT] IFR-certified GPS Suggestions As Art points out, there are radical differences between a 'WAAS certified GPS' as a position source for ADSB, and an IFR certified GPS navigation radio. As far as I know, there are no experimental EFIS systems that are approved for IFR *navigation*. Perfectly fine to use them as flight instruments in IFR conditions, but until the FAA modifies their rules, you still need an IFR certified GPS navigator (complete with certified, up to date databases, approaches, etc) for IFR GPS navigation in the USA. I've seen some rumors that FAA might be considering an easing on that rule, so that non-certified GPS could be used for IFR, similar to non-TSO VOR/ILS receivers, but haven't heard of any official change. On Wed, Jul 17, 2019 at 7:12 AM Art Zemon wrote: > Mike, > > Yes, I have an MGL system and their latest GPS, the SP-12 > , has the necessary > certifications to be an ADS-B source. Rainier has posted the details but > they were so detailed that my eyes glazed over while reading them. The > bottom line is that the SP-12 is certified but the GPS which is integrated > into the EFIS is significantly more accurate. Go figure. > > I am seeking a navigation radio with a GPS receiver that I can use for > flying IFR so I want both the necessary certifications *and* the database > with approaches, SIDs, STARs, etc. And I want a proven user interface that > someone else has already designed and debugged. I am willing to do a lot of > experimenting but, when I am in the clouds, I want to minimize my risk and > workload. > > The MGL SP-12 is only GPS receiver, though. It lacks a front panel > display, database, etc etc etc, so it won't meet my needs. > > -- Art Z. > > On Tue, Jul 16, 2019 at 11:37 PM wrote: > >> Hello Art >> >> >> >> If I remember correctly you have MGL equipment, there was a query on the >> MGL forum about this, the answer was that MGL was WAAS certified. >> >> >> >> Not sure if this was your question or whether you wanted something in >> addition to your system >> > > -- > https://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ > > *Love the stranger for you yourselves were strangers in Egypt. *Deut. > 10:19 > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 02:03:51 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: [OT] IFR-certified GPS Suggestions From: Charlie England Hey Art, Don't know your budget, but an IFR rated friend replaced his Garmin 430 with an Avidyne 440. Slide-in replacement for the 430, and he says that it's got a much better user interface and some really nice features that 'anticipate' the next segment when flying a procedure. At the time, they were offering a very attractive trade-in deal for 430s, which I suppose won't help you much. :-) Charlie On 7/17/2019 1:53 PM, Charlie England wrote: > As Art points out, there are radical differences between a 'WAAS > certified GPS' as a position source for ADSB, and an IFR certified GPS > navigation radio. As far as I know, there are no experimental EFIS > systems that are approved for IFR *navigation*. Perfectly fine to use > them as flight instruments in IFR conditions, but until the FAA > modifies their rules, you still need an IFR certified GPS navigator > (complete with certified, up to date databases, approaches, etc) for > IFR GPS navigation in the USA. I've seen some rumors that FAA might be > considering an easing on that rule, so that non-certified GPS could be > used for IFR, similar to non-TSO VOR/ILS receivers, but haven't heard > of any official change. > > On Wed, Jul 17, 2019 at 7:12 AM Art Zemon > wrote: > > Mike, > > Yes, I have an MGL system and their latest GPS, the SP-12 > , has the necessary > certifications to be an ADS-B source. Rainier has posted the > details but they were so detailed that my eyes glazed over while > reading them. The bottom line is that the SP-12 is certified but > the GPS which is integrated into the EFIS is significantly more > accurate. Go figure. > > I am seeking a navigation radio with a GPS receiver that I can use > for flying IFR so I want both the necessary certifications > /and/the database with approaches, SIDs, STARs, etc. And I want a > proven user interface that someone else has already designed and > debugged. I am willing to do a lot of experimenting but, when I am > in the clouds, I want to minimize my risk and workload. > > The MGL SP-12 is only GPS receiver, though. It lacks a front panel > display, database, etc etc etc, so it won't meet my needs. > > -- Art Z. > > On Tue, Jul 16, 2019 at 11:37 PM > wrote: > > Hello Art > > If I remember correctly you have MGL equipment, there was a > query on the MGL forum about this, the answer was that MGL was > WAAS certified. > > Not sure if this was your question or whether you wanted > something in addition to your system > > > -- > https://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ > > /Love the stranger for you yourselves were strangers in Egypt. > /Deut. 10:19 > --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 03:25:58 PM PST US From: Art Zemon Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: [OT] IFR-certified GPS Suggestions Charlie, I am definitely considering the Avidyne IFD 440. I have a friend with one in his RV10 and he really likes it. I am also considering the new Garmin GPS 175 and then add a second comm radio and call it done. (I already have a VOR/ILS/GS nav radio.) -- Art Z. On Wed, Jul 17, 2019 at 4:19 PM Charlie England wrote: > Hey Art, > > Don't know your budget, but an IFR rated friend replaced his Garmin 430 > with an Avidyne 440. Slide-in replacement for the 430, and he says that > it's got a much better user interface and some really nice features that > 'anticipate' the next segment when flying a procedure. > -- https://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/ *Love the stranger for you yourselves were strangers in Egypt. *Deut. 10:19 ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 10:12:13 PM PST US From: Subject: AeroElectric-List: Antenna Cable length Hello, I am about to cut my antenna to final length and want to confirm: a: if there is an optimal antenna length and b: if there is a minimum distance between radio and antenna. The radio is a MGL V16 remote mount I have 2 possible antenna position and want to test both, at the moment one is +/- 2 feet from the radio and the other +/- 8ft Thanks Mike --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message aeroelectric-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/aeroelectric-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/aeroelectric-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.