Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:26 AM - Re: RV10 Electrical Issue (w/ Format Clean Up) (Bill Watson)
2. 08:42 AM - Re: RV10 Electrical Issue (w/ Format Clean Up) (user9253)
3. 11:39 AM - Re: Magnetos (EfraimOtero)
4. 01:11 PM - Re: Re: RV10 Electrical Issue (w/ Format Clean Up) (WILLIAM BOOTH)
5. 02:01 PM - Re: Re: Magnetos (Neal George)
6. 02:01 PM - Sealed Connectors (Sebastien)
7. 02:07 PM - Re: Re: RV10 Electrical Issue (w/ Format Clean Up) (Tim Olson)
8. 02:19 PM - Re: Re: RV10 Electrical Issue (w/ Format Clean Up) (WILLIAM BOOTH)
9. 02:25 PM - Re: Sealed Connectors (Stuart Hutchison)
10. 02:30 PM - Re: Magnetos (EfraimOtero)
11. 04:04 PM - Re: RV10 Electrical Issue (w/ Format Clean Up) (user9253)
12. 04:12 PM - Re: Sealed Connectors (Alec Myers)
13. 04:20 PM - Re: Re: Magnetos (Neal George)
14. 05:43 PM - Re: Sealed Connectors (Kelly McMullen)
15. 06:07 PM - Re: Re: RV10 Electrical Issue (w/ Format Clean Up) (WILLIAM BOOTH)
16. 08:05 PM - Re: RV10 Electrical Issue (w/ Format Clean Up) (user9253)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: RV10 Electrical Issue (w/ Format Clean Up) |
On 1/11/2021 8:26 PM, Gary Wold wrote:
> Was written...
>
>> Hey guys I am way in over my head on this forum but a nice man from
>> BandC suggested I try. Attached is the electrical diagram of my
>> recently purchased RV10. It was completed in 2009 and the avionics
>> was switched to a Garmin 900x a year later. My issue is it safe and
>> operationally sound. It is an X design, if that is fa
> I missed your original post, but I feel the same way about being a
> newbie. Cannot understand why aircraft electronics are hard for me.
> I can wire 125v circuits with my eyes closed. Apprehensive
> aboutwiring my EAB aircraft.
I'm not a complete newbie but an amateur that has installed a Z-14 in an
RV10 and flown it for 10+ years and 1,000+ hours.
Untangling someone else's pride and joy versus working on your own
electrical system from the ground up appears to be 2 different tasks.
In this case the system is well documented but the design intent is
unknown. That's half good but challenging.
If you are DIYing your electrical system one of the best things you can
do is read up the stuff presented here and decide to implement one of
the 'Z' designs documented here. Then implement it without modifying it
here and there to achieve some capability you think you need. Why not?
Because that capability has most likely been considered, hashed out,
possibly tested, and then either implemented in the appropriate Z design
or discarded as not needed or wrong headed. If you select the right Z
figure and stick with it, you'll do well. Some very good heads have
spent a lot of time and effort honing these designs down into very
serviceable solutions - all under the guidance and leadership of Mr
Nuckulls.
Doing a Z design 'as-is' will simplify things greatly. Me, I think I'm
going to write up a 1 pager on my design intent and how it should be
operated. Right now that just in my head.
Have Fun!
--
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Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: RV10 Electrical Issue (w/ Format Clean Up) |
What appear to be relays in the lower right corner are actually illuminated switches.
I do not see any over voltage protection.
While cranking the engine, if the bus tie switch is closed and if bus B switch
is closed,
then the aux battery will help crank the engine. Are the wires big enough to
handle the current? The solution is to eliminate the bus tie switch. So what
if bus B is one volt less than Bus A? A Schottky diode will not drop as much
voltage and will not get as hot.
Alternators A and B have their labels reversed.
The strobe circuit needs to be protected by a fuse.
Connecting both alternators to one current shunt is not necessarily unsafe unless
the shunt fails.
Consider using individual hall effect current sensors.
If the alternators do not play well with each other, the simple solution is to
only have one on at a time.
If the original builder practiced good workmanship, I would not rewire the airplane.
--------
Joe Gores
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=500156#500156
Message 3
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Bob, Jerry, Firstly may you have a happy and safe new year!
many thanks for your input! I will try Jerry's suggestion to test for sparks. I
have to say I am not quite electrically savvy. I changed the spark plugs to brand
new REM 40E and I will try the spark test.
I have also been looking for the proper P/N to replace the harness if necessary.
Anyone know what this would be?
Again, thanks!
Ef
--------
EfraimOtero
Fisher Celebrity EX N500BC
O200 COntinental
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=500160#500160
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: RV10 Electrical Issue (w/ Format Clean Up) |
I would like to avoid rewiring if possible.
- Over voltage protection I can resolve with a PP alternator (and change it o
ver to the primary?).
- The batteries to help crank not only are not big enough , but the wires ar
e not big enough. (Picture included.)
- A Schottky diode is a great solution but wiring it like my current one wo
uld be incorrect as =9CI=9D understand it. (Picture included.)
- Great catch on the mislabeled alternators; I saw that too.
- The Hall effect current sensor; is that a directional flow item, like a d
iode?
- Yes on the one at a time and only keep the other one for STANDBY use.
William Booth
Sent from my iPad
> On Jan 12, 2021, at 11:42 AM, user9253 <fransew@gmail.com> wrote:
>
l.com>
>
> What appear to be relays in the lower right corner are actually illuminate
d switches.
>
> I do not see any over voltage protection.
>
> While cranking the engine, if the bus tie switch is closed and if bus B sw
itch is closed,
> then the aux battery will help crank the engine. Are the wires big enough
to
> handle the current? The solution is to eliminate the bus tie switch. So w
hat
> if bus B is one volt less than Bus A? A Schottky diode will not drop as m
uch
> voltage and will not get as hot.
>
> Alternators A and B have their labels reversed.
>
> The strobe circuit needs to be protected by a fuse.
>
> Connecting both alternators to one current shunt is not necessarily unsafe
unless the shunt fails.
> Consider using individual hall effect current sensors.
> If the alternators do not play well with each other, the simple solution i
s to only have one on at a time.
>
> If the original builder practiced good workmanship, I would not rewire the
airplane.
>
> --------
> Joe Gores
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=500156#500156
>
>
>
>
>
>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
>
>
Message 5
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Ef -
Assuming your O-200 is fitted with Continental mags, the harness is P/N:
10-821471-17 <http://ipc.cmg.aero/IPC/PartsOfaSection#/>.
Neal
================
On Jan 12, 2021, at 1:34 PM, EfraimOtero <efraim.otero@gmail.com> wrote:
<efraim.otero@gmail.com>
Bob, Jerry, Firstly may you have a happy and safe new year!
many thanks for your input! I will try Jerry's suggestion to test for
sparks. I have to say I am not quite electrically savvy. I changed the
spark plugs to brand new REM 40E and I will try the spark test.
I have also been looking for the proper P/N to replace the harness if
necessary. Anyone know what this would be?
Again, thanks!
Ef
--------
EfraimOtero
Fisher Celebrity EX N500BC
O200 COntinental
Message 6
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| Subject: | Sealed Connectors |
Is there a weather sealed PIDG blade crimp connector? I seem to remember
something with heat shrink and glue. They looked like this but with a heat
shrink end for the wire.
[image: OIP.jpg]
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: RV10 Electrical Issue (w/ Format Clean Up) |
I would suggest that the battery arrangement in the picture shouldn't
have ever
been part of the cranking circuit. I say this because it looks like
that was
a copy of my aux battery config, of which I was the first RV-10 to put them
in that location. It looks like the liked my location, liked some of the
configuration, but then if they tried in any way to use it for engine
cranking,
they took a hard turn and went down a different path than those batteries
would have ever been planned to be used for.
My primary battery is an Odyssey PC925, located in the tail, and it has no
problem cranking the engine all by itself.
People who use PC680's often install 2, in the same rear location, and
tie them
together for cranking. You should probably have someone look over
that portion of your electrical system in particular, and just plan to
remove
these by the flap torque tube completely from any engine cranking operation.
Tim
On 1/12/2021 3:07 PM, WILLIAM BOOTH wrote:
> I would like to avoid rewiring if possible.
>
> - Over voltage protection I can resolve with a PP alternator (and change it over
to the primary?).
> - The batteries to help crank not only are not big enough , but the wires are
not big enough. (Picture included.)
> - A Schottky diode is a great solution but wiring it like my current one would
be incorrect as I understand it. (Picture included.)
> - Great catch on the mislabeled alternators; I saw that too.
> - The Hall effect current sensor; is that a directional flow item, like a diode?
> - Yes on the one at a time and only keep the other one for STANDBY use.
>
> William Booth
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Jan 12, 2021, at 11:42 AM, user9253 <fransew@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> What appear to be relays in the lower right corner are actually illuminated
switches.
>>
>> I do not see any over voltage protection.
>>
>> While cranking the engine, if the bus tie switch is closed and if bus B switch
is closed,
>> then the aux battery will help crank the engine. Are the wires big enough to
>> handle the current? The solution is to eliminate the bus tie switch. So what
>> if bus B is one volt less than Bus A? A Schottky diode will not drop as much
>> voltage and will not get as hot.
>>
>> Alternators A and B have their labels reversed.
>>
>> The strobe circuit needs to be protected by a fuse.
>>
>> Connecting both alternators to one current shunt is not necessarily unsafe unless
the shunt fails.
>> Consider using individual hall effect current sensors.
>> If the alternators do not play well with each other, the simple solution is
to only have one on at a time.
>>
>> If the original builder practiced good workmanship, I would not rewire the airplane.
>>
>> --------
>> Joe Gores
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=500156#500156
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
> ===================================
> ===================================
> ===================================
> ===================================
> ===================================
>>
>>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: RV10 Electrical Issue (w/ Format Clean Up) |
BTW what is the purpose of the diode, how is it used and how does the electricity
flow thru it?
William Booth
> On Jan 12, 2021, at 11:42 AM, user9253 <fransew@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> What appear to be relays in the lower right corner are actually illuminated switches.
>
> I do not see any over voltage protection.
>
> While cranking the engine, if the bus tie switch is closed and if bus B switch
is closed,
> then the aux battery will help crank the engine. Are the wires big enough to
> handle the current? The solution is to eliminate the bus tie switch. So what
> if bus B is one volt less than Bus A? A Schottky diode will not drop as much
> voltage and will not get as hot.
>
> Alternators A and B have their labels reversed.
>
> The strobe circuit needs to be protected by a fuse.
>
> Connecting both alternators to one current shunt is not necessarily unsafe unless
the shunt fails.
> Consider using individual hall effect current sensors.
> If the alternators do not play well with each other, the simple solution is to
only have one on at a time.
>
> If the original builder practiced good workmanship, I would not rewire the airplane.
>
> --------
> Joe Gores
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=500156#500156
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Sealed Connectors |
I just put dual-wall (glue-lined) heatshrink over the crimped connector its then
sealed and provides great strain relief all in one.
V/r, Stuart
> On 13 Jan 2021, at 8:56 am, Sebastien <cluros@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Is there a weather sealed PIDG blade crimp connector? I seem to remember something
with heat shrink and glue. They looked like this but with a heat shrink
end for the wire.
>
> <OIP.jpg>
Message 10
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Neal, thanks for the prompt response.
Mine are Bendix S4 LN -21 mags, P/N 10-51360-30. Are these the same as Continental?
Gues not...? [Shocked] [Embarassed]
--------
EfraimOtero
Fisher Celebrity EX N500BC
O200 COntinental
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=500167#500167
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_1555_146.jpg
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: RV10 Electrical Issue (w/ Format Clean Up) |
Think of the diode as a one way check valve. It allows current to
flow from bus A to bus B, but not in the opposite direction.
--------
Joe Gores
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=500172#500172
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Sealed Connectors |
This stuff is *awesome* for sealing connectors, splices etc, and its not badly
priced. Comes in 4 diameters, with a great shrink ratio.
IF you cant find the connector you want you can use a section of this on the stem:
https://www.mouser.ca/datasheet/2/418/5/NG_DS_ES1000_404-735359.pdf
On Jan 12, 2021, at 4:56 PM, Sebastien <cluros@gmail.com> wrote:
Is there a weather sealed PIDG blade crimp connector? I seem to remember something
with heat shrink and glue. They looked like this but with a heat shrink end
for the wire.
<OIP.jpg>
Message 13
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Yes, they are the same. Continental bought the Bendix ignition line about 35 years
ago
Neal
=================
On Jan 12, 2021, at 4:25 PM, EfraimOtero <efraim.otero@gmail.com> wrote:
Neal, thanks for the prompt response.
Mine are Bendix S4 LN -21 mags, P/N 10-51360-30. Are these the same as Continental?
Gues not...? [Shocked] [Embarassed]
--------
EfraimOtero
Fisher Celebrity EX N500BC
O200 COntinental
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Sealed Connectors |
If the connection is where you are worried about weather connection, and
the wire is #18 or smaller, suggest you dump the blade connectors and
get Electronics International OLC-1 or better OLC-2 connectors. They
create a weather tight seal using Allen screws in a connective sleeve.
Intended for EGT, CHT and fuel sending units in engine compartment. They
cost $1 each in multiples of 5 from the company direct, free shipping
and free Allen wrench. Blade connectors on EGT and CHT weather and get
highly variable resistance, causing unpredictable swings in readings.
The OLC connectors give rock solid readings and are reusable, unlike
crimp connectors.
On 1/12/2021 5:07 PM, Alec Myers wrote:
>
> This stuff is *awesome* for sealing connectors, splices etc, and its not badly
priced. Comes in 4 diameters, with a great shrink ratio.
> IF you cant find the connector you want you can use a section of this on the
stem:
> https://www.mouser.ca/datasheet/2/418/5/NG_DS_ES1000_404-735359.pdf
>
>
>
> On Jan 12, 2021, at 4:56 PM, Sebastien <cluros@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Is there a weather sealed PIDG blade crimp connector? I seem to remember something
with heat shrink and glue. They looked like this but with a heat shrink
end for the wire.
>
> <OIP.jpg>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: RV10 Electrical Issue (w/ Format Clean Up) |
RE the diode: Specifically why is it needed on this design; how else could the
power flow?
Re: Tims comment on the Aux Batteries; too small and the wires too small too....
I agree it has puzzled me when I first saw it but if buse B is turned on for start
I should be ok? That being said how else should it be done? Again safe and
sound is the goal.
William Booth
> On Jan 12, 2021, at 7:05 PM, user9253 <fransew@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Think of the diode as a one way check valve. It allows current to
> flow from bus A to bus B, but not in the opposite direction.
>
> --------
> Joe Gores
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=500172#500172
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: RV10 Electrical Issue (w/ Format Clean Up) |
Follow the wires from the aux battery, through the bus B relay, to
Bus B, through the bus tie switch, to bus A, to the big dot (junction)
below bus A, to the starter relay, to the starter.
Lots of current will flow through that path. Prevent it by removing the bus tie
switch.
And remove that jumper from the bottom of the diodes (labeled 2)
because it also will conduct starter current.
--------
Joe Gores
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=500182#500182
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