Today's Message Index:
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1. 09:30 AM - Re: AeroElectric-List - SL-15 audio - 12/31/19 ()
2. 05:00 PM - Re: B&C voltage regulator low voltage warning (ADDENDUM) (markfw)
3. 05:15 PM - Re: EFI current requirements (markfw)
4. 05:20 PM - Re: EFI current requirements (markfw)
Message 1
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| Subject: | RE: AeroElectric-List - SL-15 audio - 12/31/19 |
I'm familiar with this issue:
My Apollo radio stack included an SL-10 MS (similar to SL-15 but with marker
beacon and stereo). I bought it 2001 and the plane first flew in 2008. I
wired it so I could plug in mp3 players and iPods using mini jack patch
chords. To my dismay, I had to crank the SL-10 all the way up (mp3 player
at max volume) to hear anything (very distorted). Since these units are
made by PS engineering, I contacted them and they said the design was
completed before mp3 players became popular. Mp3 players put out a very
weak signal hence this problem. PS engineering had updated their units by
then and recommended I fix the problem by buying a new model at $1300. I
had just finished the airplane and didn't want to do that. PS engineering
then suggested I purchase a small self-contained mp3 amplifier and place it
in line between the mp3 player and the SL-10. Not sure if they're still on
the market but the brand of that amplifier is "Boostaroo" and it was
originally designed to amplify the signal of mp3 players enough to drive two
sets of earbuds. It has one input, two outputs and provides a fixed amount
of gain (no controls of any kind, when you plug in the mp3 player patch
chord it turns the unit on). It's about the size of your thumb, weighs a
couple ounces and runs on AAAA (yup that's quad A) batteries (available at
many stores selling batteries). Worked great and I used it for 9 years
until I saw the new plug and play PS Engineering PMA 7000BT at Sun N Fun. I
bought one and since it's plug and play, just swapped out my SL-10 with NO
wiring changes required. It has all the features of the SL-10 plus
automatic squelch, blue tooth and a more powerful amplifier for mp3 signals.
Love the unit and don't need to use patch chords anymore, just Bluetooth my
smart phone/iPad and get loud and clear audio through my Bose headsets
(stereo). If you want blue tooth and this new capability, I would contact PS
engineering and see if the 7000BT is also a plug and play replacement for
the SL-15 (I believe it is). If you are on a budget then I suggest the
Boostaroo, it worked very well for me with the SL-10 and cost about $30 as I
recall. I'm sure there are other mp3 amplifiers available that would work
as well if you can't find a Boostaroo. The Boostaroo is just so compact and
lite weight that it's perfect for our application, takes up zero room in the
airplane and no controls to mess with.
Regards
Dean Psiropoulos
RV-6A N197DM
320+ hours of pure fun
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
<owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com> On Behalf Of
AeroElectric-List Digest Server
Sent: Wednesday, January 01, 2020 2:31 AM
Subject: AeroElectric-List Digest: 4 Msgs - 12/31/19
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Total Messages Posted Tue 12/31/19: 4
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Today's Message Index:
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3. 05:11 PM - Re: SL-15 Audio Output (William Hunter)
________________________________ Message 3
_____________________________________
Time: 05:11:33 PM PST US
From: William Hunter <billhuntersemail@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: SL-15 Audio Output
Hi all,
Sorry for the late reply however life seems to get in the way.
I am about to leave on a 3 week trip so I will research this stuff whilst
gone.
One thing for sure is I will buy a 3 conductor patch cord and try it out
when I get back.
My cell phone is an LG Android type phone and it's the typical plug that has
a microphone and stereo earbuds. It works fine in our GMC Yukon for the aux
input (when at full volume... after pressing the olde yes I know that loud
volume can damage my hearing button... blah... blah... blah) so I imagine it
has plenty of zaps to run the zapp's to run the SL 15... yes I tried full
volume on the phone.
Thanks!!!!
Bill Hunter
On Mon, Dec 30, 2019, 20:15 Jeff B. <loboflyer@gmail.com> wrote:
> Bill:
>
> As a point of reference, my cell phone (Samsung Galaxy series) needs
> to b
e
> cranked to max output volume when hooked to my car audio line input
> for reasonable speaker volume. That includes clicking the "yeah, I
> meant it
to
> be that loud" box. Do you have the phone volume maxed?
>
> You say 4-conductor. How is that wired from the phone? I'd try a
> 3-conductor patch cable. Here's a forum post elsewhere that gives
> some clues to wiring
> <https://www.head-fi.org/threads/3-5-mm-jacks-4-vs-3-conductors.689100
> /#p
ost-9955513>.
> Apple vs. everyone else means that the microphone and ground are
> reversed between systems.
> (apologies if images aren't appearing... link should be good). By
> plugging in a 3-conductor cable you should be telling the phone to
> ignore the microphone.
>
> [image: image.png]
>
> From the SL-15 install manual:
> "The audio signal at the entertainment input must be a minimum of
> 500mV P-P per channel for optimum music performance." (Max is 1V P-P).
>
> [image: image.png]
>
>
> I think the SL-15 input impedance is 510 ohms (unsure if this applies
> to the entertainment inputs. Line level is typically 10's of k ohms.
>
> [image: image.png]
>
> You don't say what phone you're using, but Ken Rockwell has measured
> the iPhone 6S's headphone output
> <https://www.kenrockwell.com/apple/iphone-6s-plus-audio-quality.htm>an
> d says it puts out 0.979V at 600 ohms (and I see no reason why it
> wouldn't
be
> representative of the general phone population):
>
> 600=CE=A9: 0.979 V RMS @ 0.0012% THD.
>
> At 600 ohms, 0.979 Vrms is 2.77Vpk-pk, so a phone should have no issue
> (over-) driving the input.
>
> -Jeff-
>
>
> On Mon, Dec 30, 2019 at 6:44 PM Charlie England <ceengland7@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On 12/30/2019 4:56 PM, billhuntersemail@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>> Happy New Years Eve Greetings!!!
>>
>> I was hoping for advice on how to fix a low audio problem I am having
>> with the audio input to the SL-15 in my airplane.
>>
>> Specifically, I connect my =9Csmart=9D phone to the 1/8 inch
audio input jack
>> of my SL-15 and I can just barely hear my crazy [party affiliation
>> redacted] political talk show that is playing from my telephone. The
>> au
dio
>> is indeed playing however the volume is reallyreally low. Even
though my
>> wife is super happy with this setup I would like to fix if for those
>> rea
lly
>> rare times when I allow her to play her media we can actually hear it
>> ov
er
>> the continuous loud droning in the cabin (the airplane itself is very
>> quiet).
>>
>> If I unplug the cable connecting my phone to the ships audio input
>> jack and then insert my earbud headphones into the phone my political
>> talk sh
ow
>> volume comes in loud, obnoxious, and opinionated as I expect so I
>> have confirmed that the phone output audio is working. I can hear
>> the aircra
ft
>> radio as expected.
>>
>> I have soldered up the audio jack as depicted in the wire harness
>> diagra
m
>> below and I am using a four conductor patch cable to connect the
>> phone t
o
>> the ships input jack. Could this be the problem as I am mix matching
>> stereo and mono connectors?
>>
>> Here is a wire diagram of the SL-15 bottom connector.
>>
>> Any help (as usual) would be most appreciated!!!
>>
>> Hi Bill,
>>
>> I see two possibilities. One is that you wired it correctly, but the
>> audio panel is expecting a much higher level than the phone's
>> headphone jack is capable of providing. (This is a strong
>> probability.) Look at th
e
>> audio panel's specs to see what level it wants on the music input,
>> and t
hen
>> look at the phone's specs to see the max output from the headphone jack.
If
>> you need help translating dB to volts, etc, shoot us a followup email.
>>
>> Another possibility is, as you mentioned, a miswired cable. You said
>> you used a 4 wire cable. Note that there are only 3 possibilities at
>> the aud
io
>> panel. If the cable has a 4 terminal plug at the audio panel, it's
>> entir
ely
>> possible that the right channel pin in the audio panel connector
>> could b
e
>> hitting both the R ring and the ground ring. You may need something
>> with the 4 conductor plug on one end, and a 3 conductor plug at the
>> audio pan
el.
>> Unfortunately, a quick stroll through 'the google' didn't turn one up...
>>
>> Charlie
>> [image: Image result for cell phone headphone connector diagram"]
>>
>
________________________________ Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: B&C voltage regulator low voltage warning (ADDENDUM) |
Bob,
thanks for the info about the MANL fuse.
My address is:
1009 Western Ave #1207
Seattle, WA 98104
Mark
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=494152#494152
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| Subject: | Re: EFI current requirements |
skywagon185(at)gmail.com wrote:
> Mark,
> Just a suggestion about your battery comments....
> I would think that using the smaller battery to "boost charge" the larger battery
might be better than trying to start an engine directly off the smaller.
> The larger boosted battery has the internal hardware and cabling to handle huge
loads like starting sequences. The smaller battery could bring the larger back
to life enough to get a good engine start.....
>
> EARTHX SELLS A CONNECTOR TO THE BATTERY TERMINALS WHICH IS USED BY THEIR RECOMMENDED
CHARGING UNITS AND BY THEIR "JUMP START" BATTERY. IT IS RATED AT 400 AMPS.
I ASSUME THAT THE BMS FIGURES OUT HOW TO ROUTE THE JUMP START CURRENT TO
THE STARER.
>
> On Sun, Dec 29, 2019 at 10:42 AM markfw wrote:
>
>
> >
> > John,
> >
> > Thanks for the link to the thread of Ross's evaluation of the Shorei battery.
This is a good example of non-truth in advertising.
> >
> > However, according to Ross the Shorei weighs 2.2 pounds and is good for approximately
6 ah. The EarthX ETX 900 battery is rated by them at 15.6 ah and weighs
4.9 pounds.
> >
> > Since these Lithium battery manufacturers apparently all use the same (or
similar) Chinese Lithium cells I would say that EarthX is rating their batteries
properly for continuous use rather than just starting.
> >
> > I will be using an EarthX 24 ah single battery in my day-VFR Carbon Cub. I
will also have the EarthX 2 ah portable "starter" battery if I forget to turn
off my master switch. It will be interesting to see if it will actually start
my engine. It's counterintuitive that such a small battery could start an O-340,
but it can supposedly do it.
> >
> > I am a Vans Air Force subscriber. I lurk there and learn a ton from the thousands
of RV pilots and builders.
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> > Mark
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=494093#494093 (http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=494093#494093)
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ==========
> > br> fts!)
> > r> > target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
> > -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
> > ==========
> > -
> > Electric-List" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
> > ==========
> > FORUMS -
> > _blank" rel="noreferrer">http://forums.matronics.com
> > ==========
> > WIKI -
> > lank" rel="noreferrer">http://wiki.matronics.com
> > ==========
> > b Site -
> > -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
> > target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
> > ==========
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=494153#494153
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| Subject: | Re: EFI current requirements |
ceengland7(at)gmail.com wrote:
> While connecting them in parallel might increase available current to start,
it won't charge the other battery, unless it's badly depleted.
>
> I missed the earlier posts in this thread; 'the google' sometimes
decides Aeroelectric emails are spam (likely due to 'unusual' subject
lines).
>
> The issue of AH ratings has been around as long as lithium battery
tech. Since the typical duty of a battery in a motor vehicle is purely
starting, the lithium guys have almost always used AH 'equivalent' ratings
when it comes to the battery's ability to *start* an engine. It's the
difference between *power* (ex: 400 HP Corvette) and *energy* (50 gallon
gas tank). A Corvette with a gallon of gas in its tank will get to the
end of a quarter mile first, and then it won't go any farther. A Chevette
with a 10 gallon tank will win the 200 mile race every time over the
Corvette with a 1 gallon tank.
>
> Nothing really 'wrong' with the equivalent thing, as long as everyone
is on the same page and is using the battery purely as a starting
battery. But even in a car, the difference in capacity might mean the difference
between getting home after an alt failure, or being stranded on
the side of the road.
>
> IIRC, EarthX did the same 'equivalent' ratings thing early in their
venture into the a/c market, until a bunch of us pointed out to them
that if the plane is electrically dependent, those numbers don't work.
>
> Those of you planning on using EX batteries do need to be aware
that the internal battery management system really is another failure point,
and has failed in at least one case. If it decides that there are external
problems, or the battery is near end-of-charge (whether its assumption
is correct or not), it will disconnect the battery. Under the right
conditions, with some, older design alternators, the load dump could
cause an alternator failure. Not likely a risk with B&C alts, but many older
internally regulated alternators will die in a load dump situation.
>
> In an 'alternator out' situation, the EX *will* disconnect at some
point, before the battery is fully depleted. Your call on use, but do
know the failure modes if you use them.
>
> Charlie
>
> CHARLIE, YES THE EARTHX BMS SHUTS DOWN THE BATTERY GRACEFULLY AT 11.5V. THEY
SAY THAT THIS IS WHEN ONLY 5% OF THE BATTERY ENERGY IS LEFT. I THINK THE INTENT
IS TO AVOID A LOAD DUMP ONTO THE ALTERNATOR. I AM USING A B & C ALTERNATOR.
>
> On 1/1/2020 3:29 PM, skywagon185guy . wrote:
>
>
> > Mark,
> > Just a suggestion about your battery comments....
> > I would think that using the smaller battery to "boost charge"
the larger battery might be better than trying to start an engine
directly off the smaller.
> > The larger boosted battery has the internal hardware and
cabling to handle huge loads like starting sequences. The smaller battery
could bring the larger back to life enough to get a good engine
start.....
> >
> >
> >
> > On Sun, Dec 29, 2019 at 10:42 AM markfw
wrote:
> >
> >
> > > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "markfw"
> > >
> > > John,
> > >
> > > Thanks for the link to the thread of Ross's evaluation of the
Shorei battery. This is a good example of non-truth in advertising.
> > >
> > > However, according to Ross the Shorei weighs 2.2 pounds and is
good for approximately 6 ah. The EarthX ETX 900 battery is
rated by them at 15.6 ah and weighs 4.9 pounds.
> > >
> > > Since these Lithium battery manufacturers apparently all use
the same (or similar) Chinese Lithium cells I would say that
EarthX is rating their batteries properly for continuous use rather
than just starting.
> > >
> > > I will be using an EarthX 24 ah single battery in my day-VFR
Carbon Cub. I will also have the EarthX 2 ah portable "starter"
battery if I forget to turn off my master switch. It will be interesting
to see if it will actually start my engine. It's counterintuitive
that such a small battery could start an O-340, but it can supposedly
do it.
> > >
> > > I am a Vans Air Force subscriber. I lurk there and learn a ton
from the thousands of RV pilots and builders.
> > >
> > > Thanks.
> > >
> > > Mark
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=494154#494154
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