Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 08:29 AM - Re: Bus Bar Equivalent AWG (Hummer H2)
2. 08:34 AM - Re: Exploring a Different Way to Wire Avionics (Hummer H2)
3. 08:47 AM - Re: Exploring a Different Way to Wire Avionics (Faraon17)
4. 08:52 AM - Re: Premature EarthX death? (Faraon17)
5. 03:30 PM - Position indicator needed (rparigoris)
6. 04:03 PM - Re: Position indicator needed (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
7. 04:48 PM - Re: Position indicator needed (Charlie England)
8. 04:53 PM - Re: Position indicator needed (rparigoris)
9. 05:50 PM - Re: Re: Position indicator needed (Charlie England)
10. 06:50 PM - Re: Position indicator needed (rparigoris)
11. 07:14 PM - Re: Re: Position indicator needed (Dick Tasker)
12. 07:40 PM - Re: Re: Position indicator needed (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
13. 07:52 PM - Re: Re: Position indicator needed (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
14. 07:54 PM - Re: Re: Position indicator needed (Charlie England)
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| Subject: | Re: Bus Bar Equivalent AWG |
Yea these guys are good. Cuz that situation is hard, I am glad if they could help
you,
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=497188#497188
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| Subject: | Re: Exploring a Different Way to Wire Avionics |
And what will be the bonus from this? Is it necessary?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=497189#497189
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| Subject: | Re: Exploring a Different Way to Wire Avionics |
better to do [Laughing]
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=497190#497190
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| Subject: | Re: Premature EarthX death? |
I had a similar situation, I somehow succeeded, but patted the nevis :x
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=497191#497191
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| Subject: | Position indicator needed |
Hi Group. I need a display for Actuonix P version of P16. Actuator has a 5,800
ohm potentiometer, it ranges from 0 to 5,800 when running actuator in and out.
We tried Actuonix display but it has a internal wiring flaw the way they designed
circuit around a TI LM394 IC. They sent a replacement and it has same flaw.
The way they want it wired is to supply 12 + and (-)volts to the actuator pot
and the wiper is pulling voltage off it (voltage divider). Thx. Ron P.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=497197#497197
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| Subject: | Re: Position indicator needed |
At 05:26 PM 7/7/2020, you wrote:
>
>Hi Group. I need a display for Actuonix P version of P16. Actuator
>has a 5,800 ohm potentiometer, it ranges from 0 to 5,800 when
>running actuator in and out. We tried Actuonix display but it has a
>internal wiring flaw the way they designed circuit around a TI LM394
>IC. They sent a replacement and it has same flaw. The way they want
>it wired is to supply 12 + and (-)volts to the actuator pot and the
>wiper is pulling voltage off it (voltage divider). Thx. Ron P.
Do you have a schematic of the acutuonix system?
Does the pot in the actuator have 2 or 3 wires
coming out? Is the display bar graph, analog,
lcd, . . . . ?
Bob . . .
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| Subject: | Re: Position indicator needed |
On 7/7/2020 5:26 PM, rparigoris wrote:
>
> Hi Group. I need a display for Actuonix P version of P16. Actuator has a 5,800
ohm potentiometer, it ranges from 0 to 5,800 when running actuator in and out.
We tried Actuonix display but it has a internal wiring flaw the way they designed
circuit around a TI LM394 IC. They sent a replacement and it has same flaw.
The way they want it wired is to supply 12 + and (-)volts to the actuator
pot and the wiper is pulling voltage off it (voltage divider). Thx. Ron P.
>
Hi Ron,
Are you sure you have that IC # correct? The 394 is a matched pair of
NPN transistors in one case. Not sure why you'd need that for a position
indicator.
Could it be an LM3914? The 3914 is a 10 segment LED driver/level
indicator (likely what you want). The 3914 will work as a voltmeter,
which is what you want to display the varying voltage from the position
pot. Have you measured the wiper voltage with a regular voltmeter as you
move the actuator? If the voltage is 'stuck' at 12V, odds are that the
ground end of the potentiometer isn't grounded. This assumes that the
potentiometer is actually moving with the actuator.
If you have a variable power supply, you can check the other end of the
system by feeding a varying voltage into the indicator's sense input.
Even a string of 1.5V batteries would give you stepped voltages to feed
the indicator's input.
Charlie
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| Subject: | Re: Position indicator needed |
Hi Bob
Sorry no schematic just a data sheet:
https://s3.amazonaws.com/actuonix/Actuonix+Position+Indicator+Datasheet.pdf
It's a 3 wire LED Bar Graph with 10 LEDs.
The 5,800ohm pot gets wired as a voltage divider and the wiper goes into the red
of the indicator. My build partner is a EE and say he can't see how their unit
can possibly work.
Here's what Wayne wrote to company:
I opened up the first indicator that failed and found a burned-out trace going
to the adjustment pot. Upon drawing out the circuit I found the two ends of the
adjustment pot wired directly to +12 and ground, the wiper goes to pin 5 (signal
in). The wiper of the pot in the actuator also goes to pin five with the
ends wired to +12 and ground (Feedback potentiometer negative reference rail
and Feedback potentiometer positive reference rail according to P16 instruction
manual). With this configuration, it is easy to see a short circuit occurring
when the actuator is near or at its limit (+12 or GND) and the adjustment
pot is turned to near the opposite rail. There is no protection ie. limiting resistors,
off the ends of the indicator pot to limit current in this condition.
Likewise, with the indicator pot acting as the voltage divider for signal-in,
I could not measure any variation in signal-in voltage even with as little
as 200 ohms at the actuator pot wiper. I'd be interested to know if anyone else
has gotten this to work without modification, if so, can you provide details?
Would be great if we could adapt an off the shelf unit. Alsochecked with Dynon
and our D10A can not take an input and display.
Ron P.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=497199#497199
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| Subject: | Re: Position indicator needed |
On 7/7/2020 6:49 PM, rparigoris wrote:
om>
>
> Hi Bob
> Sorry no schematic just a data sheet:
> https://s3.amazonaws.com/actuonix/Actuonix+Position+Indicator+Datasheet.p
df
> It's a 3 wire LED Bar Graph with 10 LEDs.
> The 5,800ohm pot gets wired as a voltage divider and the wiper goes into
the red of the indicator. My build partner is a EE and say he can't see how
their unit can possibly work.
> Here's what Wayne wrote to company:
> I opened up the first indicator that failed and found a burned-out trace
going to the adjustment pot. Upon drawing out the circuit I found the two
ends of the adjustment pot wired directly to +12 and ground, the wiper goes
to pin 5 (signal in). The wiper of the pot in the actuator also goes to p
in five with the ends wired to +12 and ground (Feedback potentiometer negat
ive reference rail and Feedback potentiometer positive reference rail accor
ding to P16 instruction manual). With this configuration, it is easy to se
e a short circuit occurring when the actuator is near or at its limit (+12
or GND) and the adjustment pot is turned to near the opposite rail. There i
s no protection ie. limiting resistors, off the ends of the indicator pot t
o limit current in this condition. Likewise, with the indicator pot acting
as the voltage divider for signal-in, I could not measure any variation in
signal-in voltage even with as little as 200 ohms at the actuator pot wipe
r. I'd be inter!
> ested to know if anyone else has gotten this to work without modificati
on, if so, can you provide details?
>
> Would be great if we could adapt an off the shelf unit. Alsochecked with
Dynon and our D10A can not take an input and display.
> Ron P.
Circuit description for the likely IC being uses is here:
https://components101.com/ics/lm3914-dot-bar-display-driver
From the text, below the circuit demo animation:
Simply power the IC using the V+ and V- and the analog signal voltage is
given to pin 5. Here we have used 9V to power the IC to monitor an
analogy voltage of 0-5V.=C2- Always note that the voltage used to power t
he
IC (here 9V) should be at least 1.5V more that the monitoring
voltage(here 5V).
Note that max input voltage should always be at least 1.5V lower than
supply voltage.
If you search for 'LM3914 level meter', you should find dozens of hits
on both ebay and Amazon, in addition to other vendors.
Hope that helps,
Charlie
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| Subject: | Re: Position indicator needed |
Hi Charlie
Yes it's a LM3914 not LM394, dumb thumb. Here's my partner Wayne that will comment:
Hi Charlie, Thanks for the feedback and I agree with you the 3914 should be operating
as a voltmeter. The pot in the actuator is fine, the problem is that Actuonix
didn't follow proper design (in my opinion) and wired an "adjustment"
pot into the circuit alongside the 3914 whereby its directly across +12 and ground.
Its wiper is in parallel with pin 5 (signal input) AND the wiper from the
actuator pot. I think you can figure out what happens when one pot is adjusted
towards ground and the other (like the actuator) starts heading towards +12.
Full battery short circuit taking out traces on the LM3914 circuit board.
Difficult to fix because critical traces are all under the DIP IC, we're just
looking for a mounted 3914 without this flaw, I suspect a voltage following op
amp would serve as a trim on pin 5 so as to adjust full scale when the actuator
is extended.
Thanks, Wayne
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=497202#497202
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| Subject: | Re: Position indicator needed |
Although it is a little pricey nowadays, this should work for what you want to do: http://www.rayallencompany.com/products/indsens.html
Otherwise, Charlie is correct about the LM3914. If your friend is an EE he should
be easily able to use it to design what you want to do. That is what is in
the Ray Allen indicator.
I have older versions of their indicators in my plane. I traced the schematic of
their unit and have it if you want a copy. They don't have the problem your
friend discovered in the unit you have
from Actuonix.
Dick Tasker
rparigoris wrote:
>
> Hi Bob
> Sorry no schematic just a data sheet:
> https://s3.amazonaws.com/actuonix/Actuonix+Position+Indicator+Datasheet.pdf
> It's a 3 wire LED Bar Graph with 10 LEDs.
> The 5,800ohm pot gets wired as a voltage divider and the wiper goes into the
red of the indicator. My build partner is a EE and say he can't see how their
unit can possibly work.
> Here's what Wayne wrote to company:
> I opened up the first indicator that failed and found a burned-out trace going
to the adjustment pot. Upon drawing out the circuit I found the two ends of
the adjustment pot wired directly to +12 and ground, the wiper goes to pin 5
(signal in). The wiper of the pot in the actuator also goes to pin five with
the ends wired to +12 and ground (Feedback potentiometer negative reference rail
and Feedback potentiometer positive reference rail according to P16 instruction
manual). With this configuration, it is easy to see a short circuit occurring
when the actuator is near or at its limit (+12 or GND) and the adjustment
pot is turned to near the opposite rail. There is no protection ie. limiting
resistors, off the ends of the indicator pot to limit current in this condition.
Likewise, with the indicator pot acting as the voltage divider for signal-in,
I could not measure any variation in signal-in voltage even with as little
as 200 ohms at the actuator pot wiper. I'd be inter!
> ested to know if anyone else has gotten this to work without modification,
if so, can you provide details?
>
> Would be great if we could adapt an off the shelf unit. Alsochecked with Dynon
and our D10A can not take an input and display.
> Ron P.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=497199#497199
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Position indicator needed |
At 06:49 PM 7/7/2020, you wrote:
>
>Hi Bob
>Sorry no schematic just a data sheet:
>https://s3.amazonaws.com/actuonix/Actuonix+Position+Indicator+Datasheet.pdf
>It's a 3 wire LED Bar Graph with 10 LEDs.
>The 5,800ohm pot gets wired as a voltage divider and the wiper goes
>into the red of the indicator. My build partner is a EE and say he
>can't see how their unit can possibly work.
>Here's what Wayne wrote to company:
>I opened up the first indicator that failed and found a burned-out
>trace going to the adjustment pot. Upon drawing out the circuit I
>found the two ends of the adjustment pot wired directly to +12 and
>ground, the wiper goes to pin 5 (signal in). The wiper of the pot
>in the actuator also goes to pin five with the ends wired to +12 and
>ground (Feedback potentiometer negative reference rail and Feedback
>potentiometer positive reference rail according to P16 instruction
>manual). With this configuration, it is easy to see a short circuit
>occurring when the actuator is near or at its limit (+12 or GND) and
>the adjustment pot is turned to near the opposite rail. There is no
>protection ie. limiting resistors, off the ends of the indicator pot
>to limit current in this condition. Likewise, with the indicator
>pot acting as the voltage divider for signal-in, I could not measure
>any variation in signal-in voltage even with as little as 200 ohms
>at the actuator pot wiper. I'd be interested to know if anyone else
>has gotten this to work without modification, if so, can you provide details?
>
>Would be great if we could adapt an off the shelf unit. Alsochecked
>with Dynon and our D10A can not take an input and display.
>Ron P.
That drawing is a classic example of how NOT
to sell a DIY wiring job . . . further, from
what I am able to glean from the writer's narrative,
it seems that the products in hand have
manufacturing/design defects on some level.
Here's what an exemplar wiring diagram MIGHT
look like for that system
https://tinyurl.com/y8ywpf78
It could not be simpler but perhaps unnecessarily
complicated due to defects in hardware?
Bob . . .
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| Subject: | Re: Position indicator needed |
>
>Would be great if we could adapt an off the shelf unit. Alsochecked
>with Dynon and our D10A can not take an input and display.
>Ron P.
Here's one possibility but it's pretty pricey
https://tinyurl.com/y7k6c5ht
This is such a simple device . . . too bad
the current offering is so short on info and
perhaps quality.
Maybe this could be an open source venture for
the List. I can get housings 3D printed.
Do any of you guy's feel like crafting
a little board to mount the jelly-beans?
Bob . . .
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| Subject: | Re: Position indicator needed |
On 7/7/2020 8:45 PM, rparigoris wrote:
>
> Hi Charlie
> Yes it's a LM3914 not LM394, dumb thumb. Here's my partner Wayne that will comment:
> Hi Charlie, Thanks for the feedback and I agree with you the 3914 should be operating
as a voltmeter. The pot in the actuator is fine, the problem is that
Actuonix didn't follow proper design (in my opinion) and wired an "adjustment"
pot into the circuit alongside the 3914 whereby its directly across +12 and
ground. Its wiper is in parallel with pin 5 (signal input) AND the wiper from
the actuator pot. I think you can figure out what happens when one pot is adjusted
towards ground and the other (like the actuator) starts heading towards
+12. Full battery short circuit taking out traces on the LM3914 circuit board.
Difficult to fix because critical traces are all under the DIP IC, we're just
looking for a mounted 3914 without this flaw, I suspect a voltage following
op amp would serve as a trim on pin 5 so as to adjust full scale when the actuator
is extended.
>
> Thanks, Wayne
Agree; any trim pot should have the 'top' tied to the source, and the
wiper tied to the 3914's input pin. Any chance you could just modify the
circuit?
Also, the pinout shown on the data sheet for your display seemed a bit
weird, with signal on red and B+ on white. Can you verify that the wire
colors go where the data sheet says they go?
If you don't have any luck with a fix, here's one possibility as a
replacement.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/LM3914-10-Segment-5V-12V-Battery-Capacity-Power-Level-LED-Indicator-Display-Kit-/153106868480?_trksid=p2385738.m4383.l4275.c10&var=452950159370
Charlie
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